MA-SEN Megathread: Senator Markey wins

[brucejoel99]

It’s pathetic how much everyone on this thread is buying Markeys BS just because they’re anti-dynasty. Even if JK is likely to do more for Massachusetts. I’d say thank god my state is smarter than this thread but clearly from all indications they aren’t

It's pathetic how much you (both in this thread & presumably in real life too) are buying JKIII's BS just because you're pro-dynasty. Even if Markey has literally shown time & time again just how much he does for Massachusetts. Thank god all indications clearly show that your state is smarter than you.

[Mike Thick]

It’s pathetic how much everyone on this thread is buying Markeys BS just because they’re anti-dynasty. Even if JK is likely to do more for Massachusetts. I’d say thank god my state is smarter than this thread but clearly from all indications they aren’t

[Roronoa D. Law]

I'm so glad I never got engaged into this race.

[Amenhotep Bakari-Sellers]

Now, since Warren is certainly going for Cabinet, Pressley will get the seat, not Kennedy

[Tekken_Guy]

Now, since Warren is certainly going for Cabinet, Pressley will get the seat, not Kennedy

Isn’t Pressley the reason why Kennedy ran against Markey in the first place?

[GoTfan]

Now, since Warren is certainly going for Cabinet, Pressley will get the seat, not Kennedy

Isn’t Pressley the reason why Kennedy ran against Markey in the first place?

I'm inclined to tnink so. Running against Pressley will be very, very difficult for Kennedy if he loses here and decides to dive at Warren's seat.

[brucejoel99]

Now, since Warren is certainly going for Cabinet, Pressley will get the seat, not Kennedy

Isn’t Pressley the reason why Kennedy ran against Markey in the first place?

I'm inclined to tnink so. Running against Pressley will be very, very difficult for Kennedy if he loses here and decides to dive at Warren's seat.

Yeah, the fact that it would've been difficult in any event given her popularity is probably the reason he decided to go now for Markey, whom he probably (& seemingly wrongly) assumed would be easier to beat than Pressley.

[GoTfan]

Now, since Warren is certainly going for Cabinet, Pressley will get the seat, not Kennedy

Isn’t Pressley the reason why Kennedy ran against Markey in the first place?

I'm inclined to tnink so. Running against Pressley will be very, very difficult for Kennedy if he loses here and decides to dive at Warren's seat.

Yeah, the fact that it would've been difficult in any event given her popularity is probably the reason he decided to go now for Markey, whom he probably (& seemingly wrongly) assumed would be easier to beat than Pressley.

It's incredible to think we live in a world where a Kennedy could lose two Senate races.

[brucejoel99]

Now, since Warren is certainly going for Cabinet, Pressley will get the seat, not Kennedy

Isn’t Pressley the reason why Kennedy ran against Markey in the first place?

I'm inclined to tnink so. Running against Pressley will be very, very difficult for Kennedy if he loses here and decides to dive at Warren's seat.

Yeah, the fact that it would've been difficult in any event given her popularity is probably the reason he decided to go now for Markey, whom he probably (& seemingly wrongly) assumed would be easier to beat than Pressley.

It's incredible to think we live in a world where a Kennedy could lose two Senate races.

In Massachusetts, no less!

[Tekken_Guy]

What about Seth Moulton? I always felt he was eyeing this Senate too.

[YE]

What about Seth Moulton? I always felt he was eyeing this Senate too.

I’d support Kennedy in a primary before I support Moulton.

[TiltsAreUnderrated]

What about Seth Moulton? I always felt he was eyeing this Senate too.

Moulton got burnt thanks to his failed revolt against Pelosi being followed up all too quickly by a flop of a presidential bid. He could make a comeback in time, but winning a statewide primary in the near future would seem to be a very uphill battle for a moderate who isn't exactly famed for his charisma or connections in the House. Perhaps his best shot at the Senate (without being prepared to jump from Congress to another statewide office first) is as the Totally Electable Guy^TM in the event of a Charlie Baker upset.

[Tekken_Guy]

What about Seth Moulton? I always felt he was eyeing this Senate too.

I’d support Kennedy in a primary before I support Moulton.

Would he do better or worse than Kennedy in a hypothetical primary vs. Pressley?

[YE]

What about Seth Moulton? I always felt he was eyeing this Senate too.

I’d support Kennedy in a primary before I support Moulton.

Would he do better or worse than Kennedy in a hypothetical primary vs. Pressley?

I see no reason why him of all people would have any sort of appeal in the Dem primary electorate. Would probably do worse than Kennedy.

[We Live in Black and White]

What about Seth Moulton? I always felt he was eyeing this Senate too.

I’d support Kennedy in a primary before I support Moulton.

Would he do better or worse than Kennedy in a hypothetical primary vs. Pressley?

Worse. By a subtantial margin. Kennedy may be an entitled little s**t, but he's an entitled little s**t with legacy power.

[TiltsAreUnderrated]

So far, only Hoyer had openly participated in this primary.
https://twitter.com/greggiroux/status/1294693774782877696

[brucejoel99]

So far, only Hoyer had openly participated in this primary.
https://twitter.com/greggiroux/status/1294693774782877696

https://twitter.com/hjessy_/status/1294696586870755329

[Dipper Josh]

So far, only Hoyer had openly participated in this primary.
https://twitter.com/greggiroux/status/1294693774782877696

https://twitter.com/hjessy_/status/1294696586870755329

Even if that was the reason, that still doesn't excuse it. Why would you have to even it out? Why would want to be neutral in this race?

Staying neutral isn't a good thing when it's a principled politician getting primaried by a shameless opportunist.

[Farmlands]

I'm so glad I never got engaged into this race.

I was more engaged (and anxious) when it looked like Kennedy really was going to win than now. I guess fear really is a more powerful motivator than optimism.

[brucejoel99]

So far, only Hoyer had openly participated in this primary.
https://twitter.com/greggiroux/status/1294693774782877696

https://twitter.com/hjessy_/status/1294696586870755329

Even if that was the reason, that still doesn't excuse it. Why would you have to even it out? Why would want to be neutral in this race?

Staying neutral isn't a good thing when it's a principled politician getting primaried by a shameless opportunist.

Maybe she's just helping out a colleague? The PAC she created was specifically made for young upstarts like JKIII, after all. And not to mention, Schumer & the DSCC have both endorsed & are helping Markey fend off JKIII, so it's not like Pelosi - at worst - staying neutral is the end of the world for Markey or anything.

Plus, it's not like she's lacking in the department of helping principled politicians when they're primaried by shameless opportunists: she just successfully worked to help all 3 primaried Squad members fend off their challengers.

[MillennialModerate]

So far, only Hoyer had openly participated in this primary.
https://twitter.com/greggiroux/status/1294693774782877696

https://twitter.com/hjessy_/status/1294696586870755329

Even if that was the reason, that still doesn't excuse it. Why would you have to even it out? Why would want to be neutral in this race?

Staying neutral isn't a good thing when it's a principled politician getting primaried by a shameless opportunist.

HAHAHAHAHAHAH. principled politican.

As someone who actually lives here and knows what Markey is - and don’t get me wrong I agree with many of his positions but principled is not him.

Well you’ll all get your wish sadly but my god are you being sold a bill of goods

[KaiserDave]

So far, only Hoyer had openly participated in this primary.
https://twitter.com/greggiroux/status/1294693774782877696

https://twitter.com/hjessy_/status/1294696586870755329

Even if that was the reason, that still doesn't excuse it. Why would you have to even it out? Why would want to be neutral in this race?

Staying neutral isn't a good thing when it's a principled politician getting primaried by a shameless opportunist.

HAHAHAHAHAHAH. principled politican.

As someone who actually lives here and knows what Markey is - and don’t get me wrong I agree with many of his positions but principled is not him.

Well you’ll all get your wish sadly but my god are you being sold a bill of goods

You’re never going to explain are you

K

[brucejoel99]

So far, only Hoyer had openly participated in this primary.
https://twitter.com/greggiroux/status/1294693774782877696

https://twitter.com/hjessy_/status/1294696586870755329

Even if that was the reason, that still doesn't excuse it. Why would you have to even it out? Why would want to be neutral in this race?

Staying neutral isn't a good thing when it's a principled politician getting primaried by a shameless opportunist.

HAHAHAHAHAHAH. principled politican.

As someone who actually lives here and knows what Markey is - and don’t get me wrong I agree with many of his positions but principled is not him.

Well you’ll all get your wish sadly but my god are you being sold a bill of goods

You’re never going to explain are you

K

No, he's never gonna tell us what's wrong with Markey because - as we all know & a majority of Massachusetts Democrats have evidently come to realize - there isn't anything wrong with Markey. The only issue MillennialModerate has with Markey is that his last name isn't Kennedy, but he won't actually tell us that explicitly - even though we all know it's true - because he knows deep down it's just not a defensible position in any rationally reasonable way.

If we're lucky, though, maybe he'll tell us whether or not his ass gets jealous of all the sh*t that comes out of his mouth!

[MillennialModerate]

So far, only Hoyer had openly participated in this primary.
https://twitter.com/greggiroux/status/1294693774782877696

https://twitter.com/hjessy_/status/1294696586870755329

Even if that was the reason, that still doesn't excuse it. Why would you have to even it out? Why would want to be neutral in this race?

Staying neutral isn't a good thing when it's a principled politician getting primaried by a shameless opportunist.

HAHAHAHAHAHAH. principled politican.

As someone who actually lives here and knows what Markey is - and don’t get me wrong I agree with many of his positions but principled is not him.

Well you’ll all get your wish sadly but my god are you being sold a bill of goods

You’re never going to explain are you

K

What is there to explain? By a lot of members here and by the red rose crew on Twitter he’s being painted as some saint of the far left who has always put his neck out when it wasn’t always the politically prudent thing to do. But that’s not the case. I’m not the smartest person on these forums and I’m not pretending to be and I’ve gotten some things wrong and I will again but I feel a little less intelligent every time I read the Markey praise.

You could go back and read his record for highlights but just to name a few of the notable ones: He was vehemently against busing in Boston public schools, it would’ve been the politically courageous thing to do to support it but he opposed - a decision that surely saved his political ass back then but wasn’t the morally right one. He supported the ‘94 crime bill wholeheartedly - Now I understand I support Biden who had a role in that bill but don’t tell me that Markey is this darling of the left and fights for what is right over what is politically prudent. He voted for the Iraq war - What turned out to be a foreign policy disaster for this nation, found no WMD’s and cost the nation trillions that could’ve gone to other meaningful causes.

He spent less time in the state than every member of the Massachusetts delegation (including Warren who was RUNNING FOR PRESIDENT). He’s been known to be an absent political for years. The special election where he won the senate seat was known to be an apathetic race where Democratic voters were bored to tears with the options they had. Then in the general of that special election Markey won against a very mediocre canidate by just 10 points and actually lost more cities/towns than he won. He literally just likes holding the positions and gives off the impression he’s just going along for the ride.

Then he attatches his name to a bill introduced by an popular freshman congresswoman and he’s all of a sudden he’s this left wing darling? Give me a break.

And if you think some 70 something year old soon to be retired Ed Markey  - will get more accomplished for Massachusetts or have more influence for Massachusetts then a young, vibrant, enthusiastic guy who yes has the publicity & resources of the Kennedy name then I can’t help you.

[brucejoel99]

So far, only Hoyer had openly participated in this primary.
https://twitter.com/greggiroux/status/1294693774782877696

https://twitter.com/hjessy_/status/1294696586870755329

Even if that was the reason, that still doesn't excuse it. Why would you have to even it out? Why would want to be neutral in this race?

Staying neutral isn't a good thing when it's a principled politician getting primaried by a shameless opportunist.

HAHAHAHAHAHAH. principled politican.

As someone who actually lives here and knows what Markey is - and don’t get me wrong I agree with many of his positions but principled is not him.

Well you’ll all get your wish sadly but my god are you being sold a bill of goods

You’re never going to explain are you

K

What is there to explain? By a lot of members here and by the red rose crew on Twitter he’s being painted as some saint of the far left who has always put his neck out when it wasn’t always the politically prudent thing to do. But that’s not the case. I’m not the smartest person on these forums and I’m not pretending to be and I’ve gotten some things wrong and I will again but I feel a little less intelligent every time I read the Markey praise.

You literally said recently that both Atlas & Massachusetts are stupid for not being as eager to bow down before JKIII as you've been. "Not pretending to be the smartest person" my ass.

The only thing that should make you feel unintelligent is the fact that you're clearly not intelligent.

You could go back and read his record for highlights but just to name a few of the notable ones: He was vehemently against busing in Boston public schools, it would’ve been the politically courageous thing to do to support it but he opposed - a decision that surely saved his political ass back then but wasn’t the morally right one. He supported the ‘94 crime bill wholeheartedly - Now I understand I support Biden who had a role in that bill but don’t tell me that Markey is this darling of the left and fights for what is right over what is politically prudent. He voted for the Iraq war - What turned out to be a foreign policy disaster for this nation, found no WMD’s and cost the nation trillions that could’ve gone to other meaningful causes.

Okay? Yeah, those all suck but he's clearly changed course, proven himself to be a great ally for the State of Massachusetts to have, & stood on the side of working families much moreso than JKIII.

Not to mention, everybody (including our party's presidential nominee who, I'll remind you, you vehemently supported in the primaries) has changed course on those issues, so it's inarguably fair to call out that hypocrisy.

But hey, keep pretending that, had JKIII been in Congress in 1994, he wouldn't have voted for the crime bill. Yeah, it was a bad bill. Markey shouldn't have voted for it, but the idea that JKIII wouldn't have done the same (which was the politically expedient choice at the time) is f**king hilarious. Same for the Iraq War, & same for every other regressive policy that Markey supported. At least Markey's had the decency to evolve.

Or have you conveniently forgotten that JKIII was anti-marijuana until he changed his stance when it was obvious he'd otherwise be left behind, voted in favor of nuclear weapons, voted "against legislation curtailing the government's data snooping power," voted to curtail Dodd-Frank by making it harder to designate financial firms systemically important, co-sponsored the bill that would've banned boycotts of Israel (which, regardless of where you stand on Israel, is just wholly undemocratic in & of itself), & heavily invested in fossil fuel companies?

You shouldn't have, considering we've reminded you about all of this on this forum time & time again. No, you didn't forget about it. You just don't care. And that's fine (I mean, it's not, but whatever), but at least be honest about it.

He spent less time in the state than every member of the Massachusetts delegation (including Warren who was RUNNING FOR PRESIDENT). He’s been known to be an absent political for years. The special election where he won the senate seat was known to be an apathetic race where Democratic voters were bored to tears with the options they had. Then in the general of that special election Markey won against a very mediocre canidate by just 10 points and actually lost more cities/towns than he won. He literally just likes holding the positions and gives off the impression he’s just going along for the ride.

Cool, except that's not a legitimate criticism in anyway. Their job is in DC. Why on Earth should somebody give two sh*ts that they don't come home? That doesn't make them bad at their job, because their job is literally in DC. They represent Massachusetts in DC, not in Massachusetts.

If the best argument JKIII has as to why one should vote for him is because Markey spends his time in the place that the people have literally employed him to go to & represent them at, then that's an excellent argument for JKIII to f**k off. "You don't spend enough time in the state" would be a great argument for a state legislator whose job is literally in the state, sure. But if that really is the best argument JKIII has against Markey (& it seems to be, as that's seemingly the only coherent argument we've all heard), then he has absolutely nothing.

JKIII promising to spend more time at his mansion in the state rather than in DC where his job actually is isn't an argument for electing JKIII. Your Senator represents you in DC, not Massachusetts.

And how can you seriously believe with a straight face that JKIII isn't the one in the race who looks like somebody who just wants power for power's sake (which, yes, is more than enough reason to deny it to him)?

Then he attatches his name to a bill introduced by an popular freshman congresswoman and he’s all of a sudden he’s this left wing darling? Give me a break.

Attached his name to a bill introduced by a popular freshman congresswoman? Jesus christ, yet another issue that's been made clear to you on this forum before: not only did he co-write the resolution with her (so, if anything, it's equally his bill), but it was a full 7 years before AOC was even born when he began to lead the charge for environmental protections in the House. His long record of fighting for the environment is clear as day, especially considering he has a perfect score from the League of Conservation Voters & authored both the 2009 cap-&-trade bill as well as the 1982 Nuclear Freeze Resolution. To imply that his environmental activism is nothing more than an attempt to get the left-wing to support him in the here & now is a disingenuous, outright lie.

But you don't care that it's a lie. You know it's a lie. The only way you can actually attempt to sh*t on Markey is to lie.

And if you think some 70 something year old soon to be retired Ed Markey  - will get more accomplished for Massachusetts or have more influence for Massachusetts then a young, vibrant, enthusiastic guy who yes has the publicity & resources of the Kennedy name then I can’t help you.

For the umpteenth f**king time, the Senate doesn't operate according to publicity. It operates on seniority. If Markey wins, he starts off this next term with 8 years of seniority under his belt; if JKIII wins, he starts off with nothing (or, near nothing, depending on how many non-Representatives become freshmen Senator next year). So if I'm a Massachusetts voter & I want my Senator to carry maximum influence in the Senate, where their influence matters most, then I go for the guy who's already accumulated nearly a decade of seniority over the guy without it.

Not to mention, Markey is the ranking member on both East Asian & Pacific Affairs as well as Environment & Public Works Oversight, & it's that latter committee that's particularly key in regards to his influence, considering Markey has - again - been Capitol Hill's premier environmental activist since 1982.

As for JKIII accruing real influence, how can anybody reasonably square him being able to do that with his obvious ambitions? He's clearly proven that his House seat was nothing more than a springboard to him, & his haste here now suggests that he feels like he needs a Senate seat sooner rather than later, so who's to say the intent here isn't to just attempt to use the Senate seat as another springboard, too, meaning he wouldn't even wanna be in the Senate long enough to gain any real influence in the first place?

So no, JKIII is not gonna be able to use his "publicity" to be more influential for Massachusetts in the Senate than Markey's seniority would be because, again, the Senate doesn't operate on publicity. Seniority is all that matters: Markey's got it, & JKIII doesn't.

If you can't be honest about Markey caring more for the people of Massachusetts than JKIII, then we can't help you.