Biden VP news megathread (pg 286 - been selected, announcement could be today)

[Lord Halifax]

538's discussion of the running mate choices: https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/will-biden-choose-a-running-mate-based-on-electability-ideology-or-identity/.

TL;DR: they think it will be Harris.

I'm sure Bernie bros will be apoplectic reading that Harris is actually one of the most liberal senator.

"Liberal" is an utterly meaningless term that needs to be retired. It's measured as a combination of things that aren't related.

[brucejoel99]

538's discussion of the running mate choices: https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/will-biden-choose-a-running-mate-based-on-electability-ideology-or-identity/.

TL;DR: they think it will be Harris.

I'm sure Bernie bros will be apoplectic reading that Harris is actually one of the most liberal senator.

Wait until you tell them that Bernie's literally worked with her on criminal justice reform in the Senate.

[Landslide Lyndon]

538's discussion of the running mate choices: https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/will-biden-choose-a-running-mate-based-on-electability-ideology-or-identity/.

TL;DR: they think it will be Harris.

I'm sure Bernie bros will be apoplectic reading that Harris is actually one of the most liberal senator.

"Liberal" is an utterly meaningless term that needs to be retired. It's measured as a combination of things that aren't related.

Yeah, who cares about her senate votes when your gut says otherwise?

[Lord Halifax]

538's discussion of the running mate choices: https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/will-biden-choose-a-running-mate-based-on-electability-ideology-or-identity/.

TL;DR: they think it will be Harris.

I'm sure Bernie bros will be apoplectic reading that Harris is actually one of the most liberal senator.

"Liberal" is an utterly meaningless term that needs to be retired. It's measured as a combination of things that aren't related.

Yeah, who cares about her senate votes when your gut says otherwise?

That has nothing to do with what I said.

[Warren 4 Secretary of Everything]

The criticism against black women that they are "cops" reminds me of 2007 when people were accusing Obama of not being "black enough".

And the criticism against Harris is every bit as stupid as the complaints against Obama were.

Whether you like the criticism or not, it stuck with young black voters. And Demings was quite literally a police chief... so yeah, a cop.

And it's not a criticism against "black women", its a criticism against Demings and Harris. No one calls Maxine Waters, Ayanna Pressley, or Stacey Abrams cops. Law enforcement officers, be they DA's or police officers, are overwhelmingly unpopular among black voters under 30.

So while Harris and Demings may shore up old black people (an age group that already loves Biden and gave him the nomination in the first place over the objections of everyone else), they'll push younger ones further away.

It's an unnecessary risk when other potential VP's offer the same things Harris does without the downsides.

[brucejoel99]

The criticism against black women that they are "cops" reminds me of 2007 when people were accusing Obama of not being "black enough".

And the criticism against Harris is every bit as stupid as the complaints against Obama were.

Whether you like the criticism or not, it stuck with young black voters. And Demings was quite literally a police chief... so yeah, a cop.

And it's not a criticism against "black women", its a criticism against Demings and Harris. No one calls Maxine Waters, Ayanna Pressley, or Stacey Abrams cops. Law enforcement officers, be they DA's or police officers, are overwhelmingly unpopular among black voters under 30.

So while Harris and Demings may shore up old black people (an age group that already loves Biden and gave him the nomination in the first place over the objections of everyone else), they'll push younger ones further away.

It's an unnecessary risk when other potential VP's offer the same things Harris does without the downsides.

But it's still a stupid criticism that anybody with an iota of knowledge should be able to see through.

The AG under whom prison population fell became a "cop" that single-handedly started the mass-incarceration crisis. The woman who helped low-level drug offenders get jobs & educations became a racist who locked up black men for using pot. The woman who helped parents make sure their kids got to school became a Nazi who locked you up if your kid was late for class. The woman who helped homeowners get billions in relief from big banks became a corrupt puppet of Wall Street.

It's a stupid criticism, but a stark reminder that the left is just as vulnerable to misinformation as the right, & that makes me fear for the future of the left & the country as a whole.

[Lord Halifax]

Why can't people just accept that Kamala Harris sucks and move on.

[brucejoel99]

Why can't people just accept that Kamala Harris sucks and move on.

Because she doesn't.

[Rookie Yinzer]

The criticism against black women that they are "cops" reminds me of 2007 when people were accusing Obama of not being "black enough".

And the criticism against Harris is every bit as stupid as the complaints against Obama were.

Whether you like the criticism or not, it stuck with young black voters. And Demings was quite literally a police chief... so yeah, a cop.

And it's not a criticism against "black women", its a criticism against Demings and Harris. No one calls Maxine Waters, Ayanna Pressley, or Stacey Abrams cops. Law enforcement officers, be they DA's or police officers, are overwhelmingly unpopular among black voters under 30.

So while Harris and Demings may shore up old black people (an age group that already loves Biden and gave him the nomination in the first place over the objections of everyone else), they'll push younger ones further away.

It's an unnecessary risk when other potential VP's offer the same things Harris does without the downsides.

Harris never appeared on the ballot. How do you know it “stuck with young black voters”? Because Black Bernie stans and blue checks on Twitter didn’t like her?

[We Live in Black and White]

Why can't people just accept that Kamala Harris sucks and move on.

Because she doesn't.

She is very much a police statist and, more pragmatically, adds bugger all to Biden's ticket. If he wants to boost Black turnout, Abrams and even Booker are better bets (hypothetically in Booker's case, since I know Biden is going to pick a woman).

[brucejoel99]

Why can't people just accept that Kamala Harris sucks and move on.

Because she doesn't.

She is very much a police statist and, more pragmatically, adds bugger all to Biden's ticket. If he wants to boost Black turnout, Abrams and even Booker are better bets (hypothetically in Booker's case, since I know Biden is going to pick a woman).

[Dr Oz Lost Party!]

Why can't people just accept that Kamala Harris sucks and move on.

Because she doesn't.

She is very much a police statist and, more pragmatically, adds bugger all to Biden's ticket. If he wants to boost Black turnout, Abrams and even Booker are better bets (hypothetically in Booker's case, since I know Biden is going to pick a woman).

What in the world makes you think Abrams and Booker would do any better than her with black turnout? I am so sick and tired of this Abrams obsession. She lost her only statewide race and has stated multiple times that she doesn't want to be Vice President.

Atlas seems to have a weird fetish for Abrams and hate boner for Harris and its just incredibly weird.

[Amenhotep Bakari-Sellers]

Its gonna be Klobuchar,  Klobuchar has made a home in DC and doesnt mind travels overseas. Harris wants her family in San Francisco and our ally Israel likes Klobuchar

[We Live in Black and White]

Why can't people just accept that Kamala Harris sucks and move on.

Because she doesn't.

She is very much a police statist and, more pragmatically, adds bugger all to Biden's ticket. If he wants to boost Black turnout, Abrams and even Booker are better bets (hypothetically in Booker's case, since I know Biden is going to pick a woman).

What in the world makes you think Abrams and Booker would do any better than her with black turnout? I am so sick and tired of this Abrams obsession. She lost her only statewide race and has stated multiple times that she doesn't want to be Vice President.

Atlas seems to have a weird fetish for Abrams and hate boner for Harris and its just incredibly weird.

It's not just an Atlas thing, my guy. Nobody likes Harris, least of all the young voters Biden is going to need in November.

And Bruce, not gonna lie, I like your contributions a lot and agree with you 90% of the time, but rolling your eyes at me isn't a contribution, nor is it debate, nor is it changing my mind.

[Dr Oz Lost Party!]

Why can't people just accept that Kamala Harris sucks and move on.

Because she doesn't.

She is very much a police statist and, more pragmatically, adds bugger all to Biden's ticket. If he wants to boost Black turnout, Abrams and even Booker are better bets (hypothetically in Booker's case, since I know Biden is going to pick a woman).

What in the world makes you think Abrams and Booker would do any better than her with black turnout? I am so sick and tired of this Abrams obsession. She lost her only statewide race and has stated multiple times that she doesn't want to be Vice President.

Atlas seems to have a weird fetish for Abrams and hate boner for Harris and its just incredibly weird.

It's not just an Atlas thing, my guy. Nobody likes Harris, least of all the young voters Biden is going to need in November.

And Bruce, not gonna lie, I like your contributions a lot and agree with you 90% of the time, but rolling your eyes at me isn't a contribution, nor is it debate, nor is it changing my mind.

This is also not a contribution, chief.

[American2020]

How Will Biden Choose His Running Mate?

Goal 1: Help with electability, real or imagined
Helps: Sen. Tammy Baldwin of Wisconsin, Sen. Amy Klobuchar of Minnesota, Michigan Gov. Gretchen Whitmer

Hurts: Sen. Elizabeth Warren of Massachusetts

Goal 2: Balance the ticket demographically — particularly on race and ethnicity
Helps: Sen. Tammy Duckworth of Illinois, Sen. Kamala Harris of California, New Mexico Gov. Michelle Lujan Grisham, Abrams, Cortez Masto

Hurts: Baldwin, Klobuchar, Warren, Whitmer … basically anyone who is white

Goal 3: Balance the ticket ideologically
Helps: Abrams, Harris, Warren

Hurts: Klobuchar

Goal 4: Help Democrats gain a Senate majority
Helps: Duckworth, Harris

Hurts: Baldwin, Warren

In any case, looking at the party-based criteria, here’s how things shake out for Abrams, Harris, Klobuchar and Warren, who The New York Times recently reported are senior Democratic Party officials’ leading choices for Biden’s running mate. (We’ve also included Duckworth, who’s a more obscure senator than Warren, but we wanted to note how favorably she looks compared with her in terms of these party-based metrics):

Harris: three positives, no negatives.
Abrams: two positives, no negatives.
Duckworth: two positives, no negatives.
Klobuchar: one positive, two negatives.
Warren: one positive, three negatives.

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/will-biden-choose-a-running-mate-based-on-electability-ideology-or-identity

[We Live in Black and White]

Why can't people just accept that Kamala Harris sucks and move on.

Because she doesn't.

She is very much a police statist and, more pragmatically, adds bugger all to Biden's ticket. If he wants to boost Black turnout, Abrams and even Booker are better bets (hypothetically in Booker's case, since I know Biden is going to pick a woman).

What in the world makes you think Abrams and Booker would do any better than her with black turnout? I am so sick and tired of this Abrams obsession. She lost her only statewide race and has stated multiple times that she doesn't want to be Vice President.

Atlas seems to have a weird fetish for Abrams and hate boner for Harris and its just incredibly weird.

It's not just an Atlas thing, my guy. Nobody likes Harris, least of all the young voters Biden is going to need in November.

And Bruce, not gonna lie, I like your contributions a lot and agree with you 90% of the time, but rolling your eyes at me isn't a contribution, nor is it debate, nor is it changing my mind.

This is also not a contribution, chief.

Neither is being an arrogant prick, which seems to be what you've made your thing since 2018. You want to contribute, try proving my assertions wrong.

[brucejoel99]

Why can't people just accept that Kamala Harris sucks and move on.

Because she doesn't.

She is very much a police statist and, more pragmatically, adds bugger all to Biden's ticket. If he wants to boost Black turnout, Abrams and even Booker are better bets (hypothetically in Booker's case, since I know Biden is going to pick a woman).

What in the world makes you think Abrams and Booker would do any better than her with black turnout? I am so sick and tired of this Abrams obsession. She lost her only statewide race and has stated multiple times that she doesn't want to be Vice President.

Atlas seems to have a weird fetish for Abrams and hate boner for Harris and its just incredibly weird.

It's not just an Atlas thing, my guy. Nobody likes Harris, least of all the young voters Biden is going to need in November.

And Bruce, not gonna lie, I like your contributions a lot and agree with you 90% of the time, but rolling your eyes at me isn't a contribution, nor is it debate, nor is it changing my mind.

Anything I could legitimately contribute in response to what you said is stuff that I &/or other posters have said here time & time again. I'm not gonna repeat myself for the sake of just doing so. That's not debate, nor is it constructive. At least an eyeroll adequately expresses my thoughts/feelings rn.

[We Live in Black and White]

Why can't people just accept that Kamala Harris sucks and move on.

Because she doesn't.

She is very much a police statist and, more pragmatically, adds bugger all to Biden's ticket. If he wants to boost Black turnout, Abrams and even Booker are better bets (hypothetically in Booker's case, since I know Biden is going to pick a woman).

What in the world makes you think Abrams and Booker would do any better than her with black turnout? I am so sick and tired of this Abrams obsession. She lost her only statewide race and has stated multiple times that she doesn't want to be Vice President.

Atlas seems to have a weird fetish for Abrams and hate boner for Harris and its just incredibly weird.

It's not just an Atlas thing, my guy. Nobody likes Harris, least of all the young voters Biden is going to need in November.

And Bruce, not gonna lie, I like your contributions a lot and agree with you 90% of the time, but rolling your eyes at me isn't a contribution, nor is it debate, nor is it changing my mind.

Anything I could legitimately contribute in response to what you said is stuff that I &/or other posters have said here time & time again. I'm not gonna repeat myself for the sake of just doing so. That's not debate, nor is it constructive. At least an eyeroll adequately expresses my thoughts/feelings rn.

I'll excuse that, then. Better than Pitts' response, at least.

[Lord Halifax]

How Will Biden Choose His Running Mate?

Goal 1: Help with electability, real or imagined
Helps: Sen. Tammy Baldwin of Wisconsin, Sen. Amy Klobuchar of Minnesota, Michigan Gov. Gretchen Whitmer

Hurts: Sen. Elizabeth Warren of Massachusetts

Goal 2: Balance the ticket demographically — particularly on race and ethnicity
Helps: Sen. Tammy Duckworth of Illinois, Sen. Kamala Harris of California, New Mexico Gov. Michelle Lujan Grisham, Abrams, Cortez Masto

Hurts: Baldwin, Klobuchar, Warren, Whitmer … basically anyone who is white

Goal 3: Balance the ticket ideologically
Helps: Abrams, Harris, Warren

Hurts: Klobuchar

Goal 4: Help Democrats gain a Senate majority
Helps: Duckworth, Harris

Hurts: Baldwin, Warren

In any case, looking at the party-based criteria, here’s how things shake out for Abrams, Harris, Klobuchar and Warren, who The New York Times recently reported are senior Democratic Party officials’ leading choices for Biden’s running mate. (We’ve also included Duckworth, who’s a more obscure senator than Warren, but we wanted to note how favorably she looks compared with her in terms of these party-based metrics):

Harris: three positives, no negatives.
Abrams: two positives, no negatives.
Duckworth: two positives, no negatives.
Klobuchar: one positive, two negatives.
Warren: one positive, three negatives.

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/will-biden-choose-a-running-mate-based-on-electability-ideology-or-identity

Hopefully Biden will end up picking someone other than the ones "senior Democratic officials" prefer. Abrams, Harris, Klobuchar and Warren are all bad choices. Abrams is unqualified and unimpressive, Warren and Harris both ran bad campaigns and provide perfect targets for Trump (and Warren is too old), and Klobuchar is too awkward, comes with a lot of bagage and has no appeal to PoC.

Jim Clyburn reportedly wants Keshia Lance Bottoms and Harry Reid wants CCM, hopefully one of the two grey eminences will get their way.

[Landslide Lyndon]

The same guys who said for a year that nobody likes Biden now assure us that nobody likes Harris.
We listen to them carefully.

[Warren 4 Secretary of Everything]

The criticism against black women that they are "cops" reminds me of 2007 when people were accusing Obama of not being "black enough".

And the criticism against Harris is every bit as stupid as the complaints against Obama were.

Whether you like the criticism or not, it stuck with young black voters. And Demings was quite literally a police chief... so yeah, a cop.

And it's not a criticism against "black women", its a criticism against Demings and Harris. No one calls Maxine Waters, Ayanna Pressley, or Stacey Abrams cops. Law enforcement officers, be they DA's or police officers, are overwhelmingly unpopular among black voters under 30.

So while Harris and Demings may shore up old black people (an age group that already loves Biden and gave him the nomination in the first place over the objections of everyone else), they'll push younger ones further away.

It's an unnecessary risk when other potential VP's offer the same things Harris does without the downsides.

Harris never appeared on the ballot. How do you know it “stuck with young black voters”? Because Black Bernie stans and blue checks on Twitter didn’t like her?

She never polled well with voters under 30. And while this is purely anecdotal, she was a joke and pretty wifey disliked by everyone I knew in my age group in college. Whereas Biden was viewed positively as Obama’s bff, Harris was just a cop meme.

[Dr Oz Lost Party!]

The criticism against black women that they are "cops" reminds me of 2007 when people were accusing Obama of not being "black enough".

And the criticism against Harris is every bit as stupid as the complaints against Obama were.

Whether you like the criticism or not, it stuck with young black voters. And Demings was quite literally a police chief... so yeah, a cop.

And it's not a criticism against "black women", its a criticism against Demings and Harris. No one calls Maxine Waters, Ayanna Pressley, or Stacey Abrams cops. Law enforcement officers, be they DA's or police officers, are overwhelmingly unpopular among black voters under 30.

So while Harris and Demings may shore up old black people (an age group that already loves Biden and gave him the nomination in the first place over the objections of everyone else), they'll push younger ones further away.

It's an unnecessary risk when other potential VP's offer the same things Harris does without the downsides.

Harris never appeared on the ballot. How do you know it “stuck with young black voters”? Because Black Bernie stans and blue checks on Twitter didn’t like her?

She never polled well with voters under 30. And while this is purely anecdotal, she was a joke and pretty wifey disliked by everyone I knew in my age group in college. Whereas Biden was viewed positively as Obama’s bff, Harris was just a cop meme.

You're right. Purely anecdotal. And the hate is based on youth ignorance of what prosecutorial work it.

[Warren 4 Secretary of Everything]

The criticism against black women that they are "cops" reminds me of 2007 when people were accusing Obama of not being "black enough".

And the criticism against Harris is every bit as stupid as the complaints against Obama were.

Whether you like the criticism or not, it stuck with young black voters. And Demings was quite literally a police chief... so yeah, a cop.

And it's not a criticism against "black women", its a criticism against Demings and Harris. No one calls Maxine Waters, Ayanna Pressley, or Stacey Abrams cops. Law enforcement officers, be they DA's or police officers, are overwhelmingly unpopular among black voters under 30.

So while Harris and Demings may shore up old black people (an age group that already loves Biden and gave him the nomination in the first place over the objections of everyone else), they'll push younger ones further away.

It's an unnecessary risk when other potential VP's offer the same things Harris does without the downsides.

Harris never appeared on the ballot. How do you know it “stuck with young black voters”? Because Black Bernie stans and blue checks on Twitter didn’t like her?

She never polled well with voters under 30. And while this is purely anecdotal, she was a joke and pretty wifey disliked by everyone I knew in my age group in college. Whereas Biden was viewed positively as Obama’s bff, Harris was just a cop meme.

You're right. Purely anecdotal. And the hate is based on youth ignorance of what prosecutorial work it.

I’m not arguing that they’re right, I’m arguing that a narrative has already been spun about Harris which made her unpalatable to an important part of our base (and the same part that she’s supposed to shore up as VP nominee).

[President Johnson]

I even don't get the Kamala criticism for having law enforcement background. That often helps in a general election where Biden is trying to convince moderate voters and some Republicans to abandon Trump. She may have some issues in her record, but heck, who hasn't? It's peanuts compared to others, especially on the other side. I don't need to list Trump's endless list of disgraceful stuff, just look at Pence. The guy promoted state mandatory discrimination of LGBT people and didn't even apologize when courts intervened. In California, Kamala Harris enforced the law even at times when she held different personal opinions such as the death penalty. Otherwise, she brings a ton of pros to the ticket beyond age, race, gender and geographical balance. She's actually qualified to assume the Oval Office if (god forbid) circumstances arrive. Furthermore, she doesn't put a senate seat in danger of losing and is battle tested (and well known) on the national stage. I'm confident she has learned from her failed presidential bid.

Aside from that, I actually find her likeable. Only thing I didn't like was the cheap shot on Uncle Joe during the first debate, but that's politics. I think it's no longer a big deal for Joe Biden. He knows the game better than anybody.