Senate Bill: Fix the Regions Amendment (Rejected)

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Just what Senate's rules are you talking about Xahar?

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[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

My amendment to condense Article 4.2-4.4 into one section:

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All the rules are designed using relative constructs connected to the size of the chamber. Right now it is ten becuase of this:

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Change that and the rules are constructed so as to produce a number dependent on what that clause of the Constitution says and you have to change that to modify the Senate anyway.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Ah, Xahar? Anybody?

[President Tyrion]

I would like to see a clause that prevents an "activist" governor from gumming up a constitutionally mandated process.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

What do you suggest?

[President Tyrion]

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This amendment, at first glance, seems rather hefty, so I'll take suggestions as well.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

I would prefer it be required that it be someone from the region of the Governor in question for one.

Also as you said, it seems kind of bulky for some reason. Maybe that is unavoidable, but we should try and see if it isn't.

[President Tyrion]

I would prefer it be required that it be someone from the region of the Governor in question for one.

Also as you said, it seems kind of bulky for some reason. Maybe that is unavoidable, but we should try and see if it isn't.

I agree.

I think that it's important to allow the Senate to overturn the committee if they choose to bully someone out. I'm not sure how to make it more compact.

Here's a new version, including your suggestion.

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[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

As to the other point that Xahar made about the transition of the seats. I have experience wtih this from back when we attempted to flip the Regional and At-Large seat elections.

You would hold new elections for all the seats and those you want be up in the next election two months later would have a two month term that first time, the same way they divided up the real life Senate into classes. That way at all times, everyone has their fair representation along the lines of the new boundaries or in equal proportions if at-large from the date of effectiveness, onward.

I would point out that there would be numerous offices having just been abolished and therefore no shortage of Senate candidates.

You would establish the process for the transition ahead of time in the amendment and set a effectiveness date that is reasonable so as to ensure a smooth transition.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Does anyone else have any thoughts about Tyrion's text proposal?

[tmthforu94]

I'm not sure if I agree with the committee being able to remove someone who disagrees, then has the power to make their own choice on who takes their place (which would likely be someone supportive of their plan). The region should definitely be able to select their representative, and if, after that, they are still at an impasse, they'll need to go back to the drawing board.

[President Tyrion]

I'm not sure if I agree with the committee being able to remove someone who disagrees, then has the power to make their own choice on who takes their place (which would likely be someone supportive of their plan). The region should definitely be able to select their representative, and if, after that, they are still at an impasse, they'll need to go back to the drawing board.

Should we give the power to replace the dissenter to the Senate?

[tmthforu94]

I'm not sure if I agree with the committee being able to remove someone who disagrees, then has the power to make their own choice on who takes their place (which would likely be someone supportive of their plan). The region should definitely be able to select their representative, and if, after that, they are still at an impasse, they'll need to go back to the drawing board.

Should we give the power to replace the dissenter to the Senate?

Personally, I think it would be more appropriate to give it to the region they represent. Perhaps the regional legislature?

[President Tyrion]

I'm not sure if I agree with the committee being able to remove someone who disagrees, then has the power to make their own choice on who takes their place (which would likely be someone supportive of their plan). The region should definitely be able to select their representative, and if, after that, they are still at an impasse, they'll need to go back to the drawing board.

Should we give the power to replace the dissenter to the Senate?

Personally, I think it would be more appropriate to give it to the region they represent. Perhaps the regional legislature?

I don't know if I want to explicitly involve a body the constitution doesn't recognize though. I guess we're already on thin ice with Governors in the first place, but I don't know.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

I agree with Tmth on this one. The purpose of the Governor's doing it is to have them represented and it would be better to have their elected representatives making the selection then to have people from other region's plucking someone randomly from within the region.

[President Tyrion]

I agree with Tmth on this one. The purpose of the Governor's doing it is to have them represented and it would be better to have their elected representatives making the selection then to have people from other region's plucking someone randomly from within the region.

Sure, I can agree with that.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

So an amendment is in order then.

[tmthforu94]

Basing it off the amendment Tyrion offered, as I'm a little lost on what the overall text of this amendment is looking like...I introduce the following amendment:

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[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Unfortunately we really don't have a text. WE have a serious of disconnected amendments here.

This is what happens when I have a family crisis in the middle of a floor debate, I should have policed amendment quality more closely.


We have the OP

and then these:
Amendment 57:12 by Tmthforu94

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[/quote]

Amendment 57:24 by Maxwell

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[/quote]

[President Tyrion]

Basing it off the amendment Tyrion offered, as I'm a little lost on what the overall text of this amendment is looking like...I introduce the following amendment:

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I'm not sure I'm on board with this, because it basically gives the task of overseeing the process to the legislature. I'd rather the legislature just choose the replacement, making the text of the full amendment proposed:

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[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Also any amendments should bring some sense to the underlying text structure.


Kind of not going to make it optional either.

[President Tyrion]

Er, looks like we lost some words on the way, which is your point, I think.

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[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Not exactly, but that is important too.


What I mean is providing some structure to the underlying bill. Compining all these components into one "Amendment Text" with sections and so forth, as well as precise instructions as to where/how each pieces is to be inserted into the Constitution. Right now it is a confused mess of disjointed blocks and pieces.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

To be more precise, has the OP been erased and 57:24 is the current text minus the strikethroguh, or is that 4 region thing still part of this?

[President Tyrion]

Aw man, I was hoping someone would bite the bullet for me. OK, I'll do this sh!t. Just remember my work when I actually swear in, my dear future colleagues .

To be more precise, has the OP been erased and 57:24 is the current text minus the strikethroguh, or is that 4 region thing still part of this?

I think tmth's amendment passed (which I think was 57:12), as did Maxwell's (57:24), so 57:24 provides the groundwork for the text.

I HEREBY OFFER THIS AMENDMENT AS AN AMALGAMATION OF MY, TMTH'S, AND MAXWELL'S IDEAS. I URGE MY FELLOW SENATORS TO WITHDRAW THEIR OUTSTANDING INDIVIDUAL AMENDMENT PROPOSALS IF THEY SUPPORT THE TERMS OF MINE.

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This is the text. Questions? Comments? Concerns? Awards for me for having read through 7 pages of this stuff?