Russia-Ukraine war and related tensions Megathread

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

https://www.twitter.com/EuromaidanPress/status/1511931823999361027

"Patriarch" Kirill is a disgusting heresiarch at least as bad as his predecessor Sergius.

[NOVA Green]

I was hoping against logic that Bucha might have been an isolated incident of one bad Russian unit. Of course, that's increasingly looking to be wrong. Buzova/Buzovaya is a village of 1,500 residents along the E40/ M08 highway connecting Kyiv and Lviv.

https://twitter.com/Euan_MacDonald/status/1513224016798142473?s=20&t=GZW_HgT...

Ugh...

Yes totally agree with you on the "hoping against logic" sentiments.

Unfortunately I suspect as we move forward in time, the "known incidents" of such mass atrocities will become all too depressingly frequent, where in the overwhelming majority of incidents will involve entire Russian units who took out their anger and frustration of major military losses on their side against virtually entirely defenseless Ukrainian Civilians.

One can only imagine what horrors might be uncovered at some point in the future in Russian Occupied areas of Southern and Eastern Ukraine, where obtaining information currently is much more difficult than in recently liberated parts of the country.

We still have no real idea of the extent and practices of the Russian "filtration centers" East of Maripoul for example, where an estimated tens of thousands of Ukrainian Civilians were "processed", other than a few anecdotal reports from those who managed to make their way from Russia proper back into EU or NATO areas.

I will also add that although perhaps I might have seemed a little bit harsh in recent days by calling out multiple posters, who themselves are fine and decent individuals, for comments made in anger and pain after being witness to such horrors, regarding statements involving Russian POWs, but I believe that it is possible to both strongly condemn those who committed such atrocities, without succumbing to the "dark side" and falling into the moral and ethical morass whereby that should then justify hypothetical atrocities from the other side.

An eye for an eye leaves both people blind and the dehumanization of "the enemy" can itself become justifications for future atrocities.

I'll just stop there.

[NOVA Green]

Anecdotal....

Talked to one of my step-mothers last night for a couple hours for the first time since the Russian Invasion of Ukraine.

She is now in her late 70s but was doing Christian Missionary work in Belarus up until shortly before COVID hit, basically roughly for about (5) years 3-4 months / year.

Her last go around (pre-COVID) she went to Poland instead since the repression in Belarus was getting harsher and harsher and effectively she was detained for multiple days for allegedly supporting illegal activities within the country.

She is still in touch indirectly with her friends in Belarus through several individuals who left for Poland after the rigged election, popular uprising, and massive repression afterwards.

From what she is hearing, public opinion in Belarus is overwhelmingly against the war in Ukraine, even among many folks who generally support the current regime.

Anecdotal and all, so take it with a grain of salt, but still it supports other information we have seen elsewhere which helps explain why Belarus did not join "Putin's War".

[NOVA Green]

I was hoping against logic that Bucha might have been an isolated incident of one bad Russian unit. Of course, that's increasingly looking to be wrong. Buzova/Buzovaya is a village of 1,500 residents along the E40/M08 highway connecting Kyiv and Lviv.

https://twitter.com/Euan_MacDonald/status/1513224016798142473?s=20&t=GZW_HgT...

Now we're getting a little bit more info about the apparent Russian massacres of Ukrainian civilians outside of the village of Buzova.

Photographs from the Ukrainian village of Buzova make up a tableau of horrific images: charred corpses strewn across the road, mangled bodies piled on top of each other, one man lying in a field with a bullet in his head.

Together, the images confirm the accounts of local Ukrainians who say that Russian forces killed as many as 50 civilians as they tried to flee fighting northwest of Kyiv last month. The bodies lay along or near the M06 highway, which runs west from Kyiv, the capital, to the city of Zhytomyr.

“I now call it the road of death,” said Taras Didych, the mayor of the district, Dmytrivka, where most of the bodies were found. The highway strings together the towns and villages that were recently retaken from Russian forces, who were pushed back and retreated after their failed attempt to take the capital. “We are just coming back to life,” he said.

“Some were burned. Others had their hands tied. Others were shot in the head outside their cars,” Mr. Didych said. Those descriptions corresponded to images he shared with The New York Times that Mr. Didych said he had taken on his phone at the scene.

Mr. Didych said it wasn’t clear when the killings took place, or if they had all happened at the same time. He said it was more likely that Russian forces killed families intermittently as they tried to escape their homes during the month that invading troops occupied this strip of territory outside of Kyiv.

https://www.nytimes.com/live/2022/04/10/world/ukraine-russia-war-news/dozens-of-bodies-have-been-found-on-a-highway-to-kyiv-a-local-official-says

[Hindsight was 2020]

https://mobile.twitter.com/TheStudyofWar/status/1513277658037071872

[NOVA Green]

Interesting article about Ukrainian Draft Dodgers....

Not your typical MSM article, but worth a read from another perspective.

Thousands of Ukrainian men of military age have left the country to avoid participating in the war, according to records from regional law enforcement officials and interviews with people inside and outside Ukraine. Smuggling rings in Moldova, and possibly other European countries, have been doing a brisk business. Some people have paid up to $15,000 for a secret night-time ride out of Ukraine, Moldovan officials said.

All this has forced many Ukrainian men who don’t want to serve into taking illegal routes into Hungary, Moldova and Poland and other neighboring countries. Even among those convinced they fled for the right reasons, some said they felt guilty and ashamed.

Ukrainian politicians have threatened to put draft dodgers in prison and confiscate their homes. But within Ukrainian society, even as cities continue to be pummeled by Russian bombs, the sentiments are more divided.

But none of the more than a dozen men interviewed for this article seemed interested. Mr. Danuliv, a businessman from western Ukraine, said he wanted no part in the war. When asked if he feared being ostracized or shamed, he shook his head.

“I didn’t kill anyone. That’s what’s important to me,” he said. “I don’t care what people say.”

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/04/10/world/asia/ukraine-draft-dodgers.html

I support the right of anyone and everyone to choose NOT to follow mandatory conscription orders.

It should be a choice as to whether or not to pick up arms to take another human's life, and not a requirement of citizenship.

Musical Interlude: Phil Ochs live at a small venue in Greenwich Village in 1965 performing the "Draft Dodger Rag"

[pppolitics]

Interesting article about Ukrainian Draft Dodgers

Not your typical MSM article, but worth a read from another perspective.

Thousands of Ukrainian men of military age have left the country to avoid participating in the war, according to records from regional law enforcement officials and interviews with people inside and outside Ukraine. Smuggling rings in Moldova, and possibly other European countries, have been doing a brisk business. Some people have paid up to $15,000 for a secret night-time ride out of Ukraine, Moldovan officials said.

All this has forced many Ukrainian men who don’t want to serve into taking illegal routes into Hungary, Moldova and Poland and other neighboring countries. Even among those convinced they fled for the right reasons, some said they felt guilty and ashamed.

Ukrainian politicians have threatened to put draft dodgers in prison and confiscate their homes. But within Ukrainian society, even as cities continue to be pummeled by Russian bombs, the sentiments are more divided.

But none of the more than a dozen men interviewed for this article seemed interested. Mr. Danuliv, a businessman from western Ukraine, said he wanted no part in the war. When asked if he feared being ostracized or shamed, he shook his head.

“I didn’t kill anyone. That’s what’s important to me,” he said. “I don’t care what people say.”

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/04/10/world/asia/ukraine-draft-dodgers.html

I support the right of anyone and everyone to choose NOT to follow mandatory conscription orders.

It should be a choice as to whether or not to pick up arms to take another human's life, and not a requirement of citizenship.

This is about protecting one's own homeland.

This is NOT about being sent to fight in a foreign war.

The conscript is 100% justified.

[Hindsight was 2020]

https://mobile.twitter.com/CanadianUkrain1/status/1513270462746398724

[It’s so Joever]

Interesting article about Ukrainian Draft Dodgers

Not your typical MSM article, but worth a read from another perspective.

Thousands of Ukrainian men of military age have left the country to avoid participating in the war, according to records from regional law enforcement officials and interviews with people inside and outside Ukraine. Smuggling rings in Moldova, and possibly other European countries, have been doing a brisk business. Some people have paid up to $15,000 for a secret night-time ride out of Ukraine, Moldovan officials said.

All this has forced many Ukrainian men who don’t want to serve into taking illegal routes into Hungary, Moldova and Poland and other neighboring countries. Even among those convinced they fled for the right reasons, some said they felt guilty and ashamed.

Ukrainian politicians have threatened to put draft dodgers in prison and confiscate their homes. But within Ukrainian society, even as cities continue to be pummeled by Russian bombs, the sentiments are more divided.

But none of the more than a dozen men interviewed for this article seemed interested. Mr. Danuliv, a businessman from western Ukraine, said he wanted no part in the war. When asked if he feared being ostracized or shamed, he shook his head.

“I didn’t kill anyone. That’s what’s important to me,” he said. “I don’t care what people say.”

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/04/10/world/asia/ukraine-draft-dodgers.html

I support the right of anyone and everyone to choose NOT to follow mandatory conscription orders.

It should be a choice as to whether or not to pick up arms to take another human's life, and not a requirement of citizenship.

This is about protecting one's own homeland.

This is NOT about being sent to fight in a foreign war.

The conscript is 100% justified.

Regardless I will not judge those who fled. While I would hope personally I wouldn’t do it if I were in that situation, I understand why many are compelled to do so.

[NOVA Green]

A few other interesting nuggets from the ISW's Daily update, which a comrade upthread had referenced the Kherson Front, but this is interesting from another perspective.

The Russian Defense Ministry is reportedly offering cash bonuses to incentivize forces withdrawn from northeastern Ukraine to reenter combat operations. Radio Svoboda published images of a document on April 10 that it reported was issued by the Russian Ministry of Defense on April 2 offering specific bonuses for Russian troops in Ukraine.[1] The document specifies large payments including 300,000 rubles for destroying a fixed-wing aircraft, 200,000 for destroying a helicopter, and 50,000 for armored vehicles and artillery. Radio Svoboda stated the payments are intended to coerce units withdrawn from the Kyiv, Chernihiv, and Sumy regions to reenter combat. We have previously reported several instances of Russian soldiers refusing orders to return to Ukraine after being pulled back.[2]

Russian forces are implementing increasingly draconian measures to conscript previously ineligible personnel. The Ukrainian Military Intelligence Directorate (GUR) reported on April 10 that Russian forces are now conscripting previously ineligible categories of people, including those with childhood disabilities and workers in protected industries.[3] The GUR reported that DNR/LNR authorities are enabling traffic inspectors to issue on-the-spot conscription notices and are establishing checkpoints on key highways. DNR and Russian military police are additionally reportedly destroying documents granting exemptions—such as medical records or work certificates—to forcibly conscript people.[4]

https://www.understandingwar.org/backgrounder/russian-offensive-campaign-assessment-april-10

[Obama-Biden Democrat]

https://mobile.twitter.com/TheStudyofWar/status/1513277658037071872

I was worried that the Ukrainian counterattacks would be small and local, but the counteroffensive in the Mykolaiv and Kherson Oblasts is impressive. There is a good chance Kherson is liberated soon.

[Badger]

To carry out their ever more bloodcurdling stated plans, Russia would at least have to occupy all of Ukraine - and for an actual genocide they would have to stay fully in control for decades.

How likely is this, exactly?

Or is it just more blowhard rhetoric mainly designed for impressionable outsiders.

 Impressionable insiders  I would think. That is, basically  Putin's "base" in Russia.

[Badger]

Based Boris!

https://twitter.com/BorisJohnson/status/1512818337415372802?s=20&t=Fn1yKXh5R...

 Generally not a fan of bojo, but d***** if he hasn't been a true leader in Western Europe regarding supporting Ukraine.

[Badger]

https://twitter.com/visegrad24/status/1512906959980216323?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7C...

ugggg

It doesn't sound speaking Russian in the video. If he's speaking Chechen that's something I haven't seen in the war before. Also saying the Chechens need to leave Europe seems a bit...well Chechnya is in Europe last time I checked.

https://twitter.com/Noxcho99/status/1512938809108930567?s=20&t=3ifqQzYwqYyRP...

 The woman screaming Natasha is heard later in the video, but what do we think happened to Natasha after that gunshot?

[Badger]

https://www.twitter.com/EuromaidanPress/status/1511931823999361027

"Patriarch" Kirill is a disgusting heresiarch at least as bad as his predecessor Sergius.

[Badger]

https://mobile.twitter.com/CanadianUkrain1/status/1513270462746398724

 Next tweet. "I lied. There's no bad news."

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

Based Boris!

https://twitter.com/BorisJohnson/status/1512818337415372802?s=20&t=Fn1yKXh5R...

 Generally not a fan of bojo, but d***** if he hasn't been a true leader in Western Europe regarding supporting Ukraine.

There have been quite a few people involved in this whole situation whom I normally can't stand but who I do have to admit fall on the right side of the "just an awful politician vs. genuinely depraved on a core level" line that this is making so clear. Off the top of my head, Rubio, Duda, and, hell, even Erdogan are cases of this as well.

Interesting article about Ukrainian Draft Dodgers

Not your typical MSM article, but worth a read from another perspective.

Thousands of Ukrainian men of military age have left the country to avoid participating in the war, according to records from regional law enforcement officials and interviews with people inside and outside Ukraine. Smuggling rings in Moldova, and possibly other European countries, have been doing a brisk business. Some people have paid up to $15,000 for a secret night-time ride out of Ukraine, Moldovan officials said.

All this has forced many Ukrainian men who don’t want to serve into taking illegal routes into Hungary, Moldova and Poland and other neighboring countries. Even among those convinced they fled for the right reasons, some said they felt guilty and ashamed.

Ukrainian politicians have threatened to put draft dodgers in prison and confiscate their homes. But within Ukrainian society, even as cities continue to be pummeled by Russian bombs, the sentiments are more divided.

But none of the more than a dozen men interviewed for this article seemed interested. Mr. Danuliv, a businessman from western Ukraine, said he wanted no part in the war. When asked if he feared being ostracized or shamed, he shook his head.

“I didn’t kill anyone. That’s what’s important to me,” he said. “I don’t care what people say.”

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/04/10/world/asia/ukraine-draft-dodgers.html

I support the right of anyone and everyone to choose NOT to follow mandatory conscription orders.

It should be a choice as to whether or not to pick up arms to take another human's life, and not a requirement of citizenship.

This is about protecting one's own homeland.

This is NOT about being sent to fight in a foreign war.

The conscript is 100% justified.

Regardless I will not judge those who fled. While I would hope personally I wouldn’t do it if I were in that situation, I understand why many are compelled to do so.

This is the position I'm closest to. I think general mobilization is morally justified in this case, but I can't blame anybody for wanting to keep themselves physically safe in a situation I'll (God willing) never encounter myself.

[John Dule]

"How could these cowards refuse to fight and die in the trenches for their homeland?" I ask from behind my computer screen

[CumbrianLefty]

Based Boris!

https://twitter.com/BorisJohnson/status/1512818337415372802?s=20&t=Fn1yKXh5R...

 Generally not a fan of bojo, but d***** if he hasn't been a true leader in Western Europe regarding supporting Ukraine.

This is an occasion where his lack of consistency and underlying principles has come in useful.

Yes, he did big up Russia and Putin previously - but that genuinely doesn't matter now.

[TiltsAreUnderrated]

Based Boris!

https://twitter.com/BorisJohnson/status/1512818337415372802?s=20&t=Fn1yKXh5R...

 Generally not a fan of bojo, but d***** if he hasn't been a true leader in Western Europe regarding supporting Ukraine.

This is an occasion where his lack of consistency and underlying principles has come in useful.

Yes, he did big up Russia and Putin previously - but that genuinely doesn't matter now.

He's not been consistent in his hostility to the Russian government, but this response is consistent with his historical interests. BoJo is a performer, and probably quite comfortable with the familiar Churchill cosplay he's using right now.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

Russian soldiers 'looted radioactive material from Chernobyl research laboratories'

Somehow, and I don't know how, the already shockingly low stupidity bar keeps getting lower.

[Storr]

To be fair, I'd be running too if I was under an artillery strike,

https://twitter.com/RALee85/status/1513419654160658436?s=20&t=2Cc5xvK8hnCtki...

[Hindsight was 2020]

There are more rumblings on social media backing up the earlier tweet that the Russian column heading for Kharkiv was hit and the Russians suffered 2k+ causalities

[DINGO Joe]

Based Boris!

https://twitter.com/BorisJohnson/status/1512818337415372802?s=20&t=Fn1yKXh5R...

 Generally not a fan of bojo, but d***** if he hasn't been a true leader in Western Europe regarding supporting Ukraine.

This is an occasion where his lack of consistency and underlying principles has come in useful.

Yes, he did big up Russia and Putin previously - but that genuinely doesn't matter now.

He's not been consistent in his hostility to the Russian government, but this response is consistent with his historical interests. BoJo is a performer, and probably quite comfortable with the familiar Churchill cosplay he's using right now.

https://twitter.com/NikaMelkozerova/status/1513190467743236103

Well, the gods were good enough to have Boris gifted with a ceramic rooster which he had to graciously accept while not making a quip which the video showed he desperately wanted to.

[Silent Hunter]

Russian soldiers 'looted radioactive material from Chernobyl research laboratories'

Somehow, and I don't know how, the already shockingly low stupidity bar keeps getting lower.

Not sure if they qualify for a Darwin award.