🇬🇷 Greek politics and elections

[Filuwaúrdjan]

As a wise man once said: 'aaaaaaayyy lmao'

[oldtimer]

As a wise man once said: 'aaaaaaayyy lmao'

They even did the same mistake in the 2nd round, they extended voting hours so that more Kasselakis supporters could vote.

Those in SYRIZA are really dumb (like there wasn't any proof for years) and now they have no party.

[Battista Minola 1616]

After reading Stefanos Kasselakis's Wikipedia page and a few articles about him, I have to conclude that SYRIZA primary voters are the stupidest people on Earth. The whole thing looks like a grotesque parody of the (already silly enough) 2023 PD primaries. At least our "foreign Amerikan entryist" Elly Schlein has lived all her adult life in Italy and been an elected official for almost a decade!

[oldtimer]

After reading Stefanos Kasselakis's Wikipedia page and a few articles about him, I have to conclude that SYRIZA primary voters are the stupidest people on Earth. The whole thing looks like a grotesque parody of the (already silly enough) 2023 PD primaries. At least our "foreign Amerikan entryist" Elly Schlein has lived all her adult life in Italy and been an elected official for almost a decade!

He only needed 0.75% of adults in Greece to be total morons to get the leadership.
Easy task.

But how much did all the saturated advertisement campaign would have cost ?
Assuming the entire Annual Greek TV market is max 650 million euros, these days probably 400-450, lets be generous and say 400.

For 4 weeks I guess around 20 million.

I doubt he will become PM because he needs a combined 40% and 1st place, and PASOK+SYRIZA got 30% in the last election, the Left hates him with a passion, and ND is weak on it's right flank not it's left.

There will be a right wing shift, especially on social issues, all other parties are already going homophobic as a reaction to Kasselakis.

[Vosem]

Sometimes politics is about supply rather than demand -- ND has been weak on its right flank rather than its left so far, but it seems like if Mitsotakis were to become unpopular then many of the people who have been its base voters in the past two elections, who might never have considered Tsipras and might be leery at PASOK, might be persuadable by Kasselakis. Even if the harder left splits off, I have to imagine that in a situation where both men are short of a majority and trying to form government they'd be likelier to ally with Kasselakis than Mitsotakis.

(Yes, I am aware that in June 1989 ND and Synaspismos formed a coalition government, but that lasted only several months and Wikipedia seems to portray it as having only ever been meant to last several months and accomplish a few very specific tasks on which the right and the far-left agreed. There has never been a government lasting a four-year term -- or even a two-year half-term -- which was a right/far-left coalition.)

[DL]

If Syriza moves a bit more to the centre-left how is it any different from the remnants of PASOK?

[oldtimer]

If Syriza moves a bit more to the centre-left how is it any different from the remnants of PASOK?

Now it's more right wing than PASOK.

[oldtimer]

Sometimes politics is about supply rather than demand -- ND has been weak on its right flank rather than its left so far, but it seems like if Mitsotakis were to become unpopular then many of the people who have been its base voters in the past two elections, who might never have considered Tsipras and might be leery at PASOK, might be persuadable by Kasselakis. Even if the harder left splits off, I have to imagine that in a situation where both men are short of a majority and trying to form government they'd be likelier to ally with Kasselakis than Mitsotakis.

(Yes, I am aware that in June 1989 ND and Synaspismos formed a coalition government, but that lasted only several months and Wikipedia seems to portray it as having only ever been meant to last several months and accomplish a few very specific tasks on which the right and the far-left agreed. There has never been a government lasting a four-year term -- or even a two-year half-term -- which was a right/far-left coalition.)

Sometimes politics is about supply rather than demand -- ND has been weak on its right flank rather than its left so far, but it seems like if Mitsotakis were to become unpopular then many of the people who have been its base voters in the past two elections, who might never have considered Tsipras and might be leery at PASOK, might be persuadable by Kasselakis. Even if the harder left splits off, I have to imagine that in a situation where both men are short of a majority and trying to form government they'd be likelier to ally with Kasselakis than Mitsotakis.

(Yes, I am aware that in June 1989 ND and Synaspismos formed a coalition government, but that lasted only several months and Wikipedia seems to portray it as having only ever been meant to last several months and accomplish a few very specific tasks on which the right and the far-left agreed. There has never been a government lasting a four-year term -- or even a two-year half-term -- which was a right/far-left coalition.)

We know from the 1st 2012 election the relative size of factions in greek society.

There are 6% that are soft left liberals who vote Mitsotakis.

Lets say Kasselakis gets them: ND 34, SYRIZA 23, PASOK 12
Lets say Kasselakis gets 3% from PASOK: ND 34, SYRIZA 26, PASOK 9
Lets say ND loses 3% to its right: ND 31, SYRIZA 26, PASOK 9 (very similar to the 2nd 2012 election)

Even if Kasselakis loses no left or center left votes, he is still 5% short for 1st place and the combined PASOK+SYRIZA is still 5% short for a coalition even if they get 1st.

[Landslide Lyndon]

After reading Stefanos Kasselakis's Wikipedia page and a few articles about him, I have to conclude that SYRIZA primary voters are the stupidest people on Earth.

That much has been obvious for the last decade.

[Landslide Lyndon]

Ngl he and his husband are hot

The only good thing from this election was the normalization of having a gay political leader.
Not that the virulent homophobes were reluctant to express themselves but they were either ignored or frowned upon.

[oldtimer]

Well the first 3 post SYRIZA leader election polls are out and the consensus is the public hate Kasselakis:

Opinion

ND 32
SYRIZA 14
PASOK 10
Communist 8
Velopoulos 5
Spartans 3
Konstantopoulou 3
NIKI 4
D/K 15

Pulse (they exclude D/K's)

ND 38
SYRIZA 19
PASOK 12
Communist 9
Velopoulos 6
Spartans 4
NIKI 3
Konstantopoulou 3

Alco

ND 30
SYRIZA 14
PASOK 11
Communist 7
Spartans 4
Velopoulos 5
NIKI 2
Konstantopoulou 3
D/K 12

Kasselakis favourables look like they are similar to the leader of PASOK in the high 20's.

Still it's not the worse case scenario for Kasselakis leading SYRIZA to 3rd place, though this is before the anticipated split of SYRIZA.

The absolute moron vote may have been enough to get him elected leader of SYRIZA but it's nowhere near close to make him PM.

[Mike88]

The polls also show a KKE surge. Hardcore Syriza voters voting Communist?

[oldtimer]

The polls also show a KKE surge. Hardcore Syriza voters voting Communist?

I doubt it, the Communists always get almost nothing of the D/K vote in elections.

There is also a peculiar story from the N.Y.T. about Adonis Georgiadis and potential bribery by the Chinese government that's going around in greek media :

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/09/28/technology/huawei-greece-lobbying-campaign.html

Though I think the Times is looking at the wrong area, his business interests including his brother Leonidas Georgiadis would probably be far more fertile, last year it was published that hundreds of thousands of euros where unaccounted for in their bank statements :

https://thepressproject.gr/novartis-diapistonontai-adiefkrinista-posa-sto-logariasmo-tou-georgiadi-alla-archeiotheteitai-i-dioxi-tou/

And this mystery institute he founded in 1994:

https://ellinikiagogi.gr/

Also his large unpaid bank loans.

In short Georgiadis, like probably most greek politicians, is vulnerable to an outside financial investigation.

[oldtimer]

The largest stadium in the Greece, the Athens Olympic one, has been closed indefinitely due to it's crumbling roof.

It  was widely talked even before the completion of the roof in 2004 that it was badly designed and badly made by the"World's Worst" Architect Santiago Calatrava, people made jokes about it even on TV that it was going to fall to pieces.

Calatrava is considered by the greek public as very fraud friendly and that's why it is said a lot of public contracts in Greece went to him, for his apparently very expensive (on paper) shoddy work.

It's not the first time a Calatrava work falls to pieces or has tons of missing money in other countries:

https://theculturetrip.com/europe/spain/articles/santiago-calatrava-architectures-biggest-scandal

https://nypost.com/2018/04/07/feds-probe-80m-construction-scandal-at-church-wrecked-on-9-11/

[Mike88]

It's not the first time a Calatrava work falls to pieces or has tons of missing money in other countries:

https://theculturetrip.com/europe/spain/articles/santiago-calatrava-architectures-biggest-scandal

https://nypost.com/2018/04/07/feds-probe-80m-construction-scandal-at-church-wrecked-on-9-11/

Calatrava's Orient train station in Lisbon is also subject to a tense debate:

https://twitter.com/saulescritor/status/1648395110160248833

Even though it is very photogenic and pleasant to the eye, those who use the station say that it's very uncomfortable. In the summer, the glass from the "steel palm trees" warms so much that the station feels like an oven. And in the winter, as there are no side protections, the wind throws the rain against passengers waiting at the platforms.

[Mike88]

The first round of the local elections is set for this Sunday, 8 October. The second round is one week from now, 15 October. Some polls of some of the races:

Athens city: (Population 643,000)
https://twitter.com/GreeceElects/status/1709621906981175578

Thessaloniki city: (Population 319,000)
https://twitter.com/GreeceElects/status/1709270956986785960

Attica region: (Population 3,800,000)
https://twitter.com/GreeceElects/status/1709591707921137838

Peloponnese region: (Population 582,000)
https://twitter.com/GreeceElects/status/1710279661278622178

South Aegean region: (Population 309,000)
https://twitter.com/GreeceElects/status/1709279479225344185

[Mike88]

Polls opened at 7am local time and close at 7pm, in around 4 hours from now.

At midday, turnout stood at 14.5%.

[Mike88]

At 5:30pm, turnout stood at 44.6%.

[Mike88]

Polls are now closed across the country and counting is under way.

Municipal elections results page

Regional elections results page

[oldtimer]

No surprises in results so far.

I can call all Governorships for the incumbents or incumbent parties, except Pelloponese and Thessaly.

[oldtimer]

The only interest in Mayorships is who comes 2nd in Athens, but that's a formality due to a lack of organised opposition parties.

[Mike88]

The only interest in Mayorships is who comes 2nd in Athens, but that's a formality due to a lack of organised opposition parties.

So far PASOK is in 2nd, but less than 1% counted.

[oldtimer]

The only interest in Mayorships is who comes 2nd in Athens, but that's a formality due to a lack of organised opposition parties.

So far PASOK is in 2nd, but less than 1% counted.

You have 4 unpopular candidates essentially tied for a distant 2nd.

[oldtimer]

Looks like there might be 1 or 2 surprises in governorships in West Macedonia,  East Macedonia, and the Ionian Islands.

[oldtimer]

The Pireaus Mayoralship has been called for Olympiakos F.C. for the 3rd consecutive time.