Afghan government collapse.

[lfromnj]

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/07/02/world/asia/afghanistan-withdrawal-taliban.html

As we leave, the fairly low moral Afghan forces are surrendering quickly.

Well we entered with a Taliban there, and now we exit with the Taliban there.

[S019]

As if anyone with a brain couldn’t see this happening. This is the big mistake of Biden’s presidency so far, and he’d be well advised to reverse so we don’t face these disastrous consequences. I now look forward to the anti-war mob calling me a neocon and warmonger.

[lfromnj]

As if anyone with a brain couldn’t see this happening. This is the big mistake of Biden’s presidency so far, and he’d be well advised to reverse so we don’t face these disastrous consequences. I now look forward to the anti-war mob calling me a neocon and warmonger.

Again the Afghan Army has little desire to fight. They literally are surrending Humvees and other equipment to pure infantry. Either we go back in and stay with 50000+ or we leave and accept the 2nd loss our nation has had.

From a geopolitical situation we could also hope for a Chinese intervention although they would probably be just as bad as the Taliban for many people of Afghanistan.

[Ⓐnarchy in the ☭☭☭P!]

As if anyone with a brain couldn’t see this happening. This is the big mistake of Biden’s presidency so far, and he’d be well advised to reverse so we don’t face these disastrous consequences. I now look forward to the anti-war mob calling me a neocon and warmonger.

As opposed to what, stay in Afghanistan until the end of time? Because the Afghan National Army has had 20 years to get into shape and clearly it never will.

The US should have left Afghanistan decades ago, it would have ended the exact same way but with considerably less spent blood and treasure.

The real question is what happens to the several hundred special forces Biden left behind if the Taliban win completely.

[PSOL]

As if anyone with a brain couldn’t see this happening. This is the big mistake of Biden’s presidency so far, and he’d be well advised to reverse so we don’t face these disastrous consequences. I now look forward to the anti-war mob calling me a neocon and warmonger.

As opposed to what, stay in Afghanistan until the end of time? Because the Afghan National Army has had 20 years to get into shape and clearly it never will.

The US should have left Afghanistan decades ago, it would have ended the exact same way but with considerably less spent blood and treasure.

The real question is what happens to the several hundred special forces Biden left behind if the Taliban win completely.

They will make some sort of deal to stay.

[CumbrianLefty]

As if anyone with a brain couldn’t see this happening. This is the big mistake of Biden’s presidency so far, and he’d be well advised to reverse so we don’t face these disastrous consequences. I now look forward to the anti-war mob calling me a neocon and warmonger.

The US should have done a better job of nation building in the previous two decades, then.

Given their brutality *and* incompetence, a return to Taliban rule in Afghanistan is most certainly a depressing thought - but the only long term remedy to that lies with the local people themselves.

[Blue3]

We went into Afghanistan for Osama bin Laden, not the Taliban. They just refused to give him up.

We stayed long enough. Too long. At least they've had 20 years of knowing what it would be like under a more modernized democracy (if heavily corrupt), and a whole  generation educated from birth to adulthood.

It's their fight now. We shouldn't have let the mission creep into nationbuilding in the first place. We should have used Osama bin Laden's death as justification for total withdrawal.

[Never Made it to Graceland]

Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld should suffer horribly forever for blowing a generation of wealth and the blood of innocent civilians for this ridiculous charade. Obama doesn't come out smelling much better for refusing to end it, like LBJ.

Is life under the Taliban worse than the US Chair Force "accidentally" blowing up a hospital and murdering your sick child or pregnant wife?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kunduz_hospital_airstrike

This war and Iraq were the defining American mistakes of my lifetime. We will never get back the opportunities we lost and the guilt we bear for it.

[jaymichaud]

America should have left after the "first phase" was over in 2014, tbh.

[Derpist]

Massive whitepill to see the good guys in Afghanistan win despite facing down the most powerful war machine and empire in human history.

[S019]

We went into Afghanistan for Osama bin Laden, not the Taliban. They just refused to give him up.

We stayed long enough. Too long. At least they've had 20 years of knowing what it would be like under a more modernized democracy (if heavily corrupt), and a whole  generation educated from birth to adulthood.

It's their fight now. We shouldn't have let the mission creep into nationbuilding in the first place. We should have used Osama bin Laden's death as justification for total withdrawal.

They clearly are struggling in "their fight." It's simply morally unconscionable to abandon the Afghan people to this fate, especially since they have now experienced democracy. Quite frankly a lot of the debate over the Afghanistan withdrawal especially among the American left is quite selfish in the fact that they seem to not really care that life for many Afghanis, especially women and those of minority ethnic groups, will get worse under the Taliban, and just seem to excuse that with some version of "war bad."

Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld should suffer horribly forever for blowing a generation of wealth and the blood of innocent civilians for this ridiculous charade. Obama doesn't come out smelling much better for refusing to end it, like LBJ.

Is life under the Taliban worse than the US Chair Force "accidentally" blowing up a hospital and murdering your sick child or pregnant wife?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kunduz_hospital_airstrike

This war and Iraq were the defining American mistakes of my lifetime. We will never get back the opportunities we lost and the guilt we bear for it.

Yes, I am pretty sure that the Taliban has killed more than 42 people. Let's not forget that the made pretty liberal (god, I hate that word in this context, but it works) use of the death penalty. They punished things like owning western media with death, not to mention absurd rules like banning women from leaving the house without a male guardian, requiring men to grow beards, banning women's education, and violating much of this was also punishable by death. It seems that people misunderstand fundamentally who the Taliban are, there's a reason that they sheltered terrorists, because their ideology is just as extreme as the terrorists.

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

The right time to leave Afghanistan was either fifteen years ago or never.

[NewYorkExpress]

Instead of committing ground troops to a forever war in Afghanistan, we should have just nuked Kabul back in 2001.

[Continential]

Should we send our men to die in a country far away from home for the next 10 years? I thought that the army was supposed to fight for America, not to fight in another country. Even if American Troops stayed for the next ten years, and hypothetically in 2031, I assume Afghanistan would still collapse like this. The United States spent nearly a trillion dollars on Afghanistan, and even despite spending a trillion dollars, the government is collapsing quickly. It's the fault of the Government of Afghanistan that it couldn't defeat the Taliban even with around a trillion dollars of spending by the Americans, and I don't want to spend several trillion more on Afghanistan when we could spend it at home.

[Continential]

Instead of committing ground troops to a forever war in Afghanistan, we should have just nuked Kabul back in 2001.

I also want to start a nuclear war.

[NewYorkExpress]

Instead of committing ground troops to a forever war in Afghanistan, we should have just nuked Kabul back in 2001.

I also want to start a nuclear war.

Who, exactly is going to come to The Taliban's defense if we nuke them? They were literal pariahs. Even traditional enemies of America, like China, Russia, Iran etc, weren't going to step in and help them, even if we used nuclear weapons.

[Continential]

Instead of committing ground troops to a forever war in Afghanistan, we should have just nuked Kabul back in 2001.

I also want to start a nuclear war.

Who, exactly is going to come to The Taliban's defense if we nuke them? They were literal pariahs. Even traditional enemies of America, like China, Russia, Iran etc, weren't going to step in and help them, even if we used nuclear weapons.

Nuking a city filled with innocent people won't go well with the world.

[NewYorkExpress]

Instead of committing ground troops to a forever war in Afghanistan, we should have just nuked Kabul back in 2001.

I also want to start a nuclear war.

Who, exactly is going to come to The Taliban's defense if we nuke them? They were literal pariahs. Even traditional enemies of America, like China, Russia, Iran etc, weren't going to step in and help them, even if we used nuclear weapons.

Nuking a city filled with innocent people won't go well with the world.

Most likely scenario is a bunch of European countries slap sanctions on George W. Bush and Donald Rumsfeld, and we never end up going into Iraq as a result of the backlash.

[Continential]

Instead of committing ground troops to a forever war in Afghanistan, we should have just nuked Kabul back in 2001.

I also want to start a nuclear war.

Who, exactly is going to come to The Taliban's defense if we nuke them? They were literal pariahs. Even traditional enemies of America, like China, Russia, Iran etc, weren't going to step in and help them, even if we used nuclear weapons.

Nuking a city filled with innocent people won't go well with the world.

Most likely scenario is a bunch of European countries slap sanctions on George W. Bush and Donald Rumsfeld, and we never end up going into Iraq as a result of the backlash.

Nuking a city is worse then going to Iraq.

[Blue3]

We went into Afghanistan for Osama bin Laden, not the Taliban. They just refused to give him up.

We stayed long enough. Too long. At least they've had 20 years of knowing what it would be like under a more modernized democracy (if heavily corrupt), and a whole  generation educated from birth to adulthood.

It's their fight now. We shouldn't have let the mission creep into nationbuilding in the first place. We should have used Osama bin Laden's death as justification for total withdrawal.

They clearly are struggling in "their fight." It's simply morally unconscionable to abandon the Afghan people to this fate, especially since they have now experienced democracy. Quite frankly a lot of the debate over the Afghanistan withdrawal especially among the American left is quite selfish in the fact that they seem to not really care that life for many Afghanis, especially women and those of minority ethnic groups, will get worse under the Taliban, and just seem to excuse that with some version of "war bad."

I'm actually usually ok with humanitarian interventions. But this is too much for too long. The current method isn't work, the fight must move beyond military action for now.

If we want to permanently enforce our way of life on them, let's just annex them and declare them a new state, add a star (or a few) to the flag. Would you support that?

Yes, at least now a whole generation has now experienced democracy. So if the Taliban retakes the country, it will eventually fall or modernize, and this time with a more organic movement led by their youth, not propping up a corrupt government that no one seems willing to fight for.

[CumbrianLefty]

Massive whitepill to see the good guys in Afghanistan win despite facing down the most powerful war machine and empire in human history.

You don't have to try *this* hard, you know.

[Derpist]

Massive whitepill to see the good guys in Afghanistan win despite facing down the most powerful war machine and empire in human history.

You don't have to try *this* hard, you know.

A good reminder that Western leftists will always dutifully serve their empires by trying to draw false equivalences between national liberation movements and the colonial empires they oppose.

The same people attacking the Taliban today would be attacking the Vietcong in 1970, the FLN in 1960, the DPRK in 1950, and the USSR in 1942. Jacobin would probably be screaming "Neither Berlin nor Moscow" to attack lend-lease lol

[Red Velvet]

For the US, was this result like a new Vietnam?

[Chips]

We should've gotten out of there a VERY long time ago. Save the innocent Afghan blood and the trillions could've been better used here.

[Never Made it to Graceland]

We should've gotten out of there a VERY long time ago. Save the innocent Afghan blood and the trillions could've been better used here.

Pure facts.