Biden VP news megathread (pg 286 - been selected, announcement could be today)

[Heebie Jeebie]

Kaine was not a great selection because he didn't offer anything that Clinton already didn't offer. And it's completely bizarre that anyone would think that voters saw Clinton as farther away from the center than Trump. Trump ran the most right-wing and extreme campaign in a long time. There was and is nothing centrist about him.

This is a bizarre rewriting of history.  Trump ran on a platform of avoiding all cuts to Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid (an enormous departure from conservative ideological orthodoxy and a huge move toward the center on economic issues),  skepticism of free trade, a little token praise of Planned Parenthood, and criticism of George W. Bush’s foreign policy.  He dropped all talk of reversing LGBTQ marriage equality.  Even on immigration, Trump’s position was not in any clear way more extreme than Paul Ryan's.  It's no surprise, then, that

https://twitter.com/ForecasterEnten/status/883742412279078912?ref_src=twsrc%5Etf...

Anyway, Clinton's main problems were that she was viewed as being too far left and too enmeshed in three decades of bitter partisan fights.  Kaine's boring-ness was the whole point!  He was the opposite of all that.  Choosing him as a running mate was intended to signal that, unlike Republicans and Trump, Democrats were stable, reasonable, and dependable.

[DrScholl]

Kaine was not a great selection because he didn't offer anything that Clinton already didn't offer. And it's completely bizarre that anyone would think that voters saw Clinton as farther away from the center than Trump. Trump ran the most right-wing and extreme campaign in a long time. There was and is nothing centrist about him.

This is a bizarre rewriting of history.  Trump ran on a platform of avoiding all cuts to Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid (an enormous departure from conservative ideological orthodoxy and a huge move toward the center on economic issues),  skepticism of free trade, a little token praise of Planned Parenthood, and criticism of George W. Bush’s foreign policy.  He dropped all talk of reversing LGBTQ marriage equality.  Even on immigration, Trump’s position was not in any clear way more extreme than Paul Ryan's.  It's no surprise, then, that

https://twitter.com/ForecasterEnten/status/883742412279078912?ref_src=twsrc%5Etf...

His promises were obviously not believable and were far overshadowed by his blatant racist rhetoric. The racist rhetoric is what got him through the primary and what won him the election. He appealed to racist instincts in many voters across the Midwest. Calling Mexicans rapists is not centrist.

[Sherrod Brown Shill]

Next week The convention can't come soon enough. I'm tired of the Pro vs Anti Kamala camps bickering about which one is more irritating. You both are!

I don't get the hype around her, nor do I get the disdain. Kamala is very generic center left Dem

Kamala is very left-wing. It's scary how fast American politics has shifted, lol. I feel like "moderate" voters like me are being force fed a bunch of leftwing gobbledygook just because we think Trump and the current GOP are garbage. I really want Trump and the GOP eliminated, but I'm skeptical of a lot of the proposals coming from Kamala and other dems. Just because she isn't as fanatical as Bernie/Warren doesn't mean Kamala is "center left"

Harris' biggest "sin' was that she ran against God King Emperor Sanders. Had she stayed put, the usual suspects wouldn't have whipped themselves into a frenzy against her.

Progressives disliked Kamala when she did that whole "prosecute marijuana smokers in an extremely progressive state" thing.

Has nothing to do with her campaigning against Bernie, though that certainly helped show her true colors.

To be honest it be better if we figure out what Democrats "Progressive" actually like. I think we're down to 0 Senators, 3 House members, and maybe 1 Governor?

More progressive than Harris?

Ro Khanna
Ed Markey
Elizabeth Warren
Ilhan Omar
Ruben Gallego
Katie Porter
Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez
Rashida Tlaib
Kirsten Gillibrand
Gavin Newsom
Jared Polis
Andrew Cuomo
Kate Brown
Gretchen Whitmer
Jay Inslee
Cory Booker
Tammy Baldwin
Jeff Merkley
Sherrod Brown
Karen Bass
Val Demings

To name a few!

You think that the people that I bolded are more progressive than Kamala?

LMAAAAAAAAAOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The rest could be up for debate if you acknowledge Kamala's hypocrisy on marijuana, sex work, and the like (many Democrats don't), though Merkley and Sherrod Brown are objectively more progressive than Harris.

Kamala Harris is the second most liberal Democrat in the Senate, only Warren is more liberal than her. In fact, she's more liberal than every House Democrat except Sylvia Garcia. Yet, somehow the third most liberal Democrat in Congress and the second most liberal Democrat in the Senate is not considered a progressive. It really doesn't make sense to me, Harris' voting record is to the left of almost everyone on your list, she even ran for President as a progressive. Progressive =/= Bernie Sanders and too many people in this thread think that supporting Sanders is required to be a progressive.

I'm of the position that Harris is more left than people give her credit for seriously NOMINATE scores are not a good argument and don't use them in this context. The idea that Harris is to the left of self-described Democratic Socialists is quite ridiculous.

[Sherrod Brown Shill]

Going by DW-NOMINATE scores the squad are some of the most centrist House Democrats. It's just not a useful metric for this. More of a "willing to buck your party" score nowadays it seems.

[Heebie Jeebie]

Kaine was not a great selection because he didn't offer anything that Clinton already didn't offer. And it's completely bizarre that anyone would think that voters saw Clinton as farther away from the center than Trump. Trump ran the most right-wing and extreme campaign in a long time. There was and is nothing centrist about him.

This is a bizarre rewriting of history.  Trump ran on a platform of avoiding all cuts to Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid (an enormous departure from conservative ideological orthodoxy and a huge move toward the center on economic issues),  skepticism of free trade, a little token praise of Planned Parenthood, and criticism of George W. Bush’s foreign policy.  He dropped all talk of reversing LGBTQ marriage equality.  Even on immigration, Trump’s position was not in any clear way more extreme than Paul Ryan's.  It's no surprise, then, that

His promises were obviously not believable and were far overshadowed by his blatant racist rhetoric. The racist rhetoric is what got him through the primary and what won him the election. He appealed to racist instincts in many voters across the Midwest. Calling Mexicans rapists is not centrist.

And yet..

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

Rice would be great as SoS

Too bad it's Gillibrand who's getting the job, though.

Don't know if you are joking but why would she abandon her safe senate seat to serve for 2-4 years as cabinet member?

Sympathy for Jeff Sessions?

[DrScholl]

Kaine was not a great selection because he didn't offer anything that Clinton already didn't offer. And it's completely bizarre that anyone would think that voters saw Clinton as farther away from the center than Trump. Trump ran the most right-wing and extreme campaign in a long time. There was and is nothing centrist about him.

This is a bizarre rewriting of history.  Trump ran on a platform of avoiding all cuts to Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid (an enormous departure from conservative ideological orthodoxy and a huge move toward the center on economic issues),  skepticism of free trade, a little token praise of Planned Parenthood, and criticism of George W. Bush’s foreign policy.  He dropped all talk of reversing LGBTQ marriage equality.  Even on immigration, Trump’s position was not in any clear way more extreme than Paul Ryan's.  It's no surprise, then, that

His promises were obviously not believable and were far overshadowed by his blatant racist rhetoric. The racist rhetoric is what got him through the primary and what won him the election. He appealed to racist instincts in many voters across the Midwest. Calling Mexicans rapists is not centrist.

And yet..

And look at Trump's record and see exactly how centrist it is. I'm waiting for a chart that shows that Trump is actually more moderate than Clinton.

With that said, the real election data doesn't suggest that Trump was viewed as centrist because he bled voters in more moderate areas and gained them in areas that have moved far right.

[ηєω ƒяσηтιєя]

Next week The convention can't come soon enough. I'm tired of the Pro vs Anti Kamala camps bickering about which one is more irritating. You both are!

I don't get the hype around her, nor do I get the disdain. Kamala is very generic center left Dem

Kamala is very left-wing. It's scary how fast American politics has shifted, lol. I feel like "moderate" voters like me are being force fed a bunch of leftwing gobbledygook just because we think Trump and the current GOP are garbage. I really want Trump and the GOP eliminated, but I'm skeptical of a lot of the proposals coming from Kamala and other dems. Just because she isn't as fanatical as Bernie/Warren doesn't mean Kamala is "center left"

Harris' biggest "sin' was that she ran against God King Emperor Sanders. Had she stayed put, the usual suspects wouldn't have whipped themselves into a frenzy against her.

Progressives disliked Kamala when she did that whole "prosecute marijuana smokers in an extremely progressive state" thing.

Has nothing to do with her campaigning against Bernie, though that certainly helped show her true colors.

To be honest it be better if we figure out what Democrats "Progressive" actually like. I think we're down to 0 Senators, 3 House members, and maybe 1 Governor?

More progressive than Harris?

Ro Khanna
Ed Markey
Elizabeth Warren
Ilhan Omar
Ruben Gallego
Katie Porter
Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez
Rashida Tlaib
Kirsten Gillibrand
Gavin Newsom
Jared Polis
Andrew Cuomo
Kate Brown
Gretchen Whitmer
Jay Inslee
Cory Booker
Tammy Baldwin
Jeff Merkley
Sherrod Brown
Karen Bass
Val Demings

To name a few!

You think that the people that I bolded are more progressive than Kamala?

LMAAAAAAAAAOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The rest could be up for debate if you acknowledge Kamala's hypocrisy on marijuana, sex work, and the like (many Democrats don't), though Merkley and Sherrod Brown are objectively more progressive than Harris.

You put Kirsten Gillibrand as more progressive than Kamala but yet don't want to acknowledge that Kamala is a progressive? Very, very hypocritical.

When Gillibrand first entered Congress, she was a conservadem and then she gets appointed to the Senate and suddenly becomes a staunch progressive. Kamala has been consistent her entire time in the Senate. She's been among the top 5 most progressive senators each year during her time in the Senate.

[NYSforKennedy2024]

Anyways, I don't get the people in Bidenworld who are worried about Kamala's ambition.

Joe is 77 years old and due to human mortality and the stress of the presidency, there's a good chance that Joe could not serve a full 1 or 2 terms (not being morbid just telling the truth).

Joe would be 86 in 2028, Kamala would be 64. Why should she not be ambitious? Joe himself has ran for president 3 times and if it wasn't for that ambition he wouldn't have been VP under Obama nor would he be the presumptive Democratic nominee right now. That line of criticism against Kamala is pathetically sexist and stupid.

What if I told you it wasn't sexist to have expectations regarding psychological mindset heading into a job?

If Demings, Bass, Warren, Baldwin, or whoever it is comes in and acknowledges they will not be seeking to hold the future of the party: they're dedicating themselves 100% fully to the office. That's what we need.

Not another Mike Pence.

[Heebie Jeebie]

Kaine was not a great selection because he didn't offer anything that Clinton already didn't offer. And it's completely bizarre that anyone would think that voters saw Clinton as farther away from the center than Trump. Trump ran the most right-wing and extreme campaign in a long time. There was and is nothing centrist about him.

This is a bizarre rewriting of history.  Trump ran on a platform of avoiding all cuts to Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid (an enormous departure from conservative ideological orthodoxy and a huge move toward the center on economic issues),  skepticism of free trade, a little token praise of Planned Parenthood, and criticism of George W. Bush’s foreign policy.  He dropped all talk of reversing LGBTQ marriage equality.  Even on immigration, Trump’s position was not in any clear way more extreme than Paul Ryan's.  It's no surprise, then, that

His promises were obviously not believable and were far overshadowed by his blatant racist rhetoric. The racist rhetoric is what got him through the primary and what won him the election. He appealed to racist instincts in many voters across the Midwest. Calling Mexicans rapists is not centrist.

And yet..

And look at Trump's record and see exactly how centrist it is. I'm waiting for a chart that shows that Trump is actually more moderate than Clinton.

With that said, the real election data doesn't suggest that Trump was viewed as centrist because he bled voters in more moderate areas and gained them in areas that have moved far right.

I think you're just being purposely obtuse.  I'm not arguing that Trump is or was more centrist--the point is that in 2016 average voters saw him as more centrist.

[DrScholl]

Kaine was not a great selection because he didn't offer anything that Clinton already didn't offer. And it's completely bizarre that anyone would think that voters saw Clinton as farther away from the center than Trump. Trump ran the most right-wing and extreme campaign in a long time. There was and is nothing centrist about him.

This is a bizarre rewriting of history.  Trump ran on a platform of avoiding all cuts to Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid (an enormous departure from conservative ideological orthodoxy and a huge move toward the center on economic issues),  skepticism of free trade, a little token praise of Planned Parenthood, and criticism of George W. Bush’s foreign policy.  He dropped all talk of reversing LGBTQ marriage equality.  Even on immigration, Trump’s position was not in any clear way more extreme than Paul Ryan's.  It's no surprise, then, that

His promises were obviously not believable and were far overshadowed by his blatant racist rhetoric. The racist rhetoric is what got him through the primary and what won him the election. He appealed to racist instincts in many voters across the Midwest. Calling Mexicans rapists is not centrist.

And yet..

And look at Trump's record and see exactly how centrist it is. I'm waiting for a chart that shows that Trump is actually more moderate than Clinton.

With that said, the real election data doesn't suggest that Trump was viewed as centrist because he bled voters in more moderate areas and gained them in areas that have moved far right.

I think you're just being purposely obtuse.  I'm not arguing that Trump is or was more centrist--the point is that in 2016 average voters saw him as more centrist.

The actual election data (not polling) doesn't support the idea that voters actually saw Trump as moderate. If that was true he wouldn't have lost places places like Orange County, DuPage County, etc. and greatly increased Republican vote shares in Appalachian counties. I'm going off of real data, not polling.

[Interlocutor is just not there yet]

Next week The convention can't come soon enough. I'm tired of the Pro vs Anti Kamala camps bickering about which one is more irritating. You both are!

I don't get the hype around her, nor do I get the disdain. Kamala is very generic center left Dem

Kamala is very left-wing. It's scary how fast American politics has shifted, lol. I feel like "moderate" voters like me are being force fed a bunch of leftwing gobbledygook just because we think Trump and the current GOP are garbage. I really want Trump and the GOP eliminated, but I'm skeptical of a lot of the proposals coming from Kamala and other dems. Just because she isn't as fanatical as Bernie/Warren doesn't mean Kamala is "center left"

Harris' biggest "sin" was that she ran against God King Emperor Sanders. Had she stayed put, the usual suspects wouldn't have whipped themselves into a frenzy against her.
Remember how Beto got the same treatment the moment he showed presidential ambitions even though until then people like Sirota were praising hm.

Lol of course it comes back to Bernie.

I don't really care who it is at this point. But being aware of her since her 2010 AG campaign, I've always found her a very opaque politician. Never knowing what she stands for outside of "She's a Democrat". And how she'd easily flip on a dime when the opportunity comes (IE: Quickly dismissing school truancy as discriminatory a year ago despite it being one of her strongest policies as DA & AG).

I expect her to be in the Biden Administration (As VP or AG) and I'll still vote for Biden no matter who he picks. I just don't get the hype about her that folks outside of California do

[brucejoel99]

[NYSforKennedy2024]

Next week The convention can't come soon enough. I'm tired of the Pro vs Anti Kamala camps bickering about which one is more irritating. You both are!

I don't get the hype around her, nor do I get the disdain. Kamala is very generic center left Dem

Kamala is very left-wing. It's scary how fast American politics has shifted, lol. I feel like "moderate" voters like me are being force fed a bunch of leftwing gobbledygook just because we think Trump and the current GOP are garbage. I really want Trump and the GOP eliminated, but I'm skeptical of a lot of the proposals coming from Kamala and other dems. Just because she isn't as fanatical as Bernie/Warren doesn't mean Kamala is "center left"

Harris' biggest "sin" was that she ran against God King Emperor Sanders. Had she stayed put, the usual suspects wouldn't have whipped themselves into a frenzy against her.
Remember how Beto got the same treatment the moment he showed presidential ambitions even though until then people like Sirota were praising hm.

Lol of course it comes back to Bernie.

I don't really care who it is at this point. But being aware of her since her 2010 AG campaign I've always found her a very opaque politician. Never knowing what she stands for outside of "She's a Democrat". And how she'd easily flip on a dime when the opportunity comes (IE: Quickly dismissing school truancy as discriminatory a year ago despite it being one of her strongest policies as DA & AG)

I expect her to be in the Biden Administration (As VP or AG) and I'll still vote for Biden no matter who he picks. I just don't get the hype about her that folks outside of California do

[Rookie Yinzer]

Next week The convention can't come soon enough. I'm tired of the Pro vs Anti Kamala camps bickering about which one is more irritating. You both are!

I don't get the hype around her, nor do I get the disdain. Kamala is very generic center left Dem

Kamala is very left-wing. It's scary how fast American politics has shifted, lol. I feel like "moderate" voters like me are being force fed a bunch of leftwing gobbledygook just because we think Trump and the current GOP are garbage. I really want Trump and the GOP eliminated, but I'm skeptical of a lot of the proposals coming from Kamala and other dems. Just because she isn't as fanatical as Bernie/Warren doesn't mean Kamala is "center left"

Harris' biggest "sin' was that she ran against God King Emperor Sanders. Had she stayed put, the usual suspects wouldn't have whipped themselves into a frenzy against her.

Progressives disliked Kamala when she did that whole "prosecute marijuana smokers in an extremely progressive state" thing.

Has nothing to do with her campaigning against Bernie, though that certainly helped show her true colors.

Marijuana convictions went down every year she was AG and to assert that she personally prosecuted every marijuana case is completely absurd. Y’all don’t even know how the office she held works.

[Interlocutor is just not there yet]

(snip)

You're right. Let's go back to deciphering Biden's press notes for any secret messages or acronyms of who he might pick in 1-2 weeks. Or Dodd's feelings of Kamala Harris that may as well come from someone in this thread.

If you want VP news, then I propose locking this thread until the actual announcement comes

[Amenhotep Bakari-Sellers]

Harris is not the Veep that should be picked

[NYSforKennedy2024]

Next week The convention can't come soon enough. I'm tired of the Pro vs Anti Kamala camps bickering about which one is more irritating. You both are!

I don't get the hype around her, nor do I get the disdain. Kamala is very generic center left Dem

Kamala is very left-wing. It's scary how fast American politics has shifted, lol. I feel like "moderate" voters like me are being force fed a bunch of leftwing gobbledygook just because we think Trump and the current GOP are garbage. I really want Trump and the GOP eliminated, but I'm skeptical of a lot of the proposals coming from Kamala and other dems. Just because she isn't as fanatical as Bernie/Warren doesn't mean Kamala is "center left"

Harris' biggest "sin' was that she ran against God King Emperor Sanders. Had she stayed put, the usual suspects wouldn't have whipped themselves into a frenzy against her.

Progressives disliked Kamala when she did that whole "prosecute marijuana smokers in an extremely progressive state" thing.

Has nothing to do with her campaigning against Bernie, though that certainly helped show her true colors.

Marijuana convictions went down every year she was AG and to assert that she personally prosecuted every marijuana case is completely absurd. Y’all don’t even know how the office she held works.

Kamala's definition of government does include being a hypocrite and flipping on issues for career gain, I guess you're right. I wouldn't understand how that works.

[Roronoa D. Law]

The funniest thing about all these articles and comments from the likes of Morgan and Dodd is that it has rallied the Democrat's base around Harris.

[NYSforKennedy2024]

The funniest thing about all these articles and comments from the likes of Morgan and Dodd is that it has rallied the Democrat's base around Harris.

And thus, the tragedy of the Democratic Party.

Hawley will destroy Kamala in '24 if she gets her way.

[ηєω ƒяσηтιєя]

It pisses me off that people are talking about Kamala being too ambitious. Almost every Democratic Vice President in the past 80 years has ran for the Presidency (except Alben W. Barkely):


Henry A. Wallace - ran for the presidency in 1948.

Harry Truman - ran for for a full-term after FDR's death. Would have ran again in 1952 but Korean War soured his approvals.

Lyndon B. Johnson - ran for a full-term after JFK's death. Would have ran again in 1968 but Vietnam War soured his approvals.

Hubert H. Humphrey - ran for the presidency twice (1968 & 1972).

Walter Mondale - ran for the presidency in 1984.

Al Gore - ran for the presidency in 2000 (and in 1988 before becoming the VP).

Joe Biden - ran for the presidency in 2020 (and in 1988 and 2008 before becoming the VP).

Hmmm, I wonder what the difference between Kamala and these 7 men are?

[BidenHarris2020]

Anyways, I don't get the people in Bidenworld who are worried about Kamala's ambition.

Joe is 77 years old and due to human mortality and the stress of the presidency, there's a good chance that Joe could not serve a full 1 or 2 terms (not being morbid just telling the truth).

Joe would be 86 in 2028, Kamala would be 64. Why should she not be ambitious? Joe himself has ran for president 3 times and if it wasn't for that ambition he wouldn't have been VP under Obama nor would he be the presumptive Democratic nominee right now. That line of criticism against Kamala is pathetically sexist and stupid.

What if I told you it wasn't sexist to have expectations regarding psychological mindset heading into a job?

If Demings, Bass, Warren, Baldwin, or whoever it is comes in and acknowledges they will not be seeking to hold the future of the party: they're dedicating themselves 100% fully to the office. That's what we need.

Not another Mike Pence.

This is politics. Power/Ambition is the name of the game. Anyone who claims otherwise is lying. Get real

[JRP1994]

https://twitter.com/FoxNewsSunday/status/1288576737803108357

[NYSforKennedy2024]

The funniest thing about all these articles and comments from the likes of Morgan and Dodd is that it has rallied the Democrat's base around Harris.

And thus, the tragedy of the Democratic Party.

Hawley will destroy Kamala in '24 if she gets her way.

You seem almost excited at the prospect of a soft fascist becoming President if it means the black cop lady doesn’t get it.

I'm not excited for it, I'm telling you what will happen if Biden allows "black cop lady" (I mean, this is technically a valid description of her? lmao, I can't believe the KHive) to ride his coattails, completely lie about her ambitions, and then hijack the party in order to become the new face of corporate centrism.

Are you guys really excited about Kamala's connections and corporations installing her as the next face of the Democratic Party for 10 years??? This seriously doesn't make sense to me.

Is this not just what the GOP did with Cheney?

[DrScholl]

The funniest thing about all these articles and comments from the likes of Morgan and Dodd is that it has rallied the Democrat's base around Harris.

And thus, the tragedy of the Democratic Party.

Hawley will destroy Kamala in '24 if she gets her way.

What is so great about Hawley? He's from an incredibly red state and has no notable political instincts that make him a good presidential candidate.

Post Trump it will be hard for Republicans to win the White House again without moving away from the far right and there isn't a Republican candidate that wants to do that. No Republican is going to be destroying any Democrat in a presidential election any time soon.