Official West Virginia Democratic Primary Discussion Thread...

[Flying Dog]

Monogolia county 48-47 Clinton

[War on Want]

Why would people throw away their vote on a candidate who is NOT RUNNING!!?!?!?!?!!

Because they dislike the other two? If you still support Obama though this is a good thing....

Its funny.  I support Barack Obama AND John McCain.  I can't make up my mind between the two.  At this point, I'm more inclined to vote for Obama, though that can easily change.

Why the heck would you consider John McCain, when he supports the Iraq War, will do nothing for the Working class, and isn't a strong Social Conservative? The only good thing about him is that he is for doing something about Global Warming.

[exopolitician]

Olberman is being pretty obnoxious with this whole "we are awaiting to hear from Hillary Clinton give the most AMAZING speech known to mankind and earth and stuff...."

[Filuwaúrdjan]

Monogolia county 48-47 Clinton

Only about a tenth in. Depending on where that tenth is...

[Joe Biden 2020]

Why would people throw away their vote on a candidate who is NOT RUNNING!!?!?!?!?!!

Because they dislike the other two? If you still support Obama though this is a good thing....

Its funny.  I support Barack Obama AND John McCain.  I can't make up my mind between the two.  At this point, I'm more inclined to vote for Obama, though that can easily change.

Why the heck would you consider John McCain, when he supports the Iraq War, will do nothing for the Working class, and isn't a strong Social Conservative? The only good thing about him is that he is for doing something about Global Warming.

Because he would appoint moderate to conservative judges (probably moderate due to a heavily Democratic Senate), but more importantly would provide a check on a growing Democratic Congress.

[Eraserhead]

Where can I get results that actually show the Edwards votes coming in?

[War on Want]

Why would people throw away their vote on a candidate who is NOT RUNNING!!?!?!?!?!!

Because they dislike the other two? If you still support Obama though this is a good thing....

Its funny.  I support Barack Obama AND John McCain.  I can't make up my mind between the two.  At this point, I'm more inclined to vote for Obama, though that can easily change.

Why the heck would you consider John McCain, when he supports the Iraq War, will do nothing for the Working class, and isn't a strong Social Conservative? The only good thing about him is that he is for doing something about Global Warming.

Because he would appoint moderate to conservative judges (probably moderate due to a heavily Democratic Senate), but more importantly would provide a check on a growing Democratic Congress.

Wouldn't no checks on a Democratic Congress be better for reform for the Working Class, and Leftism?

[Daniel Adams]

Where can I get results that actually show the Edwards votes coming in?

Here for state-level results. This page shows results by county, but is less user-friendly.

[Joe Biden 2020]

Why would people throw away their vote on a candidate who is NOT RUNNING!!?!?!?!?!!

Because they dislike the other two? If you still support Obama though this is a good thing....

Its funny.  I support Barack Obama AND John McCain.  I can't make up my mind between the two.  At this point, I'm more inclined to vote for Obama, though that can easily change.

Why the heck would you consider John McCain, when he supports the Iraq War, will do nothing for the Working class, and isn't a strong Social Conservative? The only good thing about him is that he is for doing something about Global Warming.

Because he would appoint moderate to conservative judges (probably moderate due to a heavily Democratic Senate), but more importantly would provide a check on a growing Democratic Congress.

Wouldn't no checks on a Democratic Congress be better for reform for the Working Class, and Leftism?

You've got to realize, I'm not a leftist.  I am a conservative Democrat.  I like Obama because he would bring change and would turn this economy around, but I also think McCain could do that, as well.  The main thing I agree with Obama on is getting out of Iraq.  I agree with McCain on a lot of other things.

Like I said, I'm still trying to figure out who I like.

[Beet]

Formally the DNC didn't give them a pass until December, but informally, both states had consulted with Dean before making their moves and it was widely understood that they'd be given the pass. Florida was the first to make a move on May 3, and, in order to forestall a chaotic rush, the Rules Committee decided to set an example with Florida.

When Michigan followed in August, they had no choice but to do the same. New Hampshire's constitution requires that its primary be at least one week before any other primary. Therefore they legally had no choice but to move 1 week prior to Michigan to Jan. 8. After consultations with the DNC both NH and IA were allowed to move.

I used to think Dean behaved unfairly, but now I'm not so sure. Which state moved first-- New Hampshire or Michigan?

You have something of a point in the case of Iowa.  But with NH, they said from day 1 that they were going to violate the DNC calendar, as they would never agree to voting after Nevada.  True, they didn't formally select their date until after Michigan did, but they said many times before that that they were going to vote earlier than Jan. 22nd, no matter what the DNC said.  In fact, Michigan used this to justify their own actions.  They said "Well, NH says they're going to break the rules, so why shouldn't we?"

Go reread this thread, in which you agreed with me on this point:

https://uselectionatlas.org/FORUM/index.php?topic=72920.30

Yeah, but that was before I knew about the waivers. Reading Jake's post again, I'm not sure how New Hampshire had committed to violating the rules before the Michigan move. All I could find is quotes indicating that they would caveat themselves from abiding by the rules if other states moved their primaries to within 1 week of theirs. In short, they had agreed only conditionally:

You must be logged in to read this quote.

So I guess I'm still unclear on the Michigan excuse. It seems they were saying "We'll go ahead and break the rules because New Hampshire has caveated themselves from following them in the case that following them becomes contradictory to their preestablished state law... which only happens if we move to Jan. 15" Seems like a narrow reed to hang your move on, but perhaps there's more that I'm unaware of.

[Eraserhead]

Where can I get results that actually show the Edwards votes coming in?

Here for state-level results. This page shows results by county, but is less user-friendly.

Thanks.

[Sam Spade]

Randolph County @ 74% now looks normal.

[Flying Dog]

What's with Cabell?

[War on Want]

Why would people throw away their vote on a candidate who is NOT RUNNING!!?!?!?!?!!

Because they dislike the other two? If you still support Obama though this is a good thing....

Its funny.  I support Barack Obama AND John McCain.  I can't make up my mind between the two.  At this point, I'm more inclined to vote for Obama, though that can easily change.

Why the heck would you consider John McCain, when he supports the Iraq War, will do nothing for the Working class, and isn't a strong Social Conservative? The only good thing about him is that he is for doing something about Global Warming.

Because he would appoint moderate to conservative judges (probably moderate due to a heavily Democratic Senate), but more importantly would provide a check on a growing Democratic Congress.

Wouldn't no checks on a Democratic Congress be better for reform for the Working Class, and Leftism?

You've got to realize, I'm not a leftist.  I am a conservative Democrat.  I like Obama because he would bring change and would turn this economy around, but I also think McCain could do that, as well.  The main thing I agree with Obama on is getting out of Iraq.  I agree with McCain on a lot of other things.

Like I said, I'm still trying to figure out who I like.

Really? I understand you are a conservative Democrat, but you seem pretty leftist on Economics issues and what counts? Would McCain really turn around the Economy anyways, when he proposes the same old Republican rhetoric?

[Joe Biden 2020]

Why would people throw away their vote on a candidate who is NOT RUNNING!!?!?!?!?!!

Because they dislike the other two? If you still support Obama though this is a good thing....

Its funny.  I support Barack Obama AND John McCain.  I can't make up my mind between the two.  At this point, I'm more inclined to vote for Obama, though that can easily change.

Why the heck would you consider John McCain, when he supports the Iraq War, will do nothing for the Working class, and isn't a strong Social Conservative? The only good thing about him is that he is for doing something about Global Warming.

Because he would appoint moderate to conservative judges (probably moderate due to a heavily Democratic Senate), but more importantly would provide a check on a growing Democratic Congress.

Wouldn't no checks on a Democratic Congress be better for reform for the Working Class, and Leftism?

You've got to realize, I'm not a leftist.  I am a conservative Democrat.  I like Obama because he would bring change and would turn this economy around, but I also think McCain could do that, as well.  The main thing I agree with Obama on is getting out of Iraq.  I agree with McCain on a lot of other things.

Like I said, I'm still trying to figure out who I like.

Really? I understand you are a conservative Democrat, but you seem pretty leftist on Economics issues and what counts? Would McCain really turn around the Economy anyways, when he proposes the same old Republican rhetoric?

Okay... Fair argument.  You're right, I am pretty left on the economy.  I guess I'm torn between by liberal economics (Obama) and conservative social issues (McCain).  I generally tilt toward my economics, thus is why I am leaning toward Obama right now.  Its because of my conservative social stances why I would be happy with a McCain administration.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

What's with Cabell?

Not got the results in front of me (about to go to be), but Cabell is basically Huntington and surrounds. By WV standards it's a fairly white collar city and has a large student population. No idea if that's any help.

[Flying Dog]

What's with Cabell?

Not got the results in front of me (about to go to be), but Cabell is basically Huntington and surrounds. By WV standards it's a fairly white collar city and has a large student population. No idea if that's any help.

Quite a bit. Thanks.

[Democratic Hawk]

Why would people throw away their vote on a candidate who is NOT RUNNING!!?!?!?!?!!

Because they dislike the other two? If you still support Obama though this is a good thing....

Its funny.  I support Barack Obama AND John McCain.  I can't make up my mind between the two.  At this point, I'm more inclined to vote for Obama, though that can easily change.

Why the heck would you consider John McCain, when he supports the Iraq War, will do nothing for the Working class, and isn't a strong Social Conservative? The only good thing about him is that he is for doing something about Global Warming.

Because he would appoint moderate to conservative judges (probably moderate due to a heavily Democratic Senate), but more importantly would provide a check on a growing Democratic Congress.

My preference would be for a President Obama together an increasingly influential Blue Dog presence in the House. Senators will vote with their consciences on judicial appointees

Congressional Democrats may well serve to be a stronger check on Obama than those servile Republicans ever were on Bush

Dave

[Mr. Morden]

So I guess I'm still unclear on the Michigan excuse. It seems they were saying "We'll go ahead and break the rules because New Hampshire has caveated themselves from following them in the case that following them becomes contradictory to their preestablished state law... which only happens if we move to Jan. 15" Seems like a narrow reed to hang your move on, but perhaps there's more that I'm unaware of.

No, NH moving up their primary and breaking the rules wasn't dependent on Michigan moving to Jan. 15th.  They repeatedly said they were going to do that anyway, because they wouldn't accept voting after Nevada, as the DNC rules required:

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,250502,00.html

You must be logged in to read this quote.

That was way back in February 2007.

[Joe Biden 2020]

Why would people throw away their vote on a candidate who is NOT RUNNING!!?!?!?!?!!

Because they dislike the other two? If you still support Obama though this is a good thing....

Its funny.  I support Barack Obama AND John McCain.  I can't make up my mind between the two.  At this point, I'm more inclined to vote for Obama, though that can easily change.

Why the heck would you consider John McCain, when he supports the Iraq War, will do nothing for the Working class, and isn't a strong Social Conservative? The only good thing about him is that he is for doing something about Global Warming.

Because he would appoint moderate to conservative judges (probably moderate due to a heavily Democratic Senate), but more importantly would provide a check on a growing Democratic Congress.

My preference would be for a President Obama together an increasingly influential Blue Dog presence in the House. Senators will vote with their consciences on judicial appointees

Congressional Democrats may well serve to be a stronger check on Obama than those servile Republicans ever were on Bush

Dave

Good points.  I always like your analysis of things, Dave.

[War on Want]

Why would people throw away their vote on a candidate who is NOT RUNNING!!?!?!?!?!!

Because they dislike the other two? If you still support Obama though this is a good thing....

Its funny.  I support Barack Obama AND John McCain.  I can't make up my mind between the two.  At this point, I'm more inclined to vote for Obama, though that can easily change.

Why the heck would you consider John McCain, when he supports the Iraq War, will do nothing for the Working class, and isn't a strong Social Conservative? The only good thing about him is that he is for doing something about Global Warming.

Because he would appoint moderate to conservative judges (probably moderate due to a heavily Democratic Senate), but more importantly would provide a check on a growing Democratic Congress.

My preference would be for a President Obama together an increasingly influential Blue Dog presence in the House. Senators will vote with their consciences on judicial appointees

Congressional Democrats may well serve to be a stronger check on Obama than those servile Republicans ever were on Bush

Dave

Good points.  I always like your analysis of things, Dave.

I was going to say the same thing, but I figured that someone else would say it. The Democratic Party is more of a regional party anyways, and most of the new Democrats elected will be either Blue Dogs, or DLCer's to hold Obama in check.

[Joe Biden 2020]

Why would people throw away their vote on a candidate who is NOT RUNNING!!?!?!?!?!!

Because they dislike the other two? If you still support Obama though this is a good thing....

Its funny.  I support Barack Obama AND John McCain.  I can't make up my mind between the two.  At this point, I'm more inclined to vote for Obama, though that can easily change.

Why the heck would you consider John McCain, when he supports the Iraq War, will do nothing for the Working class, and isn't a strong Social Conservative? The only good thing about him is that he is for doing something about Global Warming.

Because he would appoint moderate to conservative judges (probably moderate due to a heavily Democratic Senate), but more importantly would provide a check on a growing Democratic Congress.

My preference would be for a President Obama together an increasingly influential Blue Dog presence in the House. Senators will vote with their consciences on judicial appointees

Congressional Democrats may well serve to be a stronger check on Obama than those servile Republicans ever were on Bush

Dave

Good points.  I always like your analysis of things, Dave.

I was going to say the same thing, but I figured that someone else would say it. The Democratic Party is more of a regional party anyways, and most of the new Democrats elected will be either Blue Dogs, or DLCer's to hold Obama in check.

Now, I hadn't thought of that aspect of it.  But, you're right, looking at the vulnerable seats ready to flip to the Democrats that they do look more Blue-Doggish and DLC'ish.

[Sam Spade]

Cabell is now at 60-35 Hillary with 28%.

Logan is about where I expected it.

[Joe Biden 2020]

So far, Clinton has claimed 15 delegates compared to Obama's 3 delegates in West Virginia tonight.  The count now stands at 1,877 for Obama (148 shy of nom) and 1,712 for Clinton (165 shy of Obama).  There are 10 pledged delegates left up for grabs in West Virginia and the current count with 23% in stands at 63-30 for Hillary Clinton.  That's basically a 2-1 margin, so I'm thinking that Hillary will get 18-20 delegates total and Obama will pick up 8-10 total, giving Hillary a 10-12 net delegate pick-up.

Kentucky and Oregon...  Here we come...

[Democratic Hawk]

So absolutely no chance whatsoever of Obama winning a single county then?

Dave