North Carolina and Republicans' push to the extreme right

[barfbag]

I was watching an Assembly hearing on the voter suppression legislation; one of the speakers testifed that white males in NC have one of the worst turnout rates relative to their population. The voter ID legislation may actually end up hurting the Republicans.

Voter ID disproportionately affects the groups with low turnout rate. The impact is most felt in states with very big Hispanic population.

Since North Carolina doesn't have a huge Hispanic population like Arizona, I am not sure that the impact is that great.

Voter ID may impact the youth vote, but it may also impact the elderly vote.


In my opinion, the most alarming thing NC Republicans are doing is to try end the child taxes credit for students who vote from their college. Ending early voting and same day voter registration are close second and third.

What do ending child tax credits and having your kid vote from college have anything to do with each other. Why should you get a child tax credit if your child is over 18 anyway?

I don't understand with the big hurrah is on the left with getting rid of voting machines for early voting. I thought voting by machine was only for the actual voting day that day. If you have to mail your paper ballot early because you  are going on vacation than fine I understand but having voting machines open for 2 weeks? That's just insanity to me.

I agree with you however why can't vote and register to vote on the same day?

Like I said above, there will insanely long lines and people will leave, having not voted (aka Florida 2012).

There are tons of things we can do to keep election day just once every 4 years. We can have more polling locations, instead of carding people for ID, have fingerprinting set up at the booths, open polls earlier or even at midnight, and make election day a national holiday. One or all of these things would work. We don't need to risk people voting multiple times on multiple days.

Sure. Let's take DNA samples and check criminal records while they are at it.

See what I mean. The Democrats are against fair elections. I suggest a simple way to eliminate voter fraud and we get a smart ass remark about DNA testing and criminal records as opposed to another idea. Please explain to me in depth detail what is so bad about stopping voter fraud. Now, I've already moved away from the voter ID argument which I never argued, but most Republicans would and what I've done is call a Democrat out. The Democrat knowing full well why their party is really against voter ID, makes a smart ass remark about DNA testing and criminal records instead of staying on topic.

[illegaloperation]

See what I mean. The Democrats are against fair elections. I suggest a simple way to eliminate voter fraud and we get a smart ass remark about DNA testing and criminal records as opposed to another idea. Please explain to me in depth detail what is so bad about stopping voter fraud. Now, I've already moved away from the voter ID argument which I never argued, but most Republicans would and what I've done is call a Democrat out. The Democrat knowing full well why their party is really against voter ID, makes a smart ass remark about DNA testing and criminal records instead of staying on topic.

The leading cause of voter fraud is absentee ballot. In person impersonation voter fraud is rare.

Voter ID does not do anything to combat absentee ballot fraud.

If Republicans are REALLY trying to combat voter fraud, they would end absentee ballot (except for those under special circumstances).

[barfbag]

See what I mean. The Democrats are against fair elections. I suggest a simple way to eliminate voter fraud and we get a smart ass remark about DNA testing and criminal records as opposed to another idea. Please explain to me in depth detail what is so bad about stopping voter fraud. Now, I've already moved away from the voter ID argument which I never argued, but most Republicans would and what I've done is call a Democrat out. The Democrat knowing full well why their party is really against voter ID, makes a smart ass remark about DNA testing and criminal records instead of staying on topic.

The leading cause of voter fraud is absentee ballot. In person impersonation voter fraud is rare.

Voter ID does not do anything to combat absentee ballot fraud.

If Republicans are REALLY trying to combat voter fraud, they would end absentee ballot (except for those under special circumstances).

Absentee ballots need to stop too. I'm not sure if I said that yet. I've argued all along to end absentee ballots except for the military. Glad to see we agree on something

[greenforest32]

Looks like the voter suppression bill has arrived. I'm surprised they're leaving out felony disenfranchisement?

http://pulse.ncpolicywatch.org/2013/07/23/worse-than-imagined-voter-suppression-bill-emerges/

You must be logged in to read this quote.

[RedSLC]

Looks like the voter suppression bill has arrived. I'm surprised they're leaving out felony disenfranchisement?

http://pulse.ncpolicywatch.org/2013/07/23/worse-than-imagined-voter-suppression-bill-emerges/

You must be logged in to read this quote.

...I've got nothing.

[barfbag]

Looks like the voter suppression bill has arrived. I'm surprised they're leaving out felony disenfranchisement?

http://pulse.ncpolicywatch.org/2013/07/23/worse-than-imagined-voter-suppression-bill-emerges/

You must be logged in to read this quote.

...I've got nothing.

Agree with:

no more paid voter drives
eliminate early registration for 16 and 17 year olds
elimination of same day voter registration
a week sliced off of Early Voting
studying electronic candidate filing
repeals out of precinct voting
repeals mandatory high school voting drives
limits those who can assist the incompetent (Jesse Jackson shouldn't be allowed)
PAC officials not being allowed to distribute the PAC's donations

Disagree with:

everything else

Half of this bill should pass and another half shouldn't pass. Pretty much like Obamacare.

[ElectionsGuy]

This thread is a big mess now, all you get out of this is talking points, but then again some of this is entertainment to the eye.

[eric82oslo]

Here's an excellent article on the GOP voting supression efforts that at least 78% of North Carolinian voters oppose: http://www.thenation.com/blog/175395/north-carolina-republicans-push-extreme-voter-suppression-measures#

"This week, the North Carolina legislature will almost certainly pass a strict new voter ID law that could disenfranchise 318,000 registered voters who don’t have the narrow forms of accepted state-issued ID. As if that wasn’t bad enough, the bill has since been amended by Republicans to include a slew of appalling voter suppression measures."

This one is probably the most shocking part of the law in my opinion: "prevents counties from extending poll hours by one hour on election day in extraordinary circumstances (like lengthy lines)"

"The bill even eliminates Citizens Awareness Month to encourage voter registration, notes Brent Laurenz, executive director of the nonpartisan North Carolina Center for Voter Education. Because God forbid we encourage people to vote! The proposed bill eliminates nearly all of the democratic advances that made North Carolina one of the most progressive Southern states when it comes to voting rights and one of the top fifteen states in voter turnout nationally, guaranteeing that there will be longer lines at the polls, less voter participation and much more voter confusion. The legislation is likely to be deeply unpopular. For example, 56 percent of North Carolinians voted early during the 2012 election. Blacks used early voting at a higher rate than whites, comprising a majority of those who voted absentee or early. According to Public Policy Polling, 78 percent of North Carolinians support the current early voting system and 75 percent have used it in the past."

"In addition, over 155,000 voters registered to vote and voted on the same day during the early voting period in 2012. “Voters expressed their satisfaction and gratitude that North Carolina had a process that afforded citizens with more opportunities to register and vote,” said a 2009 report from the state board of elections."

"Recently, Senate Rules Committee Chairman Tom Apodaca boasted that North Carolina would no longer have to go through the legal headache of complying with Section 5 of the VRA. Responded Rev. Barber of the North Carolina NAACP, “If you think you can take away our voting rights, you’ll have a headache.”"

Well answered from mister Barber. You just don't create laws that 4 out of 5 voters oppose, do you? At least not if your hope and intention is to win future elections. This new voter suppression law is in fact just as unpopular (if not more) as the failure to demand background checks for all gun buyers nationwide. That should send a strong message to a party who would do anything in their power to oppress the very people who elected them.

[Frodo]

The North Carolina GOP is a gift that just keeps on giving....   

[illegaloperation]

The North Carolina GOP is a gift that just keeps on giving....   

Basically. Hagan reelection seems a lot easier than I previously though.

Democrats will probably have a lock on the Governor mansion for a very very long time.

[barfbag]

Here's an excellent article on the GOP voting supression efforts that at least 78% of North Carolinian voters oppose: http://www.thenation.com/blog/175395/north-carolina-republicans-push-extreme-voter-suppression-measures#

"This week, the North Carolina legislature will almost certainly pass a strict new voter ID law that could disenfranchise 318,000 registered voters who don’t have the narrow forms of accepted state-issued ID. As if that wasn’t bad enough, the bill has since been amended by Republicans to include a slew of appalling voter suppression measures."

This one is probably the most shocking part of the law in my opinion: "prevents counties from extending poll hours by one hour on election day in extraordinary circumstances (like lengthy lines)"

"The bill even eliminates Citizens Awareness Month to encourage voter registration, notes Brent Laurenz, executive director of the nonpartisan North Carolina Center for Voter Education. Because God forbid we encourage people to vote! The proposed bill eliminates nearly all of the democratic advances that made North Carolina one of the most progressive Southern states when it comes to voting rights and one of the top fifteen states in voter turnout nationally, guaranteeing that there will be longer lines at the polls, less voter participation and much more voter confusion. The legislation is likely to be deeply unpopular. For example, 56 percent of North Carolinians voted early during the 2012 election. Blacks used early voting at a higher rate than whites, comprising a majority of those who voted absentee or early. According to Public Policy Polling, 78 percent of North Carolinians support the current early voting system and 75 percent have used it in the past."

"In addition, over 155,000 voters registered to vote and voted on the same day during the early voting period in 2012. “Voters expressed their satisfaction and gratitude that North Carolina had a process that afforded citizens with more opportunities to register and vote,” said a 2009 report from the state board of elections."

"Recently, Senate Rules Committee Chairman Tom Apodaca boasted that North Carolina would no longer have to go through the legal headache of complying with Section 5 of the VRA. Responded Rev. Barber of the North Carolina NAACP, “If you think you can take away our voting rights, you’ll have a headache.”"

Well answered from mister Barber. You just don't create laws that 4 out of 5 voters oppose, do you? At least not if your hope and intention is to win future elections. This new voter suppression law is in fact just as unpopular (if not more) as the failure to demand background checks for all gun buyers nationwide. That should send a strong message to a party who would do anything in their power to oppress the very people who elected them.

Why have early voting? We can make election day a national holiday and have presidential elections once every 4 years and on the same day as it was intended.

[Frodo]

The North Carolina GOP is a gift that just keeps on giving....  

Basically. Hagan reelection seems a lot easier than I previously though.

Democrats will probably have a lock on the Governor mansion for a very very long time.

If the state Democratic Party ever gets their act together, yes.  And if and when they finally do, it will be a different party from the one that got trounced in recent years -the old rural party we all knew is gone forever.  

[barfbag]

The North Carolina GOP is a gift that just keeps on giving....   

Basically. Hagan reelection seems a lot easier than I previously though.

Democrats will probably have a lock on the Governor mansion for a very very long time.

Parties don't really have locks on governor's mansions in this country. Exceptions being Massachusetts, New York, Vermont, usually Hawaii and Rhode Island. Are you suggesting North Carolina is on their level of blueness?

[illegaloperation]

The North Carolina GOP is a gift that just keeps on giving....   

Basically. Hagan reelection seems a lot easier than I previously though.

Democrats will probably have a lock on the Governor mansion for a very very long time.

Parties don't really have locks on governor's mansions in this country. Exceptions being Massachusetts, New York, Vermont, usually Hawaii and Rhode Island. Are you suggesting North Carolina is on their level of blueness?

You are wrong about that one.

Rhode Island, Hawaii, Vermont, and Massachusetts are among the most elastic states in the country.

[pbrower2a]

See what I mean. The Democrats are against fair elections. I suggest a simple way to eliminate voter fraud and we get a smart ass remark about DNA testing and criminal records as opposed to another idea. Please explain to me in depth detail what is so bad about stopping voter fraud. Now, I've already moved away from the voter ID argument which I never argued, but most Republicans would and what I've done is call a Democrat out. The Democrat knowing full well why their party is really against voter ID, makes a smart ass remark about DNA testing and criminal records instead of staying on topic.

The leading cause of voter fraud is absentee ballot. In person impersonation voter fraud is rare.

Voter ID does not do anything to combat absentee ballot fraud.

If Republicans are REALLY trying to combat voter fraud, they would end absentee ballot (except for those under special circumstances).

Absentee ballots need to stop too. I'm not sure if I said that yet. I've argued all along to end absentee ballots except for the military. Glad to see we agree on something

Next thing you know one will need approval from one's employer.

Voter fraud is rare. Vote fraud has almost always involved administrators of the election.

[illegaloperation]

The North Carolina GOP is a gift that just keeps on giving....  

Basically. Hagan reelection seems a lot easier than I previously though.

Democrats will probably have a lock on the Governor mansion for a very very long time.

If the state Democratic Party ever gets their act together, yes.  And if and when they finally do, it will be a different party from the one that got trounced in recent years -the old rural party we all knew is gone forever.  

Hopefully Randy Voller stops screwing up and the infighting dampen.

I wonder if Roy Cooper will challenge Pat McCrory in 2016.

[barfbag]

The North Carolina GOP is a gift that just keeps on giving....   

Basically. Hagan reelection seems a lot easier than I previously though.

Democrats will probably have a lock on the Governor mansion for a very very long time.

Parties don't really have locks on governor's mansions in this country. Exceptions being Massachusetts, New York, Vermont, usually Hawaii and Rhode Island. Are you suggesting North Carolina is on their level of blueness?

You are wrong about that one.

Rhode Island, Hawaii, Vermont, and Massachusetts are among the most elastic states in the country.

When did they last have a conservative governor? I don't mean George Pataki and Mitt Romney, I mean a Mike Huckabee, George W. Bush, Ronald Reagan, Rick Perry in the governor's mansion. North Carolina is a purplish red state and will go back and forth.

[illegaloperation]

When did they last have a conservative governor? I don't mean George Pataki and Mitt Romney, I mean a Mike Huckabee, George W. Bush, Ronald Reagan, Rick Perry in the governor's mansion. North Carolina is a purplish red state and will go back and forth.

Did you read what you yourself wrote? You didn't say anything about them being social conservatives.

Also, before the North Carolina Democratic Party blew up in scandals, it almost always win the governor race.

In a "normal" year, North Carolina would choose a Republican for president and a Democrat for governor.

Unlike many Democratic Party in other states, North Carolina Democratic Party is run by conservatives not liberals.

[barfbag]

When did they last have a conservative governor? I don't mean George Pataki and Mitt Romney, I mean a Mike Huckabee, George W. Bush, Ronald Reagan, Rick Perry in the governor's mansion. North Carolina is a purplish red state and will go back and forth.

Did you read what you yourself wrote? You didn't say anything about them being social conservatives.

Also, before the North Carolina Democratic Party blew up in scandals, it almost always win the governor race.

In a "normal" year, North Carolina would choose a Republican for president and a Democrat for governor.

Unlike many Democratic Party in other states, North Carolina Democratic Party is run by conservatives not liberals.

good for them

[cheesepizza]

I'm just going to point out that politics can change a lot in a few years.  Walker seemed like he would be ousted for sure in 2011, but things changed and he held on.

[illegaloperation]

I'm just going to point out that politics can change a lot in a few years.  Walker seemed like he would be ousted for sure in 2011, but things changed and he held on.

McCrory is on the race to break as many as possible, promises that he made when he was running for governor.

What is he going to run reelection on? The broken promises?

McCrory is also a philological liar as has been proven on numerous occasions.

[ElectionsGuy]

I'm just going to point out that politics can change a lot in a few years.  Walker seemed like he would be ousted for sure in 2011, but things changed and he held on.

McCrory is on the race to break as many as possible, promises that he made when he was running for governor.

What is he going to run reelection on? The broken promises?

McCrory is also a philological liar as has been proven on numerous occasions.

So is Walker, he has not created as many jobs as he promised. But he got re-elected by an even bigger margin. All politicians are liars, we should all know that. However incumbency is a hard thing to fight.

[eric82oslo]

Here comes more food for thought, from another article on the voting suppression law in North Carolina: http://prospect.org/article/republicans-vs-democracy-north-carolina

Quote: "Barber, the leader of the coalition, is confident that between the courtroom and voter outrage, the laws will fail. “The more you try to take people’s liberties, the more people stand up,” he says.

It will help progressives that with such a sweeping bill, they won’t be the only North Carolinians who are outraged by it. Republicans will likely alienate many more than just the Democratic voters they’re targeting, because the things they’re repealing, like early voting days or same-day registration, make elections run better—and conservatives don’t like chaotic elections any better than anyone else.

In fact, many of the “liberal” election measures Republicans want to roll back—in North Carolina and elsewhere—began as bipartisan efforts. Republican attempts to roll back early voting are particularly ironic. It was actually lawmakers in conservative Texas who, in 1985, proposed that voters be allowed to cast ballots before Election Day. The initiative wasn’t controversial, let alone partisan; when it passed by overwhelming margins, newspapers barely considered the bill news. The idea was to make voting easier and, some hoped, increase turnout among those with inflexible work and child-care schedules who have trouble making it to the polls on Election Day.

Since Texas launched its program, 32 states, mostly in the South, Midwest, and West, have adopted similar measures, almost always with bipartisan support. Some states offer nearly a month of early voting, while others offer only a week. The practice has boosted turnout in some states by 2 percent to 4 percent, and it’s proved extremely popular with people who were already voting. Election officials have found that it also offers another benefit: Giving citizens more time to make their way to a polling place not only allows more flexibility, it decreases Election Day chaos."

And more:

"If the bill goes into effect for the 2014 mid-terms, conservatives and liberals alike will find themselves waiting in longer lines, with more administrative debacles. People are bound to get upset about it. In North Carolina, 57 percent of all voters cast ballots early in 2012. Polling shows only 23 percent of state residents support shortening the voting period."

There seems to be light in the end of the tunnel as well :

"Even if the North Carolina law (or parts of it) can withstand lawsuits, public outcry has forced Republicans to back down in other states when they’ve suppressed votes and made the process messier. Just ask Florida. Republican lawmakers in 2012 were determined to make voting more difficult and passed a slew of measures, including a decrease in early-voting days. The November election was a mess of long lines and addled officials. Obama still won, but Republican legislators and Governor Rick Scott—who staunchly supported the decrease and refused to extend early-voting hours in the face of extraordinary lines—had to face public outrage over their ill-conceived changes. When they reconvened in January, lawmakers immediately started restoring the reforms they’d taken away. Early-voting days are mostly back in place in Florida, and new, more convenient polling places will be opened. Not exactly the outcome Republicans had in mind."

[greenforest32]

Here comes more food for thought, from another article on the voting suppression law in North Carolina: http://prospect.org/article/republicans-vs-democracy-north-carolina

You must be logged in to read this quote.

Looks like the "the wrong people" started voting: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Weyrich#Quotes

You must be logged in to read this quote.

And wow on that bit about Texas starting early voting. That's interesting. I'm surprised a lot of the states in the Northeast like New York, Massachusetts, Rhode Island etc still don't have it: http://www.ncsl.org/legislatures-elections/elections/absentee-and-early-voting.aspx

[eric82oslo]

Btw greenforest, why don't Oregon and Washington have any polling stations? Why are you only allowed to mail in your vote?

I think it's great and natural that all the Western states have early voting btw, since otherwise many voters would already know the winner of the election and thus see no point in turning out to vote at all. But yeah, very strange that so many northeastern and New England states still haven't introduced early voting. Especially states like New York and New Jersey should consider that now after the devastation and mess that hurricane Sany led to.