Israel-Gaza war

[Stand With Israel. Crush Hamas]

Is this ISIS?

No, it is the IDF.

This is bog-standard war tactics when taking prisoners - especially prisoners from an army known to use suicide bombings as a tactic.

They're captured, thoroughly searched, and now they're prisoners of war. In the case of active Hamas agents (which most of these are), it's more than they deserve.

[pppolitics]

Is this ISIS?

No, it is the IDF.

This is bog-standard war tactics when taking prisoners - especially prisoners from an army known to use suicide bombings as a tactic.

They're captured, thoroughly searched, and now they're prisoners of war. In the case of active Hamas agents (which most of these are), it's more than they deserve.

Really?

When did the US military do this?

[Blue3]

You know they're mostly Hamas... how?

And you justify them sitting naked and blindfolded in the desert, after being searched... because?

[Stand With Israel. Crush Hamas]

Is this ISIS?

No, it is the IDF.

This is bog-standard war tactics when taking prisoners - especially prisoners from an army known to use suicide bombings as a tactic.

They're captured, thoroughly searched, and now they're prisoners of war. In the case of active Hamas agents (which most of these are), it's more than they deserve.

Really?

When did the US military do this?

Probably a few hundred times when they captured ISIS agents. Those wars weren't documented nearly as closely, nor were they constantly scrutinized by bad-faith actors looking to incite antisemitism.

[pppolitics]

Is this ISIS?

No, it is the IDF.

This is bog-standard war tactics when taking prisoners - especially prisoners from an army known to use suicide bombings as a tactic.

They're captured, thoroughly searched, and now they're prisoners of war. In the case of active Hamas agents (which most of these are), it's more than they deserve.

Really?

When did the US military do this?

Probably a few hundred times when they captured ISIS agents. Those wars weren't documented nearly as closely, nor were they constantly scrutinized by bad-faith actors looking to incite antisemitism.

There are none. You are bullsh**tting.

[Stand With Israel. Crush Hamas]

You know they're mostly Hamas... how?

And you justify them sitting naked and blindfolded in the desert, after being searched... because?

They're not naked. Look closely and you can see their skivvies.

And they're mostly Hamas because that's...who Israel is fighting in Gaza. Are you under the impression that they're going around Gaza and taking random prisoners for giggles? That seems like a spectacularly bad waste of resources during an ongoing war.

[Vosem]

Is this ISIS?

No, it is the IDF.

This is bog-standard war tactics when taking prisoners - especially prisoners from an army known to use suicide bombings as a tactic.

They're captured, thoroughly searched, and now they're prisoners of war. In the case of active Hamas agents (which most of these are), it's more than they deserve.

Really?

When did the US military do this?

More times than anyone can count. Funny question to ask on the anniversary of Pearl Harbor, actually.

Do you think I should make your image my signature too? This is exactly the behavior I've been calling for from Hamas to end the war, so it's good to see it happening.

[dead0man]

it is hard to tell the difference between ISIS and Hamas*, but only a racist (or possible stupid/ignorant, but probably a racist too) would confuse them with the the IDF




*Hamas has a better PR department is the only difference I see

[pppolitics]

Is this ISIS?

No, it is the IDF.

This is bog-standard war tactics when taking prisoners - especially prisoners from an army known to use suicide bombings as a tactic.

They're captured, thoroughly searched, and now they're prisoners of war. In the case of active Hamas agents (which most of these are), it's more than they deserve.

Really?

When did the US military do this?

More times than anyone can count. Funny question to ask on the anniversary of Pearl Harbor, actually.

Do you think I should make your image my signature too? This is exactly the behavior I've been calling for from Hamas to end the war, so it's good to see it happening.

They were not stripped naked and blindfolded.

How stupid do you think other users are to have not noticed this?

[dead0man]

the dude's ass is hanging out inches above your words and the terrorists in your sig are not naked

[pppolitics]

the dude's ass is hanging out inches above your words and the terrorists in your sig are not naked

Fine. They are almost naked.

[Isaak]

Is this ISIS?

No, it's the IDF (Israel Defence Forces).

Seriously, what is wrong with you? This is a million times better than these terrorists deserve. They were not nearly as humane when they barbarically slaughtered dozens of IDF soldiers on October 7.

[Meclazine for Israel]

the dude's ass is hanging out inches above your words and the terrorists in your sig are not naked

I am not touching that comment.

[pppolitics]

Is this ISIS?

No, it's the IDF (Israel Defence Forces).

Seriously, what is wrong with you? This is a million times better than these terrorists deserve. They were not nearly as humane when they barbarically slaughtered dozens of IDF soldiers on October 7.

Since you are from Germany, maybe you see some resemblances to the 1940s.

https://twitter.com/ShaykhSulaiman/status/1732914534036164852

[dead0man]

yes, we know the idiots you follow don't understand why this is such a stupid "gotcha" either.

[NOVA Green]

Regardless, for me the biggest question is why the international community is not doing more to force a change to Israeli military tactics, which have effectively left huge chunks of Gaza virtually depopulated and uninhabitable.

Because the standard of care that Israel has shown is much higher than the normal one, and no country wants to set the precedent that they cannot defend themselves in more-or-less the manner that Israel is doing now (really a more aggressive manner).

Anyway, good to see some of the first mass surrenders today. Hopefully this will happen to the remaining militant groups in Gaza as well, followed ultimately by Doha and New York.

Regardless of the whole subsequent conversation on this thread regarding the treatment of PP /POWs when it comes stripping prisoners and all that, including photos posted from the IDF, which quite possibly might be in violation of "International Law" when it comes to such matters...

Back to the original point you quoted me on, which was carefully and selectively edited (Nice Job there!), I have some questions about the whole Because the standard of care that Israel has shown is much higher than the normal one deal.

As an American who has witnesses as an adult US Military actions in Gulf War 1.0, US in Afghanistan after 9/11, and Invasion and Occupation of Iraq, I am really curious what you mean by that statement.

I have consistently condemned the US bombing campaign against Iraq during the Gulf War, where US missiles and jets destroyed civilian infrastructure, which may well have led to 250k Iraqi Civilians dead as a direct result of that War.

US "targeted assassinations" and drone strikes against the Taliban in Afghanistan led to 10,000s civilian deaths, where US service members in bases throughout the region were authorizing "kill shots" like it was some kind of video game, and US taxpayers had to pay "Blood Money" to the relatives of the innocents slain.

The American Invasion and Occupation of Iraq let directly to the deaths of tens of thousands of innocent civilians, despite much more precise targeting capabilities.

I am not holding Israel to any higher standard than I hold my own Government, when it comes to the direct or indirect deaths of civilians.

So not quite sure what industrialized democracy in the Modern Era you are referring to when it comes to "Much Higher than the normal one", but in my mind the only comparison would be America in which we really effed it up, and effectively turned Iraq into an Iranian proxy State.

Even the US / Iraqi Gvt / militia assault against ISIS in Mosul, as well the US Military siege of Falluja had much more restraint when it came to civilians than what we are currently witnessing in Gaza.

Respect you Vosem, as an individual who has no shortage of words, please explain your concept of "military standard of care", since your argument appears to be extremely confusing at best and deceptive at worst.

[Silent Hunter]

Stripping prisoners to ensure they're not hiding weapons is acceptable. Exposing them like this without at least blurring their faces is arguably a violation of Article 13 and Article 14 of the Third Geneva Convention.

[Ⓐnarchy in the ☭☭☭P!]

It's amazing what you can get people to justify with the thinnest of pretenses.

These are not young Hamas fighters, these are old men kidnapped from their families for a humiliating photo op. One was even identified as a journalist, the IDF's target of choice excluding ambulances, schools and hospitals.

https://twitter.com/Dima_Khatib/status/1732797311846064541

They call them terrorists because they know that's all they need to say for bigoted half-wit Westerners to concoct justifications for anything they do. Though going full Abu Ghraib is a fantastic strategy if the goal is to create terrorists.

Also, setting the moral standard for war at "anything the Allies did in WW2 at some point" is absolutely deranged. The US and Canada forcibly abducted Japanese (sometimes just Japanese-looking) citizens, seized their property and sent them to internment camps. Are we going to treat that as an acceptable policy in 2023? Is any army less brutal than the Red Army as it tore through East Prussia a model of restraint?

Frankly, it says a lot about the lack of restraint that you have to have for WW2 to be the only modern conflict you can draw any comparison with. It's already surpassed Grozny, are we going to call that an example of a humane military operation?

https://twitter.com/triofrancos/status/1732394578836390007

[Coldstream]

“I’m not an anti-Semite I just think we were too hard on the Nazis and Israel are doing the same thing”

[pppolitics]

“I’m not an anti-Semite I just think we were too hard on the Nazis and Israel are doing the same thing”

Who said that?

[GMantis]

Why should maintaining a Jewish majority even be a factor? Nobody cared about maintaining a white majority in Rhodesia or South Africa. Israel should be held to the exact same standard.

Israel is not a colony. Israel is a nation run by its indigenous people. You will never disperse or overrun them again.

The Palestinians are indigenous to the area but were forced out by Israeli settlers during Nakba.

the Palestinian identity is a 20th century construct and a lot of modern day Palestinians are descended from people that migrated to the area in the late 19th and early 20th century, the development created by Jewish pioneers ironically contributed to that.

The first claim is completely irrelevant - it doesn't matter whether there was a specific Palestinian identity, the people living there still were indigenous. The second is an outright lie - there is no evidence of any significant Arab emigration to Palestine in this period. It's telling that Israeli propaganda has to resort to such preposterous arguments to deny the rights of the Palestinians.

[Lief 🗽]

The Hamas fighters deserve to be put down like the animals they are. Israel once again goes out of its way to respect the rules of war (something that none of their enemies have EVER done) but it’s still not enough for the antisemites.

[GALeftist]

It is interesting to me that Israel's war in Gaza is only ever defended in the most general possible terms ("they should be allowed to do this and here's why") and never actually compared to any battles that have taken place in the real world, such as Raqqa or Mosul. At least Vosem has the guts to state plainly that he believes it's OK to sacrifice Palestinian children on the altar of a faster war with fewer IDF casualties. All the other apologists ITT seem to leave this natural and inevitable conclusion of their logic unstated. Cowardly imo.

[certified hummus supporter 🇵🇸🤝🇺🇸🤝🇺🇦]

-Snip-

Seriously, what is wrong with you? This is a million times better than these terrorists deserve. They were not nearly as humane when they barbarically slaughtered dozens of IDF soldiers on October 7.

"Yeah Hamas did something bad, but let's make up an excuse why Israel doing something bad is alright because... reasons..."

[Kahane's Grave Is A Gender-Neutral Bathroom]

Fundamentally, I think there are three (not all mutually exclusive) possibilities to explain why Biden isn't breaking harder from Israel than he actually is.

1. He thinks American aid to Israel gives the US vitally-needed leverage to moderate Israel's conduct, to force Netanyahu to a peace table eventually, or to force him out of the PM's seat entirely.

2. He would like to distance himself from Israel but thinks that it would be politically suicidal, whether in terms of opinion within the Democratic Party or the views of Americans in general.

3. He genuinely thinks supporting Israel is the right thing to do morally-he may oppose certain actions of theirs but in general will be behind Israel to the end. There's lots of evidence that points to this.

I don't know which of these is more prominent in his decision-making (I do think they're probably all there to some extent), but a Biden policy on Israel led more by the first of these would probably end up looking pretty different from one guided by the third one, which is closest to what we have now. A first option-led policy would look more like either Bernie or Fetterman.