The BlueSwan Basement of Absurd & Ignorant Posts VIII

[Badger]

"Race" and "Discrimination" are manufactured issues that mean nothing to people trying to put food on their f**king table.

There is no "discrimination" in this country.

Give me an example of discrimination in America. You can’t.

Racism isn’t an issue.

Whatever, racism isn’t an issue.

But racism still isn’t an issue.

It isn’t.

No, but racism isn’t an issue.

Epicly roasting me by placing my response here doesn’t change that it’s not a real issue.

It isn’t an issue.

Cmon buddy give me some evidence that it’s an issue.

You clearly can’t.

It’s not an issue.

https://lmgtfy.com/?q=racism+statistics&s=

And this proves your point... how? It’s a google search, you get opinions and polls. I don’t care about either of those. The reality is simple. Of course racism is bad, but it’s not an issue that affects anyone’s daily lives, let alone affecting anyones lives at all. People in this country are struggling to get employed, to make ends meet, to support their children’s future, to have good healthcare, and you seriously think racism is a big issue that is facing us all? What a joke.

You know, it's funny. I used to think like you. I was a naive white suburban pre-teen who thought we had solved racism and that people discussing racism were just being oversensitive. After all, we had a black President! We did away with legal segregation and Jim Crow decades ago! I hadn't experienced the cruel lash of racism myself, so I assumed it wasn't an issue for anybody in this day and age.

Then I matured a little bit. I got into high school and started to develop more of an interest in politics and the world around me. I befriended more people with backgrounds, races, ethnicities, appearances, cultures, and stories different than my own. I started to read more and pay attention to the news. And I started to realize that my thoughts on racism were foolish and underdeveloped. I didn't think racism was still a problem in this country because I was fortunate enough not to have experienced it personally.

My ignorance was regrettable, but in my own defense, I had yet to be truly exposed to other perspectives. You, on the other hand, have almost certainly been confronted with piles of evidence in your time trolling political communities like this one. But I'll give you the benefit of the doubt one more time. Let's review some of the most poignant realities. Let's review racism in this country today.

You talk about race being a distraction from bread and butter issues. People trying to put food on their table. So let's start there. Food insecurity disproportionately impacts racial minorities. While only 9% of white households in the US struggle with food insecurity, it’s a problem for 22% of black households and 18% of Hispanic households. In fact, according to Drexel’s Dr. Mariana Chilton, “you cannot take on poverty and hunger without taking on historical and contemporary discrimination.”

Let’s talk about poverty. According to the Census Bureau, for every $100 earned by white families in the US, black families earn an average of $57.30. That’s just income. In terms of actual wealth, for every $100 held by white families, black families hold $5.04. While only 10.1% of non-Hispanic whites live in poverty, 23.6% of Hispanic Americans do, alongside 26.2% of Black Americans and a shocking 28.3% of Native Americans.

How about jobs? According to Pew, for six or seven straight decades, the black unemployment rate has consistently been twice as high as the white unemployment rate. This affects black college graduates as well. Back in 2014, the unemployment rate for black college graduates was 12.4%. Overall, the unemployment rate for college graduates was 5.6%. Even higher education can’t outpace the scourge of racism. That’s not even getting into the well-attributed phenomenon of people with white sounding names receiving as high as 50% more callbacks for employment than those with stereotypically black names.

Let’s get back to education for a second. Black children are put to a disadvantage as early as preschool, where they make up half of all suspensions per the Department of Education. Across the nation, minority children make up disproportionate percentages of schools that underachieve, largely due to poor funding. According to a paper from the Civil Rights Project, schools with high proportions of minority enrollment are often characterized by "less experienced and less qualified teachers, high levels of teacher turnover, less successful peer groups and inadequate facilities and learning materials." And their problems don’t end in high school. According to the Hechinger Report, 42% of college age white Americans are actually enrolled in college, while only 34% of black and Hispanic Americans the same age are. These students are less likely to go to selective institutions and are less likely to graduate.

Black people make up around 40% of the prison population despite making up 13% of the total population of the country. This is due entirely to institutional racism, sentencing disparities, and racial profiling. Black drivers are 30% more likely to be pulled over by the police and black convicts are 20% more likely to be sentenced to jail time for the same crime (oh, and by the way, their sentences are 20% longer as well.)

Only 42% of black Americans own homes, as compared to 72% of white Americans.

When an implicit bias survey was conducted in 2012, 56% of Americans expressed anti-black attitudes. 57% of Americans expressed anti-Hispanic attitudes.

76% of black and Asian Americans, alongside 58% of Hispanics, said that they had experienced discrimination or unfair treatment at some point in their lives, something that can affect one’s psyche for years.

Let’s not forget about the President of the United States denigrating members of Congress, telling them to go back to their countries and implying their citizenship wasn’t equal to a native-born white American’s. Do you think that promotes a good image of American values in the mind’s eye of children of color?

I could go on for pages and pages, but since I assume you gave up reading a while back, I’ll wrap up with an anecdote. The other day, I attended a roundtable talk put on by some friends of mine. It was intended to discuss race, culture, and disparities here in my home county. Not that someone like you would see the value in this, but I found the perspectives of those who had differences than my own illuminating. Racial disparities exist everywhere, and if you’re not aware of that, you need to look harder. A Latino guy made the salient point that something as simple as trash collection was done with much more care in the whiter portion of my county where he used to live than the less white portion of the county where he lives now. Several Muslim students brought up the difficulties they had experienced attempting to practice their faith in school.

I find it quite telling that you don’t find racism to be a big problem in the US, Grasr00ts. It goes to show that you’re lucky. You’re living in a fantasy land where you haven’t been the victim of these vicious behaviors and, since you’re the kind of person who’s seemingly incapable of understanding other people’s perspectives, you assume that all of this bigotry has vanished. It hasn’t and it’s stunningly naive for you to assume that is has. I encourage you to try and learn from people who don’t think like you and don’t have the same background as you in the future. Like I said, I was once like you. I hadn’t experienced all of this crap so I assumed there was no way it could exist. I was wrong then, and you’re wrong now. Grow up, open your eyes, and listen to others. It might just serve you well.

Nice try, but i'm not falling for it. So many things are wrong with this post I don't even know where to start.

Don't accuse me of trolling, i'm simply expressing my actual opinion on this issue, and I feel unsatisfied because no one has given me actual evidence against it, at least until now. But I feel that a lot of your evidence is unsubstantiated. And you haven't given me any sources, so I don't know if you are skewing results or just flat out making stuff up. But here I go.

First of all, it's common knowledge that in many cases, minorities are at a worse state than whites. And while a lot of this is because of lasting effects of historical discrimination, most of it has gotten worse in recent days. Home ownership, funding to schools, and poverty statistics, all put minorities on the losing end. The reason? Historical discrimination. Recently, city, state, and the federal government, have implemented and tried to reduce these effects, but nothing changes. Why? Because the actions of the past are a domino effect. The poor state of these areas has generally decayed the societal values of these areas. When given a large sum of money, people are more likely to buy shoes and "drip", as opposed to investing that money into their futures or setting themselves up economically. This means that while these communities are no longer being treated disproportionately by the government, they are still continuing to get worse because of the societal "life is short" values that people live by, plus the overall situation getting worse for lesser income people in this country of all races.

White Americans generally hold better jobs by chance and lasting effect. Minorities have less paying jobs overall, and we can't really change that without the government being a d*ck. The reason for the disparity is lasting effects of location and job experience from a historical age of white advantage. We need to encourage and give easier job training in poorer areas, and make it easier to start a business in poorer areas, rather than use affirmative action.

The prison population inequality, is, and i'm sad to say it, due to minorities generally committing more crimes. I'm quite sure everyone knows this. While whites commit more crimes overall, latinos and african americans generally commit more crimes from a proportional perspective. This is do to societal values which in these poorer areas is more degraded, not race. There is no "institutional racism", its a lie. There is no proof to suggest blacks and hispanics are disproportionately jailed without causing disproportionate cimes.

The poll of racist attitudes sounds baloney. I would like to see where that survey was taken and how many people were polled. In reality, less than 15% of people in this country see any race as lower than their own, and most of that is probably actually minorities towards whites.

Yes, Trump is pandering to the far right and being too rhetorical for comfort, but he condemned the chants at his rallies and has went out of his way to condemn racists. I think he's a bad president, but racism is a buzzword.

I can see where you get your perspective from, but I have got a lot of perspective as well. I live in a pretty high minority area. I see these people, talk to them, and friends with them, and have learned their stories as well. The roots of the problem are poverty and bad areas where these people disproportionately live in, not because of fictional racism.

I've spent my time going through a school system which has plenty of minorities in higher occupations, getting good grades (often better than whites), etc. I live in a generic suburb, which I believe shows that it really depends on where someone lives, rather than their race, when it comes to opportunities. I think you need to look at the bigger picture.

I know this is a cliche, and one I posted many times myself. However, I have never meant it more than I do right now.


Thank you for posting directly into the thread.

[Grassroots]

"Race" and "Discrimination" are manufactured issues that mean nothing to people trying to put food on their f**king table.

There is no "discrimination" in this country.

Give me an example of discrimination in America. You can’t.

Racism isn’t an issue.

Whatever, racism isn’t an issue.

But racism still isn’t an issue.

It isn’t.

No, but racism isn’t an issue.

Epicly roasting me by placing my response here doesn’t change that it’s not a real issue.

It isn’t an issue.

Cmon buddy give me some evidence that it’s an issue.

You clearly can’t.

It’s not an issue.

https://lmgtfy.com/?q=racism+statistics&s=

And this proves your point... how? It’s a google search, you get opinions and polls. I don’t care about either of those. The reality is simple. Of course racism is bad, but it’s not an issue that affects anyone’s daily lives, let alone affecting anyones lives at all. People in this country are struggling to get employed, to make ends meet, to support their children’s future, to have good healthcare, and you seriously think racism is a big issue that is facing us all? What a joke.

You know, it's funny. I used to think like you. I was a naive white suburban pre-teen who thought we had solved racism and that people discussing racism were just being oversensitive. After all, we had a black President! We did away with legal segregation and Jim Crow decades ago! I hadn't experienced the cruel lash of racism myself, so I assumed it wasn't an issue for anybody in this day and age.

Then I matured a little bit. I got into high school and started to develop more of an interest in politics and the world around me. I befriended more people with backgrounds, races, ethnicities, appearances, cultures, and stories different than my own. I started to read more and pay attention to the news. And I started to realize that my thoughts on racism were foolish and underdeveloped. I didn't think racism was still a problem in this country because I was fortunate enough not to have experienced it personally.

My ignorance was regrettable, but in my own defense, I had yet to be truly exposed to other perspectives. You, on the other hand, have almost certainly been confronted with piles of evidence in your time trolling political communities like this one. But I'll give you the benefit of the doubt one more time. Let's review some of the most poignant realities. Let's review racism in this country today.

You talk about race being a distraction from bread and butter issues. People trying to put food on their table. So let's start there. Food insecurity disproportionately impacts racial minorities. While only 9% of white households in the US struggle with food insecurity, it’s a problem for 22% of black households and 18% of Hispanic households. In fact, according to Drexel’s Dr. Mariana Chilton, “you cannot take on poverty and hunger without taking on historical and contemporary discrimination.”

Let’s talk about poverty. According to the Census Bureau, for every $100 earned by white families in the US, black families earn an average of $57.30. That’s just income. In terms of actual wealth, for every $100 held by white families, black families hold $5.04. While only 10.1% of non-Hispanic whites live in poverty, 23.6% of Hispanic Americans do, alongside 26.2% of Black Americans and a shocking 28.3% of Native Americans.

How about jobs? According to Pew, for six or seven straight decades, the black unemployment rate has consistently been twice as high as the white unemployment rate. This affects black college graduates as well. Back in 2014, the unemployment rate for black college graduates was 12.4%. Overall, the unemployment rate for college graduates was 5.6%. Even higher education can’t outpace the scourge of racism. That’s not even getting into the well-attributed phenomenon of people with white sounding names receiving as high as 50% more callbacks for employment than those with stereotypically black names.

Let’s get back to education for a second. Black children are put to a disadvantage as early as preschool, where they make up half of all suspensions per the Department of Education. Across the nation, minority children make up disproportionate percentages of schools that underachieve, largely due to poor funding. According to a paper from the Civil Rights Project, schools with high proportions of minority enrollment are often characterized by "less experienced and less qualified teachers, high levels of teacher turnover, less successful peer groups and inadequate facilities and learning materials." And their problems don’t end in high school. According to the Hechinger Report, 42% of college age white Americans are actually enrolled in college, while only 34% of black and Hispanic Americans the same age are. These students are less likely to go to selective institutions and are less likely to graduate.

Black people make up around 40% of the prison population despite making up 13% of the total population of the country. This is due entirely to institutional racism, sentencing disparities, and racial profiling. Black drivers are 30% more likely to be pulled over by the police and black convicts are 20% more likely to be sentenced to jail time for the same crime (oh, and by the way, their sentences are 20% longer as well.)

Only 42% of black Americans own homes, as compared to 72% of white Americans.

When an implicit bias survey was conducted in 2012, 56% of Americans expressed anti-black attitudes. 57% of Americans expressed anti-Hispanic attitudes.

76% of black and Asian Americans, alongside 58% of Hispanics, said that they had experienced discrimination or unfair treatment at some point in their lives, something that can affect one’s psyche for years.

Let’s not forget about the President of the United States denigrating members of Congress, telling them to go back to their countries and implying their citizenship wasn’t equal to a native-born white American’s. Do you think that promotes a good image of American values in the mind’s eye of children of color?

I could go on for pages and pages, but since I assume you gave up reading a while back, I’ll wrap up with an anecdote. The other day, I attended a roundtable talk put on by some friends of mine. It was intended to discuss race, culture, and disparities here in my home county. Not that someone like you would see the value in this, but I found the perspectives of those who had differences than my own illuminating. Racial disparities exist everywhere, and if you’re not aware of that, you need to look harder. A Latino guy made the salient point that something as simple as trash collection was done with much more care in the whiter portion of my county where he used to live than the less white portion of the county where he lives now. Several Muslim students brought up the difficulties they had experienced attempting to practice their faith in school.

I find it quite telling that you don’t find racism to be a big problem in the US, Grasr00ts. It goes to show that you’re lucky. You’re living in a fantasy land where you haven’t been the victim of these vicious behaviors and, since you’re the kind of person who’s seemingly incapable of understanding other people’s perspectives, you assume that all of this bigotry has vanished. It hasn’t and it’s stunningly naive for you to assume that is has. I encourage you to try and learn from people who don’t think like you and don’t have the same background as you in the future. Like I said, I was once like you. I hadn’t experienced all of this crap so I assumed there was no way it could exist. I was wrong then, and you’re wrong now. Grow up, open your eyes, and listen to others. It might just serve you well.

Nice try, but i'm not falling for it. So many things are wrong with this post I don't even know where to start.

Don't accuse me of trolling, i'm simply expressing my actual opinion on this issue, and I feel unsatisfied because no one has given me actual evidence against it, at least until now. But I feel that a lot of your evidence is unsubstantiated. And you haven't given me any sources, so I don't know if you are skewing results or just flat out making stuff up. But here I go.

First of all, it's common knowledge that in many cases, minorities are at a worse state than whites. And while a lot of this is because of lasting effects of historical discrimination, most of it has gotten worse in recent days. Home ownership, funding to schools, and poverty statistics, all put minorities on the losing end. The reason? Historical discrimination. Recently, city, state, and the federal government, have implemented and tried to reduce these effects, but nothing changes. Why? Because the actions of the past are a domino effect. The poor state of these areas has generally decayed the societal values of these areas. When given a large sum of money, people are more likely to buy shoes and "drip", as opposed to investing that money into their futures or setting themselves up economically. This means that while these communities are no longer being treated disproportionately by the government, they are still continuing to get worse because of the societal "life is short" values that people live by, plus the overall situation getting worse for lesser income people in this country of all races.

White Americans generally hold better jobs by chance and lasting effect. Minorities have less paying jobs overall, and we can't really change that without the government being a d*ck. The reason for the disparity is lasting effects of location and job experience from a historical age of white advantage. We need to encourage and give easier job training in poorer areas, and make it easier to start a business in poorer areas, rather than use affirmative action.

The prison population inequality, is, and i'm sad to say it, due to minorities generally committing more crimes. I'm quite sure everyone knows this. While whites commit more crimes overall, latinos and african americans generally commit more crimes from a proportional perspective. This is do to societal values which in these poorer areas is more degraded, not race. There is no "institutional racism", its a lie. There is no proof to suggest blacks and hispanics are disproportionately jailed without causing disproportionate cimes.

The poll of racist attitudes sounds baloney. I would like to see where that survey was taken and how many people were polled. In reality, less than 15% of people in this country see any race as lower than their own, and most of that is probably actually minorities towards whites.

Yes, Trump is pandering to the far right and being too rhetorical for comfort, but he condemned the chants at his rallies and has went out of his way to condemn racists. I think he's a bad president, but racism is a buzzword.

I can see where you get your perspective from, but I have got a lot of perspective as well. I live in a pretty high minority area. I see these people, talk to them, and friends with them, and have learned their stories as well. The roots of the problem are poverty and bad areas where these people disproportionately live in, not because of fictional racism.

I've spent my time going through a school system which has plenty of minorities in higher occupations, getting good grades (often better than whites), etc. I live in a generic suburb, which I believe shows that it really depends on where someone lives, rather than their race, when it comes to opportunities. I think you need to look at the bigger picture.

I know this is a cliche, and one I posted many times myself. However, I have never meant it more than I do right now.


Thank you for posting directly into the thread.

"Badger quoted you in a post"

ZZZZZZZZZZZZZ, nothing to see here folks.

And thank you for, just like every other lefty here, not actually criticizing or constructively responding to my argument.

[Badger]

"Race" and "Discrimination" are manufactured issues that mean nothing to people trying to put food on their f**king table.

There is no "discrimination" in this country.

Give me an example of discrimination in America. You can’t.

Racism isn’t an issue.

Whatever, racism isn’t an issue.

But racism still isn’t an issue.

It isn’t.

No, but racism isn’t an issue.

Epicly roasting me by placing my response here doesn’t change that it’s not a real issue.

It isn’t an issue.

Cmon buddy give me some evidence that it’s an issue.

You clearly can’t.

It’s not an issue.

https://lmgtfy.com/?q=racism+statistics&s=

And this proves your point... how? It’s a google search, you get opinions and polls. I don’t care about either of those. The reality is simple. Of course racism is bad, but it’s not an issue that affects anyone’s daily lives, let alone affecting anyones lives at all. People in this country are struggling to get employed, to make ends meet, to support their children’s future, to have good healthcare, and you seriously think racism is a big issue that is facing us all? What a joke.

You know, it's funny. I used to think like you. I was a naive white suburban pre-teen who thought we had solved racism and that people discussing racism were just being oversensitive. After all, we had a black President! We did away with legal segregation and Jim Crow decades ago! I hadn't experienced the cruel lash of racism myself, so I assumed it wasn't an issue for anybody in this day and age.

Then I matured a little bit. I got into high school and started to develop more of an interest in politics and the world around me. I befriended more people with backgrounds, races, ethnicities, appearances, cultures, and stories different than my own. I started to read more and pay attention to the news. And I started to realize that my thoughts on racism were foolish and underdeveloped. I didn't think racism was still a problem in this country because I was fortunate enough not to have experienced it personally.

My ignorance was regrettable, but in my own defense, I had yet to be truly exposed to other perspectives. You, on the other hand, have almost certainly been confronted with piles of evidence in your time trolling political communities like this one. But I'll give you the benefit of the doubt one more time. Let's review some of the most poignant realities. Let's review racism in this country today.

You talk about race being a distraction from bread and butter issues. People trying to put food on their table. So let's start there. Food insecurity disproportionately impacts racial minorities. While only 9% of white households in the US struggle with food insecurity, it’s a problem for 22% of black households and 18% of Hispanic households. In fact, according to Drexel’s Dr. Mariana Chilton, “you cannot take on poverty and hunger without taking on historical and contemporary discrimination.”

Let’s talk about poverty. According to the Census Bureau, for every $100 earned by white families in the US, black families earn an average of $57.30. That’s just income. In terms of actual wealth, for every $100 held by white families, black families hold $5.04. While only 10.1% of non-Hispanic whites live in poverty, 23.6% of Hispanic Americans do, alongside 26.2% of Black Americans and a shocking 28.3% of Native Americans.

How about jobs? According to Pew, for six or seven straight decades, the black unemployment rate has consistently been twice as high as the white unemployment rate. This affects black college graduates as well. Back in 2014, the unemployment rate for black college graduates was 12.4%. Overall, the unemployment rate for college graduates was 5.6%. Even higher education can’t outpace the scourge of racism. That’s not even getting into the well-attributed phenomenon of people with white sounding names receiving as high as 50% more callbacks for employment than those with stereotypically black names.

Let’s get back to education for a second. Black children are put to a disadvantage as early as preschool, where they make up half of all suspensions per the Department of Education. Across the nation, minority children make up disproportionate percentages of schools that underachieve, largely due to poor funding. According to a paper from the Civil Rights Project, schools with high proportions of minority enrollment are often characterized by "less experienced and less qualified teachers, high levels of teacher turnover, less successful peer groups and inadequate facilities and learning materials." And their problems don’t end in high school. According to the Hechinger Report, 42% of college age white Americans are actually enrolled in college, while only 34% of black and Hispanic Americans the same age are. These students are less likely to go to selective institutions and are less likely to graduate.

Black people make up around 40% of the prison population despite making up 13% of the total population of the country. This is due entirely to institutional racism, sentencing disparities, and racial profiling. Black drivers are 30% more likely to be pulled over by the police and black convicts are 20% more likely to be sentenced to jail time for the same crime (oh, and by the way, their sentences are 20% longer as well.)

Only 42% of black Americans own homes, as compared to 72% of white Americans.

When an implicit bias survey was conducted in 2012, 56% of Americans expressed anti-black attitudes. 57% of Americans expressed anti-Hispanic attitudes.

76% of black and Asian Americans, alongside 58% of Hispanics, said that they had experienced discrimination or unfair treatment at some point in their lives, something that can affect one’s psyche for years.

Let’s not forget about the President of the United States denigrating members of Congress, telling them to go back to their countries and implying their citizenship wasn’t equal to a native-born white American’s. Do you think that promotes a good image of American values in the mind’s eye of children of color?

I could go on for pages and pages, but since I assume you gave up reading a while back, I’ll wrap up with an anecdote. The other day, I attended a roundtable talk put on by some friends of mine. It was intended to discuss race, culture, and disparities here in my home county. Not that someone like you would see the value in this, but I found the perspectives of those who had differences than my own illuminating. Racial disparities exist everywhere, and if you’re not aware of that, you need to look harder. A Latino guy made the salient point that something as simple as trash collection was done with much more care in the whiter portion of my county where he used to live than the less white portion of the county where he lives now. Several Muslim students brought up the difficulties they had experienced attempting to practice their faith in school.

I find it quite telling that you don’t find racism to be a big problem in the US, Grasr00ts. It goes to show that you’re lucky. You’re living in a fantasy land where you haven’t been the victim of these vicious behaviors and, since you’re the kind of person who’s seemingly incapable of understanding other people’s perspectives, you assume that all of this bigotry has vanished. It hasn’t and it’s stunningly naive for you to assume that is has. I encourage you to try and learn from people who don’t think like you and don’t have the same background as you in the future. Like I said, I was once like you. I hadn’t experienced all of this crap so I assumed there was no way it could exist. I was wrong then, and you’re wrong now. Grow up, open your eyes, and listen to others. It might just serve you well.

Nice try, but i'm not falling for it. So many things are wrong with this post I don't even know where to start.

Don't accuse me of trolling, i'm simply expressing my actual opinion on this issue, and I feel unsatisfied because no one has given me actual evidence against it, at least until now. But I feel that a lot of your evidence is unsubstantiated. And you haven't given me any sources, so I don't know if you are skewing results or just flat out making stuff up. But here I go.

First of all, it's common knowledge that in many cases, minorities are at a worse state than whites. And while a lot of this is because of lasting effects of historical discrimination, most of it has gotten worse in recent days. Home ownership, funding to schools, and poverty statistics, all put minorities on the losing end. The reason? Historical discrimination. Recently, city, state, and the federal government, have implemented and tried to reduce these effects, but nothing changes. Why? Because the actions of the past are a domino effect. The poor state of these areas has generally decayed the societal values of these areas. When given a large sum of money, people are more likely to buy shoes and "drip", as opposed to investing that money into their futures or setting themselves up economically. This means that while these communities are no longer being treated disproportionately by the government, they are still continuing to get worse because of the societal "life is short" values that people live by, plus the overall situation getting worse for lesser income people in this country of all races.

White Americans generally hold better jobs by chance and lasting effect. Minorities have less paying jobs overall, and we can't really change that without the government being a d*ck. The reason for the disparity is lasting effects of location and job experience from a historical age of white advantage. We need to encourage and give easier job training in poorer areas, and make it easier to start a business in poorer areas, rather than use affirmative action.

The prison population inequality, is, and i'm sad to say it, due to minorities generally committing more crimes. I'm quite sure everyone knows this. While whites commit more crimes overall, latinos and african americans generally commit more crimes from a proportional perspective. This is do to societal values which in these poorer areas is more degraded, not race. There is no "institutional racism", its a lie. There is no proof to suggest blacks and hispanics are disproportionately jailed without causing disproportionate cimes.

The poll of racist attitudes sounds baloney. I would like to see where that survey was taken and how many people were polled. In reality, less than 15% of people in this country see any race as lower than their own, and most of that is probably actually minorities towards whites.

Yes, Trump is pandering to the far right and being too rhetorical for comfort, but he condemned the chants at his rallies and has went out of his way to condemn racists. I think he's a bad president, but racism is a buzzword.

I can see where you get your perspective from, but I have got a lot of perspective as well. I live in a pretty high minority area. I see these people, talk to them, and friends with them, and have learned their stories as well. The roots of the problem are poverty and bad areas where these people disproportionately live in, not because of fictional racism.

I've spent my time going through a school system which has plenty of minorities in higher occupations, getting good grades (often better than whites), etc. I live in a generic suburb, which I believe shows that it really depends on where someone lives, rather than their race, when it comes to opportunities. I think you need to look at the bigger picture.

I know this is a cliche, and one I posted many times myself. However, I have never meant it more than I do right now.


Thank you for posting directly into the thread.

"Badger quoted you in a post"

ZZZZZZZZZZZZZ, nothing to see here folks.

And thank you for, just like every other lefty here, not actually criticizing or constructively responding to my argument.

Quit whining. You presented nothing resembling a coherent argument to constructively respond to.

Besides. Wesley what's his name responded with the most in-depth, fact Laden, and eloquent deconstruction of your argument that one could ever hope to read. And true to form for you, it went in one ear and completely out the other.

[John Dule]

You know, it's funny. I used to think like you. I was a naive white suburban pre-teen who thought we had solved racism and that people discussing racism were just being oversensitive. After all, we had a black President! We did away with legal segregation and Jim Crow decades ago! I hadn't experienced the cruel lash of racism myself, so I assumed it wasn't an issue for anybody in this day and age.

Then I matured a little bit. I got into high school and started to develop more of an interest in politics and the world around me. I befriended more people with backgrounds, races, ethnicities, appearances, cultures, and stories different than my own. I started to read more and pay attention to the news. And I started to realize that my thoughts on racism were foolish and underdeveloped. I didn't think racism was still a problem in this country because I was fortunate enough not to have experienced it personally.

My ignorance was regrettable, but in my own defense, I had yet to be truly exposed to other perspectives. You, on the other hand, have almost certainly been confronted with piles of evidence in your time trolling political communities like this one. But I'll give you the benefit of the doubt one more time. Let's review some of the most poignant realities. Let's review racism in this country today.

You talk about race being a distraction from bread and butter issues. People trying to put food on their table. So let's start there. Food insecurity disproportionately impacts racial minorities. While only 9% of white households in the US struggle with food insecurity, it’s a problem for 22% of black households and 18% of Hispanic households. In fact, according to Drexel’s Dr. Mariana Chilton, “you cannot take on poverty and hunger without taking on historical and contemporary discrimination.”

Let’s talk about poverty. According to the Census Bureau, for every $100 earned by white families in the US, black families earn an average of $57.30. That’s just income. In terms of actual wealth, for every $100 held by white families, black families hold $5.04. While only 10.1% of non-Hispanic whites live in poverty, 23.6% of Hispanic Americans do, alongside 26.2% of Black Americans and a shocking 28.3% of Native Americans.

How about jobs? According to Pew, for six or seven straight decades, the black unemployment rate has consistently been twice as high as the white unemployment rate. This affects black college graduates as well. Back in 2014, the unemployment rate for black college graduates was 12.4%. Overall, the unemployment rate for college graduates was 5.6%. Even higher education can’t outpace the scourge of racism. That’s not even getting into the well-attributed phenomenon of people with white sounding names receiving as high as 50% more callbacks for employment than those with stereotypically black names.

Let’s get back to education for a second. Black children are put to a disadvantage as early as preschool, where they make up half of all suspensions per the Department of Education. Across the nation, minority children make up disproportionate percentages of schools that underachieve, largely due to poor funding. According to a paper from the Civil Rights Project, schools with high proportions of minority enrollment are often characterized by "less experienced and less qualified teachers, high levels of teacher turnover, less successful peer groups and inadequate facilities and learning materials." And their problems don’t end in high school. According to the Hechinger Report, 42% of college age white Americans are actually enrolled in college, while only 34% of black and Hispanic Americans the same age are. These students are less likely to go to selective institutions and are less likely to graduate.

Black people make up around 40% of the prison population despite making up 13% of the total population of the country. This is due entirely to institutional racism, sentencing disparities, and racial profiling. Black drivers are 30% more likely to be pulled over by the police and black convicts are 20% more likely to be sentenced to jail time for the same crime (oh, and by the way, their sentences are 20% longer as well.)

Only 42% of black Americans own homes, as compared to 72% of white Americans.

When an implicit bias survey was conducted in 2012, 56% of Americans expressed anti-black attitudes. 57% of Americans expressed anti-Hispanic attitudes.

76% of black and Asian Americans, alongside 58% of Hispanics, said that they had experienced discrimination or unfair treatment at some point in their lives, something that can affect one’s psyche for years.

Let’s not forget about the President of the United States denigrating members of Congress, telling them to go back to their countries and implying their citizenship wasn’t equal to a native-born white American’s. Do you think that promotes a good image of American values in the mind’s eye of children of color?

I could go on for pages and pages, but since I assume you gave up reading a while back, I’ll wrap up with an anecdote. The other day, I attended a roundtable talk put on by some friends of mine. It was intended to discuss race, culture, and disparities here in my home county. Not that someone like you would see the value in this, but I found the perspectives of those who had differences than my own illuminating. Racial disparities exist everywhere, and if you’re not aware of that, you need to look harder. A Latino guy made the salient point that something as simple as trash collection was done with much more care in the whiter portion of my county where he used to live than the less white portion of the county where he lives now. Several Muslim students brought up the difficulties they had experienced attempting to practice their faith in school.

I find it quite telling that you don’t find racism to be a big problem in the US, Grasr00ts. It goes to show that you’re lucky. You’re living in a fantasy land where you haven’t been the victim of these vicious behaviors and, since you’re the kind of person who’s seemingly incapable of understanding other people’s perspectives, you assume that all of this bigotry has vanished. It hasn’t and it’s stunningly naive for you to assume that is has. I encourage you to try and learn from people who don’t think like you and don’t have the same background as you in the future. Like I said, I was once like you. I hadn’t experienced all of this crap so I assumed there was no way it could exist. I was wrong then, and you’re wrong now. Grow up, open your eyes, and listen to others. It might just serve you well.

So, I'm not going to disagree with your excellent points here, or your statistics (which are obviously correct). I'm just curious to hear your perspective on how you attribute the cause of these inequalities. After all, the low median household wealth of black families has its roots in events that happened centuries ago; former slaves didn't have any savings to hand down to their descendants, and so these inequalities reverberated through every successive generation. I personally would say that the modern disparity between black and white wealth has less to do with modern-day racism than it does with simple structural inequalities that, although now gone, still affect the African-American community today. Some evidence: Studies have shown that modern Nigerian immigrants to America (who are just as black as any other African-American) actually earn more on average than native-born white families, which would suggest that appearance-based racial discrimination is not the root cause of the statistical inequalities to which you refer. So I'd actually say that citing modern examples of racial inequity isn't enough of a foundation for the claim that racism today is the number one cause of those issues, which is the point that Grassr00ts was arguing against, if I'm not mistaken. None of this is to say that racism doesn't exist in the US; it obviously does, but I still think that the shadow of slavery and Jim Crow is the real culprit behind the statistics you've cited, and things like workplace discrimination in 2019 are a distant second.

[Badger]

You know, it's funny. I used to think like you. I was a naive white suburban pre-teen who thought we had solved racism and that people discussing racism were just being oversensitive. After all, we had a black President! We did away with legal segregation and Jim Crow decades ago! I hadn't experienced the cruel lash of racism myself, so I assumed it wasn't an issue for anybody in this day and age.

Then I matured a little bit. I got into high school and started to develop more of an interest in politics and the world around me. I befriended more people with backgrounds, races, ethnicities, appearances, cultures, and stories different than my own. I started to read more and pay attention to the news. And I started to realize that my thoughts on racism were foolish and underdeveloped. I didn't think racism was still a problem in this country because I was fortunate enough not to have experienced it personally.

My ignorance was regrettable, but in my own defense, I had yet to be truly exposed to other perspectives. You, on the other hand, have almost certainly been confronted with piles of evidence in your time trolling political communities like this one. But I'll give you the benefit of the doubt one more time. Let's review some of the most poignant realities. Let's review racism in this country today.

You talk about race being a distraction from bread and butter issues. People trying to put food on their table. So let's start there. Food insecurity disproportionately impacts racial minorities. While only 9% of white households in the US struggle with food insecurity, it’s a problem for 22% of black households and 18% of Hispanic households. In fact, according to Drexel’s Dr. Mariana Chilton, “you cannot take on poverty and hunger without taking on historical and contemporary discrimination.”

Let’s talk about poverty. According to the Census Bureau, for every $100 earned by white families in the US, black families earn an average of $57.30. That’s just income. In terms of actual wealth, for every $100 held by white families, black families hold $5.04. While only 10.1% of non-Hispanic whites live in poverty, 23.6% of Hispanic Americans do, alongside 26.2% of Black Americans and a shocking 28.3% of Native Americans.

How about jobs? According to Pew, for six or seven straight decades, the black unemployment rate has consistently been twice as high as the white unemployment rate. This affects black college graduates as well. Back in 2014, the unemployment rate for black college graduates was 12.4%. Overall, the unemployment rate for college graduates was 5.6%. Even higher education can’t outpace the scourge of racism. That’s not even getting into the well-attributed phenomenon of people with white sounding names receiving as high as 50% more callbacks for employment than those with stereotypically black names.

Let’s get back to education for a second. Black children are put to a disadvantage as early as preschool, where they make up half of all suspensions per the Department of Education. Across the nation, minority children make up disproportionate percentages of schools that underachieve, largely due to poor funding. According to a paper from the Civil Rights Project, schools with high proportions of minority enrollment are often characterized by "less experienced and less qualified teachers, high levels of teacher turnover, less successful peer groups and inadequate facilities and learning materials." And their problems don’t end in high school. According to the Hechinger Report, 42% of college age white Americans are actually enrolled in college, while only 34% of black and Hispanic Americans the same age are. These students are less likely to go to selective institutions and are less likely to graduate.

Black people make up around 40% of the prison population despite making up 13% of the total population of the country. This is due entirely to institutional racism, sentencing disparities, and racial profiling. Black drivers are 30% more likely to be pulled over by the police and black convicts are 20% more likely to be sentenced to jail time for the same crime (oh, and by the way, their sentences are 20% longer as well.)

Only 42% of black Americans own homes, as compared to 72% of white Americans.

When an implicit bias survey was conducted in 2012, 56% of Americans expressed anti-black attitudes. 57% of Americans expressed anti-Hispanic attitudes.

76% of black and Asian Americans, alongside 58% of Hispanics, said that they had experienced discrimination or unfair treatment at some point in their lives, something that can affect one’s psyche for years.

Let’s not forget about the President of the United States denigrating members of Congress, telling them to go back to their countries and implying their citizenship wasn’t equal to a native-born white American’s. Do you think that promotes a good image of American values in the mind’s eye of children of color?

I could go on for pages and pages, but since I assume you gave up reading a while back, I’ll wrap up with an anecdote. The other day, I attended a roundtable talk put on by some friends of mine. It was intended to discuss race, culture, and disparities here in my home county. Not that someone like you would see the value in this, but I found the perspectives of those who had differences than my own illuminating. Racial disparities exist everywhere, and if you’re not aware of that, you need to look harder. A Latino guy made the salient point that something as simple as trash collection was done with much more care in the whiter portion of my county where he used to live than the less white portion of the county where he lives now. Several Muslim students brought up the difficulties they had experienced attempting to practice their faith in school.

I find it quite telling that you don’t find racism to be a big problem in the US, Grasr00ts. It goes to show that you’re lucky. You’re living in a fantasy land where you haven’t been the victim of these vicious behaviors and, since you’re the kind of person who’s seemingly incapable of understanding other people’s perspectives, you assume that all of this bigotry has vanished. It hasn’t and it’s stunningly naive for you to assume that is has. I encourage you to try and learn from people who don’t think like you and don’t have the same background as you in the future. Like I said, I was once like you. I hadn’t experienced all of this crap so I assumed there was no way it could exist. I was wrong then, and you’re wrong now. Grow up, open your eyes, and listen to others. It might just serve you well.

So, I'm not going to disagree with your excellent points here, or your statistics (which are obviously correct). I'm just curious to hear your perspective on how you attribute the cause of these inequalities. After all, the low median household wealth of black families has its roots in events that happened centuries ago; former slaves didn't have any savings to hand down to their descendants, and so these inequalities reverberated through every successive generation. I personally would say that the modern disparity between black and white wealth has less to do with modern-day racism than it does with simple structural inequalities that, although now gone, still affect the African-American community today. Some evidence: Studies have shown that modern Nigerian immigrants to America (who are just as black as any other African-American) actually earn more on average than native-born white families, which would suggest that appearance-based racial discrimination is not the root cause of the statistical inequalities to which you refer. So I'd actually say that citing modern examples of racial inequity isn't enough of a foundation for the claim that racism today is the number one cause of those issues, which is the point that Grassr00ts was arguing against, if I'm not mistaken. None of this is to say that racism doesn't exist in the US; it obviously does, but I still think that the shadow of slavery and Jim Crow is the real culprit behind the statistics you've cited, and things like workplace discrimination in 2019 are a distant second.

Good points. I'll try to respond.

First, to nitpick, some biggest inequities in wealth between blacks and whites today have to do with the post- World War II era rather than the post-civil War era. Both have their effect, but the greatest growth in wealth among Caucasian Americans since World War II has been the growth of Suburbia and the explosion of home ownership. Most Americans went to being home owners Rabil Dean equity and dust had wealth that, relative to Prior decades, exploded to the point that we have, or had, such an economically stable middle-class for decades. However, due to government redlining programs which were explicitly racist in their application, African Americans were largely cut out of that influx of post-war wealth growth. Although he oversimplifies things, there's a good Adam ruins everything bit on the subject. Check it out. It's one of his better ones.

The difference between Nigerian immigrants and many white Americans in terms of economic advancement mostly comes from the background of the immigrants. Other examples would be the first wave of Cuban, Vietnamese, and Korean immigrants, followed by many Indian immigrants. Immigrant groups were far better off economically then most of the immigrants that came through Ellis Island in the light in a previous decades. For that matter they are substantially better off than many modern-day immigrants. For example, while many conservatives liked to point to the industrious and low Reliance on public Services among modern Asian immigrants as proof that all we needed was a good bit of stick-to-itiveness and not government handouts, etc etc. However, slightly later immigrants from Cambodia, Laos, and other parts of Southeast Asia, including the Hammam, emigrated with far less familial and financial support then the Vietnamese first wave, and unsurprisingly there participation in Reliance of public services and violent gangs is as bad as many Central American refugees.

 I don't see can't remember what my point was there, but interesting, eh? Oh yes, point being that starting off a few rungs up on the ladder obviously has its advantages, but it doesn't necessarily negate the fact that racial discrimination is active and, while hardly Universal is some red avatars claim, arguably at least still pervasive.

I'm not sure how much I'd minimize discrimination here in 2019. Every couple years the Urban League does one of those studies where blacks and whites with essentially identical educational and professional backgrounds are hand-picked to apply for the same positions, and invariably the white person gets callbacks and second interviews and write far far surpassing equally qualified black applicants. Ditto for resumes email to prospective employers of identically suited candidates, but one with a stereotypical African-American name who, of course, gets vastly fewer calls for an interview. Yes, the Civil War and Jim Crow eras have lasting probating influence oh, and I would say the Jim Crow era of which ended only 50 years ago officially, still have much to do with inequality among African Americans, Latinos, another racial minorities. This, incidentally, is the primary reason I opposed the concept of reparations. I see it too much as a way for white Americans to collectively wash their hands of addressing ongoing pervasive issues of ongoing modern discrimination. When anyone points out that discrimination is still alive, if you're too many people will point to the reparations checks rendering it a closed issue.

So, I'm not sure if I really addressed your points rather than just threw in some random thoughts of my own, but there you go. Food for thought.

[John Dule]

Disappoints. I'll try to respond.

First, to nitpick, some biggest inequities in wealth between blacks and whites today have to do with the post- World War II era rather than the post-civil War era. Both have their effect, but the greatest growth in wealth among Caucasian Americans since World War II has been the growth of Suburbia and the explosion of home ownership. Most Americans went to being home owners Rabil Dean equity and dust had wealth that, relative to Prior decades, exploded to the point that we have, or had, such an economically stable middle-class for decades. However, due to government redlining programs which were explicitly racist in their application, African Americans were largely cut out of that influx of post-war wealth growth. Although he oversimplifies things, there's a good Adam ruins everything bit on the subject. Check it out. It's one of his better ones.

The difference between Nigerian immigrants and many white Americans in terms of economic advancement mostly comes from the background of the immigrants. Other examples would be the first wave of Cuban, Vietnamese, and Korean immigrants, followed by many Indian immigrants. Immigrant groups were far better off economically then most of the immigrants that came through Ellis Island in the light in a previous decades. For that matter they are substantially better off than many modern-day immigrants. For example, while many conservatives liked to point to the industrious and low Reliance on public Services among modern Asian immigrants as proof that all we needed was a good bit of stick-to-itiveness and not government handouts, etc etc. However, slightly later immigrants from Cambodia, Laos, and other parts of Southeast Asia, including the Hammam, emigrated with far less familial and financial support then the Vietnamese first wave, and unsurprisingly there participation in Reliance of public services and violent gangs is as bad as many Central American refugees.

 I don't see can't remember what my point was there, but interesting, eh? Oh yes, point being that starting off a few rungs up on the ladder obviously has its advantages, but it doesn't necessarily negate the fact that racial discrimination is active and, while hardly Universal is some red avatars claim, arguably at least still pervasive.

I'm not sure how much I'd minimize discrimination here in 2019. Every couple years the Urban League does one of those studies where blacks and whites with essentially identical educational and professional backgrounds are hand-picked to apply for the same positions, and invariably the white person gets callbacks and second interviews and write far far surpassing equally qualified black applicants. Ditto for resumes email to prospective employers of identically suited candidates, but one with a stereotypical African-American name who, of course, gets vastly fewer calls for an interview. Yes, the Civil War and Jim Crow eras have lasting probating influence oh, and I would say the Jim Crow era of which ended only 50 years ago officially, still have much to do with inequality among African Americans, Latinos, another racial minorities. This, incidentally, is the primary reason I opposed the concept of reparations. I see it too much as a way for white Americans to collectively wash their hands of addressing ongoing pervasive issues of ongoing modern discrimination. When anyone points out that discrimination is still alive, if you're too many people will point to the reparations checks rendering it a closed issue.

So, I'm not sure if I really addressed your points rather than just threw in some random thoughts of my own, but there you go. Food for thought.

Forgive me, but wouldn't the bolded part of your comment reinforce my claim that a person's socioeconomic background has more to do with their current poverty than outright phenotype discrimination does? The whole "model minority" thing got started because the Asian immigrants coming to this country were often upper-middle-class trained professionals, or other people with marketable skills who came for economic reasons. Anyway, I actually took a whole class on the issues you just brought up (red-line districts, the HOLC, etc), so I'm well aware of all that. I'm not saying that slavery is the end-all, be-all for the state of black America, but the lack of generational wealth being passed down has caused so many other things-- low homeownership, low educational attainment, fewer employment opportunities-- that it's hard to point to anything else as the number one problem holding African-Americans back.

My point is that if we waved a magic wand and erased racism and prejudice from America today, all the inequalities listed in this thread would still persist. Employers no longer refuse to hire black people because they're black? Great, now they won't hire them because they have lower educational attainment. Banks no longer refuse loans to black people because of their skin color? Great, now they'll refuse those same loans because the applicant doesn't have the necessary collateral. To say that these problems are holdovers from Jim Crow, slavery, and past generations isn't to say that they're going to go away on their own; far from it. In fact, I'm arguing that simply changing our attitudes about race today won't undo the cold utilitarian calculus that employers, bankers, and college admissions departments have to make, and that calculus will still discriminate against African-Americans even if it uses purely "unbiased" metrics.

[Badger]

Disappoints. I'll try to respond.

First, to nitpick, some biggest inequities in wealth between blacks and whites today have to do with the post- World War II era rather than the post-civil War era. Both have their effect, but the greatest growth in wealth among Caucasian Americans since World War II has been the growth of Suburbia and the explosion of home ownership. Most Americans went to being home owners Rabil Dean equity and dust had wealth that, relative to Prior decades, exploded to the point that we have, or had, such an economically stable middle-class for decades. However, due to government redlining programs which were explicitly racist in their application, African Americans were largely cut out of that influx of post-war wealth growth. Although he oversimplifies things, there's a good Adam ruins everything bit on the subject. Check it out. It's one of his better ones.

The difference between Nigerian immigrants and many white Americans in terms of economic advancement mostly comes from the background of the immigrants. Other examples would be the first wave of Cuban, Vietnamese, and Korean immigrants, followed by many Indian immigrants. Immigrant groups were far better off economically then most of the immigrants that came through Ellis Island in the light in a previous decades. For that matter they are substantially better off than many modern-day immigrants. For example, while many conservatives liked to point to the industrious and low Reliance on public Services among modern Asian immigrants as proof that all we needed was a good bit of stick-to-itiveness and not government handouts, etc etc. However, slightly later immigrants from Cambodia, Laos, and other parts of Southeast Asia, including the Hammam, emigrated with far less familial and financial support then the Vietnamese first wave, and unsurprisingly there participation in Reliance of public services and violent gangs is as bad as many Central American refugees.

 I don't see can't remember what my point was there, but interesting, eh? Oh yes, point being that starting off a few rungs up on the ladder obviously has its advantages, but it doesn't necessarily negate the fact that racial discrimination is active and, while hardly Universal is some red avatars claim, arguably at least still pervasive.

I'm not sure how much I'd minimize discrimination here in 2019. Every couple years the Urban League does one of those studies where blacks and whites with essentially identical educational and professional backgrounds are hand-picked to apply for the same positions, and invariably the white person gets callbacks and second interviews and write far far surpassing equally qualified black applicants. Ditto for resumes email to prospective employers of identically suited candidates, but one with a stereotypical African-American name who, of course, gets vastly fewer calls for an interview. Yes, the Civil War and Jim Crow eras have lasting probating influence oh, and I would say the Jim Crow era of which ended only 50 years ago officially, still have much to do with inequality among African Americans, Latinos, another racial minorities. This, incidentally, is the primary reason I opposed the concept of reparations. I see it too much as a way for white Americans to collectively wash their hands of addressing ongoing pervasive issues of ongoing modern discrimination. When anyone points out that discrimination is still alive, if you're too many people will point to the reparations checks rendering it a closed issue.

So, I'm not sure if I really addressed your points rather than just threw in some random thoughts of my own, but there you go. Food for thought.

Forgive me, but wouldn't the bolded part of your comment reinforce my claim that a person's socioeconomic background has more to do with their current poverty than outright phenotype discrimination does? The whole "model minority" thing got started because the Asian immigrants coming to this country were often upper-middle-class trained professionals, or other people with marketable skills who came for economic reasons. Anyway, I actually took a whole class on the issues you just brought up (red-line districts, the HOLC, etc), so I'm well aware of all that. I'm not saying that slavery is the end-all, be-all for the state of black America, but the lack of generational wealth being passed down has caused so many other things-- low homeownership, low educational attainment, fewer employment opportunities-- that it's hard to point to anything else as the number one problem holding African-Americans back.

My point is that if we waved a magic wand and erased racism and prejudice from America today, all the inequalities listed in this thread would still persist. Employers no longer refuse to hire black people because they're black? Great, now they won't hire them because they have lower educational attainment. Banks no longer refuse loans to black people because of their skin color? Great, now they'll refuse those same loans because the applicant doesn't have the necessary collateral. To say that these problems are holdovers from Jim Crow, slavery, and past generations isn't to say that they're going to go away on their own; far from it. In fact, I'm arguing that simply changing our attitudes about race today won't undo the cold utilitarian calculus that employers, bankers, and college admissions departments have to make, and that calculus will still discriminate against African-Americans even if it uses purely "unbiased" metrics.

I can't argue with much, if any, of what you posted. I guess my point is that modern-day discrimination still has a great impact on the economic well being of minorities. Again, those repeatedly consistent experiments where equally qualified black applicants and resume submitters with black sounding names get call backs and interviews at a far lower rate than non Superior white applicants.

Those economic discrepancies you mentioned of course are present and have a significant impact. However race pervades those opportunities as much as economic or educational status. African Americans

[Badger]

Disappoints. I'll try to respond.

First, to nitpick, some biggest inequities in wealth between blacks and whites today have to do with the post- World War II era rather than the post-civil War era. Both have their effect, but the greatest growth in wealth among Caucasian Americans since World War II has been the growth of Suburbia and the explosion of home ownership. Most Americans went to being home owners Rabil Dean equity and dust had wealth that, relative to Prior decades, exploded to the point that we have, or had, such an economically stable middle-class for decades. However, due to government redlining programs which were explicitly racist in their application, African Americans were largely cut out of that influx of post-war wealth growth. Although he oversimplifies things, there's a good Adam ruins everything bit on the subject. Check it out. It's one of his better ones.

The difference between Nigerian immigrants and many white Americans in terms of economic advancement mostly comes from the background of the immigrants. Other examples would be the first wave of Cuban, Vietnamese, and Korean immigrants, followed by many Indian immigrants. Immigrant groups were far better off economically then most of the immigrants that came through Ellis Island in the light in a previous decades. For that matter they are substantially better off than many modern-day immigrants. For example, while many conservatives liked to point to the industrious and low Reliance on public Services among modern Asian immigrants as proof that all we needed was a good bit of stick-to-itiveness and not government handouts, etc etc. However, slightly later immigrants from Cambodia, Laos, and other parts of Southeast Asia, including the Hammam, emigrated with far less familial and financial support then the Vietnamese first wave, and unsurprisingly there participation in Reliance of public services and violent gangs is as bad as many Central American refugees.

 I don't see can't remember what my point was there, but interesting, eh? Oh yes, point being that starting off a few rungs up on the ladder obviously has its advantages, but it doesn't necessarily negate the fact that racial discrimination is active and, while hardly Universal is some red avatars claim, arguably at least still pervasive.

I'm not sure how much I'd minimize discrimination here in 2019. Every couple years the Urban League does one of those studies where blacks and whites with essentially identical educational and professional backgrounds are hand-picked to apply for the same positions, and invariably the white person gets callbacks and second interviews and write far far surpassing equally qualified black applicants. Ditto for resumes email to prospective employers of identically suited candidates, but one with a stereotypical African-American name who, of course, gets vastly fewer calls for an interview. Yes, the Civil War and Jim Crow eras have lasting probating influence oh, and I would say the Jim Crow era of which ended only 50 years ago officially, still have much to do with inequality among African Americans, Latinos, another racial minorities. This, incidentally, is the primary reason I opposed the concept of reparations. I see it too much as a way for white Americans to collectively wash their hands of addressing ongoing pervasive issues of ongoing modern discrimination. When anyone points out that discrimination is still alive, if you're too many people will point to the reparations checks rendering it a closed issue.

So, I'm not sure if I really addressed your points rather than just threw in some random thoughts of my own, but there you go. Food for thought.

Forgive me, but wouldn't the bolded part of your comment reinforce my claim that a person's socioeconomic background has more to do with their current poverty than outright phenotype discrimination does? The whole "model minority" thing got started because the Asian immigrants coming to this country were often upper-middle-class trained professionals, or other people with marketable skills who came for economic reasons. Anyway, I actually took a whole class on the issues you just brought up (red-line districts, the HOLC, etc), so I'm well aware of all that. I'm not saying that slavery is the end-all, be-all for the state of black America, but the lack of generational wealth being passed down has caused so many other things-- low homeownership, low educational attainment, fewer employment opportunities-- that it's hard to point to anything else as the number one problem holding African-Americans back.

My point is that if we waved a magic wand and erased racism and prejudice from America today, all the inequalities listed in this thread would still persist. Employers no longer refuse to hire black people because they're black? Great, now they won't hire them because they have lower educational attainment. Banks no longer refuse loans to black people because of their skin color? Great, now they'll refuse those same loans because the applicant doesn't have the necessary collateral. To say that these problems are holdovers from Jim Crow, slavery, and past generations isn't to say that they're going to go away on their own; far from it. In fact, I'm arguing that simply changing our attitudes about race today won't undo the cold utilitarian calculus that employers, bankers, and college admissions departments have to make, and that calculus will still discriminate against African-Americans even if it uses purely "unbiased" metrics.

I can't argue with much, if any, of what you posted. I guess my point is that modern-day discrimination still has a great impact on the economic well being of minorities. Again, those repeatedly consistent experiments where equally qualified black applicants and resume submitters with black sounding names get call backs and interviews at a far lower rate than non Superior white applicants.

Those economic discrepancies you mentioned of course are present and have a significant impact. However race pervades those opportunities as much as economic or educational status. African Americans have similar disadvantages in workplace advancement and job attainment versus similarly qualified white applicants even when the applicants, including the black one, have postgraduate degrees. Similarly, while reputable lending institutions aren't necessarily rolling out the red carpet for lights with low credit, their chances of obtaining credit brother Financial backing is still significantly better than for African Americans of similarly modest means.

At the risk of creating an unnecessary Kumbaya moment oh, I think we can both agree that race and economic status, in addition to being a chicken and egg Style question, are both pervasive hindrances towards minorities advancing up the economic and social ladder. As to which one is worse oh, we could have an interesting debate, But ultimately my view is it is akin to debating whether it's worse to have gonorrhea or syphilis.

[Politician]

I propose a rename of this thread.

No. White people absolutely will re-elect this pedophile rapist because he espouses their racial resentment and legitimizes it.

[Skunk]

I propose a rename of this thread.

No. White people absolutely will re-elect this pedophile rapist because he espouses their racial resentment and legitimizes it.

Where's the lie though?

[Grassroots]

I propose a rename of this thread.

No. White people absolutely will re-elect this pedophile rapist because he espouses their racial resentment and legitimizes it.

Where's the lie though?

Your hatred (or self-hate) of white people is showing. That was a bigoted post clear and simple.

[John Dule]

I propose a rename of this thread.

No. White people absolutely will re-elect this pedophile rapist because he espouses their racial resentment and legitimizes it.

Where's the lie though?

538 just released an article showing that racial resentment has actually decreased during Trump's presidency.

[Santander]

I propose a rename of this thread.

No. White people absolutely will re-elect this pedophile rapist because he espouses their racial resentment and legitimizes it.

Where's the lie though?

538 just released an article showing that racial resentment has actually decreased during Trump's presidency.

Yeah, because the racist a**holes couldn't stand a black guy in the White House.

[Politician]

MUH TRENDS

In 2016, Clinton carried Rutland County, VT 46.0-42.1; Obama had won it 59.7-37.9 four years earlier. The county's population declined 4.8% from 2010 to 2018, and it is one of the more rural and less university-oriented VT counties.

I vote Tilt D.

[SingingAnalyst]

MUH TRENDS

In 2016, Clinton carried Rutland County, VT 46.0-42.1; Obama had won it 59.7-37.9 four years earlier. The county's population declined 4.8% from 2010 to 2018, and it is one of the more rural and less university-oriented VT counties.

I vote Tilt D.

You know, you're right. Screw the trends!

In 2020 MI-PA-WI will go back to being comfortably Democratic, with Kamala Harris handily winning economically anxious Catholic voters in Macomb and Bay Counties en route to her historic victory. Heck, Ohio will probably vote for her as well esp if Sherrod is on the ticket.

And just for old time's sake, let's put AR-KY-TN-WV back into the D column.

See, I can have fun with this too!

[RINO Tom]

^ People aren’t simply parts of a math equation, dude.  Politician willingly ignores trends he doesn’t like (which is different from predicting them inaccurately, as I certainly did), but that doesn’t make trends worshipers right, either.  We aren’t going to have a map in 2044 that is 2016 trends drawn out another 25 years from right now.  That’s absurd.

[🐒Gods of Prosperity🔱🐲💸]

^ People aren’t simply parts of a math equation, dude.  Politician willingly ignores trends he doesn’t like (which is different from predicting them inaccurately, as I certainly did), but that doesn’t make trends worshipers right, either.  We aren’t going to have a map in 2044 that is 2016 trends drawn out another 25 years from right now.  That’s absurd.

How is it worshipping trends to use them to make a guess about how a county will vote?

[RINO Tom]

^ People aren’t simply parts of a math equation, dude.  Politician willingly ignores trends he doesn’t like (which is different from predicting them inaccurately, as I certainly did), but that doesn’t make trends worshipers right, either.  We aren’t going to have a map in 2044 that is 2016 trends drawn out another 25 years from right now.  That’s absurd.

How is it worshipping trends to use them to make a guess about how a county will vote?

It’s not, if you’re simply using them to make a guess and never forget that’s what it is.  It becomes an annoying problem when anyone who doesn’t agree with said guess on a given county is literally mocked and ridiculed by the barely distinguishable spammers on the 2020 board.

[TrendsareUsuallyReal]

^ People aren’t simply parts of a math equation, dude.  Politician willingly ignores trends he doesn’t like (which is different from predicting them inaccurately, as I certainly did), but that doesn’t make trends worshipers right, either.  We aren’t going to have a map in 2044 that is 2016 trends drawn out another 25 years from right now.  That’s absurd.

How is it worshipping trends to use them to make a guess about how a county will vote?

It’s not, if you’re simply using them to make a guess and never forget that’s what it is.  It becomes an annoying problem when anyone who doesn’t agree with said guess on a given county is literally mocked and ridiculed by the barely distinguishable spammers on the 2020 board.

My username is mostly a parody in response to Mr. Politician’s insistence that Texas is not turning blue. I hope it’s clear mine is more tongue in cheek due to his/her denial that Texas and other parts of the south that are getting browner and packed with white hippies are (SPOILER ALERT) getting bluer

Coalitions will evolve over the next twenty five years to look a little different than they do now, but I guarantee most of the underlying factors will still be there, much like how the Republicans’ and Democrats’ bases haven’t evolved too much since the 1980’s/90’s. It was true then that the Republican base was evangelical whites, and it’s true today but moreso. It was true then that the Democratic base was minorities, academics, and union workers. It’s largely true today too, except for the last part.

[lfromnj]

Its absurd to use Vermont with the Sanders write in.

[lfromnj]

Not that I would take away the SNAP benefits, as people there need them. (I would take sugary sodas off the list of eligible items; I would give everyone on SNAP a cookbook; I would replace sodas with detergents as items of eligibility).

What is wrong with Trump country?

Yeah not gonna deny its just as ed up lol with regards to poverty.

But even with all that poverty.

https://www.usnews.com/education/best-high-schools/kentucky/districts/owsley-county/owsley-county-high-school-8396

It still has half the people proficient in math/reading.   I would much rather be brought up here than Baltimore Maryland because atleast there is a decent chance of getting out of the vicious cycle of poverty Baltimore creates.


https://www.usnews.com/education/best-high-schools/maryland/districts/baltimore-city-public-schools/patterson-high-9017

Meanwhile a school in inner city Baltimore.

I do understand the Kentucky test districts probably have a slightly lower standard but overall there is no legitimate excuse to explain why these two schools are so different with regard to school performance. Even when comparing nationalized standardized tests  with ACT to SAT and using a convertor the Owsley county students have a score about 100 higher. What resources do these students have that inner city Baltimore students don't?

It's easier to get out of a vicious cycle of poverty in rural Kentucky than in Baltimore because of the systematic white supremacy that's the root of the issue in the first place. Those kids in Kentucky probably have access to old boy networks and other needed resources that alot of inner city kids in Baltimore don't have which need to addressed via destroying America's racial caste system via reparations (both in land and wealth). Wouldn't put too much stock in the SAT/ACT due to it's origins.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

William Jennings Bryan? Scopes Monkey Trial?, Prohibition? Evangelicals re-engaged with politics in the 1970's, but I wouldn't call that a new movement.

Yes, fire-and-brimstone preachers have always existed as a small group, as in every single Christian country in the world, even the most peaceful. I'm well placed to know that.

To me the question was about when Bible Belt evangelicalism acquired the outsize importance it has in the US today compared to the rest of the developed world.

In the 19th century, evangelicals were just a minority. Even in the wake of the 1925 Scopes Trial (prosecuted by WJB, so both your examples are the same), fundamentalists were still a minority which could be ignored by politicians running for federal office. Which is why WJB was crushed 3 times at the ballot box, incidentally.
Only after tricky Dick's terms in office did they begin wielding political power, as the Protestant Churches lost the less belligerent wings of the their communities.

[Bleach Blonde Bad Built Butch Bodies for Biden]

This BS is why there shouldn't be a primary and the party insiders should just coronate a nominee. Biden will still win but will suffer damage because the rest of the candidates constantly beat up on him.

[7,052,770]

Systemic racism is fictional in the 2010’s.

[Boobs]

Naturally. In 1871 many Blacks considered Republicans as "savoirs" from the slavery system, and Democratic party as "party of the South". I doubt many still hold such views.

Welfare state = new plantations