PA-SN 2022 megathread: Shrek vs. The Wizard of Oz

[kwabbit]

Good point(?) in defense(?) of Oz

Not so much a defense of Oz as it was tempering my criticism of Fetterman's lie with criticism of Oz, though in turn emphasizing how unnecessary the lie was. I'm not sure how many times I have to repeat that I think both candidates in the race are poor. It was literally in my last post before this one.

Once again, if you honestly believe an opponent in PA/Philly is not going to hit the other person for tweeting about trying out for the Cowboys then you don't get this area. It would be political malpractice not to.

Still, this race is unique in how little the issues matter. Toomey vs. McGinty seems so formal and serious compared to Oz vs. Fetterman.

Maybe it’s the fact that both candidates’ platforms are seen as reasonable and not extreme. Oz is the most moderate GOP nominee in a competitive race and Fetterman’s economic populism is hard to attack. So it comes down to if Fetterman can make Oz unliked enough where he can overcome the fundamentals and win in a midterm.

[wbrocks67]

Good point(?) in defense(?) of Oz

Not so much a defense of Oz as it was tempering my criticism of Fetterman's lie with criticism of Oz, though in turn emphasizing how unnecessary the lie was. I'm not sure how many times I have to repeat that I think both candidates in the race are poor. It was literally in my last post before this one.

Once again, if you honestly believe an opponent in PA/Philly is not going to hit the other person for tweeting about trying out for the Cowboys then you don't get this area. It would be political malpractice not to.

Still, this race is unique in how little the issues matter. Toomey vs. McGinty seems so formal and serious compared to Oz vs. Fetterman.

Maybe it’s the fact that both candidates’ platforms are seen as reasonable and not extreme. Oz is the most moderate GOP nominee in a competitive race and Fetterman’s economic populism is hard to attack. So it comes down to if Fetterman can make Oz unliked enough where he can overcome the fundamentals and win in a midterm.

This is a both sides-ism that isn't true. Oz thinks abortion is murder and has no exceptions besides rape, incest, life of the mother. That's not reasonable and IS extreme for a general electorate. Oz is no moderate.

[Anti Democrat Democrat Club]

I am a little skeptical about the Cowboys thing. I don't think the average Eagles fan knows what Cowboys Stadium looks like and there isn't anything on the billboard really identifying it as a Cowboys thing.

I don't think anyone really knows the tweet, tbh

[kwabbit]

Good point(?) in defense(?) of Oz

Not so much a defense of Oz as it was tempering my criticism of Fetterman's lie with criticism of Oz, though in turn emphasizing how unnecessary the lie was. I'm not sure how many times I have to repeat that I think both candidates in the race are poor. It was literally in my last post before this one.

Once again, if you honestly believe an opponent in PA/Philly is not going to hit the other person for tweeting about trying out for the Cowboys then you don't get this area. It would be political malpractice not to.

Still, this race is unique in how little the issues matter. Toomey vs. McGinty seems so formal and serious compared to Oz vs. Fetterman.

Maybe it’s the fact that both candidates’ platforms are seen as reasonable and not extreme. Oz is the most moderate GOP nominee in a competitive race and Fetterman’s economic populism is hard to attack. So it comes down to if Fetterman can make Oz unliked enough where he can overcome the fundamentals and win in a midterm.

This is a both sides-ism that isn't true. Oz thinks abortion is murder and has no exceptions besides rape, incest, life of the mother. That's not reasonable and IS extreme for a general electorate. Oz is no moderate.

Oz was pro-choice on abortion for 20 years on TV. He may have said that to win over GOP primary voters, but that position is not in his current rhetoric nor is it what he believes personally.

The PA Democrats might be able to convince some people that Oz is a pro-life extremist, but I think even you know that Oz lied about that in the primary as he did on many issues.

[wbrocks67]

Good point(?) in defense(?) of Oz

Not so much a defense of Oz as it was tempering my criticism of Fetterman's lie with criticism of Oz, though in turn emphasizing how unnecessary the lie was. I'm not sure how many times I have to repeat that I think both candidates in the race are poor. It was literally in my last post before this one.

Once again, if you honestly believe an opponent in PA/Philly is not going to hit the other person for tweeting about trying out for the Cowboys then you don't get this area. It would be political malpractice not to.

Still, this race is unique in how little the issues matter. Toomey vs. McGinty seems so formal and serious compared to Oz vs. Fetterman.

Maybe it’s the fact that both candidates’ platforms are seen as reasonable and not extreme. Oz is the most moderate GOP nominee in a competitive race and Fetterman’s economic populism is hard to attack. So it comes down to if Fetterman can make Oz unliked enough where he can overcome the fundamentals and win in a midterm.

This is a both sides-ism that isn't true. Oz thinks abortion is murder and has no exceptions besides rape, incest, life of the mother. That's not reasonable and IS extreme for a general electorate. Oz is no moderate.

Oz was pro-choice on abortion for 20 years on TV. He may have said that to win over GOP primary voters, but that position is not in his current rhetoric nor is it what he believes personally.

The PA Democrats might be able to convince some people that Oz is a pro-life extremist, but I think even you know that Oz lied about that in the primary as he did on many issues.

Oz's position in the general electorate is no exceptions but those 3. Even if you take out the comment he made in the primary, his GE stance on abortion is still wildly out of step from the mainstream. That is what he's staking his candidacy on right *now*. And it's extreme.

[kwabbit]

Good point(?) in defense(?) of Oz

Not so much a defense of Oz as it was tempering my criticism of Fetterman's lie with criticism of Oz, though in turn emphasizing how unnecessary the lie was. I'm not sure how many times I have to repeat that I think both candidates in the race are poor. It was literally in my last post before this one.

Once again, if you honestly believe an opponent in PA/Philly is not going to hit the other person for tweeting about trying out for the Cowboys then you don't get this area. It would be political malpractice not to.

Still, this race is unique in how little the issues matter. Toomey vs. McGinty seems so formal and serious compared to Oz vs. Fetterman.

Maybe it’s the fact that both candidates’ platforms are seen as reasonable and not extreme. Oz is the most moderate GOP nominee in a competitive race and Fetterman’s economic populism is hard to attack. So it comes down to if Fetterman can make Oz unliked enough where he can overcome the fundamentals and win in a midterm.

This is a both sides-ism that isn't true. Oz thinks abortion is murder and has no exceptions besides rape, incest, life of the mother. That's not reasonable and IS extreme for a general electorate. Oz is no moderate.

Oz was pro-choice on abortion for 20 years on TV. He may have said that to win over GOP primary voters, but that position is not in his current rhetoric nor is it what he believes personally.

The PA Democrats might be able to convince some people that Oz is a pro-life extremist, but I think even you know that Oz lied about that in the primary as he did on many issues.

Oz's position in the general electorate is no exceptions but those 3. Even if you take out the comment he made in the primary, his GE stance on abortion is still wildly out of step from the mainstream. That is what he's staking his candidacy on right *now*. And it's extreme.

Oz has repeatedly said that he wants to return it to the states. He also says repeatedly says he’s “100% pro life” and in favor of the aforementioned exceptions as well as opposing any criminal penalties. He’s not naming a specific week because that contradicts the returning it to the states position.

Whether you want to call that extreme is your prerogative. But he’s obviously trying to moderate on the issue while being able to say he’s pro life for the base. Either way, he’s definitely not staking his campaign on it given that he mentions it as little as possible. 

[Aurelius]

This has to be one of the weirdest Senate races in a long time, in terms of the things the candidates are hitting each other about.

People need to stop talking about things they don't know about.

If you honestly don't think that someone running in Pennsylvania would not hit their opponent on tweeting about the Cowboys then you literally don't know this area at all.

That is not what I am talking about. At all.

Then what are you talking about?

Prominent issues in this campaign have been Fetterman's stroke and general health, Oz's eating habits, Fetterman's eating habits, Oz's residency, Fetterman's reluctance to debate, and Oz's medical research. It has even less to do with the issues than a typical modern campaign, and it doesn't fit the typical pattern of GOP candidate appealing to the beer track and the Dem appealing to the wine track.

[It’s so Joever]

This has to be one of the weirdest Senate races in a long time, in terms of the things the candidates are hitting each other about.

People need to stop talking about things they don't know about.

If you honestly don't think that someone running in Pennsylvania would not hit their opponent on tweeting about the Cowboys then you literally don't know this area at all.

That is not what I am talking about. At all.

Then what are you talking about?

Prominent issues in this campaign have been Fetterman's stroke and general health, Oz's eating habits, Fetterman's eating habits, Oz's residency, Fetterman's reluctance to debate, and Oz's medical research. It has even less to do with the issues than a typical modern campaign, and it doesn't fit the typical pattern of GOP candidate appealing to the beer track and the Dem appealing to the wine track.

So basically a PA version of 2012 but the candidates *really* hate eachother.

[Aurelius]

This has to be one of the weirdest Senate races in a long time, in terms of the things the candidates are hitting each other about.

People need to stop talking about things they don't know about.

If you honestly don't think that someone running in Pennsylvania would not hit their opponent on tweeting about the Cowboys then you literally don't know this area at all.

That is not what I am talking about. At all.

Then what are you talking about?

Prominent issues in this campaign have been Fetterman's stroke and general health, Oz's eating habits, Fetterman's eating habits, Oz's residency, Fetterman's reluctance to debate, and Oz's medical research. It has even less to do with the issues than a typical modern campaign, and it doesn't fit the typical pattern of GOP candidate appealing to the beer track and the Dem appealing to the wine track.

So basically a PA version of 2012 but the candidates *really* hate eachother.

2012 was actually the most "normal", issues-based presidential campaign I can remember. And college whites mostly hadn't fled the GOP yet so the wine/beer track sorting wasn't as strong as today. It's also not just that Oz is wine track and Fetterman is beer track, it's that they are both such extreme caricatures of the respective tracks.

[swf541]

SMP up with ad on puppygate

https://twitter.com/joshkraushaar/status/1579956337332875265?s=46&t=hkw_m16l...

[President Punxsutawney Phil]

This has to be one of the weirdest Senate races in a long time, in terms of the things the candidates are hitting each other about.

People need to stop talking about things they don't know about.

If you honestly don't think that someone running in Pennsylvania would not hit their opponent on tweeting about the Cowboys then you literally don't know this area at all.

That is not what I am talking about. At all.

Then what are you talking about?

Prominent issues in this campaign have been Fetterman's stroke and general health, Oz's eating habits, Fetterman's eating habits, Oz's residency, Fetterman's reluctance to debate, and Oz's medical research. It has even less to do with the issues than a typical modern campaign, and it doesn't fit the typical pattern of GOP candidate appealing to the beer track and the Dem appealing to the wine track.

So basically a PA version of 2012 but the candidates *really* hate eachother.

2012 was actually the most "normal", issues-based presidential campaign I can remember. And college whites mostly hadn't fled the GOP yet so the wine/beer track sorting wasn't as strong as today. It's also not just that Oz is wine track and Fetterman is beer track, it's that they are both such extreme caricatures of the respective tracks.

Yeah, Oz in particular oozes "wine track" more than any other high-profile candidate in a swing-state race this election cycle.

[wbrocks67]

And there it is

https://twitter.com/JoshKraushaar/status/1579956337332875265

[President Punxsutawney Phil]

And there it is

https://twitter.com/JoshKraushaar/status/1579956337332875265

I almost, almost want to say "stop, stop, he's already dead!" but then I remember Oz does have a victory path at this point.

[It’s so Joever]

And there it is

https://twitter.com/JoshKraushaar/status/1579956337332875265

Who let the dogs out?!

[Skill and Chance]

This has to be one of the weirdest Senate races in a long time, in terms of the things the candidates are hitting each other about.

People need to stop talking about things they don't know about.

If you honestly don't think that someone running in Pennsylvania would not hit their opponent on tweeting about the Cowboys then you literally don't know this area at all.

That is not what I am talking about. At all.

Then what are you talking about?

Prominent issues in this campaign have been Fetterman's stroke and general health, Oz's eating habits, Fetterman's eating habits, Oz's residency, Fetterman's reluctance to debate, and Oz's medical research. It has even less to do with the issues than a typical modern campaign, and it doesn't fit the typical pattern of GOP candidate appealing to the beer track and the Dem appealing to the wine track.

So basically a PA version of 2012 but the candidates *really* hate eachother.

2012 was actually the most "normal", issues-based presidential campaign I can remember. And college whites mostly hadn't fled the GOP yet so the wine/beer track sorting wasn't as strong as today. It's also not just that Oz is wine track and Fetterman is beer track, it's that they are both such extreme caricatures of the respective tracks.

Yeah, Oz in particular oozes "wine track" more than any other high-profile candidate in a swing-state race this election cycle.

It feels like a campaign from the 1980's when Dems still had a blue collar Western Pennsylvania base.

[President Punxsutawney Phil]

This has to be one of the weirdest Senate races in a long time, in terms of the things the candidates are hitting each other about.

People need to stop talking about things they don't know about.

If you honestly don't think that someone running in Pennsylvania would not hit their opponent on tweeting about the Cowboys then you literally don't know this area at all.

That is not what I am talking about. At all.

Then what are you talking about?

Prominent issues in this campaign have been Fetterman's stroke and general health, Oz's eating habits, Fetterman's eating habits, Oz's residency, Fetterman's reluctance to debate, and Oz's medical research. It has even less to do with the issues than a typical modern campaign, and it doesn't fit the typical pattern of GOP candidate appealing to the beer track and the Dem appealing to the wine track.

So basically a PA version of 2012 but the candidates *really* hate eachother.

2012 was actually the most "normal", issues-based presidential campaign I can remember. And college whites mostly hadn't fled the GOP yet so the wine/beer track sorting wasn't as strong as today. It's also not just that Oz is wine track and Fetterman is beer track, it's that they are both such extreme caricatures of the respective tracks.

Yeah, Oz in particular oozes "wine track" more than any other high-profile candidate in a swing-state race this election cycle.

It feels like a campaign from the 1980's when Dems still had a blue collar Western Pennsylvania base.

Flashback to the 1986 governor election when the very culturally Catholic and blue collar Democrat Casey ran an ad critical of his opponent and mentioning yoga for some reason.

[wbrocks67]

Can anyone actually view the ad though? The link is not working for me.

[swf541]

Can anyone actually view the ad though? The link is not working for me.

I watched it, took a few tries, its a brutal ad.

[wbrocks67]

ah, found it

https://twitter.com/PoliticsPA/status/1579964184846303239

[wbrocks67]

omg- that actually may be the most devastating ad all cycle. wow.

[Progressive Pessimist]

omg- that actually may be the most devastating ad all cycle. wow.

It evokes the feeling I get when an ASPCA commercial airs, and that is not good for Oz if enough Pennsylvanians are like myself.

[Comrade Funk]

I always turn the channel when those commercials come on. And I'll turn it again for this one.

[Kahane's Grave Is A Gender-Neutral Bathroom]

That ad was good by Democratic campaign standards.

[Penn_Quaker_Girl]

ah, found it

https://twitter.com/PoliticsPA/status/1579964184846303239

Caught it during the Phils-Braves NLDS game, which likely means lots of eyes on it in SE/south-central PA.  

[Sestak]

Uh...where did all the pollsters go lol? Couple weeks back everyone with a phone and a few free hours was polling this race. Now it's been a whole week since the last polls (from Monmouth and CenterStreet).