Russia-Ukraine war and related tensions Megathread

[Badger]

I have doubts any one side can position themselves as somehow "principled" on this issue.

Show me a concerted Ukrainian strategy to weaponize rape. I'll wait.

Not everything is a "both-sides-do-it" issue. Sometimes, just sometimes, there is an absolute right and an absolute wrong.

Dehumanizing things frequently happen in war. We would know. Our troops posed with dead Iraqis and took selfies with them! What utter "orcs" they were...

Yes? Which is why the soldiers at Abu grebel prosecuted, and why such activities were very much the exception to the rule as opposed to Russia where it is absolutely encouraged as an explicit weapon of terror.

Please pull your head out of your ass before you post again.

[Badger]

https://twitter.com/ZelenskyyUa/status/1581198080191664128?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7...
The comments are brutal. More money taken away from American taxpayers for a hopeless foreign war they have no investment in.

Okay traitor.

This isn’t helpful in any way. It almost reminds me of how people were post-9/11 if you questioned Bush’s actions at all. For months we have been sending money to Ukraine and I haven’t seen any results whatsoever. There is still a war and I see no signs Ukraine is even close to winning. Do we just keep sending them a blank check indefinitely? And would Ukraine support us if we truly needed them? Where is the cutoff here and why?

To be clear I am not defending Russia’s actions in any way, that would be ridiculous. But we need to move toward peace in some way; this isn’t sustainable in the long term and could drag out for years.

even if it drags out for years, that means the russkies are fighting over there and not at America's shores.

that's y its important to help the forces of global democracy over there fight Axis of Evil regimes before they get out of control and can do even more damage and threaten the entire world rather than just their region.

If the west had toppled Hitler in 1933 many millions would have survived who instead died due to appeasement that allowed the forces of evil time to gain strength.

I understand the logic here but Putin is hardly Adolf Hitler. Russia is a weak second-world country whose military has proven to be ill-equipped and unprepared for combat. it is hardly the type of army that Germany had in the 40s, and I doubt he could even defeat Poland at this point.

NATO is the red line. If he goes after any NATO country then I fully support military involvement, though Poland by itself would likely be able to take them for that matter. I feel for Ukraine, I truly do, but I don’t think Putin poses much of a threat for anyone else other than them.

Imagine thinking that, a, Putin isn't utterly morally reprehensible and bloody as Hitler simply because he hasn't literally reopened book involved, b, that fundamental American strategic interests are not at play here despite Ukraine not - at least yet - being a NATO member, or c, that despite its corruption and difficulties it is fundamentally on the side of liberal democracy under attack from a bunch of mass raping, child torturing, ethnic kidnapping/cleansing purveyors of mass War atrocities.

I mean would you say Suddam was as evil as Hitler then or Stalin was as evil as Hitler . Like you can say someone is very evil without saying they are as evil as Hitler as pretty much no one in modern human history has been as evil as Hitler .

I agree with your premise that once one gets to that level of genocidal evil it all Blends together. I suppose I have nothing but contempt for the knee jerk morally blind anti-interventionists who repeatedly oppose supporting Ukraine under the theory that Putin isn't as bad as Hitler so whatever's.

[OSR stands with Israel]

https://twitter.com/ZelenskyyUa/status/1581198080191664128?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7...
The comments are brutal. More money taken away from American taxpayers for a hopeless foreign war they have no investment in.

Okay traitor.

This isn’t helpful in any way. It almost reminds me of how people were post-9/11 if you questioned Bush’s actions at all. For months we have been sending money to Ukraine and I haven’t seen any results whatsoever. There is still a war and I see no signs Ukraine is even close to winning. Do we just keep sending them a blank check indefinitely? And would Ukraine support us if we truly needed them? Where is the cutoff here and why?

To be clear I am not defending Russia’s actions in any way, that would be ridiculous. But we need to move toward peace in some way; this isn’t sustainable in the long term and could drag out for years.

even if it drags out for years, that means the russkies are fighting over there and not at America's shores.

that's y its important to help the forces of global democracy over there fight Axis of Evil regimes before they get out of control and can do even more damage and threaten the entire world rather than just their region.

If the west had toppled Hitler in 1933 many millions would have survived who instead died due to appeasement that allowed the forces of evil time to gain strength.

I understand the logic here but Putin is hardly Adolf Hitler. Russia is a weak second-world country whose military has proven to be ill-equipped and unprepared for combat. it is hardly the type of army that Germany had in the 40s, and I doubt he could even defeat Poland at this point.

NATO is the red line. If he goes after any NATO country then I fully support military involvement, though Poland by itself would likely be able to take them for that matter. I feel for Ukraine, I truly do, but I don’t think Putin poses much of a threat for anyone else other than them.

Imagine thinking that, a, Putin isn't utterly morally reprehensible and bloody as Hitler simply because he hasn't literally reopened book involved, b, that fundamental American strategic interests are not at play here despite Ukraine not - at least yet - being a NATO member, or c, that despite its corruption and difficulties it is fundamentally on the side of liberal democracy under attack from a bunch of mass raping, child torturing, ethnic kidnapping/cleansing purveyors of mass War atrocities.

I mean would you say Suddam was as evil as Hitler then or Stalin was as evil as Hitler . Like you can say someone is very evil without saying they are as evil as Hitler as pretty much no one in modern human history has been as evil as Hitler .

I agree with your premise that once one gets to that level of genocidal evil it all Blends together. I suppose I have nothing but contempt for the knee jerk morally blind anti-interventionists who repeatedly oppose supporting Ukraine under the theory that Putin isn't as bad as Hitler so whatever's.

Oh I 100% agree this is moronic as one of the lessons we should have learned from WW2 is we never should have let Hitler become Hitler to begin with. The British/French could have stopped Hitler before 1940 and it is one of humanity's greatest tragedies that he was not stopped before then.



 

[President Punxsutawney Phil]

I have doubts any one side can position themselves as somehow "principled" on this issue.

Show me a concerted Ukrainian strategy to weaponize rape. I'll wait.

Not everything is a "both-sides-do-it" issue. Sometimes, just sometimes, there is an absolute right and an absolute wrong.

Dehumanizing things frequently happen in war. We would know. Our troops posed with dead Iraqis and took selfies with them! What utter "orcs" they were...

Yes? Which is why the soldiers at Abu grebel prosecuted, and why such activities were very much the exception to the rule as opposed to Russia where it is absolutely encouraged as an explicit weapon of terror.

Please pull your head out of your ass before you post again.

Way to misunderstand what I've said. There's a reason I've generally avoided replying when you misunderstand something I've posted. I'm no isolationist, years prior I was suspicious of Russia's activities in Syria, and more recently I felt a level of strong opposition to Russia's efforts to destabilize the American-led world order, as made clear by their promotion of things like Le Pen's presidential run in 2017. I was in fact talking about the need for Ukraine to get lots of weapons before most were, but you couldn't realize that if one just looked at your posts.
Please, whatever trashy things you are saying about me right now, kindly look in a mirror until you can become better at self-reflection, and goodbye.
EDIT: Thanks for differentiating me, though in an above post. I apologize for not taking notice of this in my wording here, though I noticed it and appreciated it then and I do so now.

[LostInOhio]

https://twitter.com/ZelenskyyUa/status/1581198080191664128?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7...
The comments are brutal. More money taken away from American taxpayers for a hopeless foreign war they have no investment in.

Okay traitor.

This isn’t helpful in any way. It almost reminds me of how people were post-9/11 if you questioned Bush’s actions at all. For months we have been sending money to Ukraine and I haven’t seen any results whatsoever. There is still a war and I see no signs Ukraine is even close to winning. Do we just keep sending them a blank check indefinitely? And would Ukraine support us if we truly needed them? Where is the cutoff here and why?

To be clear I am not defending Russia’s actions in any way, that would be ridiculous. But we need to move toward peace in some way; this isn’t sustainable in the long term and could drag out for years.

even if it drags out for years, that means the russkies are fighting over there and not at America's shores.

that's y its important to help the forces of global democracy over there fight Axis of Evil regimes before they get out of control and can do even more damage and threaten the entire world rather than just their region.

If the west had toppled Hitler in 1933 many millions would have survived who instead died due to appeasement that allowed the forces of evil time to gain strength.

I understand the logic here but Putin is hardly Adolf Hitler. Russia is a weak second-world country whose military has proven to be ill-equipped and unprepared for combat. it is hardly the type of army that Germany had in the 40s, and I doubt he could even defeat Poland at this point.

NATO is the red line. If he goes after any NATO country then I fully support military involvement, though Poland by itself would likely be able to take them for that matter. I feel for Ukraine, I truly do, but I don’t think Putin poses much of a threat for anyone else other than them.

Imagine thinking that, a, Putin isn't utterly morally reprehensible and bloody as Hitler simply because he hasn't literally reopened book involved, b, that fundamental American strategic interests are not at play here despite Ukraine not - at least yet - being a NATO member, or c, that despite its corruption and difficulties it is fundamentally on the side of liberal democracy under attack from a bunch of mass raping, child torturing, ethnic kidnapping/cleansing purveyors of mass War atrocities.

My remark about Hitler wasn’t because I was comparing their mortality. Putin is certainly a bloodthirsty dictator in the same ideological realm as Hitler. Instead I was comparing their militaries. Russia’s can’t even seem to conquer Ukraine while Germany’s in the 1930s-1940s nearly took over all of Europe.

[certified hummus supporter 🇵🇸🤝🇺🇸🤝🇺🇦]

https://twitter.com/ZelenskyyUa/status/1581198080191664128?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7...
The comments are brutal. More money taken away from American taxpayers for a hopeless foreign war they have no investment in.

Isolationists are rats but what else is new? But speaking for myself and probably for others, I'm f*****g glad MY tax dollars is being used to help people fight for their own freedom from a deluded tyrant with imperial ambitions.

[Virginiá]

Events over the past 2 months have proven that the war isn't hopeless, actually.

[BG-NY]

Russia needs to get out of there immediately and pay reparations for this invasion. It's 2022. Borders mean something. Can't invade a damned country.

[Anti-Trump Truth Socialite JD Vance Enjoying Juror]

https://twitter.com/ZelenskyyUa/status/1581198080191664128?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7...
The comments are brutal. More money taken away from American taxpayers for a hopeless foreign war they have no investment in.

Isolationists are rats but what else is new? But speaking for myself and probably for others, I'm f*****g glad MY tax dollars is being used to help people fight for their own freedom from a deluded tyrant with imperial ambitions.

Definitely. How many wasteful and stupid government programs are support with tax money? The Ukraine aid money is far more useful per dollar spent than most of them.

[NOVA Green]

Russia needs to get out of there immediately and pay reparations for this invasion. It's 2022. Borders mean something. Can't invade a damned country.

Agree 100%, but alas this is extremely unlikely to happen for many reasons.

[OSR stands with Israel]

https://twitter.com/ZelenskyyUa/status/1581198080191664128?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7...
The comments are brutal. More money taken away from American taxpayers for a hopeless foreign war they have no investment in.

Okay traitor.

This isn’t helpful in any way. It almost reminds me of how people were post-9/11 if you questioned Bush’s actions at all. For months we have been sending money to Ukraine and I haven’t seen any results whatsoever. There is still a war and I see no signs Ukraine is even close to winning. Do we just keep sending them a blank check indefinitely? And would Ukraine support us if we truly needed them? Where is the cutoff here and why?

To be clear I am not defending Russia’s actions in any way, that would be ridiculous. But we need to move toward peace in some way; this isn’t sustainable in the long term and could drag out for years.

even if it drags out for years, that means the russkies are fighting over there and not at America's shores.

that's y its important to help the forces of global democracy over there fight Axis of Evil regimes before they get out of control and can do even more damage and threaten the entire world rather than just their region.

If the west had toppled Hitler in 1933 many millions would have survived who instead died due to appeasement that allowed the forces of evil time to gain strength.

I understand the logic here but Putin is hardly Adolf Hitler. Russia is a weak second-world country whose military has proven to be ill-equipped and unprepared for combat. it is hardly the type of army that Germany had in the 40s, and I doubt he could even defeat Poland at this point.

NATO is the red line. If he goes after any NATO country then I fully support military involvement, though Poland by itself would likely be able to take them for that matter. I feel for Ukraine, I truly do, but I don’t think Putin poses much of a threat for anyone else other than them.

Imagine thinking that, a, Putin isn't utterly morally reprehensible and bloody as Hitler simply because he hasn't literally reopened book involved, b, that fundamental American strategic interests are not at play here despite Ukraine not - at least yet - being a NATO member, or c, that despite its corruption and difficulties it is fundamentally on the side of liberal democracy under attack from a bunch of mass raping, child torturing, ethnic kidnapping/cleansing purveyors of mass War atrocities.

My remark about Hitler wasn’t because I was comparing their mortality. Putin is certainly a bloodthirsty dictator in the same ideological realm as Hitler. Instead I was comparing their militaries. Russia’s can’t even seem to conquer Ukraine while Germany’s in the 1930s-1940s nearly took over all of Europe.

The reason for this is cause the UK/French really didnt do anything to try to stop Hitler until it was too late .

[citizenZ]

https://thehill.com/opinion/campaign/3673208-is-american-support-for-ukraine-on-borrowed-time/

The American public starting to tire on this.

[Woody]

Along with Mykolaiv, Kyiv has been targeted by Iranian Shahed drones during the morning. Central train station & some residential buildings.

https://twitter.com/WillemBod/status/1581905973211729921
https://twitter.com/InsiderEng/status/1581909875780513792
https://twitter.com/_MajorNews/status/1581859422199914497
https://twitter.com/AFP/status/1581894081927839744

[Woody]

More cities were hit by Shaheds:

https://twitter.com/NewsFromDonbass/status/1581919085679742976
https://twitter.com/halka_kom/status/1581917133998784515

[jaichind]

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/us-signals-slowdown-high-end-munitions-deliveries-ukraine

"US poised for slowdown in high-end munitions deliveries to Ukraine"

Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin signaled this week that the U.S. and its Western allies are having trouble keeping pace with Ukraine’s demand for the advanced weaponry it needs to fend off Russia’s invasion. That signal reflects dwindling supplies for Ukraine and fear in the White House of escalation that could lead to war between the U.S. and Russia.

[Person Man]

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/us-signals-slowdown-high-end-munitions-deliveries-ukraine

"US poised for slowdown in high-end munitions deliveries to Ukraine"

Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin signaled this week that the U.S. and its Western allies are having trouble keeping pace with Ukraine’s demand for the advanced weaponry it needs to fend off Russia’s invasion. That signal reflects dwindling supplies for Ukraine and fear in the White House of escalation that could lead to war between the U.S. and Russia.

Yes. Russia not being stopped in Ukraine will make a direct confrontation with Russia inevitable.

[Woody]

https://twitter.com/SundPamela/status/1581994958504202240

[jaichind]

https://twitter.com/SundPamela/status/1581994958504202240

It seems to be a bad idea for him to be promising total victory.  Total victory for either side is pretty much impossible so it will just undermine his credibility when he could not deliver it.  Worse, he might take unnecessary risks in trying to achieve it.

[Sir Mohamed]

Perhaps we also need to send Ukraine drones to strike Russian military targets even more effectively, including on Russian soil if used to terrorize Ukraine.

[jaichind]

Perhaps we also need to send Ukraine drones to strike Russian military targets even more effectively, including on Russian soil if used to terrorize Ukraine.

It is more than fair for Ukraine to ask for help to have the ability to do that.  It is up to the collective West to decide if they want to take a risk of providing such abilities.

[Virginiá]

https://twitter.com/EuromaidanPress/status/1581964809062391808

[Woody]

https://twitter.com/DWIS_OSINT/status/1582021590254247937
https://twitter.com/PEDROLUISCARM11/status/1582013080417861633

[Stranger in a strange land]

https://thehill.com/opinion/campaign/3673208-is-american-support-for-ukraine-on-borrowed-time/

The American public starting to tire on this.

When an article title is framed as a question, the answer is usually, "no", "it depends", or "it's the wrong question". However, there is a relevant concern about the relative weakness of support for Aid to Ukraine among American conservatives. The smart way to pitch aid for Ukraine to Right-Wingers is:
- Instead of emphasizing the "Rules-based international order" or "liberal values", frame it in terms of borders, sovereignty, and territorial integrity, all of which are key elements of said order, but are the elements that right-wingers like.
- Hammer home relentlessly that Russia is a de-facto ally of China, and that weakening Russia causes them to become more of a drain on China
- The War finally achieves Trump's goal of getting most of Europe to invest in Defense
- Talk up the strength of American weapons. Talk about how many weapons are being transferred or deployed and what types, not how much they cost.

[Anti-Trump Truth Socialite JD Vance Enjoying Juror]

https://thehill.com/opinion/campaign/3673208-is-american-support-for-ukraine-on-borrowed-time/

The American public starting to tire on this.

This is an opinion piece by a Republican political consultant which never actually provides hard data implying that support for Ukraine is going down. Do you even read these links before spamming them here?

[Hindsight was 2020]

The dude has a capital Z in his username why are you bothering to engage in him like he isn’t anything other than a pro Russian troll?