COVID-19 Megathread 6: Return of the Omicron

[DINGO Joe]

Not fight cities and counties trying to implement mask mandates recommended by the CDC, for one thing.

This is so beyond irrelevant at this point that I struggle to understand why people are still bringing it up. We're done with the masks. The only people who will even consider wearing them are a small handful of health-nut conspiracy theorists who think Big Pharma tainted the vaccine, or people that are already vaccinated and at extremely low risk. Any breath wasted on mask mandates rather than figuring out how to increase the number of vaccinated Americans is nothing but a distraction now.

People on this forum keep saying this but it's just in total contradiction to all the polling we see on this issue. 58% of adults plan to wear masks "always" or "most of the time" in public indoor spaces, and 69% support mask mandates (Source). It's not just this poll either, several other polls report similar results.

It's pretty clear now that vaccines alone are not enough to stop Delta from spreading out of control; breakthrough cases are not rare and such people could spread the virus just as much as unvaccinated infected. Vaccine mandates are great and I'm glad they're gaining traction, but we need mask mandates and vaccine mandates to control Delta, or whatever variant later takes its place which is guaranteed to be even worse. We can only hope the two together can slow the spread enough so that we don't need to bring back social distancing which actually harms the economy.

I'm very skeptical of that polling. Maybe it's accurate and this is just yet another example of America's cultural divide, but I can tell you right now that nowhere near 58% of adults in Nebraska plan on wearing masks always or most of the time, not even in Lincoln or Omaha. It's vaccines or bust as far as combatting this virus goes. Sorry to be blunt, but it's how I feel and the evidence seems to back me up. The vaccines work and everything else is just settling for less.

Was actually in a Wal Mart on Sunday and the mask rate was 99%

[Frodo]

https://twitter.com/nytimes/status/1427456495017504768

[HillGoose]

god i dont want to wear masks again

i did what they said and got vaccinated, so why can't things just go back to normal already

it's so depressing and they are never gonna let it end

[Darthpi – Anti-Florida Activist]

https://twitter.com/nytimes/status/1427456495017504768

Sounds good to me

[Donerail]

I'm not necessarily defending them. But I am wondering exactly what DeSantis and Abbott could have done. It's no longer feasible to do lockdowns, and I feel like there's only so much you can do to convince people to take vaccines. Beyond a certain point, you can't fix stupid.

DeSantis should start with doing that much. His communications over the last few weeks have been entirely about "monoclonal antibodies," not a mention of vaccines as a possible healthcare option.

[DaleCooper]

I don't think people realize how much vaccine skepticism and hesitancy these booster shots are going to inspire. Booster shots every 8 months is shocking, if that's truly necessary (aside from the most vulnerable people in our population) then these vaccines are an embarrassing failure.

For the record, I don't believe that these vaccines are actually so useless as to need another in 8 months, but I'm saying that this announcement will destroy confidence in their effectiveness. 

[Hammy]

People on this forum keep saying this but it's just in total contradiction to all the polling we see on this issue. 58% of adults plan to wear masks "always" or "most of the time" in public indoor spaces

Then why aren't they? Every time I go to Kroger, it's about 10%.

You do realize Kentucky is not a good representation of the country as a whole, right?

I don't think people realize how much vaccine skepticism and hesitancy these booster shots are going to inspire. Booster shots every 8 months is shocking, if that's truly necessary (aside from the most vulnerable people in our population) then these vaccines are an embarrassing failure.

For the record, I don't believe that these vaccines are actually so useless as to need another in 8 months, but I'm saying that this announcement will destroy confidence in their effectiveness. 

I doubt it's going to cause much hesitancy outside of people who are already pretty much determined not to get one. They said months ago that as more variants arose, modifications and additional doses would likely be needed.

Anyone with even the slightest bit of common sense and hasn't made it their mission to delegitimize everything Biden does understands this is an ongoing ever-changing situation.

[Fmr. Gov. NickG]

Why are we giving adults a third shot before children have even had a chance to get one?  

At this point there has been more than enough time to know any potential negative side effects among children.  The complacency here among both the FDA and the public is shocking.  

Like, why is all the political controvery about masks for children and not vaccines (which, just like among adults, would be both much more effective and much more convenient)?

[Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin]

god i dont want to wear masks again

i did what they said and got vaccinated, so why can't things just go back to normal already

it's so depressing and they are never gonna let it end

Because half the country (mostly but not entirely Republican) didn't.

And you can relax, their absolutely will be an end. Either, 1)the government will mandate vaccines and other preventative measures, or 2) civilization will collapse and most of us will die, or 3) most everyone who doesn't take precautions (including vaccinations) will die. I'm rooting for option 1, but I'll take 3 as preferable to 2. And 2 & 3 seem to be the only ones the Republican Death Cult will allow.

[CEO Mindset]

you could end all this panic by just forcing journalists to stop talking about it and getting rid of government/corporate rules related to it

why keep the hysteria going?

[compucomp]

I don't think people realize how much vaccine skepticism and hesitancy these booster shots are going to inspire. Booster shots every 8 months is shocking, if that's truly necessary (aside from the most vulnerable people in our population) then these vaccines are an embarrassing failure.

For the record, I don't believe that these vaccines are actually so useless as to need another in 8 months, but I'm saying that this announcement will destroy confidence in their effectiveness. 

At this point I don't care about vaccine hesitancy. If Trumpists refuse to take the vaccine because they think it contains 5G chips and it's a plot by Hillary Clinton and Bill Gates to mind control them, they can feel free to get sick and die of COVID. As a vaccinated person I need to know the truth about how effective the vaccine is against the dominant variant. If the vaccine has lost some potency against Delta and I need a booster to protect myself, then I'll happily get one. It would be a far greater sin to withhold this information in the name of a "noble white lie", we all saw how "Masks Don't Work" turned out.

Besides, I don't understand the big negative about a booster when yearly flu shots are well established. There is a bizarre notion on this forum that we must continue to insist that the vaccine is an impenetrable COVID repelling force field, in the face of the overwhelming evidence to the contrary about Delta, and if one says anything negative about the vaccine, he is a mouth-breathing antivaxxer. No, we cannot hold on to this lie, it would be far more productive to figure out how to adjust, be it simply accepting the risk, or wearing a mask and staying away from crowds, or getting a booster, or whatever.

[Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin]

https://mobile.twitter.com/jennycohn1/status/1427400062523478033

[Roll Roons]

I don't think people realize how much vaccine skepticism and hesitancy these booster shots are going to inspire. Booster shots every 8 months is shocking, if that's truly necessary (aside from the most vulnerable people in our population) then these vaccines are an embarrassing failure.

For the record, I don't believe that these vaccines are actually so useless as to need another in 8 months, but I'm saying that this announcement will destroy confidence in their effectiveness. 

At this point I don't care about vaccine hesitancy. If Trumpists refuse to take the vaccine because they think it contains 5G chips and it's a plot by Hillary Clinton and Bill Gates to mind control them, they can feel free to get sick and die of COVID. As a vaccinated person I need to know the truth about how effective the vaccine is against the dominant variant. If the vaccine has lost some potency against Delta and I need a booster to protect myself, then I'll happily get one. It would be a far greater sin to withhold this information in the name of a "noble white lie", we all saw how "Masks Don't Work" turned out.

Besides, I don't understand the big negative about a booster when yearly flu shots are well established. There is a bizarre notion on this forum that we must continue to insist that the vaccine is an impenetrable COVID repelling force field, in the face of the overwhelming evidence to the contrary about Delta, and if one says anything negative about the vaccine, he is a mouth-breathing antivaxxer. No, we cannot hold on to this lie, it would be far more productive to figure out how to adjust, be it simply accepting the risk, or wearing a mask and staying away from crowds, or getting a booster, or whatever.

Not really. Maybe they're not quite as effective as they were against the original strain, but they remain very good at stopping severe outcomes. They basically turn COVID into a cold. I think that's an acceptable level of risk.

Despite all the fearmongering about Provincetown, very few people were hospitalized and no one died. Lollapalooza had nearly 400000 attendees, but only 200 cases with no hospitalizations or deaths.

[DaleCooper]

I don't think people realize how much vaccine skepticism and hesitancy these booster shots are going to inspire. Booster shots every 8 months is shocking, if that's truly necessary (aside from the most vulnerable people in our population) then these vaccines are an embarrassing failure.

For the record, I don't believe that these vaccines are actually so useless as to need another in 8 months, but I'm saying that this announcement will destroy confidence in their effectiveness. 

At this point I don't care about vaccine hesitancy. If Trumpists refuse to take the vaccine because they think it contains 5G chips and it's a plot by Hillary Clinton and Bill Gates to mind control them, they can feel free to get sick and die of COVID. As a vaccinated person I need to know the truth about how effective the vaccine is against the dominant variant. If the vaccine has lost some potency against Delta and I need a booster to protect myself, then I'll happily get one. It would be a far greater sin to withhold this information in the name of a "noble white lie", we all saw how "Masks Don't Work" turned out.

Besides, I don't understand the big negative about a booster when yearly flu shots are well established. There is a bizarre notion on this forum that we must continue to insist that the vaccine is an impenetrable COVID repelling force field, in the face of the overwhelming evidence to the contrary about Delta, and if one says anything negative about the vaccine, he is a mouth-breathing antivaxxer. No, we cannot hold on to this lie, it would be far more productive to figure out how to adjust, be it simply accepting the risk, or wearing a mask and staying away from crowds, or getting a booster, or whatever.

I actually do care about vaccine-hesitant people because I don't wish death and illness on everyone who disagrees with me politically. Obviously, I'm less sympathetic to the unmedicated lunatics that think the vaccine is a plot to infect them with microchips, but a lot of people are not getting the vaccine because they aren't getting any straight information from the authorities. Almost everyone I know who hasn't gotten the vaccine hasn't gotten it because they've either been bombarded with lies about how dangerous it is, or they've been bombarded with lies about how it doesn't actually protect them. This isn't the laymen's fault, this is the fault of incompetent government and public health officials who can't be straight with us, and a bloodthirsty media that peddles lies for views and website traffic.

If the government's official position is that most Americans need a new shot every 8 months because the initial vaccine is inadequate, then a lot of honest Americans are going to assume that this vaccine isn't of any help. Frankly, it's not even that illogical of an assumption given that our authorities have flip-flopped on everything so far.

[Hammy]

https://mobile.twitter.com/jennycohn1/status/1427400062523478033

This is both disgusting and dangerous because the mutations have shown more resistance to antibody treatment than they have to vaccines.

[Dr. MB]

Not fight cities and counties trying to implement mask mandates recommended by the CDC, for one thing.

This is so beyond irrelevant at this point that I struggle to understand why people are still bringing it up. We're done with the masks. The only people who will even consider wearing them are a small handful of health-nut conspiracy theorists who think Big Pharma tainted the vaccine, or people that are already vaccinated and at extremely low risk. Any breath wasted on mask mandates rather than figuring out how to increase the number of vaccinated Americans is nothing but a distraction now.

People on this forum keep saying this but it's just in total contradiction to all the polling we see on this issue. 58% of adults plan to wear masks "always" or "most of the time" in public indoor spaces, and 69% support mask mandates (Source). It's not just this poll either, several other polls report similar results.

It's pretty clear now that vaccines alone are not enough to stop Delta from spreading out of control; breakthrough cases are not rare and such people could spread the virus just as much as unvaccinated infected. Vaccine mandates are great and I'm glad they're gaining traction, but we need mask mandates and vaccine mandates to control Delta, or whatever variant later takes its place which is guaranteed to be even worse. We can only hope the two together can slow the spread enough so that we don't need to bring back social distancing which actually harms the economy.

I'm very skeptical of that polling. Maybe it's accurate and this is just yet another example of America's cultural divide, but I can tell you right now that nowhere near 58% of adults in Nebraska plan on wearing masks always or most of the time, not even in Lincoln or Omaha. It's vaccines or bust as far as combatting this virus goes. Sorry to be blunt, but it's how I feel and the evidence seems to back me up. The vaccines work and everything else is just settling for less.

I said mask mandates and vaccine mandates, both in combination. Now that vaccine mandates are gaining traction and becoming more acceptable I'm happy to advocate for them too.

I think the most likely explanation is that people who will wear masks will also go out in public less often; for example I'm sure there is still something like 10-15% of the population that stays home all the time and gets everything delivered. So you're less likely to see them and disproportionately see the people who don't wear masks because they also go out in public more often.

Do you personally know anyone who still does that? I don’t know anyone who still locks down and stays at home nearly all the time.

[Bandit3 the Worker]

I did my part and got the first two doses. I'm not getting a third for years.

If we need a booster after only 8 months, that means we were lied to and sold a bill of goods.

[emailking]

I did my part and got the first two doses. I'm not getting a third for years.

If we need a booster after only 8 months, that means we were lied to and sold a bill of goods.

You weren't sold anything. They were free.

[Bandit3 the Worker]

Evidently, Iowa just became the first state in the U.S. to declare that COVID is endemic.

[Inmate Trump]

Will these boosters be different than the original shots?  Or will they be taylor made to fight delta and other variants?

Like...will I just go to the doctor or wherever and they give me a one dose of the original vaccine, or something altogether different?

[compucomp]

If the government's official position is that most Americans need a new shot every 8 months because the initial vaccine is inadequate, then a lot of honest Americans are going to assume that this vaccine isn't of any help. Frankly, it's not even that illogical of an assumption given that our authorities have flip-flopped on everything so far.

The NYT article from yesterday said that new data out of Israel indicates weakening protection from severe illness from Pfizer/BioNTech after 8 months for elderly people, hence the new recommendation. If that is the truth, then it must be made known to the public ASAP and recommendations changed accordingly. If the vaccine loses potency over time or due to the virus evolving, yeah that sucks, but we need to know. If some people misinterpret that to mean that the vaccine is useless, that's their problem, they can get sick and die of COVID once the vaccine wears off while I protect myself by getting a booster.

The public needs to know all the most current information, whether it's favorable or not, and you seem to be advocating that this knowledge should be concealed in the name of promoting vaccination. Such a coverup would backfire on the scale of "Masks Don't Work"; it would become impossible to conceal when the death/hospitalization rate starts rising among the elderly population and deadly outbreaks occur in nursing homes.

[Inmate Trump]

If the government's official position is that most Americans need a new shot every 8 months because the initial vaccine is inadequate, then a lot of honest Americans are going to assume that this vaccine isn't of any help. Frankly, it's not even that illogical of an assumption given that our authorities have flip-flopped on everything so far.

The NYT article from yesterday said that new data out of Israel indicates weakening protection from severe illness from Pfizer/BioNTech after 8 months for elderly people, hence the new recommendation. If that is the truth, then it must be made known to the public ASAP and recommendations changed accordingly. If the vaccine loses potency over time or due to the virus evolving, yeah that sucks, but we need to know. If some people misinterpret that to mean that the vaccine is useless, that's their problem, they can get sick and die of COVID once the vaccine wears off while I protect myself by getting a booster.

The public needs to know all the most current information, whether it's favorable or not, and you seem to be advocating that this knowledge should be concealed in the name of promoting vaccination. Such a coverup would backfire on the scale of "Masks Don't Work"; it would become impossible to conceal when the death/hospitalization rate starts rising among the elderly population and deadly outbreaks occur in nursing homes.

The studies have shown that for Pfizer the protection wanes over time.  There was just a study showing Moderna highly effective after 6 months, even against the Delta variant.  The study showed Moderna was 96% against Delta.  If that's the case, why isn't it just certain vaccines need a booster rather than ALL vaccines?

[Horus]

Not fight cities and counties trying to implement mask mandates recommended by the CDC, for one thing.

This is so beyond irrelevant at this point that I struggle to understand why people are still bringing it up. We're done with the masks. The only people who will even consider wearing them are a small handful of health-nut conspiracy theorists who think Big Pharma tainted the vaccine, or people that are already vaccinated and at extremely low risk. Any breath wasted on mask mandates rather than figuring out how to increase the number of vaccinated Americans is nothing but a distraction now.

People on this forum keep saying this but it's just in total contradiction to all the polling we see on this issue. 58% of adults plan to wear masks "always" or "most of the time" in public indoor spaces, and 69% support mask mandates (Source). It's not just this poll either, several other polls report similar results.

It's pretty clear now that vaccines alone are not enough to stop Delta from spreading out of control; breakthrough cases are not rare and such people could spread the virus just as much as unvaccinated infected. Vaccine mandates are great and I'm glad they're gaining traction, but we need mask mandates and vaccine mandates to control Delta, or whatever variant later takes its place which is guaranteed to be even worse. We can only hope the two together can slow the spread enough so that we don't need to bring back social distancing which actually harms the economy.

I'm very skeptical of that polling. Maybe it's accurate and this is just yet another example of America's cultural divide, but I can tell you right now that nowhere near 58% of adults in Nebraska plan on wearing masks always or most of the time, not even in Lincoln or Omaha. It's vaccines or bust as far as combatting this virus goes. Sorry to be blunt, but it's how I feel and the evidence seems to back me up. The vaccines work and everything else is just settling for less.

I said mask mandates and vaccine mandates, both in combination. Now that vaccine mandates are gaining traction and becoming more acceptable I'm happy to advocate for them too.

I think the most likely explanation is that people who will wear masks will also go out in public less often; for example I'm sure there is still something like 10-15% of the population that stays home all the time and gets everything delivered. So you're less likely to see them and disproportionately see the people who don't wear masks because they also go out in public more often.

Do you personally know anyone who still does that? I don’t know anyone who still locks down and stays at home nearly all the time.

I know literally zero people who still do this and I live in a very, very blue area not far from the CDC.

[ProudModerate2]

I did my part and got the first two doses. I'm not getting a third for years.
If we need a booster after only 8 months, that means we were lied to and sold a bill of goods.

Can you be specific as to who "lied to" you.
It seems many are holding on to "supposed promises" of this and that.
There was always a chance of variants emerging.

[pbrower2a]

you could end all this panic by just forcing journalists to stop talking about it and getting rid of government/corporate rules related to it

why keep the hysteria going?

The pesky First Amendment would get in your way.