Trump approval ratings thread 1.6
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Brittain33
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« Reply #1975 on: June 09, 2020, 04:46:12 PM »




lol Polls aren’t predictive.

They look at past. Wake me up when next months numbers are trending higher with the reopening and Econ numbers

In this case, polling below 45% approval in June correlates 100% with losing reelection in November.

Correct word. But who gives a damn the correlation?

Shame they relationship you were looking for that doesn’t exist is casual.

I think you meant “causal.”

It would be odd for low poll numbers to *cause* a President to lose office. Polls in June can’t vote, they can’t run a campaign, they expire five months before the Election. So, no, there’s no causal relationship between June polls and a President’s losing reelection.

It’s banal to note that polls represent the same underlying causes that lead a President to lose election.
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Obama-Biden Democrat
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« Reply #1976 on: June 09, 2020, 07:17:43 PM »

Donald Trump increasingly looks like the Boss from Hell -- the imperious superior who seems to wreck the institution that he commands. He makes managerial mistakes that an assistant manager at a fast-food restaurant wouldn't dream of doing.

But even worse, he does things that suggest a despot. He has assembled enforcers with police powers, responsible to no courts of law or legislative oversight,  but to whose authority is nebulous (if not overtly to the Great and Infallible Leader himself) Such is practically the definition of a secret police.

At this point I can think of one perfect nominee for Attorney General in January 2021. Keen legal mind, figures things out fast, doesn't show his hand, adheres strictly to legal precedent, and has a "do the crime and do the time" attitude.  The nightmare for a gangster, terrorist, corrupt public official, or large-scale swindler, don't you think?   

Doug Jones or Sri Srinivasan, would be fantastic impartial arbiters of the law as AG. Which would lead to our criminal fraudster mob boss president and his mafia goons in some serious legal trouble.

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pbrower2a
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« Reply #1977 on: June 10, 2020, 12:10:02 AM »

I saw some polls of Georgia and Iowa. The one in Georgia did not include any approval or favorability rating. The one in Iowa shows favorability, and that is 44-53. Because favorability and approval numbers are becoming harder to distinguish I can only imagine what that says of an approval rating in Iowa.

In any event, both states break even between Trump and Biden, which is what really counts. Democrats have an excellent chance to oust Joni Ernst in favor of Theresa Greenfield... and with approval numbers going bad for Chuck Grassley, 2022 might be a good time for him to retire.   
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pbrower2a
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« Reply #1978 on: June 10, 2020, 04:45:19 AM »

Kaier, Michigan.

It did not change the map, but it contains some remarkable detail:

4. Do you generally approve or disapprove of the job Donald Trump has done handling the
coronavirus pandemic?

• Strongly approve – 20%
• Somewhat approve – 19%
• Somewhat disapprove – 11%
• Strongly disapprove – 49%
• Total approve – 39%
• Total disapprove – 60%

5. Do you generally approve or disapprove of the job Gretchen Whitmer has done handling
the coronavirus pandemic?

• Strongly approve – 37%
• Somewhat approve – 32%
• Somewhat disapprove – 10%
• Strongly disapprove – 21%
• Total approve – 69%
• Total disapprove – 31%

6. How often, if at all, do you wear a protective mask when you leave your house and might
be in contact with other people?

• All of the time – 60%
• Most of the time – 24%
• Some of the time – 11%
• None of the time – 5%

13. Recently, Michigan announced that every registered voter in the state will be sent an
application to vote by mail for the August and November elections. Do you approve or
disapprove of this decision?

• Strongly approve – 58%
• Somewhat approve – 23%
• Somewhat disapprove – 7%
• Strongly disapprove – 12%
• Total approve – 81%
• Total disapprove – 19%

14. In your opinion, should demonstrators be permitted to carry guns inside the state Capitol
building, or should they not be permitted to carry guns inside the state Capitol building?

• Demonstrators SHOULD be permitted to carry guns inside the state Capitol – 13%
• Demonstrators should NOT be permitted to carry guns inside the state Capitol – 80%
• Not sure – 7%

15. In your opinion, are recent deaths of black individuals during police encounters isolated
incidents, or are they signs of a bigger problem?

• Isolated incidents – 24%
• Signs of a bigger problem – 68%
• Not sure – 9%

https://static1.squarespace.com/static/5e111a934eae7b3046095283/t/5edfa962ec4d69061a960910/1591716195220/Kiaer+Research+Poll+May-June+2020+-+Press



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GeorgiaModerate
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« Reply #1979 on: June 10, 2020, 07:28:52 AM »

Morning Consult/Politico, June 6-7, 1992 RV (1-week change)

Morning Consult does a ton of polls, so for consistency I'm only doing their weekly(ish) tracker for Politico.

Approve 39 (-2)
Disapprove 58 (+3)

Strongly approve 22 (nc)
Strongly disapprove 47 (+2)
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GeorgiaModerate
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« Reply #1980 on: June 10, 2020, 08:18:08 AM »

Who said they were waiting for Gallup...?

Gallup, May 28-June 4, 1034 adults (prior poll May 1-13)

Approve 39 (-10)
Disapprove 57 (+9)
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Panda Express
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« Reply #1981 on: June 10, 2020, 08:22:19 AM »

Wake me up when the Gallup poll comes out.

Wake up
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woodley park
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« Reply #1982 on: June 10, 2020, 08:47:13 AM »

Who said they were waiting for Gallup...?

Gallup, May 28-June 4, 1034 adults (prior poll May 1-13)

Approve 39 (-10)
Disapprove 57 (+9)

It is going to be a beautiful day.
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Ashley Biden's Diary
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« Reply #1983 on: June 10, 2020, 08:53:51 AM »

Who said they were waiting for Gallup...?

Gallup, May 28-June 4, 1034 adults (prior poll May 1-13)

Approve 39 (-10)
Disapprove 57 (+9)

If Trump wins again I will never pay attention to any polls ever again, even as someone obsessed with polls. Someone this unpopular a little less than 5 months before the election cannot win.
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TrendsareUsuallyReal
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« Reply #1984 on: June 10, 2020, 08:57:47 AM »

I just consider everyone who claims to neither approve or disapprove as a lost cause. If they can’t make up their minds at this point, they are definitely with Trump but too embarrassed to admit it
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GeorgiaModerate
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« Reply #1985 on: June 10, 2020, 09:11:44 AM »

The Economist/YouGov weekly tracker, June 7-9, 1500 adults including 1241 RV

Adults:

Approve 43 (+3)
Disapprove 52 (-1)

Strongly approve 24 (nc)
Strongly disapprove 41 (-1)


RV:

Approve 43 (nc)
Disapprove 56 (+1)

Strongly approve 26 (-1)
Strongly disapprove 47 (+1)

Biden 49 (+2), Trump 41 (+1)

GCB: D 47 (+1), R 39 (-1)
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The Mikado
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« Reply #1986 on: June 10, 2020, 09:44:53 AM »

I just consider everyone who claims to neither approve or disapprove as a lost cause. If they can’t make up their minds at this point, they are definitely with Trump but too embarrassed to admit it

More likely, they're "Trump/Not voting swing voters."

They're not voting Dem, sure, but they're not necessarily voting at all.
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Badger
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« Reply #1987 on: June 10, 2020, 10:12:38 AM »

Civiqs tracker, 6/5

Trump job approval: 40/57 (-17)

Alaska: 47/50 (-3)
Arizona: 40/57 (-17)
Colorado: 36/61 (-25)
Florida: 45/52 (-7)
Georgia: 44/53 (-9)
Iowa: 45/52 (-7)
Kansas: 49/48 (+1)
Michigan: 41/56 (-15)
Minnesota: 37/60 (-23)
Nevada: 37/60 (-23)
New Hampshire: 37/59 (-22)
New Mexico: 44/53 (-9)
North Carolina: 43/54 (-11)
Ohio: 45/53 (-8)
Pennsylvania: 42/54 (-12)
Texas: 47/50 (-3)
Virginia: 39/58 (-19)
Wisconsin: 43/54 (-11)

https://civiqs.com/results/approve_president_trump?uncertainty=true&annotations=true&zoomIn=true

Surprisingly good numbers for Trump in New Mexico, relatively speaking.
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wbrocks67
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« Reply #1988 on: June 10, 2020, 10:41:30 AM »

Nice to see Gallup back to reality now.
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pbrower2a
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« Reply #1989 on: June 10, 2020, 11:04:12 AM »

Crayons out for Civiqs 50-state polling data (again not to be confused with other polls) for May 2020.

https://civiqs.com/results/approve_president_trump?uncertainty=true&annotations=true&zoomIn=true



Approval:

60% or higher for Trump  (saturation 9)
55-59  (saturation 7)

51-54 (saturation 5)
exactly 50 (saturation 3)
below 50 but above disapproval 


exact ties white -- but none this time

above 45 but lower than disapproval (saturation 2)
43-45 (saturation 4)

40-42 (saturation 6)
under 40 (saturation 8 )


It's a different scale from which you may be accustomed...

I do not have symmetry.  I use the 43-45 zone as one in which an incumbent  has some chance to win if he begins the electoral season with such support -- with a spirited and competent campaign and no disasters.  40-42? Possible but unlikely. Under 40? It is rare.

46-49 has an above 50% chance of winning, barring calamities. 50%? Overrwhelming chance. 51% or higher? High 50's or higher.   
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Donald Trump’s Toupée
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« Reply #1990 on: June 10, 2020, 11:24:27 AM »

Polls lag by up to a week.

Since all those bad polls were released, the riots and violence has stopped, and we got an excellent May jobs report. What exactly do you expect for the polls coming up and into recovery summer? (Rhetorical question, they will go up....).

Anyone who thinks Trump has lost the election has no clue to either how polls work and/or about elections in general.
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pbrower2a
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« Reply #1991 on: June 10, 2020, 11:30:42 AM »

Polls lag by up to a week.

Since all those bad polls were released, the riots and violence has stopped, and we got an excellent May jobs report. What exactly do you expect for the polls coming up and into recovery summer? (Rhetorical question, they will go up....).

Anyone who thinks Trump has lost the election has no clue to either how polls work and/or about elections in general.

I am not ready to say that there will be no rebound. In fact what I see in early June is even worse than May polling.

Over 100,000 Americans will never recover from COVID-19. Any economic recovery will be slow as people steadily start doing what they did before COVID-19.

Trump has shown the level of his leadership under stress -- and it is very poor. 

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wbrocks67
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« Reply #1992 on: June 10, 2020, 12:10:39 PM »

Polls lag by up to a week.

Since all those bad polls were released, the riots and violence has stopped, and we got an excellent May jobs report. What exactly do you expect for the polls coming up and into recovery summer? (Rhetorical question, they will go up....).

Anyone who thinks Trump has lost the election has no clue to either how polls work and/or about elections in general.

YouGov literally just polled June 7-9 (Sunday-Tuesday), days after the jobs report and as protests subside. Biden's lead actually jumped week to week, Biden's favorability went up, Trump's approval among RV went down.
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ηєω ƒяσηтιєя
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« Reply #1993 on: June 10, 2020, 12:30:55 PM »

Civiqs tracker, 6/5

Trump job approval: 40/57 (-17)

Alaska: 47/50 (-3)
Arizona: 40/57 (-17)
Colorado: 36/61 (-25)
Florida: 45/52 (-7)
Georgia: 44/53 (-9)
Iowa: 45/52 (-7)
Kansas: 49/48 (+1)
Michigan: 41/56 (-15)
Minnesota: 37/60 (-23)
Nevada: 37/60 (-23)
New Hampshire: 37/59 (-22)
New Mexico: 44/53 (-9)
North Carolina: 43/54 (-11)
Ohio: 45/53 (-8)
Pennsylvania: 42/54 (-12)
Texas: 47/50 (-3)
Virginia: 39/58 (-19)
Wisconsin: 43/54 (-11)

https://civiqs.com/results/approve_president_trump?uncertainty=true&annotations=true&zoomIn=true

Surprisingly good numbers for Trump in New Mexico, relatively speaking.
Yeah, it's surprising but I've seen Civiqs say that his approval rating in NM was 47/50 as recent as 2 weeks ago. I think that polling New Mexico must be more difficult. It is one of the poorest states in the country.
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« Reply #1994 on: June 10, 2020, 12:32:15 PM »

Who said they were waiting for Gallup...?

Gallup, May 28-June 4, 1034 adults (prior poll May 1-13)

Approve 39 (-10)
Disapprove 57 (+9)
Finally Gallup is back in reality.
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tagimaucia
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« Reply #1995 on: June 10, 2020, 12:33:31 PM »

It seems to me that the economic situation hasn’t been driving Trumps approval or standing in the horse race much at all, at least up to this point (seeing as how his economic approval is still positive in the polls I’ve seen). It’s clearly been mostly about his reaction to Covid and BLM/protests.

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GeorgiaModerate
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« Reply #1996 on: June 10, 2020, 12:37:47 PM »

Cross-posted from the 2020 board:

https://www.cnn.com/2020/06/10/politics/trump-campaign-cnn-poll/index.html

Quote
Washington (CNN)President Donald Trump's campaign is demanding CNN retract and apologize for a recent poll that showed him well behind presumptive Democratic presidential nominee Joe Biden.

The demand, coming in the form of a cease and desist letter to CNN President Jeff Zucker, was immediately rejected by the network.
"We stand by our poll," said Matt Dornic, a CNN spokesman.

I don't even know what to say about this.
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pbrower2a
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« Reply #1997 on: June 10, 2020, 01:06:30 PM »

Who said they were waiting for Gallup...?

Gallup, May 28-June 4, 1034 adults (prior poll May 1-13)

Approve 39 (-10)
Disapprove 57 (+9)

How often do you see a slip that severe?
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pbrower2a
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« Reply #1998 on: June 10, 2020, 01:10:00 PM »

Prior threads have closed at 20K. Not this time. I had set up some utilities for "1.7", and I am going to post that handful of posts  just to remind us of where we would be in "1.7"... if we were starting over. Please bear with me as I add those. A refresher is in order on those utilities.
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pbrower2a
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« Reply #1999 on: June 10, 2020, 01:11:21 PM »
« Edited: June 12, 2020, 12:34:50 PM by pbrower2a »

Here is a blank map for general use:




Without electoral votes and with no distinction for districts:



Please don't post here yet. "1.5" is still alive.


----------------------------------------

The fundamental beginning of the 2020 Presidential campaign -- states and districts within 10% of being even in the 2016 Presidential election:


2016 result among states decided by 10% or less:





8% or more -- saturation 7
4% to 7.99% -- saturation 5
1.5% to 2.99% -- saturation 3
under 1.5% -- saturation 2

States in gray look too far away to be affected by a shift in votes from 2016 to polling in 2018. Should any such state go into play, then differences between 2016 and 2020 ar profound in the extreme. This range of states is between 203 and 413 electoral votes for a Democrat (and 125 and 335 for Trump). Assuming that no state that Trump lost by 10% or more in 2016 will vote for him in 2020, President Trump has at most a chance for being re-elected much like Obama in 2012 -- but he can lose as badly as GHWB did in 1992.

Remember that if such a state as Oregon goes into play for Trump, then the Democrat is in supreme trouble and at risk of losing a landslide. On the other side, if a state such as Missouri goes into play, then Trump is at risk of a landslide loss. Because there is no distinction between winning with 270 and 335 (or 413, or even 538 electoral votes)... the significance of a landslide win or loss is coattails in Congress

This is still relevant 43 months after the 2016 election and 5 months before the 2020 election.  

..................................................

Furthermore, the electoral histories of the states are relevant over the last five Presidential elections. All but the 2008 election were close, and I am not going to show anything before 2000 because several states that used to be reliably D in their voting are quite the opposite now.

How states have voted from 2000 on:




all 5 for the Republican
4 R, 1 D
3 R, 2D  
3 D, 2 R
4 D, 1 R
all five for the Democrat


If there is to be any show of any swing to 2016, then it is from 2000 if it is to show any change in state's electoral habits. The 2016 election is more similar to that of 2000 than to any other and thus as it begins it is more comparable to 2004 in that

(1) both involved open seats
(2) both followed a Democrat who had won decisive majorities in the electoral vote in the two prior elections
(3) both had the winner of the plurality of the popular vote losing the electoral vote
(4) neither election was a decisive mandate for change although the winner so interpreted the election as such
(5) both Dubya and Trump promised peace and prosperity with a basis in pro-business solutions above all else
(6) both Dubya and Trump had rather thin experience in electoral politics (Dubya had been Governor of Texas, but that is a largely ceremonial task; Trump had no experience in electoral politics)
(7) both Dubya and Trump were derided in elite-to-mass media as ignorant buffoons.
(8 ) neither Dubya nor Trump had much margin for losing electoral support from their first Presidential election and winning the second time.

This is not to say that 2020 will be analogous to 2004.  An economic meltdown like that of 2008 could make 2008 or even 1932 more relevant. I can think of results analogous to 2008 for the 2020 election, but not 1932 (or 1980); such would unfold before us in unpredictable ways.  

..................................................

  
Flips based on 2000-2016 by margin:



(**favorite son as nominee in 2000. No asterisk for 2016 because both nominees were from New York
* state 'flipped" from 2000 to 2016)

swing 10% or more 80% saturation
swing 5-9.9% 60% saturation
swing 2-4.9% 40% saturation
swing under 2% 20% saturation

Utah -- a third-party nominee finished in second place above the Democrat in 2016, so I show this in green with no other significance.  

Ignore districts of Maine and Nebraska, as I have inadequate data on those.

color shows the direction of the swing of the margin -- red to the Democrat, blue to the Republican


You are welcome to draw whatever conclusions you wish. Except that tiny swings from 2000 to 2016 were enough to swing Wisconsin and New Hampshire, swings that flipped the other states (CO, IA, MI, PA, VA) were much larger than necessary. It's obvious that except for Mississippi (which seems to vote close to an ethnic divide), the good old days for Democrats in the Mountain and Deep South (and this includes Missouri) from the New Deal to the 1990's are much in the past. Otherwise, Democrats seem to be doing better in the western US but decidedly worse (except for Illinois) in the Rust Belt.  You are also welcome to draw conclusions of applicability to 2020.  

I may not be accurate, and I would not pay much attention to small swings unless you want to make your changes.

----------------------------------------

Repeated verbatim from "1.5", as it has not really changed:

Assumptions that we can all reasonably make, lest everything be void:

1. That Donald Trump will be the Republican nominee for President -- that he will not decide not to run, that he will not die in office, and that he will not removed for diminished capacity (as after entering an irreversible coma).

2. That we will not have a military coup. Sure, we have never had one. But Seven Days in May is becoming much more plausible with this President, if for very different reasons. Doddering old leader? Check. Highly unpopular leader? Check. "Too liberal"? The opposite. "Too squeamish about taking harsh measures"? Exactly the opposite.

I would not rule out that the military would turn on him rather than soil itself in aggressive war against Iran or Venezuela. Yes, the military has not intervened in the government at any time  in American history, and 240 years of civilian control of the military will come to an end only under exceptional circumstances.

So imagine that you are a four-star general and you must choose between overthrowing Donald Trump or becoming complicit in war crimes. You don't know what you would do? Even I can't speak for myself.

3. That the elections of 2020 will not be rigged. The 2018 Congressional, Senatorial, and Gubernatorial elections looked clean enough.

4. That the Democrat (Joe Biden) will not be exposed in having done something discreditable -- insider trading, having sex with minors, being involved in a business failure the result of malfeasance, having a dishonorable discharge from the military, or having a criminal record. That is clearly in the category of 'unforeseen events'  that have nothing to do with polling.

5. That we can derive any conclusions from polling. By November 2010 we could see Obama within easy reach of winning re-election even if his Party was severely defeated in the midterm election -- it would take a spirited campaign by him and competent strategy as a candidate to turn approval in the 45-47% range into either a bare majority or even a plurality. It is a reasonable assumption that a spirited campaign and good campaign strategy were good for turning something like 45% approval into 51% of the vote. Obama ran a competent enough campaign with which to win despite a disapproval rating in the mid 40s around September 1 (just after the Republican national convention, I guess).  44% + 7% = 51%, so it looks as if he did what he needed.  

I look at recent polling numbers for Donald Trump, and he will be lucky to get 46% of the popular vote. Sure, he won with 46% of the popular vote because Hillary Clinton ran up the vote totals in places like California and New York -- but just look at the polling for Arizona, Florida, Michigan, Minnesota, Ohio, and Wisconsin. Trump could lose every one of those states based on polling that we have already seen.

That disapproval of a nominee is in the 50s may not assure that that nominee will lose 54-46 to the opponent. Maybe it will be more like 49-46-5, which only looks sort of close.

6. That Democrats will not be facing a strong left-wing alternative that guts their support. This is the most likely thing to go wrong for the Democratic nominee for President. I cannot yet rule it out.

7. That there will be no event that changes American political culture by identifying the President with some rush of patriotism or a movement toward a right-wing 'religious revival' to the benefit of 'conservative' politics.  I see nothing of the sort. Today's young adults are seemingly abandoning religion.    

But I can't completely rule out such things as an invasion from outer space, an eruption of a supervolcano or meteor strike that does great damage to human populations, a zombie apocalypse, or the Coming of a Messiah, either.  Any of these makes the Presidential election an irrelevant concern.

Time is running out for any of those things to change.

Voter participation:

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