Pelosi's staying

[feeblepizza]

What more does this woman want from us?

[Landslide Lyndon]

Thats actually a great place to be in, really.

There are many things the GOP can do in the House to exceed expectations. Cutting Congressional pay would be a great first move. I hear Boehner is interested in that. Its not much but it does send a message that this congress and this new GOP gets it enough they if everyone else takes a pay cut they should as well. On its own its miniscule, but it is as I said a great start.

Cutting congressional pay? Good luck with that.
The problem is that besides symbolic votes about repealing HCR and extending Bush's tax cuts, the Republicans have absolutely no clue of what to do.
David Frum, Andrew Sullivan and other conservatives literally are begging Bhoener and Co. for a year now to present a serious plan about how they are going to reduce the deficit, to no avail.
Frum has gone even further saying that actually the GOP leadership will quickly drop any pretense about serious governing and will focus on passing the pet projects of Bhoener's lobbyist friends.

Unless of course by beating expectations you mean launching frivolous investigations, on things like Obama's trip to India, and trying to impeach him. 

[Badger]

Pelosi is a lightning rod for swing voter discontent in House races, and will be only somewhat less so in 2012. Yes, she's done an admirable job getting legislation passed only to be stopped by GOP Senate filibusters, but would, say, Steny Hoyer, be any less effective as minority leader without being anathema to many voters?

I will say I have no desire to see Shuler as Leader--a third term back bencher from a dangerous district doesn't appeal--but I want an alternative to Pelosi. Yes, the Republicans will try to tar Steny Hoyer or any replacement the same way, but they've already succeeded with Pelosi, and it will be VERY difficult to do for a new minority leader. How many people outside the beltway, blogs and western Ohio gave a s#it who John Boehner was before Wednesday?

Bluntly put, Pelosi is a terminally damaged brand name. She needs to take one for the team and step down.

[The Vorlon]

According to the exit polls, she has an eight (as in "8" as in less than "9"... as in child molester territory) percent approval rating among independents.

8 percent.

If I was the GOP I would have 25 House members "switch" to the Dems just long enough to vote for Minority leader (and then switch back) just to make it happen.

This is the inequivalent of the GOP appointing Sarah Palin to be RNC chair (or similar act of political madness)

8%....?

Have the Dems lost their mind?

The GOP just keeps running the same plays they have run for the last two years..

[The Vorlon]

Bluntly put, Pelosi is a terminally damaged brand name. She needs to take one for the team and step down.

You are 100% correct which, of course, means there is 0% chance she will take your advice.

[tpfkaw]

According to the exit polls, she has an eight (as in "8" as in less than "9"... as in child molester territory) percent approval rating among independents.

8 percent.

If I was the GOP I would have 25 House members "switch" to the Dems just long enough to vote for Minority leader (and then switch back) just to make it happen.

This is the inequivalent of the GOP appointing Sarah Palin to be RNC chair (or similar act of political madness)

8%....?

Have the Dems lost their mind?

The GOP just keeps running the same plays they have run for the last two years..

More like the GOP appointing Dick Cheney.

[J. J.]

According to the exit polls, she has an eight (as in "8" as in less than "9"... as in child molester territory) percent approval rating among independents.

8 percent.

If I was the GOP I would have 25 House members "switch" to the Dems just long enough to vote for Minority leader (and then switch back) just to make it happen.

This is the inequivalent of the GOP appointing Sarah Palin to be RNC chair (or similar act of political madness)

8%....?

Have the Dems lost their mind?

The GOP just keeps running the same plays they have run for the last two years..

More like the GOP appointing Dick Cheney.

No,  Cheney would be a good choice.  Everybody would be afraid that if they didn't vote Republican, he's fly in through a window and suck your blood. 

[Landslide Lyndon]

According to the exit polls, she has an eight (as in "8" as in less than "9"... as in child molester territory) percent approval rating among independents.

8 percent.

If I was the GOP I would have 25 House members "switch" to the Dems just long enough to vote for Minority leader (and then switch back) just to make it happen.

This is the inequivalent of the GOP appointing Sarah Palin to be RNC chair (or similar act of political madness)

8%....?

Have the Dems lost their mind?

The GOP just keeps running the same plays they have run for the last two years..

Again, remember how elated were the GOPers when Howard Dean was elected DNC chairman?
He too was considered a permanently damaged name and a scourge for independents and moderates.

If Bhoener flops (and he isn't exactly popular, even among Republicans), then Pelosi will look good by comparison in two years.

[J. J.]

According to the exit polls, she has an eight (as in "8" as in less than "9"... as in child molester territory) percent approval rating among independents.

8 percent.

If I was the GOP I would have 25 House members "switch" to the Dems just long enough to vote for Minority leader (and then switch back) just to make it happen.

This is the inequivalent of the GOP appointing Sarah Palin to be RNC chair (or similar act of political madness)

8%....?

Have the Dems lost their mind?

The GOP just keeps running the same plays they have run for the last two years..

Again, remember how elated were the GOPers when Howard Dean was elected DNC chairman?
He too was considered a permanently damaged name and a scourge for independents and moderates.

If Bhoener flops (and he isn't exactly popular, even among Republicans), then Pelosi will look good by comparison in two years.

I was much harder on Dean for not ending the nomination sooner than I was on his appointment.

The thing with Bhoener is, he's not a "personality."  Pelosi, if by just being historic was;  The San Francisco Democrat label doesn't help, either.

[Mr. Morden]

Pelosi was a great Speaker, but this whole transition to minority power thing feels weird in the House ... Hoyer v. Clyburn? 

I have to wonder if there are any fresh faces and young talent in the Democratic caucus too.  Sure, the American people barely know who Pelosi is, so the whole idea of fresh faces is kinda funny, but I'm not really sure what the Democratic caucus is up to in the House.

Xavier Becerra, Chris Van Hollen, Debbie Wasserman Schultz, and others are basically waiting around for Pelosi, Hoyer, and Clyburn (who are all either 70 or 71 years old) to retire from the leadership.  They obviously don't think it's worth it to challenge them now.  They'll just wait around for the latter three people to step down, which'll probably happen in like four years or so anyway, given their age.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

According to the exit polls, she has an eight (as in "8" as in less than "9"... as in child molester territory) percent approval rating among independents.

8 percent.

If I was the GOP I would have 25 House members "switch" to the Dems just long enough to vote for Minority leader (and then switch back) just to make it happen.

This is the inequivalent of the GOP appointing Sarah Palin to be RNC chair (or similar act of political madness)

8%....?

Have the Dems lost their mind?

The GOP just keeps running the same plays they have run for the last two years..

Again, remember how elated were the GOPers when Howard Dean was elected DNC chairman?
He too was considered a permanently damaged name and a scourge for independents and moderates.

If Bhoener flops (and he isn't exactly popular, even among Republicans), then Pelosi will look good by comparison in two years.

Dean is probably and was in 2005 far more popular then Pelosi is now.

Pelosi is a lightning rod for swing voter discontent in House races, and will be only somewhat less so in 2012. Yes, she's done an admirable job getting legislation passed only to be stopped by GOP Senate filibusters, but would, say, Steny Hoyer, be any less effective as minority leader without being anathema to many voters?

I will say I have no desire to see Shuler as Leader--a third term back bencher from a dangerous district doesn't appeal--but I want an alternative to Pelosi. Yes, the Republicans will try to tar Steny Hoyer or any replacement the same way, but they've already succeeded with Pelosi, and it will be VERY difficult to do for a new minority leader. How many people outside the beltway, blogs and western Ohio gave a s#it who John Boehner was before Wednesday?

Bluntly put, Pelosi is a terminally damaged brand name. She needs to take one for the team and step down.

Its not that it will be "difficult" but that it will force them to have to take the time to successfully label a new leader. Pelosi was hit overwhingly hard in 2006 for being a San Fransiscan Liberal and the people rallied to her sending her numbers to 55%, now they are 8%. Her actions and time did what the GOP attacks in 2006 were supposed to do, but backfired. It takes more then one cycle, which would put the Dems in the clear in 2012 atleast from having that anvil on them.

Thats actually a great place to be in, really.

There are many things the GOP can do in the House to exceed expectations. Cutting Congressional pay would be a great first move. I hear Boehner is interested in that. Its not much but it does send a message that this congress and this new GOP gets it enough they if everyone else takes a pay cut they should as well. On its own its miniscule, but it is as I said a great start.

Cutting congressional pay? Good luck with that.
The problem is that besides symbolic votes about repealing HCR and extending Bush's tax cuts, the Republicans have absolutely no clue of what to do.
David Frum, Andrew Sullivan and other conservatives literally are begging Bhoener and Co. for a year now to present a serious plan about how they are going to reduce the deficit, to no avail.
Frum has gone even further saying that actually the GOP leadership will quickly drop any pretense about serious governing and will focus on passing the pet projects of Bhoener's lobbyist friends.

Unless of course by beating expectations you mean launching frivolous investigations, on things like Obama's trip to India, and trying to impeach him. 

Don't be ridiculous. Investigations will of course happen but thats not what will gain them any points. And no moves to impeach him will happen unless that find something that is undeniable and a case that is unassailable which I highly doubt will occur.

Frum is very wrong here and this is why. Boehner has already realized that he has to incorporate the RSC people from the 2000's into the leadership. Hence why both Pence had joined and now Hensarling will join, the leadership. We are also talking about a GOP that jumps when commanded to by Rush Limbaugh. The minute any Rep does something he doesn't like, they immediately seek to "correct" the record or whatever is necessary to please him. If Boehner takes the route described by Frum, I can guarrantee you he will be overthrown by GOPers scared to death about 100's of successful primary challenges in 2012.

That someone like Frum would fail to consider this fact is not surprising considering that he like other "insiders" think the tea party and Limbaugh are things that can be "ignored", "fixed", or will just go away like magic. I don't doubt the potential for Boehner to do just as he described if given the chance, however; I don't think that people like Cantor or Hensarling, Ryan, and McCarthy whose futures are tied to a newer more fiscally Conservative GOP would let their future get washed down the drain in insider sleeze. I think they will determine the direction indirectly more then Boehner will for if Boehner takes a wrong move, GOP civil war will ensue and Boehner's head will be the first to roll.

[Brittain33]

What was the approval rating for Congressional Republicans among Independents?

[Lunar]

According to the exit polls, she has an eight (as in "8" as in less than "9"... as in child molester territory) percent approval rating among independents.

8 percent.

If I was the GOP I would have 25 House members "switch" to the Dems just long enough to vote for Minority leader (and then switch back) just to make it happen.

This is the inequivalent of the GOP appointing Sarah Palin to be RNC chair (or similar act of political madness)

8%....?

Have the Dems lost their mind?

The GOP just keeps running the same plays they have run for the last two years..

http://www.latimes.com/news/politics/la-na-pelosi-20101024,0,6018872.story?track=rss&utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed:+latimes/news/politics+(L.A.+Times+-+Politics)

To me, the Nancy Pelosi argument is mostly an intellectual argument that matters to plugged-in moderates, conservatives, and such people, but not one that pushes elections this way or that in most cases.  Critz got hammered on Pelosi endlessly during his high-profile special, to little success.  I see RedState blogs ranting about how even the most conservative Democrats are supporting Pelosi with their first vote and how bad that is, and I'm really not sure how much it resonates ... she's not a gaffe machine that is in the news every day or anything that proactively creates problems.  She matters to some people, just like a piece of tier 2 legislation does, but she's also a phenom vote counter, not to mention a top female political leader (and looking at the 2010 exits, we both know the Democrats need to hold onto women voters).

I always have to wonder at how much of a bubble we truly are in if we think someone like John Boehner matters to an ordinary American.

[Chancellor Tanterterg]

Hoyer should run against Pelosi.  Not only do we need someone other than Pelosi, I get the sense that she's just trying to stay so that she can screw him out of the leadership.

[Landslide Lyndon]

Hoyer should run against Pelosi.  Not only do we need someone other than Pelosi, I get the sense that she's just trying to stay so that she can screw him out of the leadership.

Is that supposed to be a bad thing?

Dean is probably and was in 2005 far more popular then Pelosi is now.

Dean might not have been that "hated" but he was certainly presented successfully as a crazy clown, the liberal Christine O'Donnell of its day.
John McCain (then still a "moderate") said back then that his election was the biggest gift Democrats could make to Republicans and ensured their domination for the next years.

All this "Dean was popular, we never considered him an ultra-liberal" is revisionist history.

[Vepres]

Hoyer should run against Pelosi.  Not only do we need someone other than Pelosi, I get the sense that she's just trying to stay so that she can screw him out of the leadership.

Is that supposed to be a bad thing?

Dean is probably and was in 2005 far more popular then Pelosi is now.

Dean might not have been that "hated" but he was certainly presented successfully as a crazy clown, the liberal Christine O'Donnell of its day.
John McCain (then still a "moderate") said back then that his election was the biggest gift Democrats could make to Republicans and ensured their domination for the next years.

All this "Dean was popular, we never considered him an ultra-liberal" is revisionist history.

The chairman of a party doesn't have the profile of a Speaker.

[Landslide Lyndon]

Hoyer should run against Pelosi.  Not only do we need someone other than Pelosi, I get the sense that she's just trying to stay so that she can screw him out of the leadership.

Is that supposed to be a bad thing?

Dean is probably and was in 2005 far more popular then Pelosi is now.

Dean might not have been that "hated" but he was certainly presented successfully as a crazy clown, the liberal Christine O'Donnell of its day.
John McCain (then still a "moderate") said back then that his election was the biggest gift Democrats could make to Republicans and ensured their domination for the next years.

All this "Dean was popular, we never considered him an ultra-liberal" is revisionist history.

The chairman of a party doesn't have the profile of a Speaker.

[Vepres]

Hoyer should run against Pelosi.  Not only do we need someone other than Pelosi, I get the sense that she's just trying to stay so that she can screw him out of the leadership.

Is that supposed to be a bad thing?

Dean is probably and was in 2005 far more popular then Pelosi is now.

Dean might not have been that "hated" but he was certainly presented successfully as a crazy clown, the liberal Christine O'Donnell of its day.
John McCain (then still a "moderate") said back then that his election was the biggest gift Democrats could make to Republicans and ensured their domination for the next years.

All this "Dean was popular, we never considered him an ultra-liberal" is revisionist history.

The chairman of a party doesn't have the profile of a Speaker.

You think Steele actually had a very high profile? Sure, us political junkies knew him, but how often did pols on either side bring him up? How many times was he featured in an attack ad? How many non-political junkies would know who he was off the top of their heads?

[Holmes]

I love Pelosi. And she's really effective at what she does. That being said, she's damaged goods, I'm afraid. Republicans and Democrats have hammered on her too much that I don't think anyone's views about her will change.

[Landslide Lyndon]

You think Steele actually had a very high profile? Sure, us political junkies knew him, but how often did pols on either side bring him up? How many times was he featured in an attack ad? How many non-political junkies would know who he was off the top of their heads?

Well, he did a damn fine job embarrassing his party time and again until the powers that be sent him to Dick Cheney's undisclosed location.

[Sbane]

Pelosi should leave, mainly because she is damaged goods. Republicans were successful into making her into a boogeyman just based on where she lives. Yes the fact that she had passed all this legislation certainly helped, but she wouldn't be featured in so many ads if she was from Oshkosh. I hate how Republicans can go around attacking the cities of America (or letting one drown) but Democrats can't say sh**t about the assbackwards rural areas. Fukc that sh**t.

[J. J.]

Hoyer should run against Pelosi.  Not only do we need someone other than Pelosi, I get the sense that she's just trying to stay so that she can screw him out of the leadership.

Is that supposed to be a bad thing?

Dean is probably and was in 2005 far more popular then Pelosi is now.

Dean might not have been that "hated" but he was certainly presented successfully as a crazy clown, the liberal Christine O'Donnell of its day.
John McCain (then still a "moderate") said back then that his election was the biggest gift Democrats could make to Republicans and ensured their domination for the next years.

All this "Dean was popular, we never considered him an ultra-liberal" is revisionist history.

The only thing "crazy" was the "Dean scream."

[Sbane]

Hoyer should run against Pelosi.  Not only do we need someone other than Pelosi, I get the sense that she's just trying to stay so that she can screw him out of the leadership.

Is that supposed to be a bad thing?

Dean is probably and was in 2005 far more popular then Pelosi is now.

Dean might not have been that "hated" but he was certainly presented successfully as a crazy clown, the liberal Christine O'Donnell of its day.
John McCain (then still a "moderate") said back then that his election was the biggest gift Democrats could make to Republicans and ensured their domination for the next years.

All this "Dean was popular, we never considered him an ultra-liberal" is revisionist history.

The only thing "crazy" was the "Dean scream."

I don't know about that. I remember plenty of ads attacking him for being a "Vermont liberal" before the scream happened.

[redcommander]

Oh please please please Democrats keep Pelosi as minority leader. We already still have Reid to kick around.

[J. J.]

Hoyer should run against Pelosi.  Not only do we need someone other than Pelosi, I get the sense that she's just trying to stay so that she can screw him out of the leadership.

Is that supposed to be a bad thing?

Dean is probably and was in 2005 far more popular then Pelosi is now.

Dean might not have been that "hated" but he was certainly presented successfully as a crazy clown, the liberal Christine O'Donnell of its day.
John McCain (then still a "moderate") said back then that his election was the biggest gift Democrats could make to Republicans and ensured their domination for the next years.

All this "Dean was popular, we never considered him an ultra-liberal" is revisionist history.

The only thing "crazy" was the "Dean scream."

I don't know about that. I remember plenty of ads attacking him for being a "Vermont liberal" before the scream happened.

No there weren't.  Nobody outside of VT heard of him, and he wasn't chairman until later.