Obama: maybe I was "10 or 20 years too early"

[OSR stands with Israel]

Honestly his problem wasn't going far enough if anything when he had the trifecta. Same with Bill too. The irony is 3/4 of the past 4 administrations had trifectas and each wasted almost all on it on healthcare fights   

3/4? Besides Clinton and Obama, who do you have in mind?

Trump

[Tender Branson]

No, Obama's election as the first African-American President came just at the right moment.

It was more Trump's election that was odd and a fluke. But considering fu**ing flawed Hillary Clinton was his opponent, it wasn't that surprising after all. Obama is somewhat right that his presidency might have led to some increased white unease/racism again over the years + economic anxiety after 2008/2009, but not spectacularly so. Most also had to do with the snobby, out-of-touch campaign of Hillary Clinton, calling Trump supporters deplorables. Nothing better mobilized these supporters than that ... Still, Trump is an oddity and Americans favour Democratic policies in the long-run.

[HillGoose]

Only white people are criticized for "falling back into their tribe". Other ethnic groups were never expected to do any such thing. If the left had pushed an assimilationist American nationalism, maybe Trump wouldn't have happened but if they push identity politics for African Americans, Hispanics, and Muslims, white identity politics is going to happen and it's going to be justified.

don't sink to the tribalists level... they are all idiots. tribalism is socialism, no matter what "tribe" its coming from.

you should only care about people for what they can do for you. it's stupid to care about someone for what they look like.

[Hammy]

Only white people are criticized for "falling back into their tribe". Other ethnic groups were never expected to do any such thing. If the left had pushed an assimilationist American nationalism, maybe Trump wouldn't have happened but if they push identity politics for African Americans, Hispanics, and Muslims, white identity politics is going to happen and it's going to be justified.

don't sink to the tribalists level... they are all idiots. tribalism is socialism, no matter what "tribe" its coming from.

you should only care about people for what they can do for you. it's stupid to care about someone for what they look like.

Tribalism is actually quite opposite of socialism

[HillGoose]

Only white people are criticized for "falling back into their tribe". Other ethnic groups were never expected to do any such thing. If the left had pushed an assimilationist American nationalism, maybe Trump wouldn't have happened but if they push identity politics for African Americans, Hispanics, and Muslims, white identity politics is going to happen and it's going to be justified.

don't sink to the tribalists level... they are all idiots. tribalism is socialism, no matter what "tribe" its coming from.

you should only care about people for what they can do for you. it's stupid to care about someone for what they look like.

Tribalism is actually quite opposite of socialism

tribalists want you to care for people based on stupid things.

if a person of my race is willing to pay me $100,000 for a piece of land, but some guy of another race will pay me $300,000 for the same piece of land, why on Earth would I sell to the poor guy of my "tribe" rather than the wealthy one of another? To maintain "cultural integrity" or something? that's stupid, my only care is my own interests, and that's how it should be.

[President Johnson]

I think Obama was exactly eight years too early, while Clinton was exactly eight years too late.

I thought about this as well, she should have been president from 2009 to 2017 and then Obama 2017 to 2021. Although I would actually have preferred Al Gore during that time.

[mvd10]

I don't really think globalism is what drove Trump voters. The myth of the poor rural Trump-voting coal miner who lives in a village in West Virgnia where everybody is unemployed and on opioids needs to die. 70% of Trump voters made more than $50k and about 90% of Trump voters voted for Romney, who (except for some anti-China remarks) was extremely pro-trade. A lot of Trump voters who went anti-trade probably were pro-trade in 2015 since Republicans used to be more pro-trade than Democrats a couple of years ago. Immigration and the fear of losing 'their country' (changing cultural values) is what really drove them, and of course there are a lot of people who are just too partisan to vote Democrat. It's quite funny to see how left-wing journalists go to poor places in WV to see what drives Trump voters while they don't bother to stay in their own leafy and wealthy suburb to ask their Republican neighbour (who probably voted for Trump) why on earth someone with a college or postgraduate degree (42% Trump) and an income above $200k (48% Trump) voted for the demagogue when the alternative wasn't far-left by any means. Honestly, that looks like a more interesting question to me. Trump brought in some new voters who didn't vote for Romney, but the main reason he won is that he somehow managed to get 90% of the (mainly wealthy) Republicans who bitterly opposed him during the primaries to vote for him, even though he's a complete demagogue who wasn't even trustworthy on economic and/or social issues (though I guess he hasn't disappointed them).

Oh, and lol @ Obama the cosmopolitan globalist. He made the same sh**tty populist proposals on NAFTA in 2008 and he dragged his feet way too long with TPP (TTIP failing was Europe's mistake though). Major Wall Street banks like Goldman Sachs donated 75% of their presidential campaign donations to Obama in 2008 (and 25% to McCain) but in 2012 85% of their donations went to Romney (and only 15% to Obama). I think that says something.

[here2view]

I think Obama was exactly eight years too early, while Clinton was exactly eight years too late.

100%

This is the best way to put it.

I think about this from time to time. Democrats would have been better off with Hillary winning the nomination in 2008 and then Obama being nominated in 2016. I think Hillary beats Romney in 2012.

[twenty42]

This thread is invoking even more delusion than usual, and that is saying an awful lot around here.

[YE]

I mean I see what he's saying given he could have gotten a lot more done in a time of lower polarization and how some deep red states still have a problem with the color of his skin.

[Pandaguineapig]

It's funny to think that for a man that is so obsessed with his own legacy, that after 4-8 years of Trump, Obama could be one of the least consequential 2 term presidents in history

[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

In terms of America being ready for a Black President, maybe he's right, which is sad. Clearly his election had no "healing" effect in race relations as some, including Carter, were predicting. Hopefully he won't be, as a non-white President, just an "exception from the rule".

In terms of some of his moderate hero policies, he was 10 years too late. Aside of undeniably good things he'd accomplished, Obama turned out to be more of a DLC-er than Hillary, despite running to her left in primaries.

[Florida Man for Crime]

The other way to look at this is that the existence of the electoral college is a couple hundred years too late.

[Florida Man for Crime]

I think Obama was exactly eight years too early, while Clinton was exactly eight years too late.

If Hillary won in 2008 I think she would have been a one-term President. If not for Obama running an excellent campaign against Romney, he probably would also have lost reelection in 2012 and Hillary is nowhere near as good of a campaigner as Romney is so she loses. This is what I think happens


2008:

Clinton/Kaine 372
McCain/Pawlenty 166


2012:

Romney/Ryan 285
Clinton/Kaine 253

LOL @ the idea of Arkansas voting for Hillary Clinton. No need to make a Dick Morris of yourself, especially when it comes to 2012 projections.

[Florida Man for Crime]

I think Obama was exactly eight years too early, while Clinton was exactly eight years too late.

I thought about this as well, she should have been president from 2009 to 2017 and then Obama 2017 to 2021. Although I would actually have preferred Al Gore during that time.

This sort of Clinton nostalgia that a surprisingly large number of posters are expressing views the past with rose colored glasses.

If Clinton had been President, she would have won by a narrower margin than Obama, Dems never would have had 60 votes in the Senate, and consequently due to lack of a (brief) trifecta, her Presidency would have been even less productive than Obama's. At least Obama got Obamacare.

[Florida Man for Crime]

This thread is invoking even more delusion than usual, and that is saying an awful lot around here.

Yes.

[Obama-Biden Democrat]

I think Obama was exactly eight years too early, while Clinton was exactly eight years too late.

We could have just finished 8 years of President Hillary Clinton, and now we would be enjoying 8 years of President Obama. Hillary/Obama would have been a great ticket in 2008.

[KingSweden]

I don't really think globalism is what drove Trump voters. The myth of the poor rural Trump-voting coal miner who lives in a village in West Virgnia where everybody is unemployed and on opioids needs to die. 70% of Trump voters made more than $50k and about 90% of Trump voters voted for Romney, who (except for some anti-China remarks) was extremely pro-trade. A lot of Trump voters who went anti-trade probably were pro-trade in 2015 since Republicans used to be more pro-trade than Democrats a couple of years ago. Immigration and the fear of losing 'their country' (changing cultural values) is what really drove them, and of course there are a lot of people who are just too partisan to vote Democrat. It's quite funny to see how left-wing journalists go to poor places in WV to see what drives Trump voters while they don't bother to stay in their own leafy and wealthy suburb to ask their Republican neighbour (who probably voted for Trump) why on earth someone with a college or postgraduate degree (42% Trump) and an income above $200k (48% Trump) voted for the demagogue when the alternative wasn't far-left by any means. Honestly, that looks like a more interesting question to me. Trump brought in some new voters who didn't vote for Romney, but the main reason he won is that he somehow managed to get 90% of the (mainly wealthy) Republicans who bitterly opposed him during the primaries to vote for him, even though he's a complete demagogue who wasn't even trustworthy on economic and/or social issues (though I guess he hasn't disappointed them).

Oh, and lol @ Obama the cosmopolitan globalist. He made the same sh**tty populist proposals on NAFTA in 2008 and he dragged his feet way too long with TPP (TTIP failing was Europe's mistake though). Major Wall Street banks like Goldman Sachs donated 75% of their presidential campaign donations to Obama in 2008 (and 25% to McCain) but in 2012 85% of their donations went to Romney (and only 15% to Obama). I think that says something.

Some fair points here.

[Orthogonian Society Treasurer]

You must be logged in to read this quote.

I suppose this is the first written admission by an Obama insider that the administration was actively trying to undermine American national identity. Interesting.

The passage relating Obama's need for reassurance from his handlers re: his popularity and place in American history is deeply embarrassing. I'm surprised that this made it to print.

[Co-Chair Bagel23]

No, don't say that Obama, we love you!

[Politician]

Obama should have gotten things done when he had a supermajority, but he gave the Republicans a chance and they proceeded to destroy as many states as possible.

[OSR stands with Israel]

I think Obama was exactly eight years too early, while Clinton was exactly eight years too late.

If Hillary won in 2008 I think she would have been a one-term President. If not for Obama running an excellent campaign against Romney, he probably would also have lost reelection in 2012 and Hillary is nowhere near as good of a campaigner as Romney is so she loses. This is what I think happens


2008:

Clinton/Kaine 372
McCain/Pawlenty 166


2012:

Romney/Ryan 285
Clinton/Kaine 253

LOL @ the idea of Arkansas voting for Hillary Clinton. No need to make a Dick Morris of yourself, especially when it comes to 2012 projections.

AK was a Democratic State before 2008 OTL


and AK was rated as Safe Hillary in Hillary vs McCain matchup

[Mr. Smith]

Another point worth noting is that had Obama lost, his method to the top would've been discredited, and given how pretty much everyone else who tried that method either failed or underperformed (especially Fast Terry against someone like Ken Da' C%^h)...perhaps that would've been for the best.

Instead he won and 2016 started off on the assumption of a harder Midwest than actually was.

[TheDeadFlagBlues]

Every public statement and action since the election has lowered my opinion of the man.

The idea that Obama was "early" also strikes me as incredibly wrong. His politics have already aged poorly, and started looking dated as early as the Recession and the rise of the Tea Party.

The reality is that he has more in common with the Democratic Party of the '90s then the one that is emerging today, and nothing meaningful to say about the major challenges facing the country. Even if he did, his time in office exposed much of his 2008 campaign rhetoric as either empty or hypocritical.

It's not difficult for ex-presidents to remain popular, though - after all, somehow W., Bush Sr., and Bill Clinton remain so.

I read the much longer New York Times article about the book. Obama comes off as a remarkably delusional man. He questions whether he "pushed too far", whether "people just want to fall back into their tribe" without considering the obvious fact that he betrayed his campaign promises, his rhetoric and many constituencies by promoting the TPP just a few years after pledging to renegotiate NAFTA or by pushing the Clean Power Plan shortly after pledging to promote "clean coal" etc.

In the final analysis, Obama was wrong but not for the grandiose and delusional reasons that he thinks he was wrong. He revealed his true colors when he disdained people for "clinging to their guns and their religion" - his tendency to view people in this manner gave him the resolve to lie to them and to cheat them while in office without reflection or concern. I'm sure he viewed trade unions as dinosaurs, sharing this view with Cameron, who he clearly liked. Both men have been hurled into the dustbin of history.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

Every public statement and action since the election has lowered my opinion of the man.

The idea that Obama was "early" also strikes me as incredibly wrong. His politics have already aged poorly, and started looking dated as early as the Recession and the rise of the Tea Party.

The reality is that he has more in common with the Democratic Party of the '90s then the one that is emerging today, and nothing meaningful to say about the major challenges facing the country. Even if he did, his time in office exposed much of his 2008 campaign rhetoric as either empty or hypocritical.

It's not difficult for ex-presidents to remain popular, though - after all, somehow W., Bush Sr., and Bill Clinton remain so.

I read the much longer New York Times article about the book. Obama comes off as a remarkably delusional man. He questions whether he "pushed too far", whether "people just want to fall back into their tribe" without considering the obvious fact that he betrayed his campaign promises, his rhetoric and many constituencies by promoting the TPP just a few years after pledging to renegotiate NAFTA or by pushing the Clean Power Plan shortly after pledging to promote "clean coal" etc.

In the final analysis, Obama was wrong but not for the grandiose and delusional reasons that he thinks he was wrong. He revealed his true colors when he disdained people for "clinging to their guns and their religion" - his tendency to view people in this manner gave him the resolve to lie to them and to cheat them while in office without reflection or concern. I'm sure he viewed trade unions as dinosaurs, sharing this view with Cameron, who he clearly liked. Both men have been hurled into the dustbin of history.

Obama wasn't kidding when he said he would have been a Republican in the '80s. He really was a suck up to power who was a total fraud with the "hope and change" slogan. I voted for him in the 2008 primary, 2008 general election, and 2012 general election, and strongly regret ever voting for him.