Israel-Gaza war

[President Punxsutawney Phil]

And the Palestinians are hardly unique in not giving up their struggle for self-determination. How many people under colonial rule - because this is what Israel's rule in Palestine amounts to in practice - have given up the struggle for independence? So while one can certainly deplore Palestinian terrorism, it's preposterous to claim the Palestinians are somehow sick for not giving up their desire for self-determination.

Palestinians don’t have to give up their struggle for independence, they need to accept that they lost in 1948 and that they will not get that land back ever. If Palestinians limited their terrorism to West Bank settlers and soldiers only with the clear demand that “terrorism will only stop when you leave the West Bank” that would be one thing. But the Palestinian demand is that Israel stops existing. They need to accept that they lost in 1948 and this will not be corrected in any way. Imagine if the Algerians demanded not just that the French leave Algeria but that they also leave France. That is what Palestinians demand, and they use terrorism to pursue this fundamentally impossible goal.

Palestinians should be given Israeli citizenship as part of the amended Law of Return.

The whole point of Israel having a Jewish majority is so the country is a safe haven for Jews. If you let Palestinians become the majority, they will slaughter millions of Jews if Hamas’ behavior is any example so far. Now I know you don’t really care about what happens but a lot of people do.

Aren't Jewish birthrates in Israel now higher than Palestinian birthrates in the West Bank? I'm not at all sure Jews would be a minority under that system.

I know the Jewish-Israeli birthrate has been higher than the Arab-Israeli birthrate for a few years now.

At this point, the West Bank has more Jews (in % terms) than 1967 borders Israel has Arabs.
It's one factor in why I don't believe in a two-state solution anymore.

[Stand With Israel. Crush Hamas]

And the Palestinians are hardly unique in not giving up their struggle for self-determination. How many people under colonial rule - because this is what Israel's rule in Palestine amounts to in practice - have given up the struggle for independence? So while one can certainly deplore Palestinian terrorism, it's preposterous to claim the Palestinians are somehow sick for not giving up their desire for self-determination.

Palestinians don’t have to give up their struggle for independence, they need to accept that they lost in 1948 and that they will not get that land back ever. If Palestinians limited their terrorism to West Bank settlers and soldiers only with the clear demand that “terrorism will only stop when you leave the West Bank” that would be one thing. But the Palestinian demand is that Israel stops existing. They need to accept that they lost in 1948 and this will not be corrected in any way. Imagine if the Algerians demanded not just that the French leave Algeria but that they also leave France. That is what Palestinians demand, and they use terrorism to pursue this fundamentally impossible goal.

Palestinians should be given Israeli citizenship as part of the amended Law of Return.

The whole point of Israel having a Jewish majority is so the country is a safe haven for Jews. If you let Palestinians become the majority, they will slaughter millions of Jews if Hamas’ behavior is any example so far. Now I know you don’t really care about what happens but a lot of people do.

The Israeli solution to this has been to institute an apartheid system inside the West Bank. Amazing how most Biden supporters on here seem to brush that aside.

The Gantz policy on the West Bank will likely be very different than the Netanyahu policy. The Gaza policy will not be, as the obliteration of Hamas is no longer a topic anyone to the right of Meretz will ever compromise on.

[Vosem]

And the Palestinians are hardly unique in not giving up their struggle for self-determination. How many people under colonial rule - because this is what Israel's rule in Palestine amounts to in practice - have given up the struggle for independence? So while one can certainly deplore Palestinian terrorism, it's preposterous to claim the Palestinians are somehow sick for not giving up their desire for self-determination.

Palestinians don’t have to give up their struggle for independence, they need to accept that they lost in 1948 and that they will not get that land back ever. If Palestinians limited their terrorism to West Bank settlers and soldiers only with the clear demand that “terrorism will only stop when you leave the West Bank” that would be one thing. But the Palestinian demand is that Israel stops existing. They need to accept that they lost in 1948 and this will not be corrected in any way. Imagine if the Algerians demanded not just that the French leave Algeria but that they also leave France. That is what Palestinians demand, and they use terrorism to pursue this fundamentally impossible goal.

Palestinians should be given Israeli citizenship as part of the amended Law of Return.

The whole point of Israel having a Jewish majority is so the country is a safe haven for Jews. If you let Palestinians become the majority, they will slaughter millions of Jews if Hamas’ behavior is any example so far. Now I know you don’t really care about what happens but a lot of people do.

Aren't Jewish birthrates in Israel now higher than Palestinian birthrates in the West Bank? I'm not at all sure Jews would be a minority under that system.

I know the Jewish-Israeli birthrate has been higher than the Arab-Israeli birthrate for a few years now.

Yes, although Gaza was substantially less developed prior to the war and if you took Gaza into account the total Arab birthrate was still higher.

Immigration into the region is overwhelmingly Jewish (Israel having suffered a net loss of people only during the economic crisis of the 1980s, not before or since), and emigration is overwhelmingly Arab, but the exact emigration numbers are kind of difficult to come by. It is a common right-Israeli conspiracy theory that the PA exaggerates the Arab population of the West Bank to receive more aid which can be embezzled by leadership, and there is some evidence for this (in, eg, terms of energy expenditure), but the whole thing has the tone of people choosing to believe something because it would be convenient for them.

[pppolitics]

And the Palestinians are hardly unique in not giving up their struggle for self-determination. How many people under colonial rule - because this is what Israel's rule in Palestine amounts to in practice - have given up the struggle for independence? So while one can certainly deplore Palestinian terrorism, it's preposterous to claim the Palestinians are somehow sick for not giving up their desire for self-determination.

Palestinians don’t have to give up their struggle for independence, they need to accept that they lost in 1948 and that they will not get that land back ever. If Palestinians limited their terrorism to West Bank settlers and soldiers only with the clear demand that “terrorism will only stop when you leave the West Bank” that would be one thing. But the Palestinian demand is that Israel stops existing. They need to accept that they lost in 1948 and this will not be corrected in any way. Imagine if the Algerians demanded not just that the French leave Algeria but that they also leave France. That is what Palestinians demand, and they use terrorism to pursue this fundamentally impossible goal.

Palestinians should be given Israeli citizenship as part of the amended Law of Return.

Why, when Palestinians don’t want Israeli citizenship?

If they don't want Israeli citizenship, they don't have to apply.

Problem solved.

[pppolitics]

And the Palestinians are hardly unique in not giving up their struggle for self-determination. How many people under colonial rule - because this is what Israel's rule in Palestine amounts to in practice - have given up the struggle for independence? So while one can certainly deplore Palestinian terrorism, it's preposterous to claim the Palestinians are somehow sick for not giving up their desire for self-determination.

Palestinians don’t have to give up their struggle for independence, they need to accept that they lost in 1948 and that they will not get that land back ever. If Palestinians limited their terrorism to West Bank settlers and soldiers only with the clear demand that “terrorism will only stop when you leave the West Bank” that would be one thing. But the Palestinian demand is that Israel stops existing. They need to accept that they lost in 1948 and this will not be corrected in any way. Imagine if the Algerians demanded not just that the French leave Algeria but that they also leave France. That is what Palestinians demand, and they use terrorism to pursue this fundamentally impossible goal.

Palestinians should be given Israeli citizenship as part of the amended Law of Return.

The whole point of Israel having a Jewish majority is so the country is a safe haven for Jews. If you let Palestinians become the majority, they will slaughter millions of Jews if Hamas’ behavior is any example so far. Now I know you don’t really care about what happens but a lot of people do.

Nakba is Israel's original sin.

It's time for Israel to atone by taking back the Palestinians.

If the Jewish "majority" is so afraid that the Palestinians would do to them what they are doing to the Palestinians right now, they should establish the rights of minorities right now in case they are ever in the minority.

[Reactionary Libertarian]

And the Palestinians are hardly unique in not giving up their struggle for self-determination. How many people under colonial rule - because this is what Israel's rule in Palestine amounts to in practice - have given up the struggle for independence? So while one can certainly deplore Palestinian terrorism, it's preposterous to claim the Palestinians are somehow sick for not giving up their desire for self-determination.

Palestinians don’t have to give up their struggle for independence, they need to accept that they lost in 1948 and that they will not get that land back ever. If Palestinians limited their terrorism to West Bank settlers and soldiers only with the clear demand that “terrorism will only stop when you leave the West Bank” that would be one thing. But the Palestinian demand is that Israel stops existing. They need to accept that they lost in 1948 and this will not be corrected in any way. Imagine if the Algerians demanded not just that the French leave Algeria but that they also leave France. That is what Palestinians demand, and they use terrorism to pursue this fundamentally impossible goal.

Palestinians should be given Israeli citizenship as part of the amended Law of Return.

Why, when Palestinians don’t want Israeli citizenship?

If they don't want Israeli citizenship, they don't have to apply.

Problem solved.

In East Jerusalem there is such a system. Israel offered citizenship to the Arabs there when they captured it but they refused. Instead they have legal residency and the option to apply for Israeli citizenship. Almost all refuse, but in recent years there has been an uptick in applications. They also have the right to vote in local Jerusalem elections. Even though they make up enough of the city that their vote could have a huge impact, participation rates are in the single digits. If Israel implemented this system to Palestinians in the West Bank, it is almost certain that virtually all Palestinians would refuse and instead demand a Palestinian state. Maybe a few in Area C would apply, but it would be a very small number.

I’m surprise you would advocate for such a system, given that you are consistently anti-Israel. Your plan would be a gift to the Israeli far-right, which could have their cake and eat it too, so to speak- claim they offered full equality, while in reality the facts on the ground won’t change. Personally I think West Bank Palestinians would be much, much better off as Israeli citizens than as part of an independent Palestinian state, but that is not their preference, and any peace settlement won’t work if it doesn’t take that into account.

[pppolitics]

And the Palestinians are hardly unique in not giving up their struggle for self-determination. How many people under colonial rule - because this is what Israel's rule in Palestine amounts to in practice - have given up the struggle for independence? So while one can certainly deplore Palestinian terrorism, it's preposterous to claim the Palestinians are somehow sick for not giving up their desire for self-determination.

Palestinians don’t have to give up their struggle for independence, they need to accept that they lost in 1948 and that they will not get that land back ever. If Palestinians limited their terrorism to West Bank settlers and soldiers only with the clear demand that “terrorism will only stop when you leave the West Bank” that would be one thing. But the Palestinian demand is that Israel stops existing. They need to accept that they lost in 1948 and this will not be corrected in any way. Imagine if the Algerians demanded not just that the French leave Algeria but that they also leave France. That is what Palestinians demand, and they use terrorism to pursue this fundamentally impossible goal.

Palestinians should be given Israeli citizenship as part of the amended Law of Return.

Why, when Palestinians don’t want Israeli citizenship?

If they don't want Israeli citizenship, they don't have to apply.

Problem solved.

In East Jerusalem there is such a system. Israel offered citizenship to the Arabs there when they captured it but they refused. Instead they have legal residency and the option to apply for Israeli citizenship. Almost all refuse, but in recent years there has been an uptick in applications. They also have the right to vote in local Jerusalem elections. Even though they make up enough of the city that their vote could have a huge impact, participation rates are in the single digits. If Israel implemented this system to Palestinians in the West Bank, it is almost certain that virtually all Palestinians would refuse and instead demand a Palestinian state. Maybe a few in Area C would apply, but it would be a very small number.

I’m surprise you would advocate for such a system, given that you are consistently anti-Israel. Your plan would be a gift to the Israeli far-right, which could have their cake and eat it too, so to speak- claim they offered full equality, while in reality the facts on the ground won’t change. Personally I think West Bank Palestinians would be much, much better off as Israeli citizens than as part of an independent Palestinian state, but that is not their preference, and any peace settlement won’t work if it doesn’t take that into account.

It's not as simple as that and you know it.

Palestinians should be given the same rights as Jews under the Law of Return.

[Stand With Israel. Crush Hamas]

And the Palestinians are hardly unique in not giving up their struggle for self-determination. How many people under colonial rule - because this is what Israel's rule in Palestine amounts to in practice - have given up the struggle for independence? So while one can certainly deplore Palestinian terrorism, it's preposterous to claim the Palestinians are somehow sick for not giving up their desire for self-determination.

Palestinians don’t have to give up their struggle for independence, they need to accept that they lost in 1948 and that they will not get that land back ever. If Palestinians limited their terrorism to West Bank settlers and soldiers only with the clear demand that “terrorism will only stop when you leave the West Bank” that would be one thing. But the Palestinian demand is that Israel stops existing. They need to accept that they lost in 1948 and this will not be corrected in any way. Imagine if the Algerians demanded not just that the French leave Algeria but that they also leave France. That is what Palestinians demand, and they use terrorism to pursue this fundamentally impossible goal.

Palestinians should be given Israeli citizenship as part of the amended Law of Return.

The whole point of Israel having a Jewish majority is so the country is a safe haven for Jews. If you let Palestinians become the majority, they will slaughter millions of Jews if Hamas’ behavior is any example so far. Now I know you don’t really care about what happens but a lot of people do.

Nakba is Israel's original sin.

It's time for Israel to atone by taking back the Palestinians.

If the Jewish "majority" is so afraid that the Palestinians would do to them what they are doing to the Palestinians right now, they should establish the rights of minorities right now in case they are ever in the minority.

We have nothing to atone for, and when it comes to who owes who what, your ledger with us will never be balanced and every pogrom brings Israel closer and closer to a government who may decide to call in that debt.

[pppolitics]

And the Palestinians are hardly unique in not giving up their struggle for self-determination. How many people under colonial rule - because this is what Israel's rule in Palestine amounts to in practice - have given up the struggle for independence? So while one can certainly deplore Palestinian terrorism, it's preposterous to claim the Palestinians are somehow sick for not giving up their desire for self-determination.

Palestinians don’t have to give up their struggle for independence, they need to accept that they lost in 1948 and that they will not get that land back ever. If Palestinians limited their terrorism to West Bank settlers and soldiers only with the clear demand that “terrorism will only stop when you leave the West Bank” that would be one thing. But the Palestinian demand is that Israel stops existing. They need to accept that they lost in 1948 and this will not be corrected in any way. Imagine if the Algerians demanded not just that the French leave Algeria but that they also leave France. That is what Palestinians demand, and they use terrorism to pursue this fundamentally impossible goal.

Palestinians should be given Israeli citizenship as part of the amended Law of Return.

The whole point of Israel having a Jewish majority is so the country is a safe haven for Jews. If you let Palestinians become the majority, they will slaughter millions of Jews if Hamas’ behavior is any example so far. Now I know you don’t really care about what happens but a lot of people do.

Nakba is Israel's original sin.

It's time for Israel to atone by taking back the Palestinians.

If the Jewish "majority" is so afraid that the Palestinians would do to them what they are doing to the Palestinians right now, they should establish the rights of minorities right now in case they are ever in the minority.

We have nothing to atone for, and when it comes to who owes who what, your ledger with us will never be balanced and every pogrom brings Israel closer and closer to a government who may decide to call in that debt.

Then Israel will always be an apartheid state and other countries should treat it as such.

[Stand With Israel. Crush Hamas]

And the Palestinians are hardly unique in not giving up their struggle for self-determination. How many people under colonial rule - because this is what Israel's rule in Palestine amounts to in practice - have given up the struggle for independence? So while one can certainly deplore Palestinian terrorism, it's preposterous to claim the Palestinians are somehow sick for not giving up their desire for self-determination.

Palestinians don’t have to give up their struggle for independence, they need to accept that they lost in 1948 and that they will not get that land back ever. If Palestinians limited their terrorism to West Bank settlers and soldiers only with the clear demand that “terrorism will only stop when you leave the West Bank” that would be one thing. But the Palestinian demand is that Israel stops existing. They need to accept that they lost in 1948 and this will not be corrected in any way. Imagine if the Algerians demanded not just that the French leave Algeria but that they also leave France. That is what Palestinians demand, and they use terrorism to pursue this fundamentally impossible goal.

Palestinians should be given Israeli citizenship as part of the amended Law of Return.

The whole point of Israel having a Jewish majority is so the country is a safe haven for Jews. If you let Palestinians become the majority, they will slaughter millions of Jews if Hamas’ behavior is any example so far. Now I know you don’t really care about what happens but a lot of people do.

Nakba is Israel's original sin.

It's time for Israel to atone by taking back the Palestinians.

If the Jewish "majority" is so afraid that the Palestinians would do to them what they are doing to the Palestinians right now, they should establish the rights of minorities right now in case they are ever in the minority.

We have nothing to atone for, and when it comes to who owes who what, your ledger with us will never be balanced and every pogrom brings Israel closer and closer to a government who may decide to call in that debt.

Then Israel will always be an apartheid state and other countries should treat it as such.

The lot of you always wanted us dead and none of us believe you anymore when you pretend that we can somehow change that.

[pppolitics]

And the Palestinians are hardly unique in not giving up their struggle for self-determination. How many people under colonial rule - because this is what Israel's rule in Palestine amounts to in practice - have given up the struggle for independence? So while one can certainly deplore Palestinian terrorism, it's preposterous to claim the Palestinians are somehow sick for not giving up their desire for self-determination.

Palestinians don’t have to give up their struggle for independence, they need to accept that they lost in 1948 and that they will not get that land back ever. If Palestinians limited their terrorism to West Bank settlers and soldiers only with the clear demand that “terrorism will only stop when you leave the West Bank” that would be one thing. But the Palestinian demand is that Israel stops existing. They need to accept that they lost in 1948 and this will not be corrected in any way. Imagine if the Algerians demanded not just that the French leave Algeria but that they also leave France. That is what Palestinians demand, and they use terrorism to pursue this fundamentally impossible goal.

Palestinians should be given Israeli citizenship as part of the amended Law of Return.

The whole point of Israel having a Jewish majority is so the country is a safe haven for Jews. If you let Palestinians become the majority, they will slaughter millions of Jews if Hamas’ behavior is any example so far. Now I know you don’t really care about what happens but a lot of people do.

Nakba is Israel's original sin.

It's time for Israel to atone by taking back the Palestinians.

If the Jewish "majority" is so afraid that the Palestinians would do to them what they are doing to the Palestinians right now, they should establish the rights of minorities right now in case they are ever in the minority.

We have nothing to atone for, and when it comes to who owes who what, your ledger with us will never be balanced and every pogrom brings Israel closer and closer to a government who may decide to call in that debt.

Then Israel will always be an apartheid state and other countries should treat it as such.

The lot of you always wanted us dead and none of us believe you anymore when you pretend that we can somehow change that.

Nah, that's a waste.

It would be more interesting watching you struggle on a level playing field.

[Horus]

And the Palestinians are hardly unique in not giving up their struggle for self-determination. How many people under colonial rule - because this is what Israel's rule in Palestine amounts to in practice - have given up the struggle for independence? So while one can certainly deplore Palestinian terrorism, it's preposterous to claim the Palestinians are somehow sick for not giving up their desire for self-determination.

Palestinians don’t have to give up their struggle for independence, they need to accept that they lost in 1948 and that they will not get that land back ever. If Palestinians limited their terrorism to West Bank settlers and soldiers only with the clear demand that “terrorism will only stop when you leave the West Bank” that would be one thing. But the Palestinian demand is that Israel stops existing. They need to accept that they lost in 1948 and this will not be corrected in any way. Imagine if the Algerians demanded not just that the French leave Algeria but that they also leave France. That is what Palestinians demand, and they use terrorism to pursue this fundamentally impossible goal.

Palestinians should be given Israeli citizenship as part of the amended Law of Return.

The whole point of Israel having a Jewish majority is so the country is a safe haven for Jews. If you let Palestinians become the majority, they will slaughter millions of Jews if Hamas’ behavior is any example so far. Now I know you don’t really care about what happens but a lot of people do.

Nakba is Israel's original sin.

It's time for Israel to atone by taking back the Palestinians.

If the Jewish "majority" is so afraid that the Palestinians would do to them what they are doing to the Palestinians right now, they should establish the rights of minorities right now in case they are ever in the minority.

We have nothing to atone for, and when it comes to who owes who what, your ledger with us will never be balanced and every pogrom brings Israel closer and closer to a government who may decide to call in that debt.

Who is we? Aren't you American?

[pppolitics]

And the Palestinians are hardly unique in not giving up their struggle for self-determination. How many people under colonial rule - because this is what Israel's rule in Palestine amounts to in practice - have given up the struggle for independence? So while one can certainly deplore Palestinian terrorism, it's preposterous to claim the Palestinians are somehow sick for not giving up their desire for self-determination.

Palestinians don’t have to give up their struggle for independence, they need to accept that they lost in 1948 and that they will not get that land back ever. If Palestinians limited their terrorism to West Bank settlers and soldiers only with the clear demand that “terrorism will only stop when you leave the West Bank” that would be one thing. But the Palestinian demand is that Israel stops existing. They need to accept that they lost in 1948 and this will not be corrected in any way. Imagine if the Algerians demanded not just that the French leave Algeria but that they also leave France. That is what Palestinians demand, and they use terrorism to pursue this fundamentally impossible goal.

Palestinians should be given Israeli citizenship as part of the amended Law of Return.

The whole point of Israel having a Jewish majority is so the country is a safe haven for Jews. If you let Palestinians become the majority, they will slaughter millions of Jews if Hamas’ behavior is any example so far. Now I know you don’t really care about what happens but a lot of people do.

Nakba is Israel's original sin.

It's time for Israel to atone by taking back the Palestinians.

If the Jewish "majority" is so afraid that the Palestinians would do to them what they are doing to the Palestinians right now, they should establish the rights of minorities right now in case they are ever in the minority.

We have nothing to atone for, and when it comes to who owes who what, your ledger with us will never be balanced and every pogrom brings Israel closer and closer to a government who may decide to call in that debt.

Who is we? Aren't you American?

Clearly, his allegiance lies elsewhere.

[Horus]

And the Palestinians are hardly unique in not giving up their struggle for self-determination. How many people under colonial rule - because this is what Israel's rule in Palestine amounts to in practice - have given up the struggle for independence? So while one can certainly deplore Palestinian terrorism, it's preposterous to claim the Palestinians are somehow sick for not giving up their desire for self-determination.

Palestinians don’t have to give up their struggle for independence, they need to accept that they lost in 1948 and that they will not get that land back ever. If Palestinians limited their terrorism to West Bank settlers and soldiers only with the clear demand that “terrorism will only stop when you leave the West Bank” that would be one thing. But the Palestinian demand is that Israel stops existing. They need to accept that they lost in 1948 and this will not be corrected in any way. Imagine if the Algerians demanded not just that the French leave Algeria but that they also leave France. That is what Palestinians demand, and they use terrorism to pursue this fundamentally impossible goal.

Palestinians should be given Israeli citizenship as part of the amended Law of Return.

The whole point of Israel having a Jewish majority is so the country is a safe haven for Jews. If you let Palestinians become the majority, they will slaughter millions of Jews if Hamas’ behavior is any example so far. Now I know you don’t really care about what happens but a lot of people do.

Nakba is Israel's original sin.

It's time for Israel to atone by taking back the Palestinians.

If the Jewish "majority" is so afraid that the Palestinians would do to them what they are doing to the Palestinians right now, they should establish the rights of minorities right now in case they are ever in the minority.

We have nothing to atone for, and when it comes to who owes who what, your ledger with us will never be balanced and every pogrom brings Israel closer and closer to a government who may decide to call in that debt.

Who is we? Aren't you American?

Clearly, his allegiance lies elsewhere.

I mean, I'm not  going to assume that. I'd like to hear from Ray.

[Devils30]

And the Palestinians are hardly unique in not giving up their struggle for self-determination. How many people under colonial rule - because this is what Israel's rule in Palestine amounts to in practice - have given up the struggle for independence? So while one can certainly deplore Palestinian terrorism, it's preposterous to claim the Palestinians are somehow sick for not giving up their desire for self-determination.

Palestinians don’t have to give up their struggle for independence, they need to accept that they lost in 1948 and that they will not get that land back ever. If Palestinians limited their terrorism to West Bank settlers and soldiers only with the clear demand that “terrorism will only stop when you leave the West Bank” that would be one thing. But the Palestinian demand is that Israel stops existing. They need to accept that they lost in 1948 and this will not be corrected in any way. Imagine if the Algerians demanded not just that the French leave Algeria but that they also leave France. That is what Palestinians demand, and they use terrorism to pursue this fundamentally impossible goal.

Palestinians should be given Israeli citizenship as part of the amended Law of Return.

The whole point of Israel having a Jewish majority is so the country is a safe haven for Jews. If you let Palestinians become the majority, they will slaughter millions of Jews if Hamas’ behavior is any example so far. Now I know you don’t really care about what happens but a lot of people do.

Nakba is Israel's original sin.

It's time for Israel to atone by taking back the Palestinians.

If the Jewish "majority" is so afraid that the Palestinians would do to them what they are doing to the Palestinians right now, they should establish the rights of minorities right now in case they are ever in the minority.

We have nothing to atone for, and when it comes to who owes who what, your ledger with us will never be balanced and every pogrom brings Israel closer and closer to a government who may decide to call in that debt.

Who is we? Aren't you American?

Clearly, his allegiance lies elsewhere.

Let's be 100% honest here, as I have said before, ppp is a leftist thug. And yes, that is what I mean. Under his system of government, we would not be ruled by a democratic system (whether that be a presidential or parliamentary democracy) and instead be at the whims of leftist academics like Kendi/ Middle Eastern studies professors. These people would do whatever the f*** they want and ppp would justify everything.

Let's not mince words, even disregarding Israel, Palestine, this is someone who hates the United States of America and what it represents.

[pppolitics]

And the Palestinians are hardly unique in not giving up their struggle for self-determination. How many people under colonial rule - because this is what Israel's rule in Palestine amounts to in practice - have given up the struggle for independence? So while one can certainly deplore Palestinian terrorism, it's preposterous to claim the Palestinians are somehow sick for not giving up their desire for self-determination.

Palestinians don’t have to give up their struggle for independence, they need to accept that they lost in 1948 and that they will not get that land back ever. If Palestinians limited their terrorism to West Bank settlers and soldiers only with the clear demand that “terrorism will only stop when you leave the West Bank” that would be one thing. But the Palestinian demand is that Israel stops existing. They need to accept that they lost in 1948 and this will not be corrected in any way. Imagine if the Algerians demanded not just that the French leave Algeria but that they also leave France. That is what Palestinians demand, and they use terrorism to pursue this fundamentally impossible goal.

Palestinians should be given Israeli citizenship as part of the amended Law of Return.

The whole point of Israel having a Jewish majority is so the country is a safe haven for Jews. If you let Palestinians become the majority, they will slaughter millions of Jews if Hamas’ behavior is any example so far. Now I know you don’t really care about what happens but a lot of people do.

Nakba is Israel's original sin.

It's time for Israel to atone by taking back the Palestinians.

If the Jewish "majority" is so afraid that the Palestinians would do to them what they are doing to the Palestinians right now, they should establish the rights of minorities right now in case they are ever in the minority.

We have nothing to atone for, and when it comes to who owes who what, your ledger with us will never be balanced and every pogrom brings Israel closer and closer to a government who may decide to call in that debt.

Who is we? Aren't you American?

Clearly, his allegiance lies elsewhere.

Let's be 100% honest here, as I have said before, ppp is a leftist thug. And yes, that is what I mean. Under his system of government, we would not be ruled by a democratic system (whether that be a presidential or parliamentary democracy) and instead be at the whims of leftist academics like Kendi/ Middle Eastern studies professors. These people would do whatever the f*** they want and ppp would justify everything.

Let's not mince words, even disregarding Israel, Palestine, this is someone who hates the United States of America and what it represents.

Don't think that I didn't notice that you didn't answer the question.

[Horus]

And the Palestinians are hardly unique in not giving up their struggle for self-determination. How many people under colonial rule - because this is what Israel's rule in Palestine amounts to in practice - have given up the struggle for independence? So while one can certainly deplore Palestinian terrorism, it's preposterous to claim the Palestinians are somehow sick for not giving up their desire for self-determination.

Palestinians don’t have to give up their struggle for independence, they need to accept that they lost in 1948 and that they will not get that land back ever. If Palestinians limited their terrorism to West Bank settlers and soldiers only with the clear demand that “terrorism will only stop when you leave the West Bank” that would be one thing. But the Palestinian demand is that Israel stops existing. They need to accept that they lost in 1948 and this will not be corrected in any way. Imagine if the Algerians demanded not just that the French leave Algeria but that they also leave France. That is what Palestinians demand, and they use terrorism to pursue this fundamentally impossible goal.

Palestinians should be given Israeli citizenship as part of the amended Law of Return.

The whole point of Israel having a Jewish majority is so the country is a safe haven for Jews. If you let Palestinians become the majority, they will slaughter millions of Jews if Hamas’ behavior is any example so far. Now I know you don’t really care about what happens but a lot of people do.

Nakba is Israel's original sin.

It's time for Israel to atone by taking back the Palestinians.

If the Jewish "majority" is so afraid that the Palestinians would do to them what they are doing to the Palestinians right now, they should establish the rights of minorities right now in case they are ever in the minority.

We have nothing to atone for, and when it comes to who owes who what, your ledger with us will never be balanced and every pogrom brings Israel closer and closer to a government who may decide to call in that debt.

Who is we? Aren't you American?

Clearly, his allegiance lies elsewhere.

Let's be 100% honest here, as I have said before, ppp is a leftist thug. And yes, that is what I mean. Under his system of government, we would not be ruled by a democratic system (whether that be a presidential or parliamentary democracy) and instead be at the whims of leftist academics like Kendi/ Middle Eastern studies professors. These people would do whatever the f*** they want and ppp would justify everything.

Let's not mince words, even disregarding Israel, Palestine, this is someone who hates the United States of America and what it represents.

I cannot recall a single pppolitics post not related to I/P.

His view of the conflict seems a bit limited and one dimensional, but I have also seen no evidence that he's a fan of Kendi's ideology or anyone else like that. Far as I know he's voting Biden and is a normal Democrat on most matters. This post seems unnecessarily angry.

[Meclazine for Israel]

Another former Israeli hostage speaks of her experience in Hamas captivity.

Daniel Aloni

https://www.instagram.com/reel/C1yDozEoEtz/

Daniel and her daughter, Emilia, were released after 49 days in terrorist captivity.

Other members of Daniel's family are still held hostage in Gaza.

[President Punxsutawney Phil]

And the Palestinians are hardly unique in not giving up their struggle for self-determination. How many people under colonial rule - because this is what Israel's rule in Palestine amounts to in practice - have given up the struggle for independence? So while one can certainly deplore Palestinian terrorism, it's preposterous to claim the Palestinians are somehow sick for not giving up their desire for self-determination.

Palestinians don’t have to give up their struggle for independence, they need to accept that they lost in 1948 and that they will not get that land back ever. If Palestinians limited their terrorism to West Bank settlers and soldiers only with the clear demand that “terrorism will only stop when you leave the West Bank” that would be one thing. But the Palestinian demand is that Israel stops existing. They need to accept that they lost in 1948 and this will not be corrected in any way. Imagine if the Algerians demanded not just that the French leave Algeria but that they also leave France. That is what Palestinians demand, and they use terrorism to pursue this fundamentally impossible goal.

Palestinians should be given Israeli citizenship as part of the amended Law of Return.

The whole point of Israel having a Jewish majority is so the country is a safe haven for Jews. If you let Palestinians become the majority, they will slaughter millions of Jews if Hamas’ behavior is any example so far. Now I know you don’t really care about what happens but a lot of people do.

Nakba is Israel's original sin.

It's time for Israel to atone by taking back the Palestinians.

If the Jewish "majority" is so afraid that the Palestinians would do to them what they are doing to the Palestinians right now, they should establish the rights of minorities right now in case they are ever in the minority.

We have nothing to atone for, and when it comes to who owes who what, your ledger with us will never be balanced and every pogrom brings Israel closer and closer to a government who may decide to call in that debt.

Who is we? Aren't you American?

Clearly, his allegiance lies elsewhere.

Let's be 100% honest here, as I have said before, ppp is a leftist thug. And yes, that is what I mean. Under his system of government, we would not be ruled by a democratic system (whether that be a presidential or parliamentary democracy) and instead be at the whims of leftist academics like Kendi/ Middle Eastern studies professors. These people would do whatever the f*** they want and ppp would justify everything.

Let's not mince words, even disregarding Israel, Palestine, this is someone who hates the United States of America and what it represents.

I cannot recall a single pppolitics post not related to I/P.

His view of the conflict seems a bit limited and one dimensional, but I have also seen no evidence that he's a fan of Kendi's ideology or anyone else like that. Far as I know he's voting Biden and is a normal Democrat on most matters. This post seems unnecessarily angry.

Most people have a mostly one-dimensional view of this conflict. Most Israelis, most Arabs, loads of Europeans...
pppolitics has a partisan Democrat attitude towards this conflict. It's a type I'm very familiar with, and some of attacks he gets are extremely undeserved.

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

And the Palestinians are hardly unique in not giving up their struggle for self-determination. How many people under colonial rule - because this is what Israel's rule in Palestine amounts to in practice - have given up the struggle for independence? So while one can certainly deplore Palestinian terrorism, it's preposterous to claim the Palestinians are somehow sick for not giving up their desire for self-determination.

Palestinians don’t have to give up their struggle for independence, they need to accept that they lost in 1948 and that they will not get that land back ever. If Palestinians limited their terrorism to West Bank settlers and soldiers only with the clear demand that “terrorism will only stop when you leave the West Bank” that would be one thing. But the Palestinian demand is that Israel stops existing. They need to accept that they lost in 1948 and this will not be corrected in any way. Imagine if the Algerians demanded not just that the French leave Algeria but that they also leave France. That is what Palestinians demand, and they use terrorism to pursue this fundamentally impossible goal.

Palestinians should be given Israeli citizenship as part of the amended Law of Return.

The whole point of Israel having a Jewish majority is so the country is a safe haven for Jews. If you let Palestinians become the majority, they will slaughter millions of Jews if Hamas’ behavior is any example so far. Now I know you don’t really care about what happens but a lot of people do.

The Israeli solution to this has been to institute an apartheid system inside the West Bank. Amazing how most Biden supporters on here seem to brush that aside.

The Gantz policy on the West Bank will likely be very different than the Netanyahu policy. The Gaza policy will not be, as the obliteration of Hamas is no longer a topic anyone to the right of Meretz will ever compromise on.

I do, incidentally, think of a Gantz West Bank policy as implying substantively different dynamics for ~The Conflict~ overall for this reason, even though he is oviously not going to stop pulverizing Gaza. A Palestine in which glorified homeowners' associations of ethnosupremacist extremists aren't given carte blanche to brutalize the helots is a substantively different and substantively better Palestine, and frankly if that Palestine can additionally have Hamas and Hamas-like ideologies permanently degraded (it probably can't at this point, but if it can) then that Palestine is better still.

[CumbrianLefty]

I cannot recall a single pppolitics post not related to I/P.

They have made quite a few.

[Meclazine for Israel]

Israel are talking to the Congo (DRC) about a voluntary relocation plan for Palestinian refugees according to the Times of Israel.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2024/01/03/israel-talks-with-congo-gaza-voluntary-migration/

Congo (DRC) denies any talks have taken place

Papua New Guinea would take them for money.

Australia have put heaps of Afghani, Iranian and other Muslim asylum seekers on Nauru. They don't like it, but it is available.

[Stand With Israel. Crush Hamas]

And the Palestinians are hardly unique in not giving up their struggle for self-determination. How many people under colonial rule - because this is what Israel's rule in Palestine amounts to in practice - have given up the struggle for independence? So while one can certainly deplore Palestinian terrorism, it's preposterous to claim the Palestinians are somehow sick for not giving up their desire for self-determination.

Palestinians don’t have to give up their struggle for independence, they need to accept that they lost in 1948 and that they will not get that land back ever. If Palestinians limited their terrorism to West Bank settlers and soldiers only with the clear demand that “terrorism will only stop when you leave the West Bank” that would be one thing. But the Palestinian demand is that Israel stops existing. They need to accept that they lost in 1948 and this will not be corrected in any way. Imagine if the Algerians demanded not just that the French leave Algeria but that they also leave France. That is what Palestinians demand, and they use terrorism to pursue this fundamentally impossible goal.

Palestinians should be given Israeli citizenship as part of the amended Law of Return.

The whole point of Israel having a Jewish majority is so the country is a safe haven for Jews. If you let Palestinians become the majority, they will slaughter millions of Jews if Hamas’ behavior is any example so far. Now I know you don’t really care about what happens but a lot of people do.

Nakba is Israel's original sin.

It's time for Israel to atone by taking back the Palestinians.

If the Jewish "majority" is so afraid that the Palestinians would do to them what they are doing to the Palestinians right now, they should establish the rights of minorities right now in case they are ever in the minority.

We have nothing to atone for, and when it comes to who owes who what, your ledger with us will never be balanced and every pogrom brings Israel closer and closer to a government who may decide to call in that debt.

Who is we? Aren't you American?

Clearly, his allegiance lies elsewhere.

I mean, I'm not  going to assume that. I'd like to hear from Ray.

If there's one thing that the last three months have made clear, it's that our enemies will make no distinction when the time comes. When Israel fights back, they'll take the fight to diaspora Jews because they're soft targets.

[Angel of Death]

Israel offered citizenship to the Arabs there when they captured it but they refused.

You know how, if you repeat a lie over and over again, it becomes "common knowledge"? This is one of them.

[pppolitics]

And the Palestinians are hardly unique in not giving up their struggle for self-determination. How many people under colonial rule - because this is what Israel's rule in Palestine amounts to in practice - have given up the struggle for independence? So while one can certainly deplore Palestinian terrorism, it's preposterous to claim the Palestinians are somehow sick for not giving up their desire for self-determination.

Palestinians don’t have to give up their struggle for independence, they need to accept that they lost in 1948 and that they will not get that land back ever. If Palestinians limited their terrorism to West Bank settlers and soldiers only with the clear demand that “terrorism will only stop when you leave the West Bank” that would be one thing. But the Palestinian demand is that Israel stops existing. They need to accept that they lost in 1948 and this will not be corrected in any way. Imagine if the Algerians demanded not just that the French leave Algeria but that they also leave France. That is what Palestinians demand, and they use terrorism to pursue this fundamentally impossible goal.

Palestinians should be given Israeli citizenship as part of the amended Law of Return.

The whole point of Israel having a Jewish majority is so the country is a safe haven for Jews. If you let Palestinians become the majority, they will slaughter millions of Jews if Hamas’ behavior is any example so far. Now I know you don’t really care about what happens but a lot of people do.

Nakba is Israel's original sin.

It's time for Israel to atone by taking back the Palestinians.

If the Jewish "majority" is so afraid that the Palestinians would do to them what they are doing to the Palestinians right now, they should establish the rights of minorities right now in case they are ever in the minority.

We have nothing to atone for, and when it comes to who owes who what, your ledger with us will never be balanced and every pogrom brings Israel closer and closer to a government who may decide to call in that debt.

Who is we? Aren't you American?

Clearly, his allegiance lies elsewhere.

I mean, I'm not  going to assume that. I'd like to hear from Ray.

If there's one thing that the last three months have made clear, it's that our enemies will make no distinction when the time comes. When Israel fights back, they'll take the fight to diaspora Jews because they're soft targets.

Who are "they"?