Israel-Gaza war

[LAKISYLVANIA]

An example of how twitter responds



Going transphobe lol (because she's a transgender minister).

[Meclazine for Israel]

Bad guys hiding underground beneath Shifa Hospital and driving around in ambulances.

Hamas At Shifa

https://www.instagram.com/reel/Czcd3zJNIFb/

Using Ambulances Like Uber

https://twitter.com/cogatonline/status/1722314028402225325?s=20

Hamas have been using these ambulances supplied by Red Crescent to transport Hamas leaders all around Gaza.

[LAKISYLVANIA]

Inb4 atlas sh**ts on my country.

[TiltsAreUnderrated]

>7 deputy prime ministers at once

I see Belgian bureaucracy has adopted the "vice CEO" trick.

[Cassius]

https://twitter.com/ASE/status/1722280644804223290

Based minister!

Time for sanctions against gentiles in visually abusive shirts.

[LAKISYLVANIA]

https://twitter.com/ASE/status/1722280644804223290

Based minister!

Time for sanctions against gentiles in visually abusive shirts.

I've seen what you posted before and it has been reported. Deleting your post and changing it won't help.

No need to resort to transphobia over something you disagree with (her being transgender is even irrelevant for the discussion). But thanks for proving my point i guess.

[Cassius]

https://twitter.com/ASE/status/1722280644804223290

Based minister!

Time for sanctions against gentiles in visually abusive shirts.

I've seen what you posted before and it has been reported. Deleting your post and changing it won't help.

No need to resort to transphobia over something you disagree with (her being transgender is even irrelevant for the discussion). But thanks for proving my point i guess.

It was deleted for me! I would’ve happily left it there!

[Vosem]

https://twitter.com/The_Kyle_Mann/status/1722643584074342867

[NOVA Green]

Yeah, what I imagine this actually means is that major news outlets will very quickly disavow some Palestinian freelancers who were in league with Hamas, and those unemployed ex-journos will then find themselves in Mossad crosshairs.

Yes. From what I have seen, most journalists have every piece of footage scrutinised before it is about to be released.

So essentially they are Hamas journalists. So if they were embedded on October 7, they can argue they did not know or they were simply following instructions from Hamas.

This scenario still amounts to mainstream news organizations either knowingly paying Hamas members or finding themselves in a situation where they should have known they were paying Hamas members, which is flatly illegal.

So the Times has an article up on this story...

Unfortunately folks will need to click on the link at the bottom to read the full article, but lazy posting a Tweet which is limited in text allowed to make an "argument", in what effectively has become a "War over Media Narratives", definitely does a disservice to the truth, as well as media outlets such as the New York Times, which have attempted to cover what is a long and complicated story.

I should note that regardless of the specifics of this particular story, journalists (Or in this case  contract photo-journalists) have a long history of visiting War Zones, which might sometimes involve visiting with or even travelling with insurgent guerrilla formations as part of covering conflicts as opposed to the more traditional model of being embedded with State actors involved, where the control of information is carefully dictated by the "minders".

Now that being said there is a huge difference between covering clashes between recognized parties at conflict (Military vs Military) as an embed, versus covering a mass terrorist assault on innocent civilians, which was a significant part of what we witnessed on October 7th.

Still, the fact that stringer Photo-Journalists were on the ground early in Southern Israel on 10/7 in no way shape or form means they were embedded with Hamas, and in fact some of their work might well end up documenting war crimes against individuals involved (Those that survived considering there were about 1.5k Hamas dead within Israel proper).

There are multiple accounts about how the "Wall" was breached so quickly that even some Gaza Palestinians streamed across to loot items from Israeli communities that had been attacked.

People calling out for assassination of "journalists" should be more responsible, considering that this current conflict has already led to an unprecedented number of journalists killed within such a short time frame.

The Israeli government on Thursday accused freelance photographers for several major news organizations, including The New York Times, of being “accomplices” in the killing and abductions of Israeli soldiers and civilians by Hamas fighters — an allegation The Times vigorously denied about its freelancer.

In its report, the watchdog group questioned why six Gaza-based photographers, all of whom were working for The Associated Press and Reuters, were early to document the incursion by Hamas into Israel on Oct. 7. The journalists photographed an Israeli tank that had been destroyed at the border of the Gaza Strip, soon after the militants broke through a fence and swarmed into Israeli territory.

While a fourth A.P. photographer named in the report, Yousef Masoud, has worked as a freelancer for The Times since shortly after the war began, he was not on assignment for the paper on the morning of Oct. 7, according to a statement issued by The Times. The Times rejected suggestions that it had advance warning of the attacks or had accompanied Hamas terrorists, calling the claims “untrue and outrageous.” It also said there was “no evidence for Honest Reporting’s insinuations” about Mr. Masoud.

In its review of Mr. Masoud’s work, editors at The Times determined that the first photo he transmitted to the A.P. — of the destroyed Israeli tank — was taken more than 90 minutes after the attack began, according to an editor at The Times who spoke on the condition of anonymity to discuss an internal matter. Mr. Masoud told his editors, this person said, that he was woken at home in Khan Younis, in southern Gaza, by the sound of rocket fire, shortly after 5:30 a.m. on Saturday morning.

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/11/09/world/middleeast/israel-gaza-hamas-photographers.html

[Meclazine for Israel]

MSNBC News and ABC Australia cannot help themselves. Every news title is anti-Israeli, pro-Palestinian.

"Years ago, Netanyahu made a major mistake".

"Fifty years on, Benjamin Netanyahu is blamed by many Israelis for the failures that contributed to the horrors of October 7. "

"People are united in their rage against Benjamin Netanyahu"

"Israeli's facing a new threat"

"UN Experts say Jabalia strikes a war crime"

"The tunnels will give Hamas the upper hand."

"Settlers killing Palestinians in the West Bank"

"Jewish Protestor in Sherman Oaks knocks his head."

It suggests that the journalists in these organisations were strongly pro-Palestinian before this war broke out.

They will wait for the news of the rapes, child beheadings, torture and kidnappings of October 7 to subside before restoring their prior bias in full.

[Vosem]

Oh, I'm very aware that being embedded in insurgencies is a long-standing journalistic practice. In the 1920s, Time magazine acted as a mouthpiece for Augusto Sandino. I think this is broadly an evil practice that hurts people and that if people can be held accountable for their crimes this time, then that will save many lives in the future. Particularly optimistically, there has been an ongoing trend of bankruptcies for media organizations, so hopefully this can be used to drive them out of business entirely.

The Palestinian cause is simply evil enough that it is inevitable that those who see it up close but continue promoting it have the personalities not merely to apologize for violent crimes, but to commit them themselves; it would be karmically appropriate if this embrace of nihilism leads those organizations to nothingness.

[All Along The Watchtower]

“embrace of nihilism”

Irony.


Anyway:

https://www.nytco.com/press/statement-on-yousef-masoud/

[LAKISYLVANIA]

https://twitter.com/aamer_rahman/status/1722641101528691193

Just to make you realize even better the crossroads where you as user are at... Do you consistently condemn genocide and more importantly... what side are you on? The good one?

I know i am. The question is: "are you?".

[NOVA Green]

Oh, I'm very aware that being embedded in insurgencies is a long-standing journalistic practice. In the 1920s, Time magazine acted as a mouthpiece for Augusto Sandino. I think this is broadly an evil practice that hurts people and that if people can be held accountable for their crimes this time, then that will save many lives in the future. Particularly optimistically, there has been an ongoing trend of bankruptcies for media organizations, so hopefully this can be used to drive them out of business entirely.

The Palestinian cause is simply evil enough that it is inevitable that those who see it up close but continue promoting it have the personalities not merely to apologize for violent crimes, but to commit them themselves; it would be karmically appropriate if this embrace of nihilism leads those organizations to nothingness.

OK--- I'm a bit confused here Vosem, since apparently you were referring to my post without actually quoting me.

So, if I am reading you correctly in your first paragraph:

1.) You are blaming unnamed media outlets;

2.) You are wanting unnamed "people" to be held accountable for crimes;

3.) Desiring bankruptcies of certain unnamed media outlets

Your second paragraph appears to be a giant run of string on sentences and honestly lacks the cohesion, not only in terms of English Grammar, but perhaps more significantly it lacks any type of logical argument...

Hate to say it but almost looks like something written by the "Atlas Prophet" with a CA-GREEN avatar.

1.) You start with a statement: "The Palestinian cause is simply evil enough", without even defining what that even means.

Basically you are creating an opinion as a statement of fact, without even describing what the hell the "Palestinian Cause" even is.

2.) Then you start getting into some bizarre psychoanalysis theory: (Maybe you have been reading a bit too much Frantz Fanon lately?)

"it is inevitable that those who see it up close but continue promoting it have the personalities not merely to apologize for violent crimes, but to commit them themselves"

3.) Now you go into a final statement involving a "wish", with some assumptions regarding your use of word karma, which after all has been consistently misappropriated within Western Cultures...

Now, I totally Grok the whole concept of "embrace of nihilism" leading organizations into nothingness.

It is pretty clear here (From my interpretation) that you are talking about Hamas as opposed to media outlets on this final end of the "sentence", although your plural when it comes to organization(s) implies you are speaking about others than just Hamas.

"it would be karmically appropriate if this embrace of nihilism leads those organizations to nothingness."

Absolutely agreed that assuming you are talking about Hamas, it is patently clear that this "spectacular operation", might well lead to a relative destruction as a military force operating within Gaza.

Now, as I posted on very early on this thread it was still unclear to what extent the attack was ordered by the political vs military wing of Hamas.

It is starting to become increasingly clear, that apparently there were top leaders of the military wing ordered this, and it was not controlled by the political wing of Hamas (Let alone Israel).

Lots more to the article... so click the link below or use one of your free monthly visits to read.

In weeks of interviews, Hamas leaders, along with Arab, Israeli and Western officials who track the group, said the attack had been planned and executed by a tight circle of commanders in Gaza who did not share the details with their own political representatives abroad or with their regional allies like Hezbollah, leaving people outside the enclave surprised by the ferocity, scale and reach of the assault.

The attack ended up being broader and deadlier than even its planners had anticipated, they said, largely because the assailants managed to break through Israel’s vaunted defenses with ease, allowing them to overrun military bases and residential areas with little resistance. As Hamas stormed through a swath of southern Israel, it killed and captured more soldiers and civilians than it expected to, officials said.

With the attack, the group’s leaders in Gaza — including Yahya Sinwar, who had spent more than 20 years in Israeli prisons, and Mohammed Deif, a shadowy military commander whom Israel had repeatedly tried to assassinate — answered that question. They doubled down on military confrontation.

In 2012, Mr. Sinwar became the armed wing’s representative to Hamas’s political leadership, linking him more tightly to the leaders of the military wing, including Mr. Deif, the mysterious head of the Qassam Brigades. The two men were key architects of the Oct. 7 attack, according to Arab and Israeli officials.

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/11/08/world/middleeast/hamas-israel-gaza-war.html?searchResultPosition=9

[Vosem]

Oh, I'm very aware that being embedded in insurgencies is a long-standing journalistic practice. In the 1920s, Time magazine acted as a mouthpiece for Augusto Sandino. I think this is broadly an evil practice that hurts people and that if people can be held accountable for their crimes this time, then that will save many lives in the future. Particularly optimistically, there has been an ongoing trend of bankruptcies for media organizations, so hopefully this can be used to drive them out of business entirely.

The Palestinian cause is simply evil enough that it is inevitable that those who see it up close but continue promoting it have the personalities not merely to apologize for violent crimes, but to commit them themselves; it would be karmically appropriate if this embrace of nihilism leads those organizations to nothingness.

OK--- I'm a bit confused here Vosem, since apparently you were referring to my post without actually quoting me.

So, if I am reading you correctly in your first paragraph:

1.) You are blaming unnamed media outlets;

The tweet I quoted cited "AP, CNN, NY Times, and Reuters".

2.) You are wanting unnamed "people" to be held accountable for crimes;

Those responsible for the decision to collaborate with journalists embedded in Hamas, or those who should have been responsible, including individuals like CEOs and managing editors.

3.) Desiring bankruptcies of certain unnamed media outlets

Right, the ones I cited in the post above.

Your second paragraph appears to be a giant run of string on sentences and honestly lacks the cohesion, not only in terms of English Grammar, but perhaps more significantly it lacks any type of logical argument...

OK, let me break it down for you since you do not understand it:
1) Palestinian liberationism, a call for the extermination of everyone in a country, is very evil.
2) This is obvious to anyone who spends effort learning about it, particularly on the ground.
3) Any individual who has spent time learning about it, but remains sympathetic, has a personality that would drive them to commit violent crimes.
4) Recently, lawsuits against media organizations by individuals hurt by their reporting have driven some organizations to bankruptcy (most famously Gawker).
5) Hopefully, individuals hurt by this kind of reporting will sue the media outlets I listed above and drive them to bankruptcy.
6) This would be the just outcome.

1.) You start with a statement: "The Palestinian cause is simply evil enough", without even defining what that even means.

This is because the goal of established Palestinian political parties is to kill everyone in Israel, regardless of whether they are Jewish or not. This is promoted abroad in a series of strange and comical inversions, such as accusing Israel of genocide or apartheid. I believe I have covered this in my other posts in this thread, and everyone is familiar with the argument.

Basically you are creating an opinion as a statement of fact, without even describing what the hell the "Palestinian Cause" even is.

I don't want to start every post with a five-paragraph essay!

2.) Then you start getting into some bizarre psychoanalysis theory: (Maybe you have been reading a bit too much Frantz Fanon lately?)

Ah, no, but I did pick up Koestler. I think it is true and important that some ideological or religious beliefs deterministically lead people to commit acts of violence. 

3.) Now you go into a final statement involving a "wish", with some assumptions regarding your use of word karma, which after all has been consistently misappropriated within Western Cultures...

Now, I totally Grok the whole concept of "embrace of nihilism" leading organizations into nothingness.

It is pretty clear here (From my interpretation) that you are talking about Hamas as opposed to media outlets on this final end of the "sentence", although your plural when it comes to organization(s) implies you are speaking about others than just Hamas.

I don't think I used the word "wish"? And, no, I was talking about mainstream American media organizations and their attitudes towards insurgent organizations that are hostile to the United States. This is why I brought up Augusto Sandino, who was a rebel leader in 1920s Nicaragua and was feted by the media of the time for fighting a war against American occupation: it is because it was the earliest example of this tendency I could think of offhand. These people consistently support militias with agendas causing mass death, even if the details of their platforms are different (as between the Sandinistas and Hamas), which is why I called the media's attitude 'nihilist'.

I hope that makes my stance clear.

Just to make you realize even better the crossroads where you as user are at... Do you consistently condemn genocide and more importantly... what side are you on? The good one?

I know i am. The question is: "are you?".

I agree with every word of this, Laki, but I strongly suspect my meaning is quite different.

[certified hummus supporter 🇵🇸🤝🇺🇸🤝🇺🇦]

Today is the 85th anniversary of the Nazi pogroms against Jews.

The Nazis would likely be proud of Hamas and their stupid supporters today all over the world.

So you ever gonna answer my question after you baselessly slandered me as a "Hamas supporter" or nah?

[All Along The Watchtower]

If the Sandinistas are Hamas in Vosem’s analogy, then that means…

[certified hummus supporter 🇵🇸🤝🇺🇸🤝🇺🇦]

MSNBC News and ABC Australia cannot help themselves. Every news title is anti-Israeli, pro-Palestinian.

"Years ago, Netanyahu made a major mistake".

"Fifty years on, Benjamin Netanyahu is blamed by many Israelis for the failures that contributed to the horrors of October 7. "

"People are united in their rage against Benjamin Netanyahu"

"Israeli's facing a new threat"

"UN Experts say Jabalia strikes a war crime"

"The tunnels will give Hamas the upper hand."

"Settlers killing Palestinians in the West Bank"

"Jewish Protestor in Sherman Oaks knocks his head."

It suggests that the journalists in these organisations were strongly pro-Palestinian before this war broke out.

They will wait for the news of the rapes, child beheadings, torture and kidnappings of October 7 to subside before restoring their prior bias in full.

What exactly about these headlines is "Pro-Palestinian and anti-Israeli" Meclazine? Is it not true that had Bibi not ignored the signs Hamas was gearing up for the attacks maybe thousands of innocents would still be alive today? Is it not true settlers are attacking Palestinians in the occupied West Bank? Or is unabashed and unashamedly full support for the actions of Israel what you desire in the media?

[All Along The Watchtower]

Also this stuff about journalists having foreknowledge of/aiding and abetting about the October 7th attacks is yet more evidence that the Israeli government and its intelligence and security services are desperate to distract from their own hubris, stupidity, criminal negligence, and yes, their willful aiding and abetting of Hamas to undermine the Palestinian Authority.

Perhaps if they had been more focused on their southern border instead of kicking Palestinians out of their homes in the West Bank and making a contiguous Palestinian state there impossible, this wouldn’t have happened.

[Blue3]

https://twitter.com/dannydanon/status/1722613218437480704

[Alben Barkley]

It's worth noting that Netanyahu hates this guy, who repeatedly has challenged him for Likud leadership, and he does not speak for the Israeli government. He's just a bomb-thrower on Twitter.

[Meclazine for Israel]

What exactly about these headlines is "Pro-Palestinian and anti-Israeli" Meclazine?

I just want the facts. The guy in Sherman Oaks was murdered.

The rest are biased opinions of Israel.

If a Settler killed a Palestinian in the West Bank, let us know by who, where and when did it happen?

Just some video or photography, some details with locations, when and how.

I don't want journalists adding their bias into the story, Israeli or Palestinian.

Reporting the hospital car park Jihad accidental rocket incorrectly caused antisemitic attacks in the USA.

Atrocious media coverage agreed by nearly all on Atlas.

[Blue3]

It's worth noting that Netanyahu hates this guy, who repeatedly has challenged him for Likud leadership, and he does not speak for the Israeli government. He's just a bomb-thrower on Twitter.

It says UN Ambassador and leader of Likud?

[Alben Barkley]

It's worth noting that Netanyahu hates this guy, who repeatedly has challenged him for Likud leadership, and he does not speak for the Israeli government. He's just a bomb-thrower on Twitter.

It says UN Ambassador and leader of Likud?

FORMER UN Ambassador, FORMER Minister of Science in Likud. Like 10 years ago. Right now he's just a backbencher.

Indeed Netanyahu fired him as Deputy Minister of Defense some years ago for refusing to accept his ceasefire with Hamas...

[Logical]

One of the few things that unites Israelis and Palestinians since Oct 7 is their shared hatred of Netanyahu. You may not like it, but it is the truth.