Why do we care so much about Israel?

[pppolitics]

Why do we care so much about Israel?

Serious question.

It is not our neighbor.

It's a tiny country in the middle east.

Why don't we care about, let's say, a random country in Africa instead?

[Alben Barkley]

We need allies in the Middle East, for one thing. Israel is our most stable and reliable ally in the region, and the only democracy there as well.

[pppolitics]

Israel is our most stable and reliable ally in the region, and the only democracy there as well.

"Democracy" LOL

We need allies in the Middle East, for one thing. Israel is our most stable and reliable ally in the region, and the only democracy there as well.

Also, who is our ally in Africa?

[GeneralMacArthur]

We didn't care about Israel for a long time.  We betrayed and abandoned them repeatedly during the 50s/60s/70s when their Arab neighbors were trying to annihilate and mass-genocide them.

I think we really started caring about them in the Carter era when we took it upon ourselves to try and broker peace between the descendants of Holocaust victims and the psychopathic terrorists who openly want to mass-slaughter them for religious reasons.  That was really the first point where we started dipping our toes into Middle Eastern politics, and Israel is far and away the most sane country in that area of the world.

[Never Made it to Graceland]

We need allies in the Middle East, for one thing. Israel is our most stable and reliable ally in the region, and the only democracy there as well.

"Democracy" LOL

Also, who is our ally in Africa?

It's totally normal to have six elections in three years to keep your leader out of prison, doncha know.

[Alben Barkley]

Israel is our most stable and reliable ally in the region, and the only democracy there as well.

"Democracy" LOL

It is literally the only Middle Eastern country classified as even a flawed democracy on the Democracy Index.

Also, who is our ally in Africa?

Morocco is literally our oldest ally, being the first country in the world to formally recognize the United States and the country with which we have the longest unbroken streak of diplomatic relations.

[Stand With Israel. Crush Hamas]

It's a small, immensely powerful, nuclear-capable nation rich in tech resources that can offer the US a lot of proprietary technology in exchange for diplomatic protection from a horde of scum vultures who would love to erase it from existence. It 100% makes sense as an ally for the United States on a purely pragmatic level.

[pppolitics]

It's a small, immensely powerful, nuclear-capable nation rich in tech resources that can offer the US a lot of proprietary technology in exchange for diplomatic protection from a horde of scum vultures who would love to erase it from existence. It 100% makes sense as an ally for the United States on a purely pragmatic level.

If Israel is such an "immensely powerful, nuclear-capable nation rich in tech resources", why do we have to keep giving it monetary aids?

[pppolitics]

Morocco is literally our oldest ally, being the first country in the world to formally recognize the United States and the country with which we have the longest unbroken streak of diplomatic relations.

When is the last time we hear about Morocco, again?

[Horus]

There are a large number of Zionists in America, most of them are Evangelical Christians. These Evangelicals tend to value Israel more than America and have made the GOP the most pro Israel major party in the Western World due to their extremely violent and antisemitic beliefs relating to the "end times." They are literally obsessed with Jews and Israel and it's creepy. Fortunately as the Boomers die off and Evangelical Christianity declines in the states, the focus on Israel will lessen as will the money we waste propping them up.

[Stand With Israel. Crush Hamas]

It's a small, immensely powerful, nuclear-capable nation rich in tech resources that can offer the US a lot of proprietary technology in exchange for diplomatic protection from a horde of scum vultures who would love to erase it from existence. It 100% makes sense as an ally for the United States on a purely pragmatic level.

If Israel is such an "immensely powerful, nuclear-capable nation rich in tech resources", why do we have to keep giving it monetary aids?

Those "monetary aids" are essentially stipends for purchases of American military technology.

I'm getting the vibe you didn't ask the initial question in good faith.

[Never Made it to Graceland]

It's a small, immensely powerful, nuclear-capable nation rich in tech resources that can offer the US a lot of proprietary technology in exchange for diplomatic protection from a horde of scum vultures who would love to erase it from existence. It 100% makes sense as an ally for the United States on a purely pragmatic level.

If Israel is such an "immensely powerful, nuclear-capable nation rich in tech resources", why do we have to keep giving it monetary aids?

Those "monetary aids" are essentially stipends for purchases of American military technology.

How many Americans died from rationing insulin last year, again?

[Stand With Israel. Crush Hamas]

It's a small, immensely powerful, nuclear-capable nation rich in tech resources that can offer the US a lot of proprietary technology in exchange for diplomatic protection from a horde of scum vultures who would love to erase it from existence. It 100% makes sense as an ally for the United States on a purely pragmatic level.

If Israel is such an "immensely powerful, nuclear-capable nation rich in tech resources", why do we have to keep giving it monetary aids?

Those "monetary aids" are essentially stipends for purchases of American military technology.

How many Americans died from rationing insulin last year, again?

Silence, Corbynite.

[Stand With Israel. Crush Hamas]

We need allies in the Middle East, for one thing. Israel is our most stable and reliable ally in the region, and the only democracy there as well.

"Democracy" LOL

Also, who is our ally in Africa?

It's totally normal to have six elections in three years to keep your leader out of prison, doncha know.

Fellas, is it undemocratic to vote?

[Vosem]

There are a large number of Zionists in America, most of them are Evangelical Christians. These Evangelicals tend to value Israel more than America and have made the GOP the most pro Israel major party in the Western World due to their extremely violent and antisemitic beliefs relating to the "end times." They are literally obsessed with Jews and Israel and it's creepy. Fortunately as the Boomers die off and Evangelical Christianity declines in the states, the focus on Israel will lessen as will the money we waste propping them up.

Evangelical Christianity is not declining in the States, though (it was at one point among specifically white Americans, but that doesn't seem to be the case any longer): https://theconversation.com/think-us-evangelicals-are-dying-out-well-define-evangelicalism-152640

Also, note that 2020 was the first presidential election in decades at which, per the Edison Research exit polling, the evangelical proportion of the electorate grew (to 28%, from 26% in 2016): https://www.cnn.com/election/2020/exit-polls/president/national-results

And that probably understates the case, since it measures just white evangelicals as a proportion of the electorate but recent growth in evangelicalism has been much less white than in the past.

Moreover evangelical Christianity has been spreading to a bunch of countries in Latin America and sub-Saharan Africa, which is why you've suddenly seen leaders in countries as varied as Guatemala, Brazil, and South Sudan touting their support for Israel.

(But, yes, anyone who doesn't list "evangelical theology" as one of the reasons here is kidding themselves. Ray does have a point too in that much of the aid to Israel is basically a roundabout way of subsidizing American arms manufacturers, and that the aid got started during a time in the Cold War when American interest in the Middle East made rather more sense than it does now and when the humanitarian argument was also stronger. He doesn't bring up that there is very large-scale intelligence sharing between the US and Israel, such that many of the controversies of the Trump Administration were about revealing information that Israel had revealed to the US confidentially).

[Vosem]

Morocco is literally our oldest ally, being the first country in the world to formally recognize the United States and the country with which we have the longest unbroken streak of diplomatic relations.

When is the last time we hear about Morocco, again?

The Trump Administration extremely controversially extended recognition to Morocco's annexation of western Sahara in 2020 in exchange for a host of diplomatic concessions, one of which was recognition of Israeli sovereignty. This was hugely controversial -- it is one of the few cases since the Kellogg-Briand Pact in 1928 when the US kinda sorta recognized someone's conquest -- and we heard a lot about it. What a weird question.

[Indy Texas]

We care way too much about the Middle East in general.

The oil supply doesn't matter like it did in the '70s - there are ample resources in other countries (including our own) and growing alternatives to petroleum.

There is no rival superpower jockeying for influence there like the Soviet Union. Russia wants to muck around in Syria? So what? Russia has been mucking around in the Levant/Black Sea/Caucasus for centuries. Meanwhile China is quietly buying up Africa.

It's not a very populous region compared to Africa, India, China or Southeast Asia. And it's even smaller when you consider that the Gulf States are basically rotten boroughs that are 10% natives and 90% expat migrant workers.

The idea that the Israel-Palestine conflict was a root cause of post-Cold War Islamist terrorism was always a big lie.

Israel's insistence that it is surrounded by enemies turned out to be a lie. It has peace treaties or tacit nonaggression pacts with literally every country in the area other than Iran. The Arab countries' insistence that the Palestinian issue was ever some major sticking point for them was a lie, based on how quickly they grew tired of it when they decided they wanted Israel's help dealing with Iran.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

We need allies in the Middle East, for one thing. Israel is our most stable and reliable ally in the region, and the only democracy there as well.

Just because they're the least on fire of the dumpster fire of the middle east doesn't mean that they should be considered an ally.

[GoTfan]

It's a small, immensely powerful, nuclear-capable nation rich in tech resources that can offer the US a lot of proprietary technology in exchange for diplomatic protection from a horde of scum vultures who would love to erase it from existence. It 100% makes sense as an ally for the United States on a purely pragmatic level.

If Israel is such an "immensely powerful, nuclear-capable nation rich in tech resources", why do we have to keep giving it monetary aids?

Those "monetary aids" are essentially stipends for purchases of American military technology.

How many Americans died from rationing insulin last year, again?

Silence, Corbynite.

You know someone is too far gone when they say that not having to ration insulin is a Corbynite position.

[Omega21]

It's a small, immensely powerful, nuclear-capable nation rich in tech resources that can offer the US a lot of proprietary technology in exchange for diplomatic protection from a horde of scum vultures who would love to erase it from existence. It 100% makes sense as an ally for the United States on a purely pragmatic level.

If Israel is such an "immensely powerful, nuclear-capable nation rich in tech resources", why do we have to keep giving it monetary aids?

Those "monetary aids" are essentially stipends for purchases of American military technology.

How many Americans died from rationing insulin last year, again?

That's an issue mainly to do with the immense power Pharma has over the US. You, as an uninsured tourist could get American-made drugs much cheaper in Europe. Insulin is, in some places, even 2, 3, or 4 times cheaper, because the politicians aren't as influenced by lobbyists bribes, and have more bargaining power.

Still, definitely a disgrace for "the richest country in the world", especially considering Insulin is an ancient drug, and "but my research costs" doesn't really cut it.

More money would simply be pouring water into a leaking cup. You don't need more water, you need to plug the oversized pharma profit holes.

Silence, Corbynite.

You know someone is too far gone when they say that not having to ration insulin is a Corbynite position.

American "left": Surely they could just make do with one dose every 7 days?
European right: what the f**k

[Ferguson97]

Because they are an ally?

I’m not even really pro-Israel, but this is a weird question.

[Never Made it to Graceland]

We need allies in the Middle East, for one thing. Israel is our most stable and reliable ally in the region, and the only democracy there as well.

"Democracy" LOL

Also, who is our ally in Africa?

It's totally normal to have six elections in three years to keep your leader out of prison, doncha know.

Fellas, is it undemocratic to vote?

Imagine being this clueless, and thinking that Israeli democracy is anything close to functional right now. Just another in your greatest hits of comical statements.

[Donerail]

We need allies in the Middle East, for one thing. Israel is our most stable and reliable ally in the region, and the only democracy there as well.

"Democracy" LOL

Also, who is our ally in Africa?

It's totally normal to have six elections in three years to keep your leader out of prison, doncha know.

Fellas, is it undemocratic to vote?

Imagine being this clueless, and thinking that Israeli democracy is anything close to functional right now. Just another in your greatest hits of comical statements.

Eh, he's kind of got a point on this specific criticism. Belgium, for instance, isn't disqualified as a democracy just because their elections often produce fragmented governments with no clear majority.

The fatal flaw of Israeli "democracy" is that Israel, which has a fairly functional democracy within its internationally-recognized borders, also maintains a colonial occupation of Palestine. Israeli law functionally governs the lives of millions in the West Bank and Gaza, but they have no say in how that law is written. The problem is not the number of parties or the difficulties of coalition formation, it's the fact that half the population living under Israeli governance doesn't get to vote at all.

[Bismarck]

The Sheldon Adelson’s (RIP) of the world certainly help.

[͘]

Israel is overrated in Middle Eastern politics. I'm surprised that the clusterf#ck between Iran and Saudi Arabia for influence isn't discussed more.