Race-based Affirmative Action

[© tweed]

I oppose all forms of AA.

Talk it up.

[John Dibble]

Oppose race based, sex based, age based, and class based, which covers every kind I can think of.

[Emsworth]

I oppose all forms of affirmative action. Individuals should be hired on their merits, not on irrelevant qualities like race, ethnicity, sex, economic class, et cetera. The same applies to college admissions.

[Jake]

Oppose

[phk]

Oppose race based, sex based, age based, and class based, which covers every kind I can think of.

What about political affirmitive action for conservatives to liberal colleges?

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

Oppose race based, sex based, age based, and class based, which covers every kind I can think of.

What about political affirmitive action for conservatives to liberal colleges?

Obviously we need affirmative action for stupid people.

[© tweed]

Oppose race based, sex based, age based, and class based, which covers every kind I can think of.

What about political affirmitive action for conservatives to liberal colleges?

Or affirmative action for atheist liberals attempting to attend Jerry Falwell's university. 

[AkSaber]

Oppose race based, sex based, age based, and class based, which covers every kind I can think of.

^^^^^

I oppose all forms of affirmative action. Individuals should be hired on their merits, not on irrelevant qualities like race, ethnicity, sex, economic class, et cetera. The same applies to college admissions.

^^^^^

[Ebowed]

Even Opebo opposes race based affirmative action.  The Democratic party needs to ditch this stupid platform plank.

[John Dibble]

Oppose race based, sex based, age based, and class based, which covers every kind I can think of.

What about political affirmitive action for conservatives to liberal colleges?

Oppose.

[phk]

Oppose race based, sex based, age based, and class based, which covers every kind I can think of.

What about political affirmitive action for conservatives to liberal colleges?

Or affirmative action for atheist liberals attempting to attend Jerry Falwell's university. 

Liberals generally stay away from that crap.

Conservatives usually go to Berkeley thinking it was a bastion of conservative values.

[opebo]

Even Opebo opposes race based affirmative action.  The Democratic party needs to ditch this stupid platform plank.

Well, it does seem a little intrusive to me, and at times counterproductive due to working class white resentment and a perceived devaluation of black 'acheivement', but one must admit is has done a lot of good for blacks - in fact for them it is one of the few bright spots of the last 20-30 years.

I certainly don't mind if it is continued, however generous welfare, free health care and education, as well as some form of reparations would work as well.

[Dave from Michigan]

oppose, i got in a arguement with some of my black coworkers over this issue that turned out ugly they didn't even have any arguements they called me racist. i refuse to discuss politics at work

[J. J.]

It depends, but it should be tailored to correct past discrimination.

[A18]

I support merit-based affirmative action, and oppose every other kind.

[ATFFL]

Oppose race based, sex based, age based, and class based, which covers every kind I can think of.

What about political affirmitive action for conservatives to liberal colleges?

Obviously we need affirmative action for stupid people.

Which is why we gave you the universities in the first place.

[Giant Saguaro]

In principle, I generally oppose all forms of AA. I think it violates the very thing it grew out of (The '64 Civil Rights Act in the case of race-based AA) and it usually amounts to reverse discrimination.

[A18]

Assuming Roberts is not another Souter, the days of race-based affirmative action are numbered.

[© tweed]

Assuming Roberts is not another Souter, the days of race-based affirmative action are numbered.

What if Gonzales is nominated?  I seem to remember O'Connor was for race-based AA (although I could be wrong) so if Gonzales and Roberts go through, that could be a wash with O'Connor/Rehnquist.

[A18]

Gonzales would be a disaster, and he won't be nominated.

[© tweed]

I think he might be, as a pander to Hispanic voters.  It might help in Florida 2006, and possibly other places.

[A18]

Maybe when Stevens dies or something. Not as a replacement for Rehnquist.

[Alcon]

Maybe when Stevens dies (assuming he does, which looks likely, given his age).

Assuming he does?  Do you know something we don't?

[© tweed]

Maybe when Stevens dies (assuming he does, which looks likely, given his age).

Assuming he does?  Do you know something we don't?

Well obviously nobody knows (except for Stevens himself possibly).  But Stevens is 85, and that alone makes him a question mark to survive through 2009.  But he's had no reported health problems, so my hunch tells me he'll make it to the next presidential term.

If he doesn't, he'll die trying; he won't retire with a Republican in office.

[dazzleman]

I am very ambivalent about race-based affirmative action.

Because I hire regularly, I have seen both sides of this issue.  I know from my own experience that people tend to hire the person with whom they feel most comfortable, and the higher level the position, the more true this is.

The person you feel most comfortable with is usually the person most like you, both in terms of class background and race.

I think that affirmative action has been both helpful and damaging to blacks, as well as women.  White women, incidentally, rather than blacks, have been the biggest beneficiaries of affirmative action. 

It has been helpful in the sense that it simply adds an incentive to the hiring manager to move a little bit beyond his comfort zone, and consider people of other backgrounds for a desirable position, people who may have been dismissed previously.  In this sense, it works as intended, in getting qualified blacks considered for good positions.

On the other hand, it has been harmful in its implementation because it has created a situation in which blacks are held to a lower standard, and when their performance is below par, it is harder to get rid of them because of feared legal action, and it has helped create an environment in which blacks will sometimes claim that racism was behind their firing, even when it was their own performance.  This is also true of women, who will often claim that their poor performance is because of gender discrimination when it is not. 

The effect of this is to cancel out the incentive to consider blacks and/or women for more responsible positions.  Because it is effectively more difficult to get rid of an incompetent black person or woman, you must be much more sure of them before you hire them, and can't afford to take as much of a risk with them.

To sum up my views, I would say that in theory, I really don't believe in race-based affirmative action.  In a perfect world, I would oppose it unequivocally.  In the real world, I could support some of the more subtle forms of it.  I think you can do a lot of things if you decline to be too specific about what you're doing, and affirmative action is one of these things.  I don't think it hurts so much to give an edge to a person who has not had a lot of good breaks in life; I see so many people who have had the way paved for them since day one, and sometimes the person who has had to try harder will do a better job.  But I think the politically correct direction in which affirmative action has veered has largely been destructive.

I would also say that affirmative action acts to some extent as a safety valve, that helps us to avoid addressing some of the real issues.  In general, blacks are significantly more poorly educated than whites, for a number of reasons, and affirmative action does not help with this because it comes along too late.  It would be better to look for new and innovative ways to improve black education from the outset.  I have come around to believing that parental attitude and involvement is the most important component of education, far more important than the racial composition of a school or the amount of money spent.  A grassroots outreach program to convince parents of at-risk children to support their children's education could produce at least some modest positive results.  I would couple this with vouchers to allow parents to get their children out of failing schools.  If civil rights groups like the NAACP spent half the time and energy on this as they spend on trying to get integration through the courts, an effort that has failed miserably and wouldn't help even if it succeeded, there could be some improvement in the overall situation.  I won't hold my breath waiting, though.