UK General Discussion: Rishecession

[CumbrianLefty]

That is long standing fixation of the Labour left, though. Its why they opposed Tory right to buy in the 1980s - something that proved a big vote loser (and still worse when middle class Bennite activists - who were usually home owners/mortgagers themselves - used to lecture people on council estates on how wrong they were to want to own their own properties)

[Blair]

That is long standing fixation of the Labour left, though. Its why they opposed Tory right to buy in the 1980s - something that proved a big vote loser (and still worse when middle class Bennite activists - who were usually home owners/mortgagers themselves - used to lecture people on council estates on how wrong they were to want to own their own properties)

I'm going off the top of my head but the obvious flaw is also that even if a Labour Government just focused on social rent, what happens when Prime Minister Badenoch comes in to power in 2029 or 2034?

IIRC a lot of New Labours approach to council housing was focused on having to repair the existing stock because it was in such a bad condition in the 90s- the common thing you hear from social tenants is 'well at least under Labour I had a new kitchen'- council and social housing relies on a consensus & a long term agreement around funding.

There has certainly be a change in attitudes & moods around social housing; I can remember when Theresa May lifting the cap on the Public Works Board was seen as a relatively big move! I think it will be one of the bigger issues in the next election- hence why Gove has been on clean up duty over leasehold & cladding issues.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

IIRC a lot of New Labours approach to council housing was focused on having to repair the existing stock because it was in such a bad condition in the 90s- the common thing you hear from social tenants is 'well at least under Labour I had a new kitchen'- council and social housing relies on a consensus & a long term agreement around funding.

Yes: the late 90s were thirty years after the big boom in system-built estates, and they were already starting to show their age.

[TheTide]

The only person I can think of who is fit for the UK presidency is David Beckham.

Providing the presidency was a largely ceremonial role then it could be filled with none political and nationally respected figures, like if David Attenborough was younger he'd be ideal.

If it wasn't a largely ceremonial role then someone like Piers Morgan could emerge as a Trump-like figure under certain circumstances.

[Blair]

It would never happen in my lifetime but I imagine if we did we'd follow other parliamentary democracies and have a parliamentarian elected by 2/3rds majority from both houses; assuming that the HOL had been stopped from reaching 2000 members by then.

It's rather macabre but the really fascinating discussion that we should be having about royal power is just what was actually being planned or discussed around Mr Blobby and his election threats in July '22.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

It's rather macabre but the really fascinating discussion that we should be having about royal power is just what was actually being planned or discussed around Mr Blobby and his election threats in July '22.

It has been unofficially confirmed* that a Dismissal was absolutely on the cards if Mr Blobby had dug in, which is why the terminally ill Brenda had to have her mobile ICU moved to Buck House for a few days. What we don't know is how close we were to seeing that happen: was it on the table as an absolute last resort, or was the plan to get on with it if he refused to heel?

_{*By that most reliable of sources on the Palace: i.e. Private Eye.}

[Blair]

It's rather macabre but the really fascinating discussion that we should be having about royal power is just what was actually being planned or discussed around Mr Blobby and his election threats in July '22.

It has been unofficially confirmed* that a Dismissal was absolutely on the cards if Mr Blobby had dug in, which is why the terminally ill Brenda had to have her mobile ICU moved to Buck House for a few days. What we don't know is how close we were to seeing that happen: was it on the table as an absolute last resort, or was the plan to get on with it if he refused to heel?

_{*By that most reliable of sources on the Palace: i.e. Private Eye.}

Oh yes of course I remember the bit in the Eye about how they had their own lawyers at the ready because they specifically didn't trust No.10 after the prorogation mess and there were suggestions being made that a request for dissolution would have been turned down- lol upon googling it appears the plan was revealed in a book- she would have been 'unable to take his call'.

Ofc the funny thing is how his the cult of Blobby would have reacted to him being sacked; a remainer plot ofc would have been the likely line.

[Zinneke]

I love how the Queen would have had the same excuse I do when I haven't finished a work assignment to get out of a constitutional pickle.

[TheTide]

It's rather macabre but the really fascinating discussion that we should be having about royal power is just what was actually being planned or discussed around Mr Blobby and his election threats in July '22.

It has been unofficially confirmed* that a Dismissal was absolutely on the cards if Mr Blobby had dug in, which is why the terminally ill Brenda had to have her mobile ICU moved to Buck House for a few days. What we don't know is how close we were to seeing that happen: was it on the table as an absolute last resort, or was the plan to get on with it if he refused to heel?

_{*By that most reliable of sources on the Palace: i.e. Private Eye.}

Oh yes of course I remember the bit in the Eye about how they had their own lawyers at the ready because they specifically didn't trust No.10 after the prorogation mess and there were suggestions being made that a request for dissolution would have been turned down- lol upon googling it appears the plan was revealed in a book- she would have been 'unable to take his call'.

Ofc the funny thing is how his the cult of Blobby would have reacted to him being sacked; a remainer plot ofc would have been the likely line.

He'd have a made a speech saying:

"Well may we say God Save the Queen. Because nothing will save the...err...Queen."

[CumbrianLefty]

It's rather macabre but the really fascinating discussion that we should be having about royal power is just what was actually being planned or discussed around Mr Blobby and his election threats in July '22.

It has been unofficially confirmed* that a Dismissal was absolutely on the cards if Mr Blobby had dug in, which is why the terminally ill Brenda had to have her mobile ICU moved to Buck House for a few days. What we don't know is how close we were to seeing that happen: was it on the table as an absolute last resort, or was the plan to get on with it if he refused to heel?

_{*By that most reliable of sources on the Palace: i.e. Private Eye.}

Oh yes of course I remember the bit in the Eye about how they had their own lawyers at the ready because they specifically didn't trust No.10 after the prorogation mess and there were suggestions being made that a request for dissolution would have been turned down- lol upon googling it appears the plan was revealed in a book- she would have been 'unable to take his call'.

Ofc the funny thing is how his the cult of Blobby would have reacted to him being sacked; a remainer plot ofc would have been the likely line.

"WOKE QUEEN HATES BRITAIN"

[Blair]

In news after some very lurid briefing about a DAMNING report being released today on Sue Gray it now appears it's been postponed and a placeholder statement has been released which doesn't really say a much.

It was odd how excited the Tories got over a civil servant and how they seemed convinced it mattered to anyone normal.

[Torrain]

Interested to find out whether its postponement is routine, or if someone in the Civil Service kicked up a fuss about what looks like an overt breach of purdah.

[Torrain]

Bit of Holyrood drama about the Green/SNP introduction of HPMA (Highly-Protected Marine Areas) - which would banning fishing, windfarms, as well as most water sports, and even undersea infrastructure cables from 10% of Scottish waters. SNP MSPs hold almost every coastal constituency, and there's been an unusual level of disquiet, perhaps even rebellion, from those members (see here):

• A Yousaf critic, Fergus Ewing, ripped his copy of the proposal apart while raging against the policy, stating: “that is what the people of Scotland who have great affection for our fishermen want to happen and what should happen and what I believe will happen at some stage or another”.
• Western Isles MSP, Alastair Allan (a supporter and endorsing of Humza Yousaf), has been uncharacteristically critical: "I have never known my constituency to be apparently so unanimously opposed to any policy as this one"
• Kate Forbes was also (of course) highly critical. In her remarks, she quoted a Scottish musician who referred to the people of the Central Belt as "arrogant strangers" and "faceless grey suits". She also said that the “rarest species in our coastal areas and our islands will soon become people if these proposals go ahead as planned”.
• Even Karen Adam, who was one of the Government's strongest defenders on policies that became political minefieldslike Gender Self-ID, came out against the proposal, warning that the promise to take the POV of "communities" into account was too vague.

There's to be a motion on scrapping the SNP HPMA proposal in Holyrood on Wednesday. Labour and the Tories both put some version of HPMAs in their 2021 manifestos, but have shifted to some over-eager variation of "look who's the arrogant out of touch party from 'down south' now", and appear to support such a motion. The question therefore, is how many SNP MSPs would be willing to support/abstain. It only takes 7 "no's" or a few more abstentions to bring the whole thing into the balance...

[JimJamUK]

Bit of Holyrood drama about the Green/SNP introduction of HPMA (Highly-Protected Marine Areas) - which would banning fishing, windfarms, as well as most water sports, and even undersea infrastructure cables from 10% of Scottish waters.

Minister - “However, it is also true that, as we tackle the climate emergency, we must do so via a fair and just transition, which empowers communities and shares in the benefits of a green economy“

What does that even mean in this context?

[lfromnj]

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-london-65456335

Plans for a 15-storey women-only tower block in west London have been given the green light.

Ealing Council approved the application, which will see 102 new flats built, from the Women's Pioneer Housing Association (WPA).

Brook House, an area of low-rise blocks owned by WPA opposite Acton Town tube station, will be knocked down and replaced.

The proposals received 56 objections, with eight expressions of support.

According to WPA Policy, any woman female by birth, or has a "gender recognition certificate legally declaring them female", as well as transgender women who "intend to undergo, are undergoing or have undergone gender reassignment", and non-binary people who meet the aforementioned criteria, can join their public waiting list.

Most of the objections are typical NIMBY ones as well.

[Torrain]

Bit of Holyrood drama about the Green/SNP introduction of HPMA (Highly-Protected Marine Areas) - which would banning fishing, windfarms, as well as most water sports, and even undersea infrastructure cables from 10% of Scottish waters.

Minister - “However, it is also true that, as we tackle the climate emergency, we must do so via a fair and just transition, which empowers communities and shares in the benefits of a green economy“

What does that even mean in this context?

“Just Transition” is an umbrella term used by several countries and trade union movements, to infer that people who work in fossil-fuels, and other industries that will be nixed by net zero, receive some kind of incentive or alternative employment. 

To put on my cynical hat - in the Scottish Government context, it roughly seems to mean - “quick, how can we make sure people in Aberdeen(shire) and fishing communities along the coast still vote for us?”

[Torrain]

SNP have new auditors:
https://twitter.com/conor_matchett/status/1653698108356698112

[Blair]

Bit of Holyrood drama about the Green/SNP introduction of HPMA (Highly-Protected Marine Areas) - which would banning fishing, windfarms, as well as most water sports, and even undersea infrastructure cables from 10% of Scottish waters. SNP MSPs hold almost every coastal constituency, and there's been an unusual level of disquiet, perhaps even rebellion, from those members (see here):

• A Yousaf critic, Fergus Ewing, ripped his copy of the proposal apart while raging against the policy, stating: “that is what the people of Scotland who have great affection for our fishermen want to happen and what should happen and what I believe will happen at some stage or another”.
• Western Isles MSP, Alastair Allan (a supporter and endorsing of Humza Yousaf), has been uncharacteristically critical: "I have never known my constituency to be apparently so unanimously opposed to any policy as this one"
• Kate Forbes was also (of course) highly critical. In her remarks, she quoted a Scottish musician who referred to the people of the Central Belt as "arrogant strangers" and "faceless grey suits". She also said that the “rarest species in our coastal areas and our islands will soon become people if these proposals go ahead as planned”.
• Even Karen Adam, who was one of the Government's strongest defenders on policies that became political minefieldslike Gender Self-ID, came out against the proposal, warning that the promise to take the POV of "communities" into account was too vague.

There's to be a motion on scrapping the SNP HPMA proposal in Holyrood on Wednesday. Labour and the Tories both put some version of HPMAs in their 2021 manifestos, but have shifted to some over-eager variation of "look who's the arrogant out of touch party from 'down south' now", and appear to support such a motion. The question therefore, is how many SNP MSPs would be willing to support/abstain. It only takes 7 "no's" or a few more abstentions to bring the whole thing into the balance...

I was going to make a rather unfair wee fee joke but seriously even I can see that the SNP are going to have a major problem when you look at their policies on Net Zero, energy independence and well the more general direction of U.K. wide polity around rural life.

You saw this with their policy around the plastic bottle deposits scheme- something that was once a popular and well received policy seemed to collapse upon its meeting with reality*.

*I do wonder how much of the coverage was just v good lobbying once the sector woke up what they would actually have to do and pay.

[Cassius]

SNP have new auditors:
https://twitter.com/conor_matchett/status/1653698108356698112

Given how small (they don’t even file full accounts) and obscure they are, this rather implies that none of the 1,900 (there or thereabouts) accounting firms based in Scotland were willing to take on the role.

[CumbrianLefty]

On which subject, a new Scottish poll out today is being ramped this morning.

(just in case the hype is justified, the last one not to show the SNP ahead was in mid-2014 I think)

[Torrain]

On which subject, a new Scottish poll out today is being ramped this morning.

(just in case the hype is justified, the last one not to show the SNP ahead was in mid-2014 I think)

Aye - early 2014 for the last Labour lead in Scottish Westminster polling, and 2011 since Labour last led a Holyrood poll.

[Torrain]

I was going to make a rather unfair wee fee joke but seriously even I can see that the SNP are going to have a major problem when you look at their policies on Net Zero, energy independence and well the more general direction of U.K. wide polity around rural life.

You saw this with their policy around the plastic bottle deposits scheme- something that was once a popular and well received policy seemed to collapse upon its meeting with reality*.

*I do wonder how much of the coverage was just v good lobbying once the sector woke up what they would actually have to do and pay.

Aye - some of the environmental  policies laid out in the SNP-Green Bute House Agreement are decent in principle, but the messaging and rollout, not to mention the actual written policy have been severely lacking.

I remain a fan of some sort of deposit scheme and broadening marine-protection areas in principle. But the current policies both now look pretty unworkable, either politically or implementation-wise. Not sure how Yousaf will balance the demands of the Greens and the moderate-conservative coastal MPs, who Forbes seems more than happy to act as ringleader for.

[JimJamUK]

Aye - some of the environmental policies laid out in the SNP-Green Bute House Agreement are decent in principle, but the messaging and rollout, not to mention the actual written policy have been severely lacking.

I remain a fan of some sort of deposit scheme and broadening marine-protection areas in principle. But the current policies both now look pretty unworkable, either politically or implementation-wise. Not sure how Yousaf will balance the demands of the Greens and the moderate-conservative coastal MPs, who Forbes seems more than happy to act as ringleader for.

The problem is that the Greens want these policies to be implemented without dilution, and the people at the top of the SNP are used to getting their own way (they’ve had a de facto majority since 2011 and little internal never mind public debate). It’s just not conductive to forming good and widely supported policies. If anything, it’s surprising it took this long for cracks to properly emerge (the Bute House Agreement looks to be the cause, though things like gender recognition would presumably have happened anyways). Will be very interesting to see the vote on HPMA and the government response.

[Torrain]

Redfield and Wilton Scottish Tracker is out. Headlines:

• No leads Yes by 10%
• SNP lead by 3% at Westminster polling (35% SNP, vs 32% Labour
• For Holyrood constituencies, SNP lead by 4% (36% SNP, versus 32% Labour)
• For Holyrood Regional Vote, Labour lead - 27% vs the SNP’s 25%.

Caveat that R&W have weird sampling, and heavily overweigh the Lib Dem’s, so this may all be inaccurate. But still - big news

[MABA 2020]

I have long hoped for the electoral downfall of the SNP, still surprised it now seems to be happening