Israel-Gaza war

[jaichind]

https://www.ndtv.com/india-news/reiterated-indias-principled-position-pm-modi-speaks-to-palestine-president-4497010

""Shared Our Deep Concern...": PM Modi Speaks To Palestinian President"

Modi came out strong for Israel at the beginning of the conflict for mostly domestic reasons.  As time passed, he must have received a lot of pressure from Arab Gulf states.  A key part of the Modi economic strategy does involve India-Gulf states investment and integration to counter PRC.  So after some time, he is pivoting somewhat.  The various pro-Modi Hindi media had been super gun-ho for Israel in the beginning are showing signs of toning it down to align with Modi to now mostly focusing on "watching the chaos in the Middle East makes one see how safe Modi made India in comparison"

[CumbrianLefty]

https://www.ndtv.com/india-news/reiterated-indias-principled-position-pm-modi-speaks-to-palestine-president-4497010

""Shared Our Deep Concern...": PM Modi Speaks To Palestinian President"

Modi came out strong for Israel at the beginning of the conflict for mostly domestic reasons.  As time passed, he must have received a lot of pressure from Arab Gulf states.  A key part of the Modi economic strategy does involve India-Gulf states investment and integration to counter PRC.  So after some time, he is pivoting somewhat.  The various pro-Modi Hindi media had been super gun-ho for Israel in the beginning are showing signs of toning it down to align with Modi to now mostly focusing on "watching the chaos in the Middle East makes one see how safe Modi made India in comparison"

As with other countries who were "1000% pro-Israel" at the start of this war.

[Red Velvet]

https://www.ndtv.com/india-news/reiterated-indias-principled-position-pm-modi-speaks-to-palestine-president-4497010

""Shared Our Deep Concern...": PM Modi Speaks To Palestinian President"

Modi came out strong for Israel at the beginning of the conflict for mostly domestic reasons.  As time passed, he must have received a lot of pressure from Arab Gulf states.  A key part of the Modi economic strategy does involve India-Gulf states investment and integration to counter PRC.  So after some time, he is pivoting somewhat.  The various pro-Modi Hindi media had been super gun-ho for Israel in the beginning are showing signs of toning it down to align with Modi to now mostly focusing on "watching the chaos in the Middle East makes one see how safe Modi made India in comparison"

People always mix up the leader with the country tbh.

Modi’s personal instincts are more right-wing and leaning towards Indian/Hindi nationalism, which under the scenario of Hamas attack, he will obviously come out strong in support of Israel in order to not set up precedents with Pakistan and signal to his electorate with Anti-Muslim rhetoric.

However, that shouldn’t be interpreted as Indian interests themselves being inherently against all muslim countries at all, as they want to position themselves as a Global South main leadership and the Muslim world is a big part of that. So when the conflict starts becoming more “complex” where Israel starts becoming the main aggressor with their disproportionate response, India is forced to reposition itself for pragmatic reasons, in order to not build a permanent bad blood with the Arab countries.

[Kahane's Grave Is A Gender-Neutral Bathroom]

Support for sending weapons to Israel not as high as I expected for GOP voters

I know these polls are saying one thing but the calls I am receiving suggest it’s even less. While this is all anecdotal, people are very angry about this and not just leftists. I think the media is covering the Palestinian angle more than in the past and that is having an impact.

The calls we're receiving (in a very left-wing district) are very neutral on the whole Israel-Palestine in general, while condemning both Hamas and Netanyahu. It's not cut-and-dry like Vosem and SnowStalker are implying.

Here's another good poll on the situation:

[Snowstalker Mk. II]

That big of a polling gap could be explained by either wording differences or a rapid day-to-day shift in sentiment as coverage shifts to the ongoing bombing of Gaza. We'll see what future polls show as they come.

[Snowstalker Mk. II]

Shrink the damn image Snowstalker

Done

[Vosem]

That big of a polling gap could be explained by either wording differences or a rapid day-to-day shift in sentiment as coverage shifts to the ongoing bombing of Gaza. We'll see what future polls show as they come.

The poll that had 48% of Americans supporting sending weapons and supplies to Israel also had 76% saying that Biden is sending either the right amount or not enough aid to Israel; I think the entirety of the difference is just wording differences. “Weapons and supplies” sounds much more intense than “aid”.

[Vosem]

As it turns out, the Israeli's had already bombed this hospital a few days previously. But of course they wouldn't do such a thing a second time.

https://www.anglicannews.org/news/2023/10/anglican-run-al-ahli-arab-hospital-in-gaza-damaged-by-israeli-rocket-fire-as-conflict-continues.aspx

Not a good day for the credibility of neoconservative propagandists and online intelligence assets spreading naked disinfo.

The horseshoe theory is real especially when it comes to foreign policy

Every time I see this term thrown around, it involves reactions to people expressing their empathy for mistreated, bombed or starving people (yes, even brown people — shocking!) and their opposition to the actors committing those crimes, so it probably says a lot more about the 'centrist' people using that term than it does about the term itself..

The point on the fish hook most distant from “far left” is exactly where you find me 🤷🏽‍♂️

No? I think many far-right people have identitarian concerns, while my political philosophy boils down to “the way to improve the lot of the most people is to strengthen a disunited nouvelle riche in every society”, subject to certain post-Industrial Revolution assumptions. This is much more directly “the opposite of being far-left” than most far-right people, since many of the far-left believe the way to do this is to unite and strengthen the poor or working class.

[ProudModerate2]

https://twitter.com/Channel4News/status/1715437877604049094

Again Channel 4 are a respected news source with a history of investigative journalism. It's vital that concerns over the version of events are investigated and addressed by the media.

I thought there was video evidence showing that one of the missiles fired by Hamas (the exact one in question), malfunctioned and actually made a U-turn(ish) and came back towards the hospital. So, the direction the missile landed at the hospital parking lot, is not in question.

[OSR stands with Israel]

https://www.ndtv.com/india-news/reiterated-indias-principled-position-pm-modi-speaks-to-palestine-president-4497010

""Shared Our Deep Concern...": PM Modi Speaks To Palestinian President"

Modi came out strong for Israel at the beginning of the conflict for mostly domestic reasons.  As time passed, he must have received a lot of pressure from Arab Gulf states.  A key part of the Modi economic strategy does involve India-Gulf states investment and integration to counter PRC.  So after some time, he is pivoting somewhat.  The various pro-Modi Hindi media had been super gun-ho for Israel in the beginning are showing signs of toning it down to align with Modi to now mostly focusing on "watching the chaos in the Middle East makes one see how safe Modi made India in comparison"

People always mix up the leader with the country tbh.

Modi’s personal instincts are more right-wing and leaning towards Indian/Hindi nationalism, which under the scenario of Hamas attack, he will obviously come out strong in support of Israel in order to not set up precedents with Pakistan and signal to his electorate with Anti-Muslim rhetoric.

However, that shouldn’t be interpreted as Indian interests themselves being inherently against all muslim countries at all, as they want to position themselves as a Global South main leadership and the Muslim world is a big part of that. So when the conflict starts becoming more “complex” where Israel starts becoming the main aggressor with their disproportionate response, India is forced to reposition itself for pragmatic reasons, in order to not build a permanent bad blood with the Arab countries.

Trends are what matter and India today is far more pro Israel and even more pro West than they were 25 let alone 50 years ago . Obviously they can’t abandon all their past stances in less than a decade cause foreign policy takes time to cultivate and change .

[Birdish]

https://twitter.com/AP/status/1715592306420486194?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5...

[prag_prog]

https://twitter.com/SometimesPooh/status/1714946653872910814?t=TBTvatgEjDdM8z2pE...

look at the community notes...there is just so much misinformation on twitter. People don't even bother verifying stories

[Snowstalker Mk. II]

https://twitter.com/SometimesPooh/status/1714946653872910814?t=TBTvatgEjDdM8z2pE...

look at the community notes...there is just so much misinformation on twitter. People don't even bother verifying stories

Deleted it.

[Snowstalker Mk. II]

BTW, I'm amazed that a former member of Congress's family getting killed has produced zero domestic backlash. The Mossad could probably outright put a hit on Tlaib and several red avatars would defend it.
https://twitter.com/justinamash/status/1715470077196194068?t=AkeoNOTRVgHtznAkqma...

[MT Treasurer]

^When you’ve learned that you can get away with a lot of things, there is no incentive for you to change course. As long as there is such a blatant power imbalance among the actors, there will never be an end to this conflict.

[Ferguson97]

https://twitter.com/USA_Polling/status/1715808716463743212

Half of 18–34-year-olds being pro-terrorism is legitimately concerning.

[LBJer]

Foreign Correspondent

Before the War

https://youtu.be/H7fG0FeVc1o

Some very interesting journalism that was put together, mainly concerning the West Bank settlements, before the onset of violence from Hamas.

Keep in mind this story started as a pro-Palestinian story from Australia's most left wing woke media. But regardless, if you take that wokey 'anti-Israel' bias with a grain of salt, it is still a very interesting story on the situation in Israel.

Palestinians should be able to get the world on their side by showing the brutality of Israeli settlers and the occupation of the west bank but you can only do that through non-violence.

In fairness it should be acknowledged that Jewish groups used terrorism before the creation of Israel.  The Irgun didn't exactly adopt a "no matter what happens to us, we won't use violence" approach either.

[American2020]

https://twitter.com/khaledmahmoued1/status/1715695165577273714

https://twitter.com/BarakRavid/status/1715745054675923212

[Velasco]

The "grievances " are the occupation and a cruel system if domination known as apartheid,  but still I would have answered that killing civilians is not justified.

Are genocidal rhetoric and the indiscrinibate murder of Palestinian civilians (4000+ so far) justifica by Hamas atrocious crimes? Is there a poll posing that relevant question? Do you realize about the bias?

[omar04]

https://twitter.com/USA_Polling/status/1715808716463743212

Half of 18–34-year-olds being pro-terrorism is legitimately concerning.

I find this hard to trust considering other polls show 19% of 18-29 year olds and 9% of Americans sympathizing more with Palestine (page 78). https://www.scribd.com/document/678478269/20231016-yahoo-tabs-1

[NOVA Green]

https://twitter.com/BarakRavid/status/1715745054675923212

QFT (Quoted for Truth)...

It is interesting, that at least according to posts on this thread, that much of Atlas does not understand, let alone the American Public, Europeans, Israelis, and Arab and Muslim populations how much Team Biden has been trying to do a "Full Court Press" throughout the region and the world on this one.

It is good that we have an American President who is seasoned from decades in the Senate, plus ( years as Veep, to be able to handle a situation which could still easily spiral way out of control.

According to a New York Times story, the Biden Administration basically helped talk Israel of a preemptive assault against Hezbullah, which was being advocated by the Israeli Defense Minister Gallant.

There are many other examples where the Biden Administration has been aggressively working on a global stage and consultations with many American allies and strategic partners, as well as other countries from China to the Middle East in an attempt to minimize the potential massive destabilization of an entire region, fuel riots throughout Europe, and generally become an area where Russia could attempt to exploit a power vacuum should the "Arab Street" explode not to mention the broader Global Muslim population.

President Biden and his top aides have been urging Israeli leaders against carrying out any major strike against Hezbollah, the powerful militia in Lebanon, that could draw it into the Israel-Hamas war, American and Israeli officials say.

The U.S. officials are concerned that some of the more hawkish members of Israel’s war cabinet have wanted to take on Hezbollah even as Israel begins a long conflict against Hamas after the Oct. 7 attacks. The Americans are conveying to the Israelis the difficulties of battling both Hamas in the south and a much more powerful Hezbollah force in the north.

The effort by top American officials to head off an Israeli offensive on Hezbollah, reported in detail here for the first time, reveals anxieties by the Biden administration over the war planning of Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu and his aides, even as the two governments strive to present a strong united front in public.

American officials want to rein in Hezbollah too. In numerous meetings across the Middle East, American diplomats have been urging their Arab counterparts to help pass messages to the militia, including via their contacts in Iran, to try to prevent any Israel-Hezbollah war from erupting, whether through actions by the militia group or by the Israelis.

U.S. officials feared that Mr. Netanyahu might approve a pre-emptive strike on Hezbollah in the immediate aftermath of the Oct. 7 attacks by Hamas, which killed more than 1,400 people. Although those fears have receded for now because Mr. Netanyahu cooled to the idea, anxieties still persist over two possibilities: an Israeli overreaction to Hezbollah rocket attacks, and harsh Israeli tactics in an expected ground offensive against Hamas in Gaza that would compel Hezbollah to enter the war.

One of the biggest champions of a pre-emptive attack on Hezbollah has been Yoav Gallant, the defense minister, who has argued Israel’s main military effort should be focused on Hezbollah since it poses a greater threat than Hamas, the officials said.

Mr. Gallant told Mr. Blinken in a small meeting on Monday that he had advocated the previous week to launch a pre-emptive strike on Hezbollah, but was overruled by other officials, said a person familiar with the discussion.

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/10/20/us/politics/biden-israel-hezbollah-war.html

[Sbane]

I have to say the Israelis have been acting very unstable….the US should seriously demand Netanyahu and the far right bearded freaks step down in exchange for continued US support for Israel.

[NOVA Green]

Not an attempt to do "Both Sides Do It" type post, but at least Israel appears to possibly be doing something against the IDF members involved.

More to the article, but considering this from a Leftist leaning Israeli publication, which has interviewed multiple witnesses including Israeli Peace Activists as well as Palestinian witnesses, this is likely not a "fake news" or "spin story", and plus Israel has disciplined the soldiers from the unit.

Part of the problem, according to the article, involves the fact that so many regular IDF have been redeployed towards either the borders with Gaza (or Lebanon) that you now have tons of "Reservists", many of whom might be young kids from local settler populations involved in "policing" in the West Bank, which can lead to a bad mix at a time of increasing tensions.

The abuse lasted almost a whole day. Soldiers and settlers detained and handcuffed three Palestinians from the West Bank village Wadi as-Seeq, and for hours, according to the Palestinians, they were severely beaten, stripped to their underwear, and photographed handcuffed, in their underwear. Their captors urinated on two of them and extinguished burning cigarettes on them. There was even an attempt to penetrate one of them with an object.

At the same time, soldiers and settlers arrested leftist Israeli activists who were present, including a minor, cuffed them, threatened to kill them, and detained them for hours. Some of the activists were beaten. The activists say that in addition to the presence of people in uniform, at some point a young settler in civilian clothes was put in charge of guarding them.

The Israelis were released after three hours. The Palestinians were only released in the evening by Civil Administration officers, and were taken to a hospital in Ramallah. Both groups were extensively robbed, including cash and a car.

The events occurred on Thursday over a week ago, October 12. The soldiers were from the Desert Frontier unit (“Sfar Hamidbar”), which was established a few years ago and recruits “hilltop youth,” radical, often violent settler youth from illegal outposts in military service, particularly choosing youth from the farming outposts that have become prevalent in the West Bank.

https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2023-10-21/ty-article-magazine/.premium/beatings-burns-attempted-sexual-assault-settlers-and-soldiers-abused-palestinians/0000018b-530f-d1d7-ab8b-7f5fca1d0000

[NOVA Green]

Israel claims responsibility for allegedly taking out parts of a Mosque in the West Bank "refugee camp" of Jenin, taking out Hamas and Islamic Jihad militants.

More to the article, but don't want to be guilty of "overquoting"

The Israel Defense Forces and Shin Bet say a military aircraft struck an “underground terror route” at a mosque in the northern West Bank city of Jenin where members of Hamas and Palestinian Islamic Jihad were sheltering.

In a joint statement, the security agencies said the IDF carried out the strike after receiving intelligence that the cell was planning an imminent attack, without elaborating.

The Shin Bet and military said the terror operatives were using the mosque as a base to plan and carry out attacks, including the recent detonation of an explosive near Israeli troops along the West Bank security barrier. No soldiers were hurt in the blast.

https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/idf-shin-bet-announce-strike-on-terror-cell-at-mosque-in-jenin/

[Ferguson97]

How do you negotiate with this?

https://twitter.com/EricLevitz/status/1715899887475142915