Israel-Gaza war

[Devils30]

Even if Israel isn't committing "genocide", surely you are against the 50+ years of occupation/colonization of the West Bank? Because ignoring that is ignoring the elephant in the room.

The Palestinian Arabs are on Jewish land, land given to the Jews by God, Himself.  Jews were in "Palestine" long before Arabs were.  If you want to play the "indigenous peoples" card here, you lost.  This is beyond question.  

If you want to talk about virtue, the Palestinian Arabs have a long history of desiring to drive the Jews out of Israel, regardless of its borders.  During WWII, the Grand Mufti of Jerusalem, the leader of Palestinian Muslims, collaborated with Hitler, himself, to ensure that no Jews entered "Palestine".  The "Palestinians" have opposed the existence of a Jewish state, regardless of the borders drawnl  The Grand Mufti fled to France, and then to Cairo to avoid prosecution for War Crimes.  They have taken up arms against Israel in 1948, 1967, and 1973.  Not a single Palestinian, whether they be from Hamas or Fatah, from Arafat to Abbas,

At no time has any Palestinian political entity acknowledged the right of Israel to exist, regardless of whatever borders are drawn.  This is undeniable.  You, yourself, have never stated (to my knowledge) what borders an independent Israel IS entitled to.  If you can't specify the borders you believe Israel is entitled to, there is no reason to believe that you are a part of the "From the River to the Sea" crowd.  

Israel has every right to defend itself from foreign entities that wish to destroy it and launch rocket attacks and terrorist actions against Israel within its borders.  The elephant in the room is the refusal of all of its political entities to affirm Israel's right to exist under ANY proposed borders.  If you can show me where any Palestinian political entity of substance acknowledges Israel's mere right to exist withing some set of borders, please edify me.

How do you know that an invisible man in the sky gave the land to the Jews?

Jews have a historical presence in the region but I am not sure using the bible to allocate land in 2023 is a productive exercise.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

If you can show me where any Palestinian political entity of substance acknowledges Israel's mere right to exist withing some set of borders, please edify me.

"A month later, Arafat declared in Geneva that the PLO would support a solution to the conflict based on these Resolutions. Effectively, the PLO recognized Israel's right to exist within pre-1967 borders, with the understanding that the Palestinians would be allowed to set up their own state in the West Bank and Gaza. The United States accepted this clarification by Arafat and began to allow diplomatic contacts with PLO officials. The Proclamation of Independence did not lead to statehood, although over 100 states recognised the State of Palestine."


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestine_Liberation_Organization#:~:text=Effectively%2C%20the%20PLO%20recognized%20Israel%27s,diplomatic%20contacts%20with%20PLO%20officials.

[pppolitics]

[pppolitics]

Biden admin again bypasses Congress to sell military equipment to Israel

https://www.cnn.com/2023/12/29/politics/biden-congress-israel-military-aid/index.html

[CumbrianLefty]

Casually raising genocide as an option is odd.

Well, you and I may think so. But tell that to the people in Israel (including some in the government and security apparatus) who are talking of it as a "solution" (you might even say, a final solution) in disturbingly cavalier and carefree fashion.

[GeneralMacArthur]

Israel is an incredibly racist society, despite the PR. Polls have shown over 50% of Israelis think Black Jews are a negative for their country.

Why would "Quds News Network" -- which, again, is literally just Hamas -- know anything about a funeral that happened in Israel?

Better question.  Why is Horus getting Quds News Network as part of his daily news diet, and what impact is this having on his brain?  You know you really have to go out of your way to find this content since QNN is banned from TikTok and Facebook (it was also banned from Twitter for years).

[Horus]

Israel is an incredibly racist society, despite the PR. Polls have shown over 50% of Israelis think Black Jews are a negative for their country.

Why would "Quds News Network" -- which, again, is literally just Hamas -- know anything about a funeral that happened in Israel?

Better question.  Why is Horus getting Quds News Network as part of his daily news diet, and what impact is this having on his brain?  You know you really have to go out of your way to find this content since QNN is banned from TikTok and Facebook (it was also banned from Twitter for years).

I'm not getting Quds network in my feed. I followed one of the links MBD put up and the "Free Palestine" page shared it. The text says no one showed up to his event and the building was empty. Are you disputing the words of this young man's family?

[GeneralMacArthur]

Israel is an incredibly racist society, despite the PR. Polls have shown over 50% of Israelis think Black Jews are a negative for their country.

Why would "Quds News Network" -- which, again, is literally just Hamas -- know anything about a funeral that happened in Israel?

Better question.  Why is Horus getting Quds News Network as part of his daily news diet, and what impact is this having on his brain?  You know you really have to go out of your way to find this content since QNN is banned from TikTok and Facebook (it was also banned from Twitter for years).

I'm not getting Quds network in my feed. I followed one of the links MBD put up and the "Free Palestine" page shared it. The text says no one showed up to his event and the building was empty. Are you disputing the words of this young man's family?

Just like the "journalists" at Quds News Network, from whom you are sourcing this anecdote, I don't live in Israel, so I have no way of actually knowing one way or another what happened at one random dude's funeral.

[Horus]

Biden admin again bypasses Congress to sell military equipment to Israel

https://www.cnn.com/2023/12/29/politics/biden-congress-israel-military-aid/index.html

Even Hillary's VP pick thinks this went too far.

https://twitter.com/timkaine/status/1741131919067111425?t=qQhrikeULzzrtx_sMK1oeQ...

[Comrade Funk]

I don't know how people can keep calling Biden a "dove." It's disgusting we're funding these war crimes - without any say from Congress in this case.

[Horus]

I don't know how people can keep calling Biden a "dove." It's disgusting we're funding these war crimes - without any say from Congress in this case.

If I weren't in a swing state he would've lost my vote long ago.

[No War, but the War on Christmas]

I don't know how people can keep calling Biden a "dove." It's disgusting we're funding these war crimes - without any say from Congress in this case.

If I weren't in a swing state he would've lost my vote long ago.

Yep, I’ll second this.

[Reactionary Libertarian]

Israel would be cool with cash compensation. Although without a peace agreement, any cash compensation will surely go to build more bombs.

Arafat's legacy does matter in terms of where we are now, right of return really makes no sense when every town is completely different than it was in 1948. It is more productive to build permanent homes for Palestinians (West Bank has plenty of space to build assuming Israel tears down the settlements 20 miles inside and I assume any treaty would give Gazans the right to move there). I just don't think the college campus "river to the sea" rhetoric is one bit productive.

Realistically though, is giving a population of people who has high rates of antisemitism control of a highland region within ten miles of most major Israeli cities actually a good idea? Even in the event of a peace agreement being signed, the opinions of average Palestinians aren't necessarily going to change.

Any successful two-state solution will be predicated on Palestinians relinquishing all claims to land outside the 1967 borders. Israel will not agree to any deal if there is a possibility of it becoming a Gaza 2.0 situation. But there’s never going to be a unilateral withdrawal where they just give control to Palestinians, while Palestinians still want to destroy Israel.

Okay, so there's a peace deal with a Palestinian governing political party who's quite politically astute and agrees to a two state solution under the 1967 ceasefire line and drops territorial claims... and as a fully independent state they re-arm... and sooner or later there's some discontent with their government and a more radical one is elected and they decide to revive the old territorial claim and attack Israel. And Israel is defenseless thanks to most of their population being within a few miles of the highland area full of Palestinian military presence.

Why would any Israelis accept this? They will be well aware that is a likely course of events.

Well, while it’s theoretically possible that a Palestinian governing party would fake support for a 2SS, and go along with it for a years long interval of implementation (which would include no military), and then launch an attack, that seems highly unlikely. More likely the second they signed the peace deal there would be riots in the streets. The reality is, any Palestinian society that can make it through a 2SS has already given up on taking over Israel. And that is why the 2SS is so difficult- Palestinian society has not gotten there.

Actually, the “fake it till you get everything” approach is quite smart, which is another reason why it will not be implemented. Hamas couldn’t even stop their own fighters from butchering many of their hostages within minutes. You think people like that are going to resist the urge to kill Jews for years and years?

[Meclazine for Israel]

IDF

We Wont Stop

https://www.instagram.com/reel/C1fUxI5PArc/

It does not look like Israel is going to back down any time soon.

[Meclazine for Israel]

Israel to take full control of Egypt-Gaza border.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2023-12-31/gaza-israel-egypt-border-control/103275364


Israeli soldiers used to have a presence in the border zone between the Gaza and Egypt in 2005.(Reuters: David Silverman)

"The Philadelphi Corridor — or to put it more correctly, the southern closing point [of Gaza] — must be in our hands. It must be shut," Mr Netanyahu said at a press conference on Saturday (local time).

"It is clear that any other arrangement would not ensure the demilitarisation that we seek."

He did not elaborate.

[Chancellor Tanterterg]

How far are we from the Final Solution to the Palestinian Question?

Dude, drop the blood libel and just admit that you’re a rabid anti-Semite.

[All Along The Watchtower]

How far are we from the Final Solution to the Palestinian Question?

What an absolutely gross, moronic, despicable comment, and I say that as someone who rather dislikes Israel in terms of its policies and its politics, and certainly dislikes my country’s level of support for Israel (again, in terms of both policy and politics—especially the latter).

Just because there are and have been cynical, bad-faith accusations of anti-Semitism coming from the pro-Israel side does not mean that there isn’t plenty of anti-Semitism coming from the “pro-Palestinian” side. Your little quip here brazenly crosses the line into the latter. Do better.

[GeneralMacArthur]

Drawing a direct analogy between the Holocaust and Israel's conduct of the war on Hamas goes beyond the simple trivialization of terms like "genocide" or "war crime" or "crime against humanity", which is bad enough, and steps directly into trivializing the Holocaust itself by playing into the notion that either

A) The Holocaust wasn't uniquely bad, because Israel is doing something equivalently bad as we speak

or

B) The Jews have no right to cry about the Holocaust, because we are now seeing that given the chance they would do something equally awful to their enemies once they're in a position of power

both of these tropes get extensive, and I mean extensive, mileage in Arabic and particularly Palestinian culture, and are key to the mindset of anti-semitism that leads to justification of the mass extermination of Jews.

Now we all know that I despise the pseudoacademic practice of twisting terms to mean something broader than, and different from, what a typical person would expect that term to mean based on the common understanding of the English language.

However, in this case I feel like it's widely understood that the umbrella of "Holocaust Denial" typically includes not just denial that the Holocaust happened at all, it also includes denial of the scope, scale, or seriousness of the Holocaust, trying to downplay its unique horror and unique place in the history of the world and Jewish culture by saying something along the lines of "the Jews are just drama queens, what they suffered was no greater than what dozens of other cultures have suffered, but they milk it for all it's worth as part of their campaign to achieve power."

Holocaust Denial isn't some hypothetical.  It's a position that's been espoused by, at least off the top of my head, the Iranian and Syrian regimes.  This happened just last week:

In a video of a speech by Assad translated and published by the Middle East Media Research Institute (MEMRI) on Monday, Assad can be seen telling a listening crowd that “there is no evidence that six million Jews were killed” during the Holocaust.

“True, there were concentration camps, but what shows you that this is a politicized issue, not a humanitarian one and not a real one, is that we talk about these six million, but why don’t we talk about the 26 million Soviets who were killed in that war? Are the six million more precious?”

source

[Meclazine for Israel]

Israeli hostage claims Hamas kidnappers were getting 'touchy' with her.

Mia Schem

https://www.instagram.com/reel/C1gZsM9AGPn/

Barbaric sexual violence against Israeli woman is now been investigated and published in NY Times and Washington Post.

https://www.cnn.com/2023/12/06/middleeast/rape-sexual-violence-hamas-israel-what-we-know-intl/index.html

This type of barbarism will not go away in the minds of the Israeli's.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

Imagine being so pro Likud that Tim Kaine has to call you out.

https://twitter.com/GuardianUS/status/1741212099618152918

[MT Treasurer]

To highlight the barbaric scale of destruction in Gaza, nearly 70% of all homes there are either destroyed or damaged. Yes, 70%.

The Wall Street Journal reports that almost half of Gaza’s buildings have been damaged or destroyed in the war there, a figure that also accounts for almost 70 percent of its 439,000 homes.

The report cites analysis of satellite photography of the Strip and other remote sensing methods.

The paper noted buildings hit include factories, houses of prayer, schools, shopping malls and hotels. Israel has said many schools, mosques and other buildings have been hit after being used for military purposes and as bases of operation by Gaza terror groups.

WSJ adds that only eight of Gaza’s 36 hospitals can accept patients, and that most basic infrastructure including water, electricity and communications is demolished.

https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/some-70-of-gaza-homes-damaged-or-destroyed-wall-street-journal-analysis/

The goal here was displacement/ethnic cleansing.

[patzer]

To highlight the barbaric scale of destruction in Gaza, nearly 70% of all homes there are either destroyed or damaged. Yes, 70%.

Hamas could have unconditionally surrendered at any time and thereby prevented all of this, but they would never do that as they hate Jews more than they care for Palestinians.

[President Punxsutawney Phil]

To highlight the barbaric scale of destruction in Gaza, nearly 70% of all homes there are either destroyed or damaged. Yes, 70%.

The Wall Street Journal reports that almost half of Gaza’s buildings have been damaged or destroyed in the war there, a figure that also accounts for almost 70 percent of its 439,000 homes.

The report cites analysis of satellite photography of the Strip and other remote sensing methods.

The paper noted buildings hit include factories, houses of prayer, schools, shopping malls and hotels. Israel has said many schools, mosques and other buildings have been hit after being used for military purposes and as bases of operation by Gaza terror groups.

WSJ adds that only eight of Gaza’s 36 hospitals can accept patients, and that most basic infrastructure including water, electricity and communications is demolished.

https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/some-70-of-gaza-homes-damaged-or-destroyed-wall-street-journal-analysis/

The goal here was displacement/ethnic cleansing.

The UN has already labelled what is going on as a domicide.

[Hindsight was 2020]

Is it me or is Israel’s actual on the ground progress kinda lackluster considering how long and the amount they have been bombarding Gaza?

[CumbrianLefty]

How far are we from the Final Solution to the Palestinian Question?

Assuming this is a serious rather than rhetorical question - still some way away.

However, that some influential people in Israel desire exactly that cannot be wished away - despite how their supporters on here and elsewhere try their utmost to do so.