Impeachment Megathread Part 3
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Author Topic: Impeachment Megathread Part 3  (Read 78250 times)
GeorgiaModerate
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« Reply #325 on: January 18, 2020, 08:55:18 AM »
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GeorgiaModerate
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« Reply #326 on: January 18, 2020, 08:57:42 AM »
Trump hires only the best lawyers...
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Penn_Quaker_Girl
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« Reply #327 on: January 18, 2020, 09:05:00 AM »
Quote from: GeorgiaModerate on January 18, 2020, 08:57:42 AM
Trump hires only the best lawyers...



The knee-jerk answer is "everybody misspeaks".

But my response would be: "true.  But when you pride yourself on being a Constitutional lawyer and a distinguished academic, you might want to be sure of your basic American history before going on national TV".  
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Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin
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« Reply #328 on: January 18, 2020, 11:08:23 AM »
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Middle-aged Europe
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« Reply #329 on: January 18, 2020, 08:45:44 PM »
Quote from: Ghost of Ruin on January 18, 2020, 11:08:23 AM


You all know what that means. "I never met that guy."
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Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin
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« Reply #330 on: January 18, 2020, 09:21:50 PM »


Translation: "to the best of my recollection" = "I want to deny it now, but I'm afraid someone will be able to prove I'm lying in the near future".
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Penn_Quaker_Girl
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« Reply #331 on: January 19, 2020, 07:59:51 AM »


Quote
"I would love to see a trial. I'd love to be a witness - because I'm a potential witness in the trial - and explain to everyone the corruption that I found in Ukraine, that far out-surpasses any that I've ever seen before, involving Joe Biden and a lot of other Democrats," he said on John Catsimatidis' radio show.
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Frodo
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« Reply #332 on: January 19, 2020, 01:24:03 PM »
House Intelligence Committee Chairman Adam Schiff has confirmed that the intelligence community have bended under pressure from Trump, and are refusing to cooperate with him in providing requested documents:

Schiff says intelligence community withholding documents on Ukraine

Before you GOP rats start cheering this on, do not think for one moment that the precedents set by this administration will not be turned around on you when we take back the White House.  What goes around, comes around.  
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Hindsight was 2020
Hindsight is 2020
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« Reply #333 on: January 19, 2020, 03:03:43 PM »
Quote from: Hindsight is 2020 on January 15, 2020, 06:03:04 AM
Again more proof how much of bad faith actors republicans have become is the fact we are know entering the “no cares about this” stage. Not once throughout this scandal has Atlas Blue (with a few exceptions) or republicans in general actually engage on the substance of this case. It has been one bad faith argument after another. From trying to out the whistleblower, to trying to make this about Hunter, to making ridiculous arguments like “no one actually heard Trump say quid pro quo”, pushing long debunked arguments like Joe Biden fired the prosecutor to protect his son, and trying to act like this straight forward case is some complex mess (ie Jim Jordan) shows that the republicans have by an large become hostile actors in our political process who care about nothing but power. Or in terms they love to use conservatives hate America 
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Florida Man for Crime
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« Reply #334 on: January 19, 2020, 03:36:41 PM »
Quote from: Hindsight is 2020 on January 19, 2020, 03:03:43 PM


An interesting thing here is to compare the undecideds by party.

Only 1% of Dems are undecided on that...
14% of "Independents" are undecided...
23% of Republicans are undecided...

What does this tell you? There are a good number of Republicans who kinda-sorta know/feel that there is something wrong here... but they lack the courage to say so.

Some element of them knows that it is wrong, but... Trump did that! So they know they can't say "no," because that would not be the Republican thing to say...

It is not what they would say if Obama were President... It is not what they would say if Romney were President...

But if Trump is President...

cognitive dissonance.
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Penn_Quaker_Girl
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« Reply #335 on: January 19, 2020, 03:43:36 PM »
Quote from: 👁👁 on January 19, 2020, 03:36:41 PM
Quote from: Hindsight is 2020 on January 19, 2020, 03:03:43 PM


An interesting thing here is to compare the undecideds by party.

Only 1% of Dems are undecided on that...
14% of "Independents" are undecided...
23% of Republicans are undecided...

What does this tell you? There are a good number of Republicans who kinda-sorta know/feel that there is something wrong here... but they lack the courage to say so.

Some element of them knows that it is wrong, but... Trump did that! So they know they can't say "no," because that would not be the Republican thing to say...

It is not what they would say if Obama were President... It is not what they would say if Romney were President...

But if Trump is President...

cognitive dissonance.

We exist.  Trust me.  There aren't nearly as many of us as there should be, but we're out there.
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gottsu
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« Reply #336 on: January 19, 2020, 03:50:14 PM »
« Edited: January 19, 2020, 04:02:30 PM by gottsu »
Quote from: Grand Mufti of Northern Virginia on January 19, 2020, 01:24:03 PM
House Intelligence Committee Chairman Adam Schiff has confirmed that the intelligence community have bended under pressure from Trump, and are refusing to cooperate with him in providing requested documents:

Schiff says intelligence community withholding documents on Ukraine

Before you GOP rats start cheering this on, do not think for one moment that the precedents set by this administration will not be turned around on you when we take back the White House.  What goes around, comes around.  

I mean, they just can't do that what Dems want. IC is beholden to WH, whatever the locator of WH is, they are on their service and are simply loyal to any president.

Quote from: Penn_Quaker_Girl on January 19, 2020, 03:43:36 PM
We exist.  Trust me.  There aren't nearly as many of us as there should be, but we're out there.
How do you feel with the fact that GOP started to became "party of chief", "chief party", "leader party" etc. (I am afraid there is no exact translation in English of what is a political party which is run exclusively by one, paramount leader who acts authoritarian inside and therefore is very little to no room for dissent of the behavior of such party leader)? Do you hope that all this will stop or at least relax with next Republican president?
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Florida Man for Crime
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« Reply #337 on: January 19, 2020, 03:55:09 PM »
Quote from: Penn_Quaker_Girl on January 19, 2020, 03:43:36 PM
Quote from: 👁👁 on January 19, 2020, 03:36:41 PM

An interesting thing here is to compare the undecideds by party.

Only 1% of Dems are undecided on that...
14% of "Independents" are undecided...
23% of Republicans are undecided...

What does this tell you? There are a good number of Republicans who kinda-sorta know/feel that there is something wrong here... but they lack the courage to say so.

Some element of them knows that it is wrong, but... Trump did that! So they know they can't say "no," because that would not be the Republican thing to say...

It is not what they would say if Obama were President... It is not what they would say if Romney were President...

But if Trump is President...

cognitive dissonance.

We exist.  Trust me.  There aren't nearly as many of us as there should be, but we're out there.

Quote
REP.
  Yes 48%
  No 29%

I would have assumed you would fall under that 29%. I wasn't talking about that 29%, but rather about the 23% that doesn't fall under either the 48% or the 29%.
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GeorgiaModerate
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« Reply #338 on: January 19, 2020, 03:59:05 PM »
Quote from: 👁👁 on January 19, 2020, 03:36:41 PM
Quote from: Hindsight is 2020 on January 19, 2020, 03:03:43 PM


An interesting thing here is to compare the undecideds by party.

Only 1% of Dems are undecided on that...
14% of "Independents" are undecided...
23% of Republicans are undecided...

What does this tell you? There are a good number of Republicans who kinda-sorta know/feel that there is something wrong here... but they lack the courage to say so.

Some element of them knows that it is wrong, but... Trump did that! So they know they can't say "no," because that would not be the Republican thing to say...

It is not what they would say if Obama were President... It is not what they would say if Romney were President...

But if Trump is President...

cognitive dissonance.

I have wondered what would happen if a pollster asked the question both ways, e.g. "would it have been acceptable for President Obama to ask a foreign leader to investigate Donald Trump during the 2016 campaign?" and "was it acceptable for President Trump to ask a foreign leader to investigate Joe Biden".   

My guess: this would be somewhat polarized (each side would think it at least somewhat more acceptable for their guy than the other side) but the polarization would be assymetrical: Republicans would find it much more acceptable for Trump than Democrats would for Obama.
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GeorgiaModerate
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« Reply #339 on: January 19, 2020, 04:02:41 PM »
Quote from: gottsu on January 19, 2020, 03:50:14 PM
Quote from: Grand Mufti of Northern Virginia on January 19, 2020, 01:24:03 PM
House Intelligence Committee Chairman Adam Schiff has confirmed that the intelligence community have bended under pressure from Trump, and are refusing to cooperate with him in providing requested documents:

Schiff says intelligence community withholding documents on Ukraine

Before you GOP rats start cheering this on, do not think for one moment that the precedents set by this administration will not be turned around on you when we take back the White House.  What goes around, comes around.  

I mean, they just can't do that what Dems want. IC is beholden to WH, whatever the locator of WH is, they are on their service and are simply loyal to any president.


This is incorrect.  Their oath of office (as with other federal employees) swears allegiance to the Constitution, not to the President.  Nowhere in the oath is the President mentioned. 
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gottsu
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« Reply #340 on: January 19, 2020, 04:20:26 PM »
Quote from: GeorgiaModerate on January 19, 2020, 04:02:41 PM
Quote from: gottsu on January 19, 2020, 03:50:14 PM
Quote from: Grand Mufti of Northern Virginia on January 19, 2020, 01:24:03 PM
House Intelligence Committee Chairman Adam Schiff has confirmed that the intelligence community have bended under pressure from Trump, and are refusing to cooperate with him in providing requested documents:

Schiff says intelligence community withholding documents on Ukraine

Before you GOP rats start cheering this on, do not think for one moment that the precedents set by this administration will not be turned around on you when we take back the White House.  What goes around, comes around.  

I mean, they just can't do that what Dems want. IC is beholden to WH, whatever the locator of WH is, they are on their service and are simply loyal to any president.


This is incorrect.  Their oath of office (as with other federal employees) swears allegiance to the Constitution, not to the President.  Nowhere in the oath is the President mentioned. 

OK, but US are ruled in practice by a person (president), not by a document (constitution), and IC simply chooses to be loyal to that person, and I can fully understand it.
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I Can Now Die Happy
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« Reply #341 on: January 19, 2020, 06:20:06 PM »


Impeachment is going to turn out to be a major disaster for the Democrats and a boon to Trump, but you didn't need to hear it from me a dozen times to know that.
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Dr Oz Lost Party!
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« Reply #342 on: January 19, 2020, 06:31:20 PM »
Quote from: Why Hasn't Atlas Convinced Me on January 19, 2020, 06:20:06 PM


Impeachment is going to turn out to be a major disaster for the Democrats and a boon to Trump, but you didn't need to hear it from me a dozen times to know that.

Your predictions have never been right. We've just learned to expect the complete opposite of what you say.
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Hindsight was 2020
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« Reply #343 on: January 19, 2020, 06:35:27 PM »
Quote from: PA is Lean D on January 19, 2020, 06:31:20 PM
Quote from: Why Hasn't Atlas Convinced Me on January 19, 2020, 06:20:06 PM


Impeachment is going to turn out to be a major disaster for the Democrats and a boon to Trump, but you didn't need to hear it from me a dozen times to know that.

Your predictions have never been right. We've just learned to expect the complete opposite of what you say.
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emailking
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« Reply #344 on: January 19, 2020, 07:43:14 PM »
Quote from: I Can Now Die Happy on January 19, 2020, 06:20:06 PM


Impeachment is going to turn out to be a major disaster for the Democrats and a boon to Trump, but you didn't need to hear it from me a dozen times to know that.

The first day (and maybe more) is going to be consumed by largely procedural votes. A lot of this will get hashed out in that time.
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Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin
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« Reply #345 on: January 19, 2020, 11:17:14 PM »
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Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin
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« Reply #346 on: January 19, 2020, 11:18:11 PM »
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Florida Man for Crime
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« Reply #347 on: January 20, 2020, 01:24:46 AM »
Quote from: Ghost of Ruin on January 19, 2020, 11:18:11 PM


Yes, that seems like exactly the sort of precedent we should all want to set.
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Obama-Biden Democrat
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« Reply #348 on: January 20, 2020, 02:14:04 AM »
Quote from: 👁👁 on January 20, 2020, 01:24:46 AM
Quote from: Ghost of Ruin on January 19, 2020, 11:18:11 PM


Yes, that seems like exactly the sort of precedent we should all want to set.

Looney Lindsey. Sad!
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pbrower2a
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« Reply #349 on: January 20, 2020, 07:45:06 AM »
Quote from: Ghost of Ruin on January 19, 2020, 11:18:11 PM

 

Retire -- and possibly flee.
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