Trump 2nd Impeachment News/Talk Megathread

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Trump will be removed by invoking the 20th amendment.

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If 13 days is too long to invoke the 20th amendment, it's possible that DC and the Department of Transportation headed by anti Trumper Chao could make DC have a temporary time zone of UTC+300 or so. Yeah, obviously not happening.

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What would the timetable for an impeachment be at this point? I heard Congress won't be back in session until January 19th, but obviously they'd need to convene before them to vote on articles, right?

Note that there's no requirement that the process be finished before Joe Biden takes office; when William Belknap was impeached as Secretary of War in 1876, he resigned but was nonetheless tried and acquitted by the Senate. This would not necessarily be a futile gesture, since conviction could (and presumably would) be accompanied by a lifetime ban from holding federal office.

Alcee Hastings obviously didn't get a ban on holding federal office.

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Well, now Trump can't send out mean tweets against anyone.  Does that make a difference in anyone's calculations?

Probably makes Senate conviction significantly more likely tbh

Because Trump would have to find some other venue to say something mean to them?

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I'm sick of hearing about Republicans doing things out of "physical fear". If you're too much of a coward to vote your conscience at least have some decency and resign rather than degrading yourself.

Do you want every member of congress to resign?

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Regardless of whether you want the 25th invoked, that House vote on the 25th was pointless.

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According to McCaskill this is the highest amount of same party votes ever in an impeachment

There were 5 Democratic House members who voted to impeach Clinton, while 0 Democrats voted to impeach Johnson, and 0 Republicans for Trump's prior impeachment. Romney last time was the only same party in the Senate.

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Can't wait for CNN to herald Trump's "new tone".

“Today is the day Trump became President”

They said that when he bombed Syria.

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Anyone know when the House will send the articles to the Senate? Do they want to wait a few days to let Biden install his cabinet? I think that's defensible, but they can't wait too long because it will start to look petty.

Rumor is tomorrow or Friday.

They could have done this to try to prevent Barrett from being confirmed, but instead might time it to prevent Biden's cabinet from being confirmed? Amazing.

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Anyone know when the House will send the articles to the Senate? Do they want to wait a few days to let Biden install his cabinet? I think that's defensible, but they can't wait too long because it will start to look petty.

Rumor is tomorrow or Friday.

They could have done this to try to prevent Barrett from being confirmed, but instead might time it to prevent Biden's cabinet from being confirmed? Amazing.

If RBG died in late December or early January it could have been stopped, but McConnell had so much time to fill the seat that there was no way he could be stopped.

Don't confuse him with facts. It's ALWAYS the Democrats' fault in jfern world.

That's not a fact. If the House impeached Trump repeatedly, the Senate wouldn't be able to do anything. But instead they decide to sent impeachments to the Senate right before the Iowa caucus and when Trump is no longer President.

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Anyone know when the House will send the articles to the Senate? Do they want to wait a few days to let Biden install his cabinet? I think that's defensible, but they can't wait too long because it will start to look petty.

Rumor is tomorrow or Friday.

They could have done this to try to prevent Barrett from being confirmed, but instead might time it to prevent Biden's cabinet from being confirmed? Amazing.

If RBG died in late December or early January it could have been stopped, but McConnell had so much time to fill the seat that there was no way he could be stopped.

Don't confuse him with facts. It's ALWAYS the Democrats' fault in jfern world.

That's not a fact. If the House impeached Trump repeatedly, the Senate wouldn't be able to do anything. But instead they decide to sent impeachments to the Senate right before the Iowa caucus and when Trump is no longer President.

Is it constitutionally mandated that impeachment trials take precedence over all other business in the Senate? Because I think they would have simply nuclear'd through a rule change that allows the majority leader to bring up whatever nominations they want ahead of impeachment trials on the schedule. There are very numerous reasons this wouldn't work, and you know that.

If you want to hit on the House for wasting the Senate's time with an impeachment trial of a president out of office, that's one thing; this particular hypothetical is ridiculous and you know it.

Well regardless, it's a joke to have their two trials shortly before the Iowa caucus and once Trump has already left office.

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Has there been any consideration to admitting DC before the trial to decrease the number of Republicans who would have to go out on a limb and convict?

Not that admitting states just for impeachment votes is a good precedent, but since DC statehood is a 100% lock this year anyway, might as well move it up on the calendar. After all, the Americans living in DC deserve a voice in this matter.

1. Admit DC as 25 states
2. Have quick elections in all 25 new states
3. Remove Trump from office without any Republican votes even though he already left
4. Profit!

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Has there been any consideration to admitting DC before the trial to decrease the number of Republicans who would have to go out on a limb and convict?

Not that admitting states just for impeachment votes is a good precedent, but since DC statehood is a 100% lock this year anyway, might as well move it up on the calendar. After all, the Americans living in DC deserve a voice in this matter.

1. Admit DC as 25 states
2. Have quick elections in all 25 new states
3. Remove Trump from office without any Republican votes even though he already left
4. Profit!

So much talk about how “liberals hate socialists more than fascists”, not so much about how the reverse is also true for a certain obnoxious portion of the left.

I do love how there was this catchphrase among socialists and far leftist that goes “scratch a lib and a fascist bleeds”. Yet these past 4 years under the closest to a fascist we have had in office we have seen this segment of leftist like Glenn Greenwald, Matt Taibbi, Chapo Trap House, and posters like Jfern and Big Abraham that spend there time only attacking mainstream democrats just to be a contrarian and in cases outright defend Trump

Some of us remember Obama's neoliberal warmongering.

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Has there been any consideration to admitting DC before the trial to decrease the number of Republicans who would have to go out on a limb and convict?

Not that admitting states just for impeachment votes is a good precedent, but since DC statehood is a 100% lock this year anyway, might as well move it up on the calendar. After all, the Americans living in DC deserve a voice in this matter.

1. Admit DC as 25 states
2. Have quick elections in all 25 new states
3. Remove Trump from office without any Republican votes even though he already left
4. Profit!

So much talk about how “liberals hate socialists more than fascists”, not so much about how the reverse is also true for a certain obnoxious portion of the left.

I do love how there was this catchphrase among socialists and far leftist that goes “scratch a lib and a fascist bleeds”. Yet these past 4 years under the closest to a fascist we have had in office we have seen this segment of leftist like Glenn Greenwald, Matt Taibbi, Chapo Trap House, and posters like Jfern and Big Abraham that spend there time only attacking mainstream democrats just to be a contrarian and in cases outright defend Trump

Some of us remember Obama's neoliberal warmongering.

Like?

Seriously?

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Has there been any consideration to admitting DC before the trial to decrease the number of Republicans who would have to go out on a limb and convict?

Not that admitting states just for impeachment votes is a good precedent, but since DC statehood is a 100% lock this year anyway, might as well move it up on the calendar. After all, the Americans living in DC deserve a voice in this matter.

1. Admit DC as 25 states
2. Have quick elections in all 25 new states
3. Remove Trump from office without any Republican votes even though he already left
4. Profit!

So much talk about how “liberals hate socialists more than fascists”, not so much about how the reverse is also true for a certain obnoxious portion of the left.

I do love how there was this catchphrase among socialists and far leftist that goes “scratch a lib and a fascist bleeds”. Yet these past 4 years under the closest to a fascist we have had in office we have seen this segment of leftist like Glenn Greenwald, Matt Taibbi, Chapo Trap House, and posters like Jfern and Big Abraham that spend there time only attacking mainstream democrats just to be a contrarian and in cases outright defend Trump

Some of us remember Obama's neoliberal warmongering.

Okay, but what mystifies people isn't why a hard leftist would be hostile to mainstream Democrats, it's why a hard leftist would be even more hostile to mainstream Democrats than to Trump and Trumpism, a position that only makes sense if you presuppose that 1. foreign policy is so overwhelmingly more important than domestic policy that a President can literally attempt to abolish representative democracy at home and still be preferable to a "normal" President whose foreign policy was worse than the aspiring autocrat's and 2. excessive use of hard power is the only kind of bad foreign policy. Normal people, including normal leftists, reject both of those premises.

When everyone is acting like Trump is worse than Hitler while Democrats aren't much better than Trump, what's the point of piling on with Trump. I'm more scared of Presidents that the media isn't so willing to stand up to.

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Has there been any consideration to admitting DC before the trial to decrease the number of Republicans who would have to go out on a limb and convict?

Not that admitting states just for impeachment votes is a good precedent, but since DC statehood is a 100% lock this year anyway, might as well move it up on the calendar. After all, the Americans living in DC deserve a voice in this matter.

1. Admit DC as 25 states
2. Have quick elections in all 25 new states
3. Remove Trump from office without any Republican votes even though he already left
4. Profit!

So much talk about how “liberals hate socialists more than fascists”, not so much about how the reverse is also true for a certain obnoxious portion of the left.

I do love how there was this catchphrase among socialists and far leftist that goes “scratch a lib and a fascist bleeds”. Yet these past 4 years under the closest to a fascist we have had in office we have seen this segment of leftist like Glenn Greenwald, Matt Taibbi, Chapo Trap House, and posters like Jfern and Big Abraham that spend there time only attacking mainstream democrats just to be a contrarian and in cases outright defend Trump

Some of us remember Obama's neoliberal warmongering.

Like?

Seriously?

Yes because like I said in another thread if we are defining what Obama did in Libya as a war then Trump has totally continued this policy in Yemen and Syria. If you’re going to argue Obama was a worse president then Trump especially on the foreign policy front then you should actually present an actual case of how he was worse over engaging in the same tactic Trumpers do of misrepresenting Trump being a 24/7 domestic front news that the fact he did drone strikes more than Obama and with less regard for civilians casualties failed to gain any notice with the absurd notion Trump was a dove

So your whole excuse for Obama is sure Trump did bad things too. Trump didn't run on "hope and change" and pretend to be a progressive while Democrats got destroyed down ballot in his midterms.  If Obama wasn't a sh**tty President you wouldn't need to go with well Trump did those things too.

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Has there been any consideration to admitting DC before the trial to decrease the number of Republicans who would have to go out on a limb and convict?

Not that admitting states just for impeachment votes is a good precedent, but since DC statehood is a 100% lock this year anyway, might as well move it up on the calendar. After all, the Americans living in DC deserve a voice in this matter.

1. Admit DC as 25 states
2. Have quick elections in all 25 new states
3. Remove Trump from office without any Republican votes even though he already left
4. Profit!

So much talk about how “liberals hate socialists more than fascists”, not so much about how the reverse is also true for a certain obnoxious portion of the left.

I do love how there was this catchphrase among socialists and far leftist that goes “scratch a lib and a fascist bleeds”. Yet these past 4 years under the closest to a fascist we have had in office we have seen this segment of leftist like Glenn Greenwald, Matt Taibbi, Chapo Trap House, and posters like Jfern and Big Abraham that spend there time only attacking mainstream democrats just to be a contrarian and in cases outright defend Trump

Some of us remember Obama's neoliberal warmongering.

Okay, but what mystifies people isn't why a hard leftist would be hostile to mainstream Democrats, it's why a hard leftist would be even more hostile to mainstream Democrats than to Trump and Trumpism, a position that only makes sense if you presuppose that 1. foreign policy is so overwhelmingly more important than domestic policy that a President can literally attempt to abolish representative democracy at home and still be preferable to a "normal" President whose foreign policy was worse than the aspiring autocrat's and 2. excessive use of hard power is the only kind of bad foreign policy. Normal people, including normal leftists, reject both of those premises.

When everyone is acting like Trump is worse than Hitler while Democrats aren't much better than Trump, what's the point of piling on with Trump. I'm more scared of Presidents that the media isn't so willing to stand up to.

Okay, but the Democrats are much better than Trump. Again, the only reason any leftists dispute that is that Certain Folks have fifty years' worth of costs sunk into the Extremely New Left idea that imperialism is when the United States projects hard power; the more hard power the United States projects, the imperialister it is; and American imperialism is the gravest problem facing the world and renders all other issues irrelevant. It's the edgy-online-leftist equivalent of abortion single-issuism on the right, and, as it turns out, has had exactly the same effect of propping up an overtly right-wing-authoritarian president as somehow the moral alternative to Teh Ev0l Librulz.

Even if we ignore the fact that Democrats like Obama are war criminals, they suck on plenty of other issues.

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I don't know if anyone else posted this but I found it interesting:

13 Senators have been jurors in 3 out of the 4 Presidential impeachment trials:
Patrick Leahy of Vermont
Chuck Grassley of Iowa
Mitch McConnell of Kentucky
Richard Shelby of Alabama
Dianne Feinstein of California
Patty Murray of Washington
Jim Inhofe of Oklahoma
Ron Wyden of Oregon
Dick Durbin of Illinois
Jack Reed of Rhode Island
Susan Collins of Maine
Chuck Schumer of New York
Mike Crapo of Idaho

And if the trial happened just a little over a month earlier Pat Roberts of Kansas and Mike Enzi of Wyoming would also be included in this list.

Anyone besides Bernie who served in the House and Senate for all 3 modern impeachments? Not sure if I'm phrasing it correctly.

EDIT: Remember now Graham was in the House for Clinton's as well.

Yep! Besides Bernie and Graham there were quite a few:
Debbie Stabenow of Michigan
Richard Burr of North Carolina
John Thune of South Dakota
Bob Menendez of New Jersey
Ben Cardin of Maryland
Sherrod Brown of Ohio
Roger Wicker of Mississippi
Roy Blunt of Missouri
Jerry Moran of Kansas
Rob Portman of Ohio
Pat Toomey of Pennsylvania
Tammy Baldwin of Wisconsin

EDIT: I totally forgot about Ed Markey!

Well, if we're talking about the House, Don Young almost got to vote on a Nixon impeachment as well.

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https://twitter.com/kaitlancollins/status/1359272249153499142

Couldn't they have gotten John Barron on a zoom call?

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So does Trump say something like "No one has been found innocent by the Senate as many times as me"?