Senate Bill: Fix the Regions Amendment (Rejected)

[DemPGH]

Fix the regions amendment

The number of regions shall be reduced to four.

Sponsor: Senator Napoleon
Slot: Forum Affairs

Senator, you may advocate or give some details at your convenience!

At some point we'll need to address the look of realignment were this to happen.

[Maxwell]

This is something we need to consider, and I have announced favorability to this kind of change. However, it seems that the Senator has already abandoned this type of reform for something that completely shatters the foundations of the game (as announced in his Presidential campaign thread). I believe we can fix this game and keep the foundations, if we take care with how we handle lowering the number of regions. Some have suggested combining the Pacific and the Midwest, which I think is problematic and ham-handed, but its a start at some thought.

[President Tyrion]

I think a reduction to 4 regions would reduce the value of regional issues. I think the problem is activity, not an overdependence on regional issues, so we should try to address that, rather than just trying to drop the number of regions.

[TJ in Oregon]

While the merger itself could be an interesting ordeal to sort out, I don't think I can support ripping apart the unique culture of each or some sort of exercise in gerrymandering to try and placate political opposition. I don't think these sorts of amendments can pass a public vote either, barring some scandal (perhaps chopping up the Pacific could have right after its abolishment crisis). Aside from a scenario like that, chopping up regions treads on too many toes to get the support needed.

[Gass3268]

I personally would like to go down to 3 regions.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

The hard part is always hammering out the details of the reconfiguration and ensuring you don't doom it from getting the necessary support in the process.


Then of course you also have to do deal with the Senate. Just ignoring the issue doesn't work because the simple act of reducing the regions, shrinks the Senate by however many Regions you remove. 

[Napoleon]

I am fine with the Nix plan.

[TNF]

I am fine with the Nix plan.

[Sbane]

The nix plan does sound pretty interesting...

[TJ in Oregon]

Why is it that we need to eliminate 2 regions? We have more people in this game than ever before, yet we managed to have 5 for years.

[Maxwell]

Wasn't this from the campaign? It does seem decently hammered out.

However, should we set a constructive date in which this comes into effect if it is passed? I think we need to ease into this rather than rush.

[President Tyrion]

You must be logged in to read this quote.

We're expanding the federal legislature? That's seems fine with me, considering the regional reduction. However, is it important to preserve parity between regional and At-Large seats? I wouldn't mind a 15-man federal legislature with 9 regional and 6 At-Large seats.

[ZuWo]

From what I have read and seen I get the impression that there are quite a few older players - people who have been in the game for years - who have a special relationship with "their" region. If you follow through with your plan and all of a sudden dissolve these regions, which, at least in the case of the Mdieast, IDS and Northeast, are healthy and function well, I predict that a substantial part of these guys will leave the game.

[Napoleon]

From what I have read and seen I get the impression that there are quite a few older players - people who have been in the game for years - who have a special relationship with "their" region. If you follow through with your plan and all of a sudden dissolve these regions, which, at least in the case of the Mdieast, IDS and Northeast, are healthy and function well, I predict that a substantial part of these guys will leave the game.

That's unfortunate I guess.

[Хahar 🤔]

The issue with changing the number of regional senators is that it would require a change in the structure of the Senate at the same time as the dramatic change in the structure of Atlasia. It would be simpler to change the five regional seats to five district seats; since the districts would be drawn by governors, this would further serve to empower governors.

From what I have read and seen I get the impression that there are quite a few older players - people who have been in the game for years - who have a special relationship with "their" region. If you follow through with your plan and all of a sudden dissolve these regions, which, at least in the case of the Mdieast, IDS and Northeast, are healthy and function well, I predict that a substantial part of these guys will leave the game.

Name these players.

[Maxwell]

Well if we want to make an actual change, let's get a look at the constitution for a second.

https://uselectionatlas.org/AFEWIKI/index.php/Article_IV_of_the_Third_Constitution

Article 4 states that any change in the regional boundaries requires two things: Consent of the regions involved, and consent of the Senate. While that sounds exactly like its something for an amendment, it doesn't seem to be case here. Would this instead be a resolution or act?

[Napoleon]

Well if we want to make an actual change, let's get a look at the constitution for a second.

https://uselectionatlas.org/AFEWIKI/index.php/Article_IV_of_the_Third_Constitution

Article 4 states that any change in the regional boundaries requires two things: Consent of the regions involved, and consent of the Senate. While that sounds exactly like its something for an amendment, it doesn't seem to be case here. Would this instead be a resolution or act?

There is more than just changing boundaries required here so an amendment is very necessary.

[TJ in Oregon]

Name these players.

I can't speak for anyone else, but I'd probably lose quite a bit of interest if the Mideast was dissolved or altered in a major way. It's a bit like destroying my history in the game and much of what I am accustomed to in it.

[Maxwell]

I am for the Nix plan as long as it halts the conversation of reforming far beyond it. I may have a small write-up later tonight or tomorrow involving some of these changes. I do like the idea of the current Governors setting up the map, should we set some dates and deadlines though?

[President Tyrion]

I am for the Nix plan as long as it halts the conversation of reforming far beyond it. I may have a small write-up later tonight or tomorrow involving some of these changes. I do like the idea of the current Governors setting up the map, should we set some dates and deadlines though?

I honestly think the Nix plan is a good compromise between the two positions. I'm not sure it goes far enough, but I understand those who feel otherwise.

As a regional executive, let me know what you need from me.

[Gass3268]

I too like the Nix plan

[bore]

In terms of regions there seem to be 4 options:

1. The status quo- I think almost all of us don't think this is viable.
2. 4 regions, this has the benefit that one region (either the pacific or the midwest, but most likely the pacific) could just be liquidized, allowing all other regions to keep their statues/history etc.
3. 3 regions, this would reduce the number of offices probably to so low that all assembly's would be filled. To do this would require a radical redrawing of the map (which I don't actually see the problem with, as I don't think anyone seriously cares which state they are registered in), and a complete repeal of all regional statue.
4. No regions

Personally I like the 3 region Nix plan, but I think the most important thing is that we reduce the number of offices. The expansion of offices has basically transformed atlasia from an election sim to a policy sim, and the atlas is far to clunky to be good at being a policy sim.

[tmthforu94]

As important as history and tradition is in this game, I think our main job in the Senate should be to find ways to improve this game for the future. I've played a pretty big role in Mideast history, and I also have grown to love many of the Midwests' traditions, so I understand some of the concerns presented. However, the importance of improving this game, plus considering the fact that the new regions could still vote to adopt some of these traditions, means the Nix Plan has my support at this point. It's the best option I've seen.

[Хahar 🤔]

Personally I like the 3 region Nix plan, but I think the most important thing is that we reduce the number of offices. The expansion of offices has basically transformed atlasia from an election sim to a policy sim, and the atlas is far to clunky to be good at being a policy sim.

This is the most important point.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

But on the flip side, an elections sim in isolation from the policy simulator has no purpose for existing and nothing to base it on. It has to be a balance or you have elections based on personality and petty crap.