Israel-Gaza war

[Meclazine for Israel]

Also Dule, Israel is not deliberately targeting civilians. The fact is Hamas has so integrated their military infrastructure into civilian infrastructure , that any military target becomes a civilian target as well. So if anyone is responsible for the large civilian death total its Hamas and not Israel.

This is outright IDF propaganda — even if (and it’s a ridiculous if) we suppose that parts of every single civilian-infrastructure target they have bombed so far were possibly/potentially used for military purposes, they still knew that bombing the entire complex would clearly result in large civilian casualties. And no, they quite evidently didn’t "warn" everybody residing in every building they bombed, as you can tell from the death toll.  

That is simply not true.

Hamas are surrounding themself with civilian targets and dressing up as civilians. This is common knowledge.

If the IDF did not warn people by text/phone/roof knocking etc, they would have killed 10,000 in the first couple of days.

The Allied Forces killed 10's of thousands of Germans and Japanese every time they bombed Germany and Japan respectively.

It's hard to believe that after 40 days, the Israeli's have only killed 10,000 Palestinians given the utter devastation of Northern Gaza.

The Hamas media machine includes Hamas fighters in that number, so we are probably closer to 5-6,000 civilians. Joe Biden has access to the real data, and he has suggested a similar analysis.

[MT Treasurer]

Also Dule, Israel is not deliberately targeting civilians. The fact is Hamas has so integrated their military infrastructure into civilian infrastructure , that any military target becomes a civilian target as well. So if anyone is responsible for the large civilian death total its Hamas and not Israel.

This is outright IDF propaganda — even if (and it’s a ridiculous if) we suppose that parts of every single civilian-infrastructure target they have bombed so far were possibly/potentially used for military purposes, they still knew that bombing the entire complex would clearly result in large civilian casualties. And no, they quite evidently didn’t "warn" everybody residing in every building they bombed, as you can tell from the death toll. 

That is not true.

Hamas are surrounding themself with civilian targets and dressing up as civilians. This is common knowledge.

Yes, all the 4,500+ children killed by Israeli bombs were either terrorists dressed up as civilians or surrounded by terrorists. This is common knowledge.

[gerritcole]

Israel seems to be prosecuting a total war - civilians are combatants for better or worse

[Hindsight was 2020]

You think the fact that people like Dule or MT Treasurer are even critical of Israel’s conduct would be a hint to people like OSR or Meclazine that Israel is going too far in it’s conduct

[OSR stands with Israel]

You think the fact that people like Dule or MT Treasurer are even critical of Israel’s conduct would be a hint to people like OSR or Meclazine that Israel is going too far in it’s conduct

Nah Dule and MT Treasurer are openly not fans of neoconservatism at all and I don’t think either are much fans of even the milder form of neoconservatism you saw under Reagan

Anyway I will fully admit it’s far more likely for the average Republican to turn on Israel than me given how social media is like these days.

[Horus]

You think the fact that people like Dule or MT Treasurer are even critical of Israel’s conduct would be a hint to people like OSR or Meclazine that Israel is going too far in it’s conduct

Nah Dule and MT Treasurer are openly not fans of neoconservatism at all and I don’t think either are much fans of even the milder form of neoconservatism you saw under Reagan

Anyway I will fully admit it’s far more likely for the average Republican to turn on Israel than me given how social media is like these days.

Ever considered that people are turning on Israel because they've killed over 4,000 children with no sign of stopping?

"It's TikTok"

"It's Gen Z"

"It's twitter"

"It's antisemitism"

Maybe look in the mirror for once?

[NOVA Green]

Meanwhile, shift of focus from the past couple pages of back and forth on other items...

Gaza's water crisis is continuing to worsen.

It is frequently forgotten, but in war zones frequently many more children, elderly, and infirmed die from contaminated water than from bombs and shells.

I suspect that this particular incident was not directly caused by parties involved in the ongoing conflict in Gaza, but rather much more likely indirectly as a result of a buildup of gases as a result of lack of wastewater treatment activities due to electricity not being active, workers not showing up, backup life safe systems not being online, etc...

Fire has gutted a water treatment plant on the outskirts of Gaza City, satellite images captured on Thursday and Friday show — the latest evidence of damage to water infrastructure amid an increasingly dire shortage of clean water.

A satellite picture from Thursday shows an enormous plume of smoke rising from the fire and hanging over a wide swath of the city. The fire burned for at least four hours. An image from Friday shows the entire plant was destroyed.

It was not clear what caused the fire, or how recently the plant had been operating.

The fire broke out amid a water crisis in Gaza, with UNRWA, the U.N. agency for Palestinian refugees, warning that 70 percent of people in the Gaza Strip are drinking contaminated water. With critical infrastructure destroyed and relatively few trucks carrying fuel and water permitted to enter Gaza, the water emergency has only spiraled.

On Friday, a U.N. expert urged Israel to allow clean water into the territory, along with fuel to run water treatment systems, and called on the country to “stop using water as a weapon of war.”

https://www.nytimes.com/live/2023/11/17/world/israel-hamas-gaza-war-news

[AtorBoltox]

https://twitter.com/broseph_stalin/status/1725481914562121794

The BBC is not a credible source on this conflict. They have repeatedly echoed Hamas propaganda uncritically our outright made up fake news ('the IDF is targeting Arab speakers and doctors'.)

[Horus]

https://twitter.com/broseph_stalin/status/1725481914562121794

The BBC is not a credible source on this conflict. They have repeatedly echoed Hamas propaganda uncritically our outright made up fake news ('the IDF is targeting Arab speakers and doctors'.)

"It's the BBC"

[Meclazine for Israel]

The BBC is not a credible source on this conflict. They have repeatedly echoed Hamas propaganda uncritically our outright made up fake news ('the IDF is targeting Arab speakers and doctors'.)

Once BBC lost their links to the Al-Shifa "crisis actors", their news coverage fell off the side of a cliff. Israeli's have not been happy with their pro-Palestinian bias.

ABC Australia is identical. They just have rehashed biased articles copying the narrative of a Palestinian.

I will give credit to PBS News Hour. You can see they are trying to present the actual reality on the ground and frequently mention the nature of their sources.

[No War, but the War on Christmas]

The BBC is not a credible source on this conflict. They have repeatedly echoed Hamas propaganda uncritically our outright made up fake news ('the IDF is targeting Arab speakers and doctors'.)

Once BBC lost their links to the Al-Shifa "crisis actors", their news coverage fell off the side of a cliff. Israeli's have not been happy with their pro-Palestinian bias.

ABC Australia is identical. They just have rehashed biased articles copying the narrative of a Palestinian.

I will give credit to PBS News Hour. You can see they are trying to present the actual reality on the ground and frequently mention the nature of their sources.

Half the links you post on here are from third-rate, ad-riddled, right-wing boomer websites that just copy the same story from each other, so the irony here is thick.

[NOVA Green]

Meanwhile, shift of focus from the past couple pages of back and forth on other items...

Gaza's water crisis is continuing to worsen.

It is frequently forgotten, but in war zones frequently many more children, elderly, and infirmed die from contaminated water than from bombs and shells.

I suspect that this particular incident was not directly caused by parties involved in the ongoing conflict in Gaza, but rather much more likely indirectly as a result of a buildup of gases as a result of lack of wastewater treatment activities due to electricity not being active, workers not showing up, backup life safe systems not being online, etc...

Fire has gutted a water treatment plant on the outskirts of Gaza City, satellite images captured on Thursday and Friday show — the latest evidence of damage to water infrastructure amid an increasingly dire shortage of clean water.

A satellite picture from Thursday shows an enormous plume of smoke rising from the fire and hanging over a wide swath of the city. The fire burned for at least four hours. An image from Friday shows the entire plant was destroyed.

It was not clear what caused the fire, or how recently the plant had been operating.

The fire broke out amid a water crisis in Gaza, with UNRWA, the U.N. agency for Palestinian refugees, warning that 70 percent of people in the Gaza Strip are drinking contaminated water. With critical infrastructure destroyed and relatively few trucks carrying fuel and water permitted to enter Gaza, the water emergency has only spiraled.

On Friday, a U.N. expert urged Israel to allow clean water into the territory, along with fuel to run water treatment systems, and called on the country to “stop using water as a weapon of war.”

https://www.nytimes.com/live/2023/11/17/world/israel-hamas-gaza-war-news

Bump... while people wrangle about other issues.

[Ⓐnarchy in the ☭☭☭P!]

Hamas are surrounding themself with civilian targets and dressing up as civilians. This is common knowledge.

That the IDF has been making decisions based on "common knowledge" is exactly how they identified Al-Shifa as a "Hamas command center" in the first place. That's the whole problem: they pretend they have some mindblowing sci-fi ground penetrating radar that gives them the scoop on where Hamas is at all times and then it turns out that they stormed a literal hospital and caused the death of dozens if not hundreds of patients on the basis of "common knowledge" acquired by decade old rumours.

This is the quality of what the IDF calls "evidence":

https://twitter.com/One_Dawah/status/1725600632965304765

EDIT:

https://twitter.com/SanaSaeed/status/1725774550300823825

but something something human shields collateral damage Hiroshima Dresden blah blah

[LAKISYLVANIA]

https://www.awrad.org/files/server/polls/polls2023/Public%20Opinion%20Poll%20-%20Gaza%20War%202023%20-%20Tables%20of%20Results.pdf

75% of Palestinians view Hamas in a positive manner and back the 10/7 attacks

75% of Americans saw Bush in a positive manner and backed the Iraq War when it began.

Getting your buildings bombed to the ground and your people brutally murdered radicalizes citizens through nationalism, who would’ve thought! Shocking stuff that Netanyahu plus Israeli far-right feed Hamas and vice-versa!

Lol you are truly unbelievable and all your defenses of radical Islamists are completely lol worthy . The fact is the PLO had genocidal goals for decades and completely sabotaged hopes for peace over and over again so it was the PLO. Now they back a group worse than the PLO because what they want is Israel to no longer exist and that’s always been their belief.

Anyway this poll is probably similar to what the German public thought about the Nazis from 43-45 and yeah Gaza just like Germany needs to be depropagandized

It's always ironic you say this because you would have backed the Iraq war lmao

And this is what makes me respect you.

Regardless of anything else, every other feud we have, i forgive and will let that slip. You're a freedom fighter when it comes to this.

[CumbrianLefty]

You think the fact that people like Dule or MT Treasurer are even critical of Israel’s conduct would be a hint to people like OSR or Meclazine that Israel is going too far in it’s conduct

Nothing that Israel does would ever be too much for them - they are the other side of the coin from those who celebrated the October 7th atrocities as "glorious resistance".

[pppolitics]

CNN analysis of video suggests IDF might have rearranged weaponry at Al-Shifa hospital prior to international news crew visits

[OSR stands with Israel]

https://www.awrad.org/files/server/polls/polls2023/Public%20Opinion%20Poll%20-%20Gaza%20War%202023%20-%20Tables%20of%20Results.pdf

75% of Palestinians view Hamas in a positive manner and back the 10/7 attacks

75% of Americans saw Bush in a positive manner and backed the Iraq War when it began.

Getting your buildings bombed to the ground and your people brutally murdered radicalizes citizens through nationalism, who would’ve thought! Shocking stuff that Netanyahu plus Israeli far-right feed Hamas and vice-versa!

Lol you are truly unbelievable and all your defenses of radical Islamists are completely lol worthy . The fact is the PLO had genocidal goals for decades and completely sabotaged hopes for peace over and over again so it was the PLO. Now they back a group worse than the PLO because what they want is Israel to no longer exist and that’s always been their belief.

Anyway this poll is probably similar to what the German public thought about the Nazis from 43-45 and yeah Gaza just like Germany needs to be depropagandized

It's always ironic you say this because you would have backed the Iraq war lmao

And this is what makes me respect you.

Regardless of anything else, every other feud we have, i forgive and will let that slip. You're a freedom fighter when it comes to this.

This just proves the horseshoe theory is true when it comes to this issue or foreign policy in general. You tend to side with Posters like Deadprez and Yellowhammer on this issue while I tend to side with S019 and President Johnson more on this issue than those posters .

[Horus]

https://www.awrad.org/files/server/polls/polls2023/Public%20Opinion%20Poll%20-%20Gaza%20War%202023%20-%20Tables%20of%20Results.pdf

75% of Palestinians view Hamas in a positive manner and back the 10/7 attacks

75% of Americans saw Bush in a positive manner and backed the Iraq War when it began.

Getting your buildings bombed to the ground and your people brutally murdered radicalizes citizens through nationalism, who would’ve thought! Shocking stuff that Netanyahu plus Israeli far-right feed Hamas and vice-versa!

Lol you are truly unbelievable and all your defenses of radical Islamists are completely lol worthy . The fact is the PLO had genocidal goals for decades and completely sabotaged hopes for peace over and over again so it was the PLO. Now they back a group worse than the PLO because what they want is Israel to no longer exist and that’s always been their belief.

Anyway this poll is probably similar to what the German public thought about the Nazis from 43-45 and yeah Gaza just like Germany needs to be depropagandized

It's always ironic you say this because you would have backed the Iraq war lmao

And this is what makes me respect you.

Regardless of anything else, every other feud we have, i forgive and will let that slip. You're a freedom fighter when it comes to this.

This just proves the horseshoe theory is true when it comes to this issue or foreign policy in general. You tend to side with Posters like Deadprez and Yellowhammer on this issue while I tend to side with S019 and President Johnson more on this issue than those posters .

It's not left vs. right, it's boomers and establishment normies vs. everyone else.

Also S019 is the most authoritarian poster here.

[OSR stands with Israel]

https://www.awrad.org/files/server/polls/polls2023/Public%20Opinion%20Poll%20-%20Gaza%20War%202023%20-%20Tables%20of%20Results.pdf

75% of Palestinians view Hamas in a positive manner and back the 10/7 attacks

75% of Americans saw Bush in a positive manner and backed the Iraq War when it began.

Getting your buildings bombed to the ground and your people brutally murdered radicalizes citizens through nationalism, who would’ve thought! Shocking stuff that Netanyahu plus Israeli far-right feed Hamas and vice-versa!

Lol you are truly unbelievable and all your defenses of radical Islamists are completely lol worthy . The fact is the PLO had genocidal goals for decades and completely sabotaged hopes for peace over and over again so it was the PLO. Now they back a group worse than the PLO because what they want is Israel to no longer exist and that’s always been their belief.

Anyway this poll is probably similar to what the German public thought about the Nazis from 43-45 and yeah Gaza just like Germany needs to be depropagandized

It's always ironic you say this because you would have backed the Iraq war lmao

And this is what makes me respect you.

Regardless of anything else, every other feud we have, i forgive and will let that slip. You're a freedom fighter when it comes to this.

This just proves the horseshoe theory is true when it comes to this issue or foreign policy in general. You tend to side with Posters like Deadprez and Yellowhammer on this issue while I tend to side with S019 and President Johnson more on this issue than those posters .

It's not left vs. right, it's boomers and establishment normies vs. everyone else.

Also S019 is the most authoritarian poster here.

lol no

[Horus]

https://www.awrad.org/files/server/polls/polls2023/Public%20Opinion%20Poll%20-%20Gaza%20War%202023%20-%20Tables%20of%20Results.pdf

75% of Palestinians view Hamas in a positive manner and back the 10/7 attacks

75% of Americans saw Bush in a positive manner and backed the Iraq War when it began.

Getting your buildings bombed to the ground and your people brutally murdered radicalizes citizens through nationalism, who would’ve thought! Shocking stuff that Netanyahu plus Israeli far-right feed Hamas and vice-versa!

Lol you are truly unbelievable and all your defenses of radical Islamists are completely lol worthy . The fact is the PLO had genocidal goals for decades and completely sabotaged hopes for peace over and over again so it was the PLO. Now they back a group worse than the PLO because what they want is Israel to no longer exist and that’s always been their belief.

Anyway this poll is probably similar to what the German public thought about the Nazis from 43-45 and yeah Gaza just like Germany needs to be depropagandized

It's always ironic you say this because you would have backed the Iraq war lmao

And this is what makes me respect you.

Regardless of anything else, every other feud we have, i forgive and will let that slip. You're a freedom fighter when it comes to this.

This just proves the horseshoe theory is true when it comes to this issue or foreign policy in general. You tend to side with Posters like Deadprez and Yellowhammer on this issue while I tend to side with S019 and President Johnson more on this issue than those posters .

It's not left vs. right, it's boomers and establishment normies vs. everyone else.

Also S019 is the most authoritarian poster here.

lol no

lol yes. He's basically Singapore.

No fun, rules for everything, OCD about perceived safety, anti civil liberties and privacy.

[Silent Hunter]

CNN analysis of video suggests IDF might have rearranged weaponry at Al-Shifa hospital prior to international news crew visits

Putting all your seized items together in a single room for the photos is a standard practice for police the world over.

But you need to photograph them in situ first.

[OSR stands with Israel]

https://www.awrad.org/files/server/polls/polls2023/Public%20Opinion%20Poll%20-%20Gaza%20War%202023%20-%20Tables%20of%20Results.pdf

75% of Palestinians view Hamas in a positive manner and back the 10/7 attacks

75% of Americans saw Bush in a positive manner and backed the Iraq War when it began.

Getting your buildings bombed to the ground and your people brutally murdered radicalizes citizens through nationalism, who would’ve thought! Shocking stuff that Netanyahu plus Israeli far-right feed Hamas and vice-versa!

Lol you are truly unbelievable and all your defenses of radical Islamists are completely lol worthy . The fact is the PLO had genocidal goals for decades and completely sabotaged hopes for peace over and over again so it was the PLO. Now they back a group worse than the PLO because what they want is Israel to no longer exist and that’s always been their belief.

Anyway this poll is probably similar to what the German public thought about the Nazis from 43-45 and yeah Gaza just like Germany needs to be depropagandized

It's always ironic you say this because you would have backed the Iraq war lmao

And this is what makes me respect you.

Regardless of anything else, every other feud we have, i forgive and will let that slip. You're a freedom fighter when it comes to this.

This just proves the horseshoe theory is true when it comes to this issue or foreign policy in general. You tend to side with Posters like Deadprez and Yellowhammer on this issue while I tend to side with S019 and President Johnson more on this issue than those posters .

It's not left vs. right, it's boomers and establishment normies vs. everyone else.

Also S019 is the most authoritarian poster here.

lol no

lol yes. He's basically Singapore.

No fun, rules for everything, OCD about perceived safety, anti civil liberties and privacy.

He doenst have the same views as he did in 2019-20 and has made that clear no matter how many times you guys bring it up .

Also we have a literal Singapore poster who has defended the laws Singapore has

[Horus]

Small but positive step from the Biden administration.

https://twitter.com/BarakRavid/status/1725976743234683347?t=XQctaMPpnlwDkwZ8rtVI...

[President Punxsutawney Phil]

Small but positive step from the Biden administration.

https://twitter.com/BarakRavid/status/1725976743234683347?t=XQctaMPpnlwDkwZ8rtVI...

Wow!

[Stand With Israel. Crush Hamas]

Given that these are actual criminals, seems entirely reasonable. Netanyahu essentially unleashing the settler mobs for revenge strikes is probably the clearest evidence yet that he needs to go.

Any sort of diplomatic assault on Israel right now would be a red line that would have extremely unpredictable consequences for the world order. This isn't that.