NY: Convicted Felon Donald Trump!

[Fmr. Gov. NickG]

It’s still unclear to me why Weisselberg couldn’t have just been forced to testify by granting him immunity.  Under this scenario, he’d be in contempt of court if he tried to avoid testifying.   It would have at least been good to have him on the witness stand to see his demeanor.

[Fmr. Gov. NickG]

Has any pollster asked how people's vote would be affected if Trump were actually in prison on Election Day?

[Fmr. Gov. NickG]

Also, it seems there was no last minute plea deal, as some had hypothesized during the trial.

So it looks like no plea deal or misdemeanor.

Hung jury or felony at this point, I would think. Acquittal seems the most unlikely.

Why not plea this to a misdemeanor? Sounds like a good compromise.

If Trump did this, wouldn’t he have to publicly allocute?

[Fmr. Gov. NickG]

Irrespective of the verdict, would it be fair to conclude at this point that the elitist pearl clutchers in the media and the legal profession who said this was a weak case based on a 'novel legal argument' were wrong?

I don’t feel like my concerns about the legal argument were really addressed at the trial much at all.

[Fmr. Gov. NickG]

The online right wing is erupting over a contention that the jury doesn't have to be unanimous to find Trump guilty, following a misleading tweet from Fox's John Roberts to that effect.  He later corrected it to confirm that they do have to be unanimous that Trump committed the crime of falsifying business records, but they don't have to be unanimous about which underlying crime it was in support of (which is what elevates it to a felony).  But it's too late, the damage is done.

The wording of that tweet & duration of time in between corrections…

https://twitter.com/johnrobertsfox/status/1795830647719932058https://twitter.com/johnrobertsfox/status/1795835934694650283https://twitter.com/johnrobertsfox/status/1795848224470700242
No doubt he knew exactly what he was doing!

Marco Rubio is now running with this. This will now be gospel on the MAGA right regardless for the truth.

Ok found out what's really going on here. New York law does not require that the jury be unanimous on the crime that was illegally covered up. The only have to be unanimous on if they thought there was an illegal cover up.

Yes.
Not sure if that will survive the eventual appeal to the SCOTUS.

This is only an issue now? Not the hundreds/thousands of criminals this law would have also effected?I guess they'll be rooting for the Supreme Court to overturn this so they can appeal their own cases. I thought conservatives were tough on crime.

Tough on real crime.

You can't selectively decided what is "real crime". There are people who think shoplifting from big box stores isn't a crime, but I don't see conservatives siding with that logic.

OK, but if this is true I don’t understand why adultery was not included as an underlying crime here, since it would be far easier to prove than any of the other included crimes.  And adultery is no less of a “real crime” in NYS than anything else he was charged with.

[Fmr. Gov. NickG]

Wonder if Trump is going to try and flee the country? If he thinks a guilty verdict is likely, no telling what he'll do. He has a plane after all

I think in the event of a guilty verdict and if Trump wanted to avoid the penalty, he could just stay in Florida. Ron DeSantis would never extradite him to New York.

How is he going to just stay in Florida if he wants to be elected President?

[Fmr. Gov. NickG]

Are to complete jury instructions posted online anywhere?

[Fmr. Gov. NickG]

Are to complete jury instructions posted online anywhere?

here:

The full instructions are here: https://www.nycourts.gov/LegacyPDFS/press/PDFs/People%20v.%20DJT%20Jury%20Instructions%20and%20Charges%20FINAL%205-23-24.pdf.  Merchan is re-reading pages 6 to 35 to the jury.

Thanks!

It’s bizarre to me that the jury can’t get a printed copy of the instructions.  Like, they can’t even get a print out of the actual elements of the crime they are asked to convict on? Instead, the judge literally repeats about a dozen pages of instruction verbatim just to help the jury remember (the sections starting on pp. 27 and 40).

Based on these instructions I think I might very well vote to convict Trump.  But I would also likely vote to overturn that conviction as an appellate court judge.

[Fmr. Gov. NickG]

Based on these instructions I think I might very well vote to convict Trump.  But I would also likely vote to overturn that conviction as an appellate court judge.

Based on…???

There are several interesting constitutional questions in the case.  But my biggest concerns lie in the vagueness and ambiguity in the criminal statute as applied in this case.  I think the statutes can be interpreted in multiple ways in several instances, and under the principle of lenity, ambiguity in criminal satutes should generally be resolved in favor of the defendant.

[Fmr. Gov. NickG]

So Trump as a convicted felon won't be able to vote for himself in Florida.

I read an article on this question about 2 weeks ago, and the conclusion is that Trump would only lose his voting rights if he were actually in prison.  Under FL law, out-of-state convictions only disenfranchise you if you would have lost your voting rights in the state where you were convicted. And NY only disenfranchises current prisoners.

[Fmr. Gov. NickG]

Where there is discretion in sentencing, I believe that the likelihood of recidivism is a legitimate and important factor.  And Trump has repeatedly shown through his public statements that he’s likely to attempt election interference again.  So wouldn’t it be a totally appropriate for Judge Marchan to impose a prison sentence during the campaign to make sure that Trump can’t interfere in it?

[Fmr. Gov. NickG]

I’m surprised that Bragg is permitted to not reveal his sentencing recommendation until the day of sentencing. I would have thought the defense would need time to prepare a response.

I feel like he has to seek serious jail time or else almost everyone on both sides will come to see this prosecution as pointless.

[Fmr. Gov. NickG]

It's been pretty discouraging how little discussion of this case there's been since the verdict.  Like, isn't the sentencing by far the most important part?

If Trump doesn't go to prison, it seems like this was all pretty pointless. But there are very compelling arguments that Trump should be immediately sentenced to prison that I don't see many people making.