UK General Discussion: Rishecession

[TheDeadFlagBlues]

Those who are actually in power should have the dignity to seize it formally by installing an actual PM instead of using Truss as a meat puppet. This reeks of cowardice and the desire to avoid responsibility for enabling this maniac. Truss should have the courage to resign for her own good instead of holding onto a figurehead role that's nothing more than a poisoned chalice, a scarlet letter.

[President Johnson]

Truss is already finished and the Tories are disarray. The UK needs a snap election and Tories in opposition.

[Torrain]

Starmer addressed Labour MPs in a meeting of the PLP tonight, and didn’t hold back when he got around to Jeremy Hunt:

If ever you needed a sign of a dying government, it's surely the return of Jeremy Hunt just in time for the horror show that is going to be their Halloween budget.

The man who butchered the NHS, risen from his political grave, shoring up this Night of the Living Dead government and taking his reaper's scythe to what remains of public services after 12 years of the Tories.

Get the feeling he knows which caretaker PM he wants to run against. Also, fascinating to see how confident he is now compared to even a few months ago. I imagine these kinds of polls do that to you, but still, Hartlepool and beergate feel like a million years ago.

[Lumine]

Propping up a corpse PM is insane and self-defeating for a number of reasons, but it could well be that Hunt and company don't trust the party's ability to coalesce behind a single, decent replacement (not with Mordaunt and Sunak refusing to budge on who gets to be N°1, and Wallace being on maneuvers), and would certainly not trust the party membership - if it comes to them - being able to excercise caution for five minutes and not elect Braverman in a landslide. If anything, it's certainly not the most delusional of schemes that Conservatives have floated this year alone.

(Can't believe I'm hoping for a Labour government as soon as possible, if only to spare Britain from such a circus)

[TheTide]

Those who are actually in power should have the dignity to seize it formally by installing an actual PM instead of using Truss as a meat puppet. This reeks of cowardice and the desire to avoid responsibility for enabling this maniac. Truss should have the courage to resign for her own good instead of holding onto a figurehead role that's nothing more than a poisoned chalice, a scarlet letter.

If Truss resigns within the next 80 days or so she will at least have the honour of being a pub quiz factoid for the rest of time (displacing George Canning).

[Filuwaúrdjan]

I can believe that some influential Tories might think this, but surely the party as a whole isn't this deluded.

Ordinarily you'd think so, but these days I... I don't know...

[🦀🎂🦀🎂]

Those who are actually in power should have the dignity to seize it formally by installing an actual PM instead of using Truss as a meat puppet. This reeks of cowardice and the desire to avoid responsibility for enabling this maniac. Truss should have the courage to resign for her own good instead of holding onto a figurehead role that's nothing more than a poisoned chalice, a scarlet letter.

It's very peculiar. I can't think of a more humiliating position for a politician to be in - she's literally being treated as some kid playacting a big-girl job while the grown ups do the real work! And worse, this isn't some shadowy puppet master, but something literally everybody knows. If I was Truss, I would seriously consider spitefully calling a general to at least take out Hunt and Mordaunt along with everybody else.

[Silent Hunter]

Those who are actually in power should have the dignity to seize it formally by installing an actual PM instead of using Truss as a meat puppet. This reeks of cowardice and the desire to avoid responsibility for enabling this maniac. Truss should have the courage to resign for her own good instead of holding onto a figurehead role that's nothing more than a poisoned chalice, a scarlet letter.

It's very peculiar. I can't think of a more humiliating position for a politician to be in - she's literally being treated as some kid playacting a big-girl job while the grown ups do the real work! And worse, this isn't some shadowy puppet master, but something literally everybody knows. If I was Truss, I would seriously consider spitefully calling a general to at least take out Hunt and Mordaunt along with everybody else.

One wonders what the King would make of a move like that. The Palace generally does not like to be involved in internal party matters.

[Cassius]

A large part of the parliamentary party seems to have a mental block on the idea of changing the PM twice within the space of one parliament (which, to be fair, hasn’t happened since… 1940). Obviously there are others jockeying for their favoured candidate (Sunak, Mordaunt, Wallace etc) to get the job, but no one seems to be an overwhelming front runner who could have a coronation. Then you have Hunt, who doesn’t appear to be interested in being PM anymore, but also occupies an awkward position as he doesn’t really have much of a relationship with any of the aforementioned replacements for Truss, so his position of Chancellor (a job he evidently does want), wouldn’t be secure if she was replaced. So we seem to be in limbo.

It’s not sustainable, in my view, if only because Truss is now so unpopular and just so bad at everything that one more airing of her to the general public could easily finish her off. I can see this week’s PMQ’s being the straw that breaks the camels back if she puts in another catastrophic performance (and, personally I’d think the odds are firmly in favour of that). If you have a PM that can’t fulfil the basic functions of PM’ing (doing PMQ’s, holding press conferences… setting policy direction) then eventually something has to give… surely.

Either that or the Tory MP’s calling her a good PM and saying that the party needs to rally round are just genuinely dim.

[brucejoel99]

https://twitter.com/skynews/status/1582073092494741505

[Sestak]

https://twitter.com/skynews/status/1582073092494741505

They…they did. This is how the whole mess got started; who is he trying to convince here?

[Torrain]

https://twitter.com/skynews/status/1582073092494741505

They…they did. This is how the whole mess got started; who is he trying to convince here?

Tory MPs want someone to stab their weakened leaders in the back, but they don't want that person to stick around afterwards (and certainly not take the old leader's place), because of the bad blood they accumulate in the process. It's why Johnsonites are resisting appointing Rishi Sunak as a consensus PM, and why Michael Heseltine never became PM after bringing down Thatcher.

The quote that gets thrown around most is Gavin Esler's (often misattributed to Heseltine): "The hand that wields the knife shall never wear the crown."

Hunt is trying to reassure his colleagues that he's a safe pair of hands, and happy to remain Chancellor. It's the only way he emerges as either caretaker PM, or continuity Chancellor in the next cabinet.

[Middle-aged Europe]

Nothing is more representative of Liz Truss' current situation than the lyrics of Olivia Rodrigo's Brutal.

[Torrain]

Truss interviewed as part of BBC News at 10. We have a public apology for the mistakes of the mini-budget, and a commitment to lead the Conservatives into the next election.

Most of her assertions don't feel credible - and there's a sense of desperation. Her choice of the Thatcher Room in No.10 feels rather awkward given the comparisons (and cosplay), and she still refuses to engage with almost any questions.

Audible dead air when Truss is asked whether she feels humiliated which felt particularly telling
(even if it didn't reflect badly on Truss, it'll fuel a certain brand of conspiracy theories).

[Zinneke]

https://twitter.com/skynews/status/1582073092494741505

They…they did. This is how the whole mess got started; who is he trying to convince here?

Tory MPs want someone to stab their weakened leaders in the back, but they don't want that person to stick around afterwards (and certainly not take the old leader's place), because of the bad blood they accumulate in the process. It's why Johnsonites are resisting appointing Rishi Sunak as a consensus PM, and why Michael Heseltine never became PM after bringing down Thatcher.

The quote that gets thrown around most is Gavin Esler's (often misattributed to Heseltine): "The hand that wields the knife shall never wear the crown."

Hunt is trying to reassure his colleagues that he's a safe pair of hands, and happy to remain Chancellor. It's the only way he emerges as either caretaker PM, or continuity Chancellor in the next cabinet.

I think given the power of the Treasury and the idiosyncratic nature of the PM role, we could be witnessing just a change in the way the roles themselves are perceived. Truss will just become the ribbon cutter figurehead who listens to FCO advice... essentially going back to being a glorified foreign sec.

[Torrain]

https://twitter.com/skynews/status/1582073092494741505

They…they did. This is how the whole mess got started; who is he trying to convince here?

Tory MPs want someone to stab their weakened leaders in the back, but they don't want that person to stick around afterwards (and certainly not take the old leader's place), because of the bad blood they accumulate in the process. It's why Johnsonites are resisting appointing Rishi Sunak as a consensus PM, and why Michael Heseltine never became PM after bringing down Thatcher.

The quote that gets thrown around most is Gavin Esler's (often misattributed to Heseltine): "The hand that wields the knife shall never wear the crown."

Hunt is trying to reassure his colleagues that he's a safe pair of hands, and happy to remain Chancellor. It's the only way he emerges as either caretaker PM, or continuity Chancellor in the next cabinet.

I think given the power of the Treasury and the idiosyncratic nature of the PM role, we could be witnessing just a change in the way the roles themselves are perceived. Truss will just become the ribbon cutter figurehead who listens to FCO advice... essentially going back to being a glorified foreign sec.

I've heard people argue that she could just become a weak figurehead for a powerful cabinet, in various corners today. But I just don't think that's sustainable past a few weeks (months at most), given how much personal blame/ire Truss now shoulders.

A ribbon-cutting figurehead works if they have an 80% approval rating (QE2). If they have an 9% approval rating (Truss - see prior thread page), they're just a political risk, helping to turn the Labour polling lead from a fluke to a sustained political reality.

Cassius put it best - if the PM can't do the basics of the job (PMQs, press conferences etc), then they just can't survive.

[Blair]

Worth noting too with her ratings that both Johnson and Blair, even while hated, had a very vocal minority of support among their fans along with a chunk of people who didn’t like them personally but liked what their Governments had done- Truss has none of that.

The only people defending her last week where the 4 ‘socially liberal, fiscally conservative’ IEA types who’ve now changed their mind…

[brucejoel99]

Truss interviewed as part of BBC News at 10. We have a public apology for the mistakes of the mini-budget, and a commitment to lead the Conservatives into the next election.

A commitment worth about as much as Kwasi Kwarteng's commitment to absolutely not going anywhere, one imagines.

[Torrain]

She's lost Murdoch - even the Sun is focusing it's fire on her:
https://twitter.com/hoffman_noa/status/1582117413469896704

Edit: the full spread of tomorrow's papers are bad for Truss, and broadly more positive on Hunt than I expected (Times and Metro as outliers). The Mail, Sun and Telegraph all painting Truss as weak and out of touch feels pretty noteworthy, and even the Express (Pravda for right-wing pensioners) is running with Truss apologising, rather than talking about her strong, defiant leadership.

Front-pages available here: https://www.tomorrowspapers.co.uk/

[Blair]

Mad this thread has 56 pages already. British politics needs a break.

[Middle-aged Europe]

Mad this thread has 56 pages already. British politics needs a break.

And it has been one hell of a ride, with lots of ups and downs. Well, downs mostly.

[brucejoel99]

Let's see: she met with Brady, she deputized somebody reported to actively be on leadership maneuvers to answer her Urgent Question from the LotO that she was dodging in order to meet with Brady, she returned from her meeting with Brady unable to move or stop anxiously blinking during "her" Chancellor's fiscal statement announcing a U-turn on pretty much her entire program for government, she's now lost the support of Murdoch & the Mail…

Does she make it to PMQs?

[MABA 2020]

Mad this thread has 56 pages already. British politics needs a break.

Yeah I'd appreciate it if Liz hangs around as a zombie PM for a while, the idea of having another leadership election sounds exhausting. Or I guess the best option would be if the Tories somehow pull off a coronation of someone boring and uncontroversial.

[Torrain]

Nothing is more representative of Liz Truss' current situation than the lyrics of Olivia Rodrigo's Brutal.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OGUy2UmRxJ0

I'd submit this tweet from the woman herself:
https://twitter.com/trussliz/status/212095934039990272

[brucejoel99]

Mad this thread has 56 pages already. British politics needs a break.

Yeah I'd appreciate it if Liz hangs around as a zombie PM for a while, the idea of having another leadership election sounds exhausting. Or I guess the best option would be if the Tories somehow pull off a coronation of someone boring and uncontroversial.

"No sneaky parliamentary maneuvers here; just the democratic membership's buyer's remorse"?

https://twitter.com/benrileysmith/status/1582114531089608704