2023 NCAA conference realignment (12/20: the PAC-2 join the WCC)

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And today's rumor is that Colorado is going to the Big 12, but the second team is Arizona, not Memphis.

Call me a traditionalist, but if the Big 12 wants to take two additional schools, one of the them being Colorado, the second should be SMU.

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ACC also looking to expand.

Other than Notre Dame, or a shock move like Florida or South Carolina leaving the SEC, I can't think of any school that fits the geographic profile and is a fit.

Maybe UConn?

I've long been dying on this hill, but West Virginia is such a natural fit for the ACC. It was a crime the ACC rejected them in the early 2010s because of "academics". The ACC isn't the Ivy League. It's a sports conference, get over yourselves.

Notre Dame football would be a great get for the ACC (ND is already in the ACC for non-football sports), but with the university's lucrative media rights deal with NBC, they have no incentive to join.

Maryland will not leave the B1G for the ACC. They make so much more money than ACC schools.

If I were the ACC (assuming ND has no interest in joining the conference for football), I'd invite West Virginia and Cincinnati. West Virginia is a no brainer with all of the former Big East schools and longstanding rivalries currently in the ACC. Meanwhile, Cincinnati expands the conference into a large new state (useful for media rights/coverage and recruiting purposes) and pairs well with Louisville, which has been an odd fit in the ACC ever since the conference added them in a panic when Maryland left for the B1G.

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The Big Ten has begun preliminary discussions to add Oregon, Washington, Cal and Stanford.

The Big Ten has begun exploratory discussions about expanding membership to 18 or even 20 teams, industry sources have told Yahoo Sports. The schools being considered are Oregon and Washington if the league adds two schools, and Cal and Stanford if it wants to move to 20. All four institutions are currently members of the Pac-12.

The discussions are in the very early stages, sources caution. No decision, including on whether to expand or stay put at 16 teams, has been made or is considered imminent.

Congrats to Cal if true, the biggest winner in all of realignment.

It's weird how all these huge things are happening, while the ACC is just sitting there doing nothing.

I think if they're going to do anything, it'll be poaching Oregon and Washington. They're the best brands left in the Pac-9 (I'm still not used to that).

While you're at it, you might as well add Cal and Stanford because they're excellent academically (something the ACC cares too much about) which would create a western wing of the conference.

That would place the ACC solidly as the 3rd best conference in the nation, increasing the conference's value significantly.

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The Big Ten has begun preliminary discussions to add Oregon, Washington, Cal and Stanford.

The Big Ten has begun exploratory discussions about expanding membership to 18 or even 20 teams, industry sources have told Yahoo Sports. The schools being considered are Oregon and Washington if the league adds two schools, and Cal and Stanford if it wants to move to 20. All four institutions are currently members of the Pac-12.

The discussions are in the very early stages, sources caution. No decision, including on whether to expand or stay put at 16 teams, has been made or is considered imminent.

Congrats to Cal if true, the biggest winner in all of realignment.

It's weird how all these huge things are happening, while the ACC is just sitting there doing nothing.

I think if they're going to do anything, it'll be poaching Oregon and Washington. They're the best brands left in the Pac-9 (I'm still not used to that).

While you're at it, you might as well add Cal and Stanford because they're excellent academically (something the ACC cares too much about) which would create a western wing of the conference.

That would place the ACC solidly as the 3rd best conference in the nation, increasing the conference's value significantly.

Why would another P5 team want to move to the ACC, which is stuck with a mediocre TV deal until 2036?  I suspect several of its current members would have already bolted if not for the grant-of-rights in their deal.  The only way I can see the ACC expanding in the near term would be to pick up some solid non-P5 programs, e.g. Memphis or UConn.

I agree picking up solid non-P5 teams is the most likely outcome for the ACC. It's clear Oregon and Washington want to join the B1G. But if they don't get invited, I could imagine them joining the ACC if the PAC 12 doesn't get a media rights done deal soon.

If the ACC sits around and continues to do nothing in the era of Superconferes, it will die. The SEC will pick off FSU and Clemson. Then the B1G will pick off UNC and UVA.

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I agree picking up solid non-P5 teams is the most likely outcome for the ACC. It's clear Oregon and Washington want to join the B1G. But if they don't get invited, I could imagine them joining the ACC if the PAC 12 doesn't get a media rights done deal soon.

If the ACC sits around and continues to do nothing in the era of Superconferes, it will die. The SEC will pick off FSU and Clemson. Then the B1G will pick off UNC and UVA.

The rump Pac-12 is still better than the ACC. Even if they can't get into the Big Ten, Washington and Oregon could walk into the Big 12 and become immediate top dogs in a better conference. And if the Big Ten wanted to scavenge the corpse of the ACC, Duke would be the logical partner to UNC which is the obvious biggest prize.

That's a good point. A ten team Pac-12 (9 + SDSU) is still in a better spot than the ACC and it's terrible TV deal which doesn't end until 2036. The ACC is in a uniquely bad spot for P5 conferences, having so many small private schools dragging it down. Sure the SEC has Vanderbilt, the B1G has Northwestern, and the Pac-12 has Stanford. But those conferences don't have five private schools. With the only one having done much of anything in revenue sports for the last quarter century being Duke basketball. Does Wake Forest vs. Boston College bring in many eyeballs? Nope.

I want the ACC to survive. But I just don't see how it can as long as the schools in the conference have an ever growing gap in yearly media rights revenue compared to schools in other conferences.

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https://twitter.com/Brett_McMurphy/status/1687157744682283008?s=20

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Utah, Arizona and Arizona State could be announced as Big Twelve members as soon as tomorrow according to Jason Scheer.

Although it is not completely finalized yet, sources indicate that Arizona, Arizona State, and Utah are all likely to join the Big 12. One source said that it would have to fall apart for the three schools not to make the move and the ideal plan for the Big 12 is to make the biggest possible impact, which is announcing all three at once. Although it is not set in stone, there could be an announcement as soon as Friday.

If that happens, the B1G will immediately pick up Washington and Oregon.

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I'll say it again- the Ivy League should embrace NIL and move up to the FBS, and Stanford should join it if the Big 10 doesn't invite them. Same for Rice.

It's never going to happen. The Ivy's are stodgy and melodramatic about amateurism. In fact, I'll wager that the Ivy League is more likely to leave the NCAA and go and do their own thing than SEC and Big Ten are, so they can go back to players not getting compensated for playing.

Yeah, they'd have to change their attitude, but a 10-team league with Stanford and Rice (or imagine a 14-team league with Vanderbilt, Northwestern, Duke, and Tulane) would have deep pocket$ and could probably make themselves the 4th best overall conference athletically if it really committed.

In an alternate universe, a Southern Ivy league was created in the early 60s:

"The effort to create a Southern athletic conference originated during the 1950s. Harvie Branscomb, then-chancellor at Vanderbilt University, originally attempted to establish a rivalry between Vanderbilt and traditional Ivy League schools to foster relationships with academically-oriented schools. The school followed through on this effort and played a game against Yale in October 1948. However, after the Vanderbilt Commodores shut out the Yale Bulldogs, 35-0, Yale said they no longer wanted to play Vanderbilt. This caused Branscomb to call a meeting with the presidents of other Southern private universities in the late 1950s—Southern Methodist University (SMU), Emory University, Rice University, Duke University and Tulane University— where Branscomb suggested they try to establish a new sports conference where small, academically-inclined private schools could compete."

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https://twitter.com/PeteThamel/status/1687262837582798848?s=20

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https://twitter.com/PeteThamel/status/1687262837582798848?s=20

Another tweet with no mention of ASU...

https://twitter.com/RossDellenger/status/1687279556695146496?s=20

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I just want to say that I feel absolutely horrible for the fans of Oregon State and Washington State. It's not right what's happening to them.

Both Oregon State and Washington State fit in nicely in the Mountain West or American, so it's not like they don't have somewhere to go if the PAC-12 really does collapse.

Well yeah they'll go to the Mountain West, but it really sucks that they have been kicked out of the "power conferences" through no fault of their own.

Even if they hold on to the Pac name and invite the better MWC/AAC teams to join, that's still not going to be considered a power conference.

I'm mostly with you for once, but Wazzu is a better fit in the Mountain West with 24k students in a micropolitan area and limited legacy. I don't buy that these mythical "power" conference that we pine for, with a history of, like, 25 years are anything special that all constituents deserve a seat by obscure historical association. I don't feel any less bad than VMI getting stuck in the Southern Conference which remains a reasonable fit to this day, whereas all other members became national powers. I wish for the rivalries, but in lieu of that, entities that fail to grow must be left behind.

Teams only should play teams that they have special or logical ties to. Washington State's chances of national success should be no higher than San Diego State or Boise State (and truly the best peers may even be Utah State and Colorado State).


I'm holding out hope that it will just be Arizona for now and the Pac-8 makes the necessary invites to last a couple more years.

I'm hoping for the same thing. Lose Arizona, they're gone. But keep everyone else that's left, add San Diego St., Colorado St., and whoever else would add value to/shore up the conference the most.

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https://twitter.com/ChrisKarpman/status/1687292041922048000?s=20

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https://twitter.com/jasonscheer/status/1687309684292894720?s=20

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https://twitter.com/NicoleAuerbach/status/1687455518208516097?s=20

https://twitter.com/RossDellenger/status/1687453545266638848?s=20

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Absolutely stupid decision for any team to stay with the Pac 12 on a streaming only deal.

I can see some logic in it for Oregon and/or Washington in the short to medium term. Dominate the new Pac-whatever and repeatedly get into the expanded 12 team CFB playoff with "the top six conference champions in the CFP rankings" getting bids rule. Then join the B1G whenever you get an offer high enough to convince you to jump ship.

https://twitter.com/slmandel/status/1687487472849346560?s=20

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Get your popcorn.

https://twitter.com/Brett_McMurphy/status/1687503777392205824?s=20

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Mega Conferences be damned. This kind of thing is why I love college football, not TV contracts:

"Zack Conti has been a walk-on with the team for four years. Without an extra scholarship for the team to hand out, EMU's team captain decides to share his."

After Four Years, Zack Conti Gifted Captain's Scholarship


 

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knife: twisted

https://twitter.com/RossDellenger/status/1687514781475860480?s=20

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That's that then. The Pac-12 as a power conference is no more. Now all that's left is to see who catches a lifeboat and who drowns. I'd bet good money that Cal, Stanford, Wazzu, and Oregon State will be left outside; none of them bring much value to the big new SuperConferences.

The Big 10 in the past 10 years has taken teams from the Big 12 (Nebraska), Pac 12 (USC, UCLA and now Oregon, Washington) and the ACC (Maryland). Plus the dying husk of the Big East but I'm not even counting that. They are definitely the conference to watch in terms of predatory conference smashing.

I get the feeling the "top" teams of the ACC will bolt to the SEC when the revenue gap between ACC TV revenue and the P2 becomes too large to ignore. Yes the GoR will cost a ton break. But by that time schools would rather suffer in the short term than fall further and further behind P2 schools.

Clemson and Florida State will be two. I'd think a third would be North Carolina. The fourth is harder to guess. I'd say it'll be either Miami or Virginia. Yes they've both sucked for a long time at football. But as we saw with Colorado, this isn't about how successful a team has been. It's about expanding into new markets. Virginia brings the SEC into a new state, while Miami would bring the SEC in one of the country's largest metro areas.

I'd rather the ACC survive intact. But at least in an SEC scenario UNC would stay in a more or less regional conference. The farthest away games would be in Texas or Missouri. It's pretty far away. But at least it's still in the South (culturally for Missouri), not all the way in California like if UNC joined the B1G.

[Storr]

"He's dead, Jim."

https://twitter.com/InsideTheBig12/status/1687537085056483341?s=20

[Storr]

That's that then. The Pac-12 as a power conference is no more. Now all that's left is to see who catches a lifeboat and who drowns. I'd bet good money that Cal, Stanford, Wazzu, and Oregon State will be left outside; none of them bring much value to the big new SuperConferences.

The Big 10 in the past 10 years has taken teams from the Big 12 (Nebraska), Pac 12 (USC, UCLA and now Oregon, Washington) and the ACC (Maryland). Plus the dying husk of the Big East but I'm not even counting that. They are definitely the conference to watch in terms of predatory conference smashing.

I get the feeling the "top" teams of the ACC will bolt to the SEC when the revenue gap between ACC TV revenue and the P2 becomes too large to ignore. Yes the GoR will cost a ton break. But by that time schools would rather suffer in the short term than fall further and further behind P2 schools.

Clemson and Florida State will be two. I'd think a third would be North Carolina. The fourth is harder to guess. I'd say it'll be either Miami or Virginia. Yes they've both sucked for a long time at football. But as we saw with Colorado, this isn't about how successful a team has been. It's about expanding into new markets. Virginia brings the SEC into a new state, while Miami would bring the SEC in one of the country's largest metro areas.

I'd rather the ACC survive intact. But at least in an SEC scenario UNC would stay in a more or less regional conference. The farthest away games would be in Texas or Missouri. It's pretty far away. But at least it's still in the South (culturally for Missouri), not all the way in California like if UNC joined the B1G.

Every one of the "Magnificent Seven" (UNC, NC State, Miami, Florida State, Clemson, Virginia and Virginia Tech) have reasons to believe that they would end up with a chair if/when the ACC collapses. I do agree that UNC is #3 but that 4-7 are a matter of debate.

The next big question will be about the playoffs; under the new 12 team playoff starting in 2024, the top 6 conference champs get auto-bids. If we're talking about a P4 (at most) instead of P5 I'm sure there will be talk about re-opening that to cut down on the number of auto-bids. The SEC and Big10 especially will want to open up more slots for their people.

Yep. No school wants to end up being left out in the cold like Houston, SMU, Rice, and TCU were when the Southwest Conference imploded...or like Oregon State and Washington State right now.

https://twitter.com/ADavidHaleJoint/status/1687553228739592192?s=20

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https://twitter.com/KLCCOregon/status/1687582612322402306?s=20

https://twitter.com/skhanjr/status/1687583963517239297?s=20

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The ACC needs to do something. Add UConn, SMU, Cal, USF, freaking Appalachian State....I don't care who. Just do something!

https://twitter.com/ADavidHaleJoint/status/1687588048278548480?s=20

[Storr]

The ACC won't bother expanding because none of the public schools in the conference have any intention of staying in it. All of them will end up in the SEC or Big 10, or Big 12 if neither of those 2 send an invite.

Valid. It's the same thing Texas and Oklahoma did while in the Big 12.

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https://twitter.com/RossDellenger/status/1687640420841357312?s=20