Bernie Sanders to be endorsed by AOC

[RaphaelDLG]

Liberal Twitter/Atlas is going to be in for a big letdown when the Squad's endorsement has only a modest effect on polling. Sanders's campaign has been over since he had a heart attack.

Because Pelosi's two purposes in life are:
1) to raise as much money as possible from corporate donors to give out to house dems - the only reason she has her job, because she sucks in every other way
2) to try to protect blue dog dems to a fault by being stupidly milquetoast, despite this attempt repeatedly backfiring on her

Right, because when Pelosi shepherded Obamacare, Dodd-Frank, and Waxman-Markey through the 111th Congress, her only goal was to raise money and protect Blue Dogs.

If Pelosi didn't get through those watered down bills, the Obama admin would have had her head on a spike.

A better question is: why did she wait forever to do an impeachment inquiry, how the hell did she just merely pass the border bill the repibs wanted when kids were being put in cages and repub voters were even outraged by it, and why has she killed hearings on MFA, GND?

[Slander and/or Libel]

Liberal Twitter/Atlas is going to be in for a big letdown when the Squad's endorsement has only a modest effect on polling. Sanders's campaign has been over since he had a heart attack.

Because Pelosi's two purposes in life are:
1) to raise as much money as possible from corporate donors to give out to house dems - the only reason she has her job, because she sucks in every other way
2) to try to protect blue dog dems to a fault by being stupidly milquetoast, despite this attempt repeatedly backfiring on her

Right, because when Pelosi shepherded Obamacare, Dodd-Frank, and Waxman-Markey through the 111th Congress, her only goal was to raise money and protect Blue Dogs.

If Pelosi didn't get through those watered down bills, the Obama admin would have had her head on a spike.

A better question is: why did she wait forever to do an impeachment inquiry, how the hell did she just merely pass the border bill the repibs wanted when kids were being put in cages and repub voters were even outraged by it, and why has she killed hearings on MFA, GND?

The answer to all three of those is the composition of her caucus, and the members toward its right who wouldn't let her do any of those things.

[RaphaelDLG]

Liberal Twitter/Atlas is going to be in for a big letdown when the Squad's endorsement has only a modest effect on polling. Sanders's campaign has been over since he had a heart attack.

Because Pelosi's two purposes in life are:
1) to raise as much money as possible from corporate donors to give out to house dems - the only reason she has her job, because she sucks in every other way
2) to try to protect blue dog dems to a fault by being stupidly milquetoast, despite this attempt repeatedly backfiring on her

Right, because when Pelosi shepherded Obamacare, Dodd-Frank, and Waxman-Markey through the 111th Congress, her only goal was to raise money and protect Blue Dogs.

If Pelosi didn't get through those watered down bills, the Obama admin would have had her head on a spike.

A better question is: why did she wait forever to do an impeachment inquiry, how the hell did she just merely pass the border bill the repibs wanted when kids were being put in cages and repub voters were even outraged by it, and why has she killed hearings on MFA, GND?

The answer to all three of those is the composition of her caucus, and the members toward its right who wouldn't let her do any of those things.

A) She doesn't need them to do hearings on MFA, GND
B) She was literally pushed by blue dogs into holding the impeachment inquiry after dragging her feet forever!
C) She should have pushed them on the kids in cages bill that dems inexplicably approved at no political benefit to the party, as holding it up to skewer repubs on family separation was a no brainer and would have been popular even in marginal districts

[slothdem]

Anything that puts distance between Warren and Omar/Tlaib is a net gain for her in the general and I think the primary as well.

AOC's endorsement would have been nice but I don't think it's any shock she's feeling the Bern.

[Zaybay]

I dont get how people are spinning this news as "Good for Warren in the general". If Warren wins the primary, AOC, Tlaib, and Omar will just change their endorsements to her.

Id also say that, while endorsements dont really seem to matter, this one may actually have an effect, due to the fact that AOC, Tlaib, and Omar are rather popular with the D base, especially the 'Very Liberal' base that Warren and Sanders are competing for.

Of course, these endorsements could mean absolutely nothing. We've just got to wait and see.

[Heebie Jeebie]

https://twitter.com/daveweigel/status/1184434055753949186

[Beet]

I dont get how people are spinning this news as "Good for Warren in the general". If Warren wins the primary, AOC, Tlaib, and Omar will just change their endorsements to her.

Id also say that, while endorsements dont really seem to matter, this one may actually have an effect, due to the fact that AOC, Tlaib, and Omar are rather popular with the D base, especially the 'Very Liberal' base that Warren and Sanders are competing for.

Of course, these endorsements could mean absolutely nothing. We've just got to wait and see.

If it has an effect, the biggest winner is Joe Biden. These are not the endorsements that will swing a Biden-Sanders swing voter to Sanders; quite the opposite. It can only take from Warren. Team Biden is popping the champagne corks tonight over ossification of a divide among his main opponents.

[Illini Moderate]

Liberal Twitter/Atlas is going to be in for a big letdown when the Squad's endorsement has only a modest effect on polling. Sanders's campaign has been over since he had a heart attack.

Because Pelosi's two purposes in life are:
1) to raise as much money as possible from corporate donors to give out to house dems - the only reason she has her job, because she sucks in every other way
2) to try to protect blue dog dems to a fault by being stupidly milquetoast, despite this attempt repeatedly backfiring on her

Right, because when Pelosi shepherded Obamacare, Dodd-Frank, and Waxman-Markey through the 111th Congress, her only goal was to raise money and protect Blue Dogs.

If Pelosi didn't get through those watered down bills, the Obama admin would have had her head on a spike.

A better question is: why did she wait forever to do an impeachment inquiry, how the hell did she just merely pass the border bill the repibs wanted when kids were being put in cages and repub voters were even outraged by it, and why has she killed hearings on MFA, GND?

She waited forever on impeachment because the Russia issue wasn't going to sell Americans on the idea. Good thing she did wait, as it was only a matter of time before Donny committed more corrupt and immoral acts that American's widely view as disqualifying....

She killed hearings on the MFA because it was a waste of time and the bill wouldn't even come close to passing the house. The Green New Deal was one of the most poorly drafted pieces of "legislation" that I have seen in years (mentioning cows farting, etc...) and was INCREDIBLY UNPOPULAR. Do you want to WIN, or do you want to grandstand for ideas that will not become reality at anytime and that will make our common goals of eliminating income inequality and a cleaner environment less popular?

[RaphaelDLG]

Liberal Twitter/Atlas is going to be in for a big letdown when the Squad's endorsement has only a modest effect on polling. Sanders's campaign has been over since he had a heart attack.

Because Pelosi's two purposes in life are:
1) to raise as much money as possible from corporate donors to give out to house dems - the only reason she has her job, because she sucks in every other way
2) to try to protect blue dog dems to a fault by being stupidly milquetoast, despite this attempt repeatedly backfiring on her

Right, because when Pelosi shepherded Obamacare, Dodd-Frank, and Waxman-Markey through the 111th Congress, her only goal was to raise money and protect Blue Dogs.

If Pelosi didn't get through those watered down bills, the Obama admin would have had her head on a spike.

A better question is: why did she wait forever to do an impeachment inquiry, how the hell did she just merely pass the border bill the repibs wanted when kids were being put in cages and repub voters were even outraged by it, and why has she killed hearings on MFA, GND?

She waited forever on impeachment because the Russia issue wasn't going to sell Americans on the idea. Good thing she did wait, as it was only a matter of time before Donny committed more corrupt and immoral acts that American's widely view as disqualifying....

She killed hearings on the MFA because it was a waste of time and the bill wouldn't even come close to passing the house. The Green New Deal was one of the most poorly drafted pieces of "legislation" that I have seen in years (mentioning cows farting, etc...) and was INCREDIBLY UNPOPULAR. Do you want to WIN, or do you want to grandstand for ideas that will not become reality at anytime and that will make our common goals of eliminating income inequality and a cleaner environment less popular?

1) I'd prefer to not die / not have my children die, and a dramatic shift in urgency / the political conversation is necessary to do so

2) NONE of her bills (moderate OR leftist ones) have any chance of getting passed through the Senate/white House.  That's not the point!  The point is to shift the conversation, put pressure on Trump/Republicans, and communicate important policy priorities in an effort to set the stage to win and then govern effectively.

3) Also, Donny was committing a ton of corrupt acts before the Ukraine scandal, which they should have focused on it they were smart (emoluments, etc) by investigating and then communicating to the public about (then if public opinion changed in response to effective communication, moving to impeach).  I agree the Russia stuff was overplayed.

Also, you didn't answer the fundamental question of why she had to be pushed by blue dogs, not the other way round as would make more sense.

[Illini Moderate]

Liberal Twitter/Atlas is going to be in for a big letdown when the Squad's endorsement has only a modest effect on polling. Sanders's campaign has been over since he had a heart attack.

Because Pelosi's two purposes in life are:
1) to raise as much money as possible from corporate donors to give out to house dems - the only reason she has her job, because she sucks in every other way
2) to try to protect blue dog dems to a fault by being stupidly milquetoast, despite this attempt repeatedly backfiring on her

Right, because when Pelosi shepherded Obamacare, Dodd-Frank, and Waxman-Markey through the 111th Congress, her only goal was to raise money and protect Blue Dogs.

If Pelosi didn't get through those watered down bills, the Obama admin would have had her head on a spike.

A better question is: why did she wait forever to do an impeachment inquiry, how the hell did she just merely pass the border bill the repibs wanted when kids were being put in cages and repub voters were even outraged by it, and why has she killed hearings on MFA, GND?

She waited forever on impeachment because the Russia issue wasn't going to sell Americans on the idea. Good thing she did wait, as it was only a matter of time before Donny committed more corrupt and immoral acts that American's widely view as disqualifying....

She killed hearings on the MFA because it was a waste of time and the bill wouldn't even come close to passing the house. The Green New Deal was one of the most poorly drafted pieces of "legislation" that I have seen in years (mentioning cows farting, etc...) and was INCREDIBLY UNPOPULAR. Do you want to WIN, or do you want to grandstand for ideas that will not become reality at anytime and that will make our common goals of eliminating income inequality and a cleaner environment less popular?

1) I'd prefer to not die / not have my children die, and a dramatic shift in urgency / the political conversation is necessary to do so

2) NONE of her bills (moderate OR leftist ones) have any chance of getting passed through the Senate/white House.  That's not the point!  The point is to shift the conversation, put pressure on Trump/Republicans, and communicate important policy priorities in an effort to set the stage to win and then govern effectively.

3) Also, Donny was committing a ton of corrupt acts before the Ukraine scandal, which they should have focused on it they were smart (emoluments, etc) by investigating and then communicating to the public about (then if public opinion changed in response to effective communication, moving to impeach).  I agree the Russia stuff was overplayed.

Also, you didn't answer the fundamental question of why she had to be pushed by blue dogs, not the other way round as would make more sense.

Arguing that the Senate should have passed the Green New Deal, MFA, etc.. which are extremely radical bills and contain specific proposals that an overwhelming majority of Americans oppose, is a dumb idea in comparison to arguing that the Senate should have passed more moderate bills that contain ideas most Americans agree with.

The GND and MFA are dead on arrival in any Senate because we don't have the money, and cannot reasonably allocate resources to accomplish the radical proposals contained in those bills. Not even mentioning the fact that American's strongly reject those bills as well.

[Slander and/or Libel]

Liberal Twitter/Atlas is going to be in for a big letdown when the Squad's endorsement has only a modest effect on polling. Sanders's campaign has been over since he had a heart attack.

Because Pelosi's two purposes in life are:
1) to raise as much money as possible from corporate donors to give out to house dems - the only reason she has her job, because she sucks in every other way
2) to try to protect blue dog dems to a fault by being stupidly milquetoast, despite this attempt repeatedly backfiring on her

Right, because when Pelosi shepherded Obamacare, Dodd-Frank, and Waxman-Markey through the 111th Congress, her only goal was to raise money and protect Blue Dogs.

If Pelosi didn't get through those watered down bills, the Obama admin would have had her head on a spike.

A better question is: why did she wait forever to do an impeachment inquiry, how the hell did she just merely pass the border bill the repibs wanted when kids were being put in cages and repub voters were even outraged by it, and why has she killed hearings on MFA, GND?

She waited forever on impeachment because the Russia issue wasn't going to sell Americans on the idea. Good thing she did wait, as it was only a matter of time before Donny committed more corrupt and immoral acts that American's widely view as disqualifying....

She killed hearings on the MFA because it was a waste of time and the bill wouldn't even come close to passing the house. The Green New Deal was one of the most poorly drafted pieces of "legislation" that I have seen in years (mentioning cows farting, etc...) and was INCREDIBLY UNPOPULAR. Do you want to WIN, or do you want to grandstand for ideas that will not become reality at anytime and that will make our common goals of eliminating income inequality and a cleaner environment less popular?

1) I'd prefer to not die / not have my children die, and a dramatic shift in urgency / the political conversation is necessary to do so

2) NONE of her bills (moderate OR leftist ones) have any chance of getting passed through the Senate/white House.  That's not the point!  The point is to shift the conversation, put pressure on Trump/Republicans, and communicate important policy priorities in an effort to set the stage to win and then govern effectively.

3) Also, Donny was committing a ton of corrupt acts before the Ukraine scandal, which they should have focused on it they were smart (emoluments, etc) by investigating and then communicating to the public about (then if public opinion changed in response to effective communication, moving to impeach).  I agree the Russia stuff was overplayed.

Also, you didn't answer the fundamental question of why she had to be pushed by blue dogs, not the other way round as would make more sense.

If enough of her caucus had told Pelosi that nothing they'd seen was enough for them to support an impeachment vote, what would she have to gain by forcing a vote and probably losing? What tools did/does she have to push those members that she didn't use?

[Heebie Jeebie]

Liberal Twitter/Atlas is going to be in for a big letdown when the Squad's endorsement has only a modest effect on polling. Sanders's campaign has been over since he had a heart attack.

Because Pelosi's two purposes in life are:
1) to raise as much money as possible from corporate donors to give out to house dems - the only reason she has her job, because she sucks in every other way
2) to try to protect blue dog dems to a fault by being stupidly milquetoast, despite this attempt repeatedly backfiring on her

Right, because when Pelosi shepherded Obamacare, Dodd-Frank, and Waxman-Markey through the 111th Congress, her only goal was to raise money and protect Blue Dogs.

If Pelosi didn't get through those watered down bills, the Obama admin would have had her head on a spike.

A better question is: why did she wait forever to do an impeachment inquiry, how the hell did she just merely pass the border bill the repibs wanted when kids were being put in cages and repub voters were even outraged by it, and why has she killed hearings on MFA, GND?

She waited forever on impeachment because the Russia issue wasn't going to sell Americans on the idea. Good thing she did wait, as it was only a matter of time before Donny committed more corrupt and immoral acts that American's widely view as disqualifying....

She killed hearings on the MFA because it was a waste of time and the bill wouldn't even come close to passing the house. The Green New Deal was one of the most poorly drafted pieces of "legislation" that I have seen in years (mentioning cows farting, etc...) and was INCREDIBLY UNPOPULAR. Do you want to WIN, or do you want to grandstand for ideas that will not become reality at anytime and that will make our common goals of eliminating income inequality and a cleaner environment less popular?

1) I'd prefer to not die / not have my children die, and a dramatic shift in urgency / the political conversation is necessary to do so

2) NONE of her bills (moderate OR leftist ones) have any chance of getting passed through the Senate/white House.  That's not the point!  The point is to shift the conversation, put pressure on Trump/Republicans, and communicate important policy priorities in an effort to set the stage to win and then govern effectively.

3) Also, Donny was committing a ton of corrupt acts before the Ukraine scandal, which they should have focused on it they were smart (emoluments, etc) by investigating and then communicating to the public about (then if public opinion changed in response to effective communication, moving to impeach).  I agree the Russia stuff was overplayed.

Also, you didn't answer the fundamental question of why she had to be pushed by blue dogs, not the other way round as would make more sense.

If enough of her caucus had told Pelosi that nothing they'd seen was enough for them to support an impeachment vote, what would she have to gain by forcing a vote and probably losing? What tools did/does she have to push those members that she didn't use?

Haven't you heard of the Green Lantern Theory of Political Leadership?  The Speaker's gavel is a Power Ring, and Pelosi can achieve any political or policy objective if only she tries hard enough or uses the right tactics.  She is functionally all-powerful, and whenever she can't get something done, it's because she's not trying hard enough, or not trying smart enough.

[RaphaelDLG]

Liberal Twitter/Atlas is going to be in for a big letdown when the Squad's endorsement has only a modest effect on polling. Sanders's campaign has been over since he had a heart attack.

Because Pelosi's two purposes in life are:
1) to raise as much money as possible from corporate donors to give out to house dems - the only reason she has her job, because she sucks in every other way
2) to try to protect blue dog dems to a fault by being stupidly milquetoast, despite this attempt repeatedly backfiring on her

Right, because when Pelosi shepherded Obamacare, Dodd-Frank, and Waxman-Markey through the 111th Congress, her only goal was to raise money and protect Blue Dogs.

If Pelosi didn't get through those watered down bills, the Obama admin would have had her head on a spike.

A better question is: why did she wait forever to do an impeachment inquiry, how the hell did she just merely pass the border bill the repibs wanted when kids were being put in cages and repub voters were even outraged by it, and why has she killed hearings on MFA, GND?

She waited forever on impeachment because the Russia issue wasn't going to sell Americans on the idea. Good thing she did wait, as it was only a matter of time before Donny committed more corrupt and immoral acts that American's widely view as disqualifying....

She killed hearings on the MFA because it was a waste of time and the bill wouldn't even come close to passing the house. The Green New Deal was one of the most poorly drafted pieces of "legislation" that I have seen in years (mentioning cows farting, etc...) and was INCREDIBLY UNPOPULAR. Do you want to WIN, or do you want to grandstand for ideas that will not become reality at anytime and that will make our common goals of eliminating income inequality and a cleaner environment less popular?

1) I'd prefer to not die / not have my children die, and a dramatic shift in urgency / the political conversation is necessary to do so

2) NONE of her bills (moderate OR leftist ones) have any chance of getting passed through the Senate/white House.  That's not the point!  The point is to shift the conversation, put pressure on Trump/Republicans, and communicate important policy priorities in an effort to set the stage to win and then govern effectively.

3) Also, Donny was committing a ton of corrupt acts before the Ukraine scandal, which they should have focused on it they were smart (emoluments, etc) by investigating and then communicating to the public about (then if public opinion changed in response to effective communication, moving to impeach).  I agree the Russia stuff was overplayed.

Also, you didn't answer the fundamental question of why she had to be pushed by blue dogs, not the other way round as would make more sense.

If enough of her caucus had told Pelosi that nothing they'd seen was enough for them to support an impeachment vote, what would she have to gain by forcing a vote and probably losing? What tools did/does she have to push those members that she didn't use?

I'm not saying that she should do that, but

A) her public statements dismissive of impeachment were counter-productive and

B) ideally she'd have coordinated a much more aggressive use of house subpoena power to investigate trump and uncover stuff that'd either build support for impeachment or at the very least just benefit democrats politically.  but for some reason she has been terrified that doing so is a bad idea when republicans did it to great success and all recent evidence says the contrary

[LiberalDem19]

So if New York goes to Biden or Warren, will AOC be throwing her support behind Biden or Warren? After all, bernie logic dictates that superdelegates must support the winner of their state. So if Biden or Warren wins, she'll need to listen to the voice of the people and support one of those two at the convention.

[RaphaelDLG]

Liberal Twitter/Atlas is going to be in for a big letdown when the Squad's endorsement has only a modest effect on polling. Sanders's campaign has been over since he had a heart attack.

Because Pelosi's two purposes in life are:
1) to raise as much money as possible from corporate donors to give out to house dems - the only reason she has her job, because she sucks in every other way
2) to try to protect blue dog dems to a fault by being stupidly milquetoast, despite this attempt repeatedly backfiring on her

Right, because when Pelosi shepherded Obamacare, Dodd-Frank, and Waxman-Markey through the 111th Congress, her only goal was to raise money and protect Blue Dogs.

If Pelosi didn't get through those watered down bills, the Obama admin would have had her head on a spike.

A better question is: why did she wait forever to do an impeachment inquiry, how the hell did she just merely pass the border bill the repibs wanted when kids were being put in cages and repub voters were even outraged by it, and why has she killed hearings on MFA, GND?

She waited forever on impeachment because the Russia issue wasn't going to sell Americans on the idea. Good thing she did wait, as it was only a matter of time before Donny committed more corrupt and immoral acts that American's widely view as disqualifying....

She killed hearings on the MFA because it was a waste of time and the bill wouldn't even come close to passing the house. The Green New Deal was one of the most poorly drafted pieces of "legislation" that I have seen in years (mentioning cows farting, etc...) and was INCREDIBLY UNPOPULAR. Do you want to WIN, or do you want to grandstand for ideas that will not become reality at anytime and that will make our common goals of eliminating income inequality and a cleaner environment less popular?

1) I'd prefer to not die / not have my children die, and a dramatic shift in urgency / the political conversation is necessary to do so

2) NONE of her bills (moderate OR leftist ones) have any chance of getting passed through the Senate/white House.  That's not the point!  The point is to shift the conversation, put pressure on Trump/Republicans, and communicate important policy priorities in an effort to set the stage to win and then govern effectively.

3) Also, Donny was committing a ton of corrupt acts before the Ukraine scandal, which they should have focused on it they were smart (emoluments, etc) by investigating and then communicating to the public about (then if public opinion changed in response to effective communication, moving to impeach).  I agree the Russia stuff was overplayed.

Also, you didn't answer the fundamental question of why she had to be pushed by blue dogs, not the other way round as would make more sense.

If enough of her caucus had told Pelosi that nothing they'd seen was enough for them to support an impeachment vote, what would she have to gain by forcing a vote and probably losing? What tools did/does she have to push those members that she didn't use?

Haven't you heard of the Green Lantern Theory of Political Leadership?  The Speaker's gavel is a Power Ring, and Pelosi can achieve any political or policy objective if only she tries hard enough or uses the right tactics.  She is functionally all-powerful, and whenever she can't get something done, it's because she's not trying hard enough, or not trying smart enough.

Look, nobody is expecting Nancy Pelosi to get anything done in terms of passing legislation through Trump's desk, but ideally her job would be to position Democrats rhetorically for the next election and beyond by passing bills through the House that dems can run on, not undercutting /damaging popular members of her own caucus who are speaking out on key issues, and using subpoena power/power of the purse to damage/embarass Trump.

She has been leading from behind on all of those counts, and has mind-bogglingly spent her energy attacking MFA, GND, Omar, AoC, etc.  She should at the very least stay neutral on all those things.

[RaphaelDLG]

Liberal Twitter/Atlas is going to be in for a big letdown when the Squad's endorsement has only a modest effect on polling. Sanders's campaign has been over since he had a heart attack.

Because Pelosi's two purposes in life are:
1) to raise as much money as possible from corporate donors to give out to house dems - the only reason she has her job, because she sucks in every other way
2) to try to protect blue dog dems to a fault by being stupidly milquetoast, despite this attempt repeatedly backfiring on her

Right, because when Pelosi shepherded Obamacare, Dodd-Frank, and Waxman-Markey through the 111th Congress, her only goal was to raise money and protect Blue Dogs.

If Pelosi didn't get through those watered down bills, the Obama admin would have had her head on a spike.

A better question is: why did she wait forever to do an impeachment inquiry, how the hell did she just merely pass the border bill the repibs wanted when kids were being put in cages and repub voters were even outraged by it, and why has she killed hearings on MFA, GND?

She waited forever on impeachment because the Russia issue wasn't going to sell Americans on the idea. Good thing she did wait, as it was only a matter of time before Donny committed more corrupt and immoral acts that American's widely view as disqualifying....

She killed hearings on the MFA because it was a waste of time and the bill wouldn't even come close to passing the house. The Green New Deal was one of the most poorly drafted pieces of "legislation" that I have seen in years (mentioning cows farting, etc...) and was INCREDIBLY UNPOPULAR. Do you want to WIN, or do you want to grandstand for ideas that will not become reality at anytime and that will make our common goals of eliminating income inequality and a cleaner environment less popular?

1) I'd prefer to not die / not have my children die, and a dramatic shift in urgency / the political conversation is necessary to do so

2) NONE of her bills (moderate OR leftist ones) have any chance of getting passed through the Senate/white House.  That's not the point!  The point is to shift the conversation, put pressure on Trump/Republicans, and communicate important policy priorities in an effort to set the stage to win and then govern effectively.

3) Also, Donny was committing a ton of corrupt acts before the Ukraine scandal, which they should have focused on it they were smart (emoluments, etc) by investigating and then communicating to the public about (then if public opinion changed in response to effective communication, moving to impeach).  I agree the Russia stuff was overplayed.

Also, you didn't answer the fundamental question of why she had to be pushed by blue dogs, not the other way round as would make more sense.

Arguing that the Senate should have passed the Green New Deal, MFA, etc.. which are extremely radical bills and contain specific proposals that an overwhelming majority of Americans oppose, is a dumb idea in comparison to arguing that the Senate should have passed more moderate bills that contain ideas most Americans agree with.

The GND and MFA are dead on arrival in any Senate because we don't have the money, and cannot reasonably allocate resources to accomplish the radical proposals contained in those bills. Not even mentioning the fact that American's strongly reject those bills as well.

Obviously much of the crap you wrote about is very debatable / not true.

Nowadays, in the age of negative polarization, elections aren't won by persuading largely mythical moderates, but by firing up your base and motivating them to turn out.

Now, some extremely radical bill like abolishing police or establishing communism would be a stupid proposal, but GND and MFA are both good policy and broadly popular among the base.

Let me tell you what is NOT going to motivate base Democrats / black voters/ young people /left Indies to turn out:  Blase proposals about giving people tax credits or doing piecemeal things to address climate change.

[Orser67]

Liberal Twitter/Atlas is going to be in for a big letdown when the Squad's endorsement has only a modest effect on polling. Sanders's campaign has been over since he had a heart attack.

Because Pelosi's two purposes in life are:
1) to raise as much money as possible from corporate donors to give out to house dems - the only reason she has her job, because she sucks in every other way
2) to try to protect blue dog dems to a fault by being stupidly milquetoast, despite this attempt repeatedly backfiring on her

Right, because when Pelosi shepherded Obamacare, Dodd-Frank, and Waxman-Markey through the 111th Congress, her only goal was to raise money and protect Blue Dogs.

If Pelosi didn't get through those watered down bills, the Obama admin would have had her head on a spike.

A better question is: why did she wait forever to do an impeachment inquiry, how the hell did she just merely pass the border bill the repibs wanted when kids were being put in cages and repub voters were even outraged by it, and why has she killed hearings on MFA, GND?

She waited forever on impeachment because the Russia issue wasn't going to sell Americans on the idea. Good thing she did wait, as it was only a matter of time before Donny committed more corrupt and immoral acts that American's widely view as disqualifying....

She killed hearings on the MFA because it was a waste of time and the bill wouldn't even come close to passing the house. The Green New Deal was one of the most poorly drafted pieces of "legislation" that I have seen in years (mentioning cows farting, etc...) and was INCREDIBLY UNPOPULAR. Do you want to WIN, or do you want to grandstand for ideas that will not become reality at anytime and that will make our common goals of eliminating income inequality and a cleaner environment less popular?

1) I'd prefer to not die / not have my children die, and a dramatic shift in urgency / the political conversation is necessary to do so

2) NONE of her bills (moderate OR leftist ones) have any chance of getting passed through the Senate/white House.  That's not the point!  The point is to shift the conversation, put pressure on Trump/Republicans, and communicate important policy priorities in an effort to set the stage to win and then govern effectively.

3) Also, Donny was committing a ton of corrupt acts before the Ukraine scandal, which they should have focused on it they were smart (emoluments, etc) by investigating and then communicating to the public about (then if public opinion changed in response to effective communication, moving to impeach).  I agree the Russia stuff was overplayed.

Also, you didn't answer the fundamental question of why she had to be pushed by blue dogs, not the other way round as would make more sense.

Arguing that the Senate should have passed the Green New Deal, MFA, etc.. which are extremely radical bills and contain specific proposals that an overwhelming majority of Americans oppose, is a dumb idea in comparison to arguing that the Senate should have passed more moderate bills that contain ideas most Americans agree with.

The GND and MFA are dead on arrival in any Senate because we don't have the money, and cannot reasonably allocate resources to accomplish the radical proposals contained in those bills. Not even mentioning the fact that American's strongly reject those bills as well.

Obviously much of the crap you wrote about is very debatable / not true.

Nowadays, in the age of negative polarization, elections aren't won by persuading largely mythical moderates, but by firing up your base and motivating them to turn out.

Now, some extremely radical bill like abolishing police or establishing communism would be a stupid proposal, but GND and MFA are both good policy and broadly popular among the base.

Let me tell you what is NOT going to motivate base Democrats / black voters/ young people /left Indies to turn out:  Blase proposals about giving people tax credits or doing piecemeal things to address climate change.

So you want to give up on every moderate, independent, and Obama/Trump voter? Seems like a great way to lose elections.

[RaphaelDLG]

Liberal Twitter/Atlas is going to be in for a big letdown when the Squad's endorsement has only a modest effect on polling. Sanders's campaign has been over since he had a heart attack.

Because Pelosi's two purposes in life are:
1) to raise as much money as possible from corporate donors to give out to house dems - the only reason she has her job, because she sucks in every other way
2) to try to protect blue dog dems to a fault by being stupidly milquetoast, despite this attempt repeatedly backfiring on her

Right, because when Pelosi shepherded Obamacare, Dodd-Frank, and Waxman-Markey through the 111th Congress, her only goal was to raise money and protect Blue Dogs.

If Pelosi didn't get through those watered down bills, the Obama admin would have had her head on a spike.

A better question is: why did she wait forever to do an impeachment inquiry, how the hell did she just merely pass the border bill the repibs wanted when kids were being put in cages and repub voters were even outraged by it, and why has she killed hearings on MFA, GND?

She waited forever on impeachment because the Russia issue wasn't going to sell Americans on the idea. Good thing she did wait, as it was only a matter of time before Donny committed more corrupt and immoral acts that American's widely view as disqualifying....

She killed hearings on the MFA because it was a waste of time and the bill wouldn't even come close to passing the house. The Green New Deal was one of the most poorly drafted pieces of "legislation" that I have seen in years (mentioning cows farting, etc...) and was INCREDIBLY UNPOPULAR. Do you want to WIN, or do you want to grandstand for ideas that will not become reality at anytime and that will make our common goals of eliminating income inequality and a cleaner environment less popular?

1) I'd prefer to not die / not have my children die, and a dramatic shift in urgency / the political conversation is necessary to do so

2) NONE of her bills (moderate OR leftist ones) have any chance of getting passed through the Senate/white House.  That's not the point!  The point is to shift the conversation, put pressure on Trump/Republicans, and communicate important policy priorities in an effort to set the stage to win and then govern effectively.

3) Also, Donny was committing a ton of corrupt acts before the Ukraine scandal, which they should have focused on it they were smart (emoluments, etc) by investigating and then communicating to the public about (then if public opinion changed in response to effective communication, moving to impeach).  I agree the Russia stuff was overplayed.

Also, you didn't answer the fundamental question of why she had to be pushed by blue dogs, not the other way round as would make more sense.

Arguing that the Senate should have passed the Green New Deal, MFA, etc.. which are extremely radical bills and contain specific proposals that an overwhelming majority of Americans oppose, is a dumb idea in comparison to arguing that the Senate should have passed more moderate bills that contain ideas most Americans agree with.

The GND and MFA are dead on arrival in any Senate because we don't have the money, and cannot reasonably allocate resources to accomplish the radical proposals contained in those bills. Not even mentioning the fact that American's strongly reject those bills as well.

Obviously much of the crap you wrote about is very debatable / not true.

Nowadays, in the age of negative polarization, elections aren't won by persuading largely mythical moderates, but by firing up your base and motivating them to turn out.

Now, some extremely radical bill like abolishing police or establishing communism would be a stupid proposal, but GND and MFA are both good policy and broadly popular among the base.

Let me tell you what is NOT going to motivate base Democrats / black voters/ young people /left Indies to turn out:  Blase proposals about giving people tax credits or doing piecemeal things to address climate change.

So you want to give up on every moderate, independent, and Obama/Trump voter? Seems like a great way to lose elections.

You don't have a good understanding of how elections work nowadays.  Read somebody like Rachel Bitecofer.

"Independent" voters overwhelmingly lean one way or the other.  The number of Obama/Trump voters is tiny and is eclipsed by the Obama voters that didn't vote / voted third party.

You campaign not to win the midpoint of the country ideologically, but the midpoint of your party, or more accurately whatever campaign style will result in as many of your people as possible turning out.

[Orser67]

Liberal Twitter/Atlas is going to be in for a big letdown when the Squad's endorsement has only a modest effect on polling. Sanders's campaign has been over since he had a heart attack.

Because Pelosi's two purposes in life are:
1) to raise as much money as possible from corporate donors to give out to house dems - the only reason she has her job, because she sucks in every other way
2) to try to protect blue dog dems to a fault by being stupidly milquetoast, despite this attempt repeatedly backfiring on her

Right, because when Pelosi shepherded Obamacare, Dodd-Frank, and Waxman-Markey through the 111th Congress, her only goal was to raise money and protect Blue Dogs.

If Pelosi didn't get through those watered down bills, the Obama admin would have had her head on a spike.

A better question is: why did she wait forever to do an impeachment inquiry, how the hell did she just merely pass the border bill the repibs wanted when kids were being put in cages and repub voters were even outraged by it, and why has she killed hearings on MFA, GND?

She waited forever on impeachment because the Russia issue wasn't going to sell Americans on the idea. Good thing she did wait, as it was only a matter of time before Donny committed more corrupt and immoral acts that American's widely view as disqualifying....

She killed hearings on the MFA because it was a waste of time and the bill wouldn't even come close to passing the house. The Green New Deal was one of the most poorly drafted pieces of "legislation" that I have seen in years (mentioning cows farting, etc...) and was INCREDIBLY UNPOPULAR. Do you want to WIN, or do you want to grandstand for ideas that will not become reality at anytime and that will make our common goals of eliminating income inequality and a cleaner environment less popular?

1) I'd prefer to not die / not have my children die, and a dramatic shift in urgency / the political conversation is necessary to do so

2) NONE of her bills (moderate OR leftist ones) have any chance of getting passed through the Senate/white House.  That's not the point!  The point is to shift the conversation, put pressure on Trump/Republicans, and communicate important policy priorities in an effort to set the stage to win and then govern effectively.

3) Also, Donny was committing a ton of corrupt acts before the Ukraine scandal, which they should have focused on it they were smart (emoluments, etc) by investigating and then communicating to the public about (then if public opinion changed in response to effective communication, moving to impeach).  I agree the Russia stuff was overplayed.

Also, you didn't answer the fundamental question of why she had to be pushed by blue dogs, not the other way round as would make more sense.

Arguing that the Senate should have passed the Green New Deal, MFA, etc.. which are extremely radical bills and contain specific proposals that an overwhelming majority of Americans oppose, is a dumb idea in comparison to arguing that the Senate should have passed more moderate bills that contain ideas most Americans agree with.

The GND and MFA are dead on arrival in any Senate because we don't have the money, and cannot reasonably allocate resources to accomplish the radical proposals contained in those bills. Not even mentioning the fact that American's strongly reject those bills as well.

Obviously much of the crap you wrote about is very debatable / not true.

Nowadays, in the age of negative polarization, elections aren't won by persuading largely mythical moderates, but by firing up your base and motivating them to turn out.

Now, some extremely radical bill like abolishing police or establishing communism would be a stupid proposal, but GND and MFA are both good policy and broadly popular among the base.

Let me tell you what is NOT going to motivate base Democrats / black voters/ young people /left Indies to turn out:  Blase proposals about giving people tax credits or doing piecemeal things to address climate change.

So you want to give up on every moderate, independent, and Obama/Trump voter? Seems like a great way to lose elections.

You don't have a good understanding of how elections work nowadays.  Read somebody like Rachel Bitecofer.

"Independent" voters overwhelmingly lean one way or the other.  The number of Obama/Trump voters is tiny and is eclipsed by the Obama voters that didn't vote / voted third party.

You campaign not to win the midpoint of the country ideologically, but the midpoint of your party, or more accurately whatever campaign style will result in as many of your people as possible turning out.

About 10% of those who voted for Trump voted for Obama, and vice versa. That's hardly a "tiny" number. The recent media focus on the WWC might be annoying, but it's not without merit:

Just 74 percent of white Obama voters with a high school diploma or less backed Mrs. Clinton in the voter study group cited by Mr. Milbank.

Similarly, the Cooperative Congressional Election Study found that Mrs. Clinton won just 78 percent of white Obama voters without a bachelor’s degree. The figure was even lower in the key Rust Belt battlegrounds.

As with every other era in U.S. history, the key to winning elections is still to drive turnout in your base and win swing voters (and, if possible, minimize turnout in your opponent's base). It's not an either-or situation, you need to both to win an election. And it's not even clear that going hard-left would be the best way to drive turnout:

Even data marshaled by a mobilization enthusiast like McElwee shows that consistent Democratic Party voters are the most left-wing kind of voter around. In other words, Obama voters who went on to back Clinton are more liberal across a range of policy areas than Obama voters who stayed home in 2016, Obama voters who went third party in 2016, and Obama voters who switched to Trump. On issue after issue, the voters who a “mobilization” strategy would target are more moderate than consistent Democrats not more left-wing than them. There are plenty of inconsistent voters in America, and it’s smart to try to get them to vote for Democrats. But the inconsistent voters aren’t some secret bloc of hard-core progressives.

[TrendsareUsuallyReal]

Maybe now Bernie can get third place in Iowa instead of 4th

[RaphaelDLG]

Liberal Twitter/Atlas is going to be in for a big letdown when the Squad's endorsement has only a modest effect on polling. Sanders's campaign has been over since he had a heart attack.

Because Pelosi's two purposes in life are:
1) to raise as much money as possible from corporate donors to give out to house dems - the only reason she has her job, because she sucks in every other way
2) to try to protect blue dog dems to a fault by being stupidly milquetoast, despite this attempt repeatedly backfiring on her

Right, because when Pelosi shepherded Obamacare, Dodd-Frank, and Waxman-Markey through the 111th Congress, her only goal was to raise money and protect Blue Dogs.

If Pelosi didn't get through those watered down bills, the Obama admin would have had her head on a spike.

A better question is: why did she wait forever to do an impeachment inquiry, how the hell did she just merely pass the border bill the repibs wanted when kids were being put in cages and repub voters were even outraged by it, and why has she killed hearings on MFA, GND?

She waited forever on impeachment because the Russia issue wasn't going to sell Americans on the idea. Good thing she did wait, as it was only a matter of time before Donny committed more corrupt and immoral acts that American's widely view as disqualifying....

She killed hearings on the MFA because it was a waste of time and the bill wouldn't even come close to passing the house. The Green New Deal was one of the most poorly drafted pieces of "legislation" that I have seen in years (mentioning cows farting, etc...) and was INCREDIBLY UNPOPULAR. Do you want to WIN, or do you want to grandstand for ideas that will not become reality at anytime and that will make our common goals of eliminating income inequality and a cleaner environment less popular?

1) I'd prefer to not die / not have my children die, and a dramatic shift in urgency / the political conversation is necessary to do so

2) NONE of her bills (moderate OR leftist ones) have any chance of getting passed through the Senate/white House.  That's not the point!  The point is to shift the conversation, put pressure on Trump/Republicans, and communicate important policy priorities in an effort to set the stage to win and then govern effectively.

3) Also, Donny was committing a ton of corrupt acts before the Ukraine scandal, which they should have focused on it they were smart (emoluments, etc) by investigating and then communicating to the public about (then if public opinion changed in response to effective communication, moving to impeach).  I agree the Russia stuff was overplayed.

Also, you didn't answer the fundamental question of why she had to be pushed by blue dogs, not the other way round as would make more sense.

Arguing that the Senate should have passed the Green New Deal, MFA, etc.. which are extremely radical bills and contain specific proposals that an overwhelming majority of Americans oppose, is a dumb idea in comparison to arguing that the Senate should have passed more moderate bills that contain ideas most Americans agree with.

The GND and MFA are dead on arrival in any Senate because we don't have the money, and cannot reasonably allocate resources to accomplish the radical proposals contained in those bills. Not even mentioning the fact that American's strongly reject those bills as well.

Obviously much of the crap you wrote about is very debatable / not true.

Nowadays, in the age of negative polarization, elections aren't won by persuading largely mythical moderates, but by firing up your base and motivating them to turn out.

Now, some extremely radical bill like abolishing police or establishing communism would be a stupid proposal, but GND and MFA are both good policy and broadly popular among the base.

Let me tell you what is NOT going to motivate base Democrats / black voters/ young people /left Indies to turn out:  Blase proposals about giving people tax credits or doing piecemeal things to address climate change.

So you want to give up on every moderate, independent, and Obama/Trump voter? Seems like a great way to lose elections.

You don't have a good understanding of how elections work nowadays.  Read somebody like Rachel Bitecofer.

"Independent" voters overwhelmingly lean one way or the other.  The number of Obama/Trump voters is tiny and is eclipsed by the Obama voters that didn't vote / voted third party.

You campaign not to win the midpoint of the country ideologically, but the midpoint of your party, or more accurately whatever campaign style will result in as many of your people as possible turning out.

About 10% of those who voted for Trump voted for Obama, and vice versa. That's hardly a "tiny" number. The recent media focus on the WWC might be annoying, but it's not without merit:

Just 74 percent of white Obama voters with a high school diploma or less backed Mrs. Clinton in the voter study group cited by Mr. Milbank.

Similarly, the Cooperative Congressional Election Study found that Mrs. Clinton won just 78 percent of white Obama voters without a bachelor’s degree. The figure was even lower in the key Rust Belt battlegrounds.

As with every other era in U.S. history, the key to winning elections is still to drive turnout in your base and win swing voters (and, if possible, minimize turnout in your opponent's base). It's not an either-or situation, you need to both to win an election. And it's not even clear that going hard-left would be the best way to drive turnout:

Even data marshaled by a mobilization enthusiast like McElwee shows that consistent Democratic Party voters are the most left-wing kind of voter around. In other words, Obama voters who went on to back Clinton are more liberal across a range of policy areas than Obama voters who stayed home in 2016, Obama voters who went third party in 2016, and Obama voters who switched to Trump. On issue after issue, the voters who a “mobilization” strategy would target are more moderate than consistent Democrats not more left-wing than them. There are plenty of inconsistent voters in America, and it’s smart to try to get them to vote for Democrats. But the inconsistent voters aren’t some secret bloc of hard-core progressives.

Yes, I actually agree with you on two counts:
1) It's not an either / or situation
2) Going hard left is not inherently more appealing than being moderate

But I'd add that

A) Appealing to swing voters has been VASTLY overemphasized as a strategy for Dems over mobilization

B) Being inspiring and having a bold message that appeals to people IS very important.  This can be someone who is center-left but in a bold, inspiring, charismatic way like Obama, but I would say that it is more often the populist message of a Sanders or Warren - as evidenced by the fact that those two are among the most appealing figures in the democratic party despite not having anywhere near the charm, backstory, or speaking ability of Barack Obama.  It's damn sure not corporate boilerplate tax credits or a message that everyone is doing just fine in today's economy.

C) In other the papers I've seen there isn't literally 10% of people changing their mind between Obama and Trump - it's 1% of people changing their mind between Obama and Trump, and the other 9% of D-leaning or R-leaning people who are inspired to turn out in one election, but don't show up in another or vote third party.

D) Voters who go back and forth between Democrats and third parties are ideological

[KaiserDave]

Looking forward to reading this thread once Warren has accepted the nomination.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

Having AOC and Omar is exactly the wrong message Democrat’s need to be sending next year if they have any hope of winning over moderates and independents.

Hillary didn't lose by not being Third Way enough.

[🦀🎂🦀🎂]

cracking up at the number of Twitter posts from resistance liberals and conservatives alike who are like "b- but Sanders is a white man?!?" It's almost as if AOC, Tlaib and Omar actually have an ideology and aren't dipsh**ts who see nothing outside their own skin colour.

[BP🌹]

Imo, if Pressley's the only member of the Squad to not endorse Bernie, then it more-or-less feels like a given that she'll end up endorsing Warren.

CNN now says it's the entire squad except Pressley.

Again, this hurts Warren more than a lot of people will realize.

Yeah, this is a big deal. This opens up a huge gulf between Sanders and Warren, at a time when the latter is running to the center.

And even so, if Warren gets Pressley - she's arguably the least popular member of the Squad. Her possible endorsement of Warren is overshadowed now.

If anyone is the least popular member of the Squad, it's Omar.

It's Tlaib. AOC/Omar have a lot of defenders. Tlaib doesn't have the same fanbase or populist appeal, she just has pure nastiness.

Pressley is the least-known, but she probably has the highest district approval rating of the four.

Nah, even without as many defenders, you just don't see nearly as much Tlaib-related vitriol as you do for Omar.

The right certainly loses their sh*t more over Omar/AOC, but I think mainstream democrats see value in them as fundraising tools and savvy social media talents. I think Tlaib is the one her own party would most like to be rid of - and they're likely to get their wish given the district's demographics.

lol