Bernie Sanders 2020 campaign megathread v2 (pg 77 - declares victory in Iowa)

[Anti Democrat Democrat Club]

When they can't argue, they turn to personal attacks.

Yeah there may not actually be a secret conspiracy by Clinton forces to trash Sanders on CNN, but if you call GeneralMacarthur an idiot then you're safe and automatically right.

Irony!

[Anti Democrat Democrat Club]

https://twitter.com/AC360/status/1214360704905596930

What was this?

Our guy going on the offensive against Biden.

https://twitter.com/AC360/status/1214364356886040577

[Anti Democrat Democrat Club]

They haven't done that since 2018.  The group had zero endorsements in 2019 and has zero for 2020.

Ever since the midterms ended, the only thing they've been doing is helping Sanders become president.

[Anti Democrat Democrat Club]

Again: Candidate draws contrast between themselves and another candidate in an election. Film at 11.

[Anti Democrat Democrat Club]

The terminally online are now suggesting that Twitter ratios imply objective truth? That's just straight Orwellian folks.

Extremely hilarious to see Warren allow this story to go through. The Bernie dead-enders can blame CNN all they want, but clearly she could've killed this story if she wanted to, but didn't! Maybe she won't lose support to Mini Mike B and others if this becomes a compelling narrative.

Exciting stuff!

This is rich coming from the guy who recommends any anti-Bernie post that reaffirms his beliefs, regardless of truth. Even from luminaries like MissScarlett!

[Anti Democrat Democrat Club]

This whole spat reminds me of an incident in my Congressional primary in 2018. On the stage of a candidate forum, a high-profile female candidate claimed, on multiple occasions, that state party leadership told her not to run because she was a woman. She was, to the naked eye, running closely with a male, progressive candidate supported by the state party. For whatever reason, she made a bold claim of sexism from certain party leaders.

The only problem was that she was a carpetbagger. Obviously, party leadership told not to run because she only lived in the state for a few months before making her run, and someone actually rebuffed her on the debate stage. It later leaked that she explicitly moved to my district to run for Congress, further her political career, and the original plan was to try and primary a progressive leader in the state from the right.

This story reminds me exactly of that - a desperate, cynical, exploitation of real issues that women face for personal gain. A cursory scan of the record will show that not only Sanders thinks a woman can win the Presidency, but thought Warren herself could. It's a "he said, she said", but the "she said" part goes against everything that Bernie has said and done for the past 30 years. The only thing backing this up is the word of an anonymous staffer who wasn't there at the meeting, so I'll take the 30 years of consistency all day.

Say what you want about Hillary Clinton, but she'd never pull something like this. I believe the reason she blames Bernie is because she felt like he shouldn't have run, but she'd never fabricate an accusation of sexism. Even ****ing Kamala Harris, whose Twitter supporters are a who's who of the worst of the party, wouldn't do something like this. It's disappointing to see that one of my political heroes has turned into a pile of gutter trash who would do anything to get the nomination, and it's a ****ing joke that the media called Hillary sketchy while they gleefully amplify Warren's abject smear.

[Anti Democrat Democrat Club]

I am out of the loop about the Bernie Sanders and Elizabeth Warren conflict going on right now. Could someone please summarize to me what is going on between the two candidates and what the fuss is all about? Thank you in advance

Sanders supporters upset that Warren confirmed a report that Sanders told her privately in 2018 that a woman can’t win the presidency in 2020. It honestly might’ve just been a comment made in passing while they were discussing other topics.

Dave Weigel's theory is that he said something about how sexism would hurt her, which got twisted in "she shouldn't run". Remember the whole spat about how racism hurt Gillum's and Abrams' campaigns? Most people focused on the terribly-worded pivot and said it was evidence that Bernie was hand-waving racism.

[Anti Democrat Democrat Club]

Shadows did nothing wrong.

[Anti Democrat Democrat Club]

Warren has a long history of twisting reality to her advantage. It's no coincidence that this falsehood emerges in a moment of desperation. Only a fool would believe her.

She chose her ego over the movement. Now the movement is in serious, serious danger because of her betrayal.

[Anti Democrat Democrat Club]

If she thinks we'll forget this in a few years, she'll be in a rude ****ing awakening when AOC takes the stage.

[Anti Democrat Democrat Club]

Good God, Atlas is going nuts over this Warren-Bernie story.
And HockeyDude is having a conniption fit over it.
Why don't we all just wait to see how they handle the situation on stage tomorrow.

As he should (and every other Bernie supporter on here). The woman who has claimed to be fighting for us for 8 years betrayed us today. If there wasn't any doubt when she pushed Medicare for All to the second half of her term in favor of Petecare, there sure as hell wasn't any now.

[Anti Democrat Democrat Club]

It’s kinda ironic how the same Sanders supporters who ardently supported Christine Ford (which was a good thing) are now complaining about “suspect timing” and are calling Warren an opportunistic liar. Literally a year ago, the Republicans were saying these things about a different women.

"An accusation of sexism is equivalent to accusations of sexual assault"

[Anti Democrat Democrat Club]

It’s kinda ironic how the same Sanders supporters who ardently supported Christine Ford (which was a good thing) are now complaining about “suspect timing” and are calling Warren an opportunistic liar. Literally a year ago, the Republicans were saying these things about a different women.

"An accusation of sexism is equivalent to accusations of sexual assault"

*SNIP, modded*

It's a shame that after years of knowing me and my character, you'd stoop so low as to make such a vile accusation against me. I'd expect this from MacArthur, but I didn't expect this from you.

[Anti Democrat Democrat Club]

It’s kinda ironic how the same Sanders supporters who ardently supported Christine Ford (which was a good thing) are now complaining about “suspect timing” and are calling Warren an opportunistic liar. Literally a year ago, the Republicans were saying these things about a different women.

"An accusation of sexism is equivalent to accusations of sexual assault"

Somehow I think you would not be happy with Warren if she had accused Sanders of sexual assault.

It's a shame that after years of knowing me and my character, you'd stoop so low as to make such a vile accusation against me. I'd expect this from MacArthur, but I didn't expect this from you.

*SNIP*

Public, high-profile psychotic breakdown that gets me demodded: *crickets*

Calling out the candidate you like for her smears, a disagreement on the importance of someone saying a woman can't win an election: Proof of my mental instability, and it must mean that I approve of sexual assault if it's from someone I like.

Beet logic, ladies and gentlemen.

[Anti Democrat Democrat Club]

1. Yeah, I get that. Unfortunately, 2015 Sawx and 2020 Sawx are two different posters. There were always seeds of leftism, but the DNC radicalized me last cycle.

When you pour your heart out for the party and they decide they want your diehard Bushist/Romneyist friend more than you, you tend to hold a grudge. Especially when it's over a minor difference in the primary that you thought would have ended 4 years ago, and when you argued with said friend over the merits of Mitt Romney's campaign.

2. Private conversations and sexual assault are in no way comparable. I didn't think I needed to explain this.

[Anti Democrat Democrat Club]

https://twitter.com/JordanUhl/status/1216917511482085379

Inject this into my ****ing veins.

[Anti Democrat Democrat Club]

I'll take the word of Cuomo himself over some Internet randos:

https://twitter.com/ChrisCuomo/status/1216943515093098497?s=19

(Also I tend to go for primary sources when I can)

[Anti Democrat Democrat Club]

Bernie’s still my 2nd choice behind Warren, but Goddd do his online supporters make me really reconsider. They’re nuts.

 The fact he does nothing to condemn and distance himself from the toxicity of his worst supporters is also very Trump like.

Do you know what else is Trump-like? Lying about your close friend saying sexist **** for personal gain.

[Anti Democrat Democrat Club]

You forgot the 30 year record of saying literally everything else.

[Anti Democrat Democrat Club]

Warren launched this attack at this moment for a reason. She's attempting to destroy the movement because her campaign is floundering; it really is the most depressing thing. Stop the Warren apologetics. She has shown her true colours.

Bernie Sanders is not the progressive movement, he is one of many figures within it.  The same is true of Warren.  It's bigger than his (or Warren's) personal Presidential aspirations unless you believe it's just a Trump-style personality cult.  

This is no different than Bernie's negative phone-banking against other candidates.  We can debate the political merits of each approach, but this is simply two progressive candidates trying to win the nomination acting like candidates.  No more, no less.  Warren does not owe Bernie any sort of deference or fealty during the primary season nor does he owe her any.

Yes, yes he is. The progressive movement is much larger than Bernie. But the only person this helps is Biden.

Even if Warren's allegations are true, she looks bad because it's still a nakedly opportunistic leak of a private conversation. The timing and the gravity of the accusation makes it blatantly obvious that it was done for political gain. Moreover, the fact that she went as far as to violate his trust in response to a low-level FO's persuasion script makes her look very thin-skinned.

Bernie looks bad here for obvious reasons. Instead of Biden being held to the fire for literally lying about warmongering, the story leading up to the Iowa caucuses is a smear campaign. I guarantee you that history will share my viewpoint with regard to this story.

In short, Warren doesn't benefit from this. Bernie doesn't benefit from this. Literally everyone involved here loses but Joe Biden, who gets less of the spotlight shone on his record. You've even said yourself that the progressive movement is bigger than one person, whether it be Bernie or Warren. It's a shame she doesn't share our belief.

[Anti Democrat Democrat Club]

.
I will vote Bernie if it somehow turns into Trump vs Sanders in 2020, but I will vote GOP for any House/Senate race in 2022 if Bernie wins just to keep this guy (and more importantly, his followers, in check)

The mask comes off. You're no different from our garden-variety blue avatars.

[Anti Democrat Democrat Club]

.
I will vote Bernie if it somehow turns into Trump vs Sanders in 2020, but I will vote GOP for any House/Senate race in 2022 if Bernie wins just to keep this guy (and more importantly, his followers, in check)

The mask comes off. You're no different from our garden-variety blue avatars.

Because I don’t want a mad-cultist having control of the House and the Senate?
This isn’t even about policy, this is about the fact that I can’t, in good conscious, give this man more power. These are the same reasons I will never support Trump, no matter how good the economy is, or if he suddenly changes his positions.

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YOU LITERALLY SUPPORT MITCH MCCONNELL ARE YOU REALLY THIS DENSE

[Anti Democrat Democrat Club]

.
I will vote Bernie if it somehow turns into Trump vs Sanders in 2020, but I will vote GOP for any House/Senate race in 2022 if Bernie wins just to keep this guy (and more importantly, his followers, in check)

The mask comes off. You're no different from our garden-variety blue avatars.

Because I don’t want a mad-cultist having control of the House and the Senate?
This isn’t even about policy, this is about the fact that I can’t, in good conscious, give this man more power. These are the same reasons I will never support Trump, no matter how good the economy is, or if he suddenly changes his positions.

I can understand seeing the personality-driven support around Sanders as similar to Trump's, but in the end Sanders still promotes the better ideas and policy for the country. Furthermore, to want to impede a potential President Sanders with a GOP controlled Congress is only being as self-defeating as you see Sanders' persona as. You're ignoring how diverse the Democratic Party actually is ideologically, especially down-ballot. It doesn't sound like you genuinely care about progress and pursuing what's right if you can't get past your spite for Sanders. And that goes for any Democrat, left-leaner, or Trump/GOP opponent with any candidate.

Oh, absolutely. The guy should be treated like the traitor he is. He may not be supporting Trump, but McConnell is as dangerous as Trump and done as much damage to our democracy (if not more). The fact that he hates Bernie so much he'd be willing to give him a third chance is deeply, deeply disturbing.

[Anti Democrat Democrat Club]

Anyone saying they would support Trump over Sanders, or vote third party, while claiming to care about liberal values and progress in this country, is being over-emotional.  I hope that over-emotionality won't carry over to the ballot box.

I think the most-likely scenario for a Sanders presidency is another Carter administration.  Carter was dogged in his centrism (actually centrism, folks, not "Biden is a centrist" when he's a solid blue liberal) and constantly picked fights with Ted Kennedy instead of being able to compromise.  As a result, nothing got done, the country declined, and Ted Kennedy primaried Carter in 1980.

But let me present you with an alternative scenario.  Trump is in control of the White House in 1976-1980, and his sole goal is to burn down the accomplishments of his predecessors (like it is with Obama).  He tears up the Nixon/Kissinger China roadmap, endorses human rights atrocities across the globe, threatens to go back into Vietnam, escalates the nuclear conflict with the Soviet Union by calling Brezhnev a "weak little bitch" on Twitter, fails at containing stagflation because he has no idea how the economy works, fails to prevent escalating hostilities between Israel and the Arab world leading to another war in the levant, and sends U.S. troops to Iran in response to the hostage crisis.  And that's not even getting started on supreme court appointments, which Carter didn't have to deal with.

In one of these scenarios, you have gridlock, an embarrassing leader and political turmoil for the Democratic Party.  In the other, you have a clueless madman in control of the country, doing everything he can to f**k s**t up.  I don't know about you but I'd rather nothing get done than bad things get done.  I'd rather watch Sanders run into a brick wall of reality trying to pass M4A than watch Trump repeal protections for pre-existing conditions.  I'd rather watch Sanders stumble around cluelessly on the world stage than watch Trump threaten to nuke North Korea because Kim Jong Un said he had a small penis on Twitter.  And I'd certainly rather have Sanders appoint RBG's replacement than have Trump put Amy Coney Barrett in there and overturn Roe v Wade.

If you are a liberal Democrat, it is your responsibility to grit your teeth and vote for Sanders in 2020, in the disastrous event that he is actually at the top of our ticket.  The threat Trump imposes on this country is too great to let your desire to be morally pure take the high ground.

Good man. You're far more respectable than MissScarlett or Forumlurker (who has pledged to support McConnell if Bernie wins).

[Anti Democrat Democrat Club]

I believe your colleague from Washington has already said he'll do the same. Lord knows this Warren spat gives me a hell of a lot more appreciation for Biden. At the end of the day, he's a good man, and that's a hell of a lot more I can say about him than Warren.