How forumites have evolved (or not) on equal marriage

[Kaine for Senate '18]

I never "evolved " on this, and I am older than 25.

So?  Is everyone expected to think the way you do?  Not everyone thinks and behaves according to rigid demographic trends.

[Grumpier Than Uncle Joe]

I never "evolved " on this, and I am older than 25.

Who is a my little pony junkie. 

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Actually even when I was a college freshman I remember polls showing a majority of 18-29 in favor. It definitely wasn't opposed by my fellow classmates much either. I remember the Massachusetts decision being discussed only positively in 2004. All those people would be over 25 today.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Let me put it this way: If you went to a College Democrats meeting circa 2003, how many people present do you think would be against gay marriage, even if they supported civil unions?

[Queen Mum Inks.LWC]

Let me put it this way: If you went to one of my shows circa 2003, how many people present do you think would be against gay marriage, even if they supported civil unions? It'd probably be about equal to supporters of the Iraq War (that is essentially no one.)

Nobody cares.  Only you could turn gay marriage into a stupid discussion on one of your shows.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Let me put it this way: If you went to one of my shows circa 2003, how many people present do you think would be against gay marriage, even if they supported civil unions? It'd probably be about equal to supporters of the Iraq War (that is essentially no one.)

Nobody cares.  Only you could turn gay marriage into a stupid discussion on one of your shows.

No the point is that there are tons of people over 25 who never "evolved" on this issue.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

And of course opebo, who has probably "evolved" more politically than any other poster never "evolved" on this issue, and he is quite a bit older than 25.

[traininthedistance]

Let me put it this way: If you went to one of my shows circa 2003, how many people present do you think would be against gay marriage, even if they supported civil unions? It'd probably be about equal to supporters of the Iraq War (that is essentially no one.)

Nobody cares.  Only you could turn gay marriage into a stupid discussion on one of your shows.

No the point is that there are tons of people over 25 who never "evolved" on this issue.

Did you support full marriage equality in 1996, when DOMA was passed?

Just because lots of people supported full marriage equality by 2003-2004 does not mean they popped out of the womb (or the metaphorical womb of a childhood with political views shaped by their parents and surroundings) with that view.

What I am saying is that many of those people who were early adopters of marriage equality probably still had some "evolution" in their past.

[minionofmidas]

Look, the vast majority of people who now support gay marriage either:

a) are younger than 25, or
b) have "evolved" on the position.

Note the second phrase. Also note that nowhere was it stated that the evolution had to occur since 2004 - most of these kids (the ones not raised in downtown major metros anyways) evolved in their first term in college.

Ninja'd.

[Kaine for Senate '18]

BRTD, why are you so focused on people who haven't evolved?  Do you think you're better than people who haven't always held your belief?  Are we somehow less entitled to hold these views?  I just don't understand why you feel the need to harp on this issue.

[Grumpier Than Uncle Joe]

BRTD, before he evolved into a faux Christian, was much more tolerable.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

BRTD, why are you so focused on people who haven't evolved?  Do you think you're better than people who haven't always held your belief?  Are we somehow less entitled to hold these views?  I just don't understand why you feel the need to harp on this issue.

Really I just wish you'd admit your old position was silly and ridiculous contrived Moderate Heroism, for the reasons sbane mentioned. Which you seemed to be growing out of until I read that thing you said about Jimmy Carter which sent my opinion of you back to 2008 levels.

Do you at least admit your old position was completely f**king stupid, made no sense whatsoever and all the people who trashed you over it were 100% right?

[afleitch]

Let me put it this way: If you went to one of my shows circa 2003, how many people present do you think would be against gay marriage, even if they supported civil unions? It'd probably be about equal to supporters of the Iraq War (that is essentially no one.)

Nobody cares.  Only you could turn gay marriage into a stupid discussion on one of your shows.

You were actually awful all those years ago. I'd forgotten.

I'm not saying that all traditional marriages are good.  But starting off with a bad, sinful marriage won't be good for the child.

On DADT

I just have to say absolutely not on this one--I am a hard core conservative, "anti-gay" person…

And on which forumite was the most…

anti gay rights? - Myself

It was once a badge of honour back in the day

[Kaine for Senate '18]

No, I don't.  I'll say it was wrong, but I will not say it was contrived, because it wasn't.  And again, I ask: why do you give a fuck?  What difference does it make to you why I finally saw the light?  Jesus, man, grow up.

[Queen Mum Inks.LWC]

Let me put it this way: If you went to one of my shows circa 2003, how many people present do you think would be against gay marriage, even if they supported civil unions? It'd probably be about equal to supporters of the Iraq War (that is essentially no one.)

Nobody cares.  Only you could turn gay marriage into a stupid discussion on one of your shows.

No the point is that there are tons of people over 25 who never "evolved" on this issue.

You could've made the same point without thinking, "ZOMG! I can throw in a sentence about hardcore shows!"

[Queen Mum Inks.LWC]

BRTD, why are you so focused on people who haven't evolved?  Do you think you're better than people who haven't always held your belief?  Are we somehow less entitled to hold these views?  I just don't understand why you feel the need to harp on this issue.

Really I just wish you'd admit your old position was silly and ridiculous contrived Moderate Heroism, for the reasons sbane mentioned. Which you seemed to be growing out of until I read that thing you said about Jimmy Carter which sent my opinion of you back to 2008 levels.

Do you at least admit your old position was completely f**king stupid, made no sense whatsoever and all the people who trashed you over it were 100% right?

Ahh, here's the true reason the thread was made.... BRTD wants Ben to say, "You're right; I was wrong."  You couldn't have just done this via PM, buddy?

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Let me put it this way: If you went to one of my shows circa 2003, how many people present do you think would be against gay marriage, even if they supported civil unions? It'd probably be about equal to supporters of the Iraq War (that is essentially no one.)

Nobody cares.  Only you could turn gay marriage into a stupid discussion on one of your shows.

No the point is that there are tons of people over 25 who never "evolved" on this issue.

You could've made the same point without thinking, "ZOMG! I can throw in a sentence about hardcore shows!"

OK fine, imagine it's a College Democrats meeting instead then. Hell, I'll even edit it.

[minionofmidas]

Wrong thread, Mr Most Anti-Inks' Rights Person on this forum.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Let me put it this way: If you went to one of my shows circa 2003, how many people present do you think would be against gay marriage, even if they supported civil unions? It'd probably be about equal to supporters of the Iraq War (that is essentially no one.)

Nobody cares.  Only you could turn gay marriage into a stupid discussion on one of your shows.

No the point is that there are tons of people over 25 who never "evolved" on this issue.

Did you support full marriage equality in 1996, when DOMA was passed?

Yes actually, as much as a 12 year old could.

[Fmr. Pres. Duke]

I know I have. But that's what we do when we are young and stupid.

[Queen Mum Inks.LWC]

Let me put it this way: If you went to one of my shows circa 2003, how many people present do you think would be against gay marriage, even if they supported civil unions? It'd probably be about equal to supporters of the Iraq War (that is essentially no one.)

Nobody cares.  Only you could turn gay marriage into a stupid discussion on one of your shows.

You were actually awful all those years ago. I'd forgotten.

I'm not saying that all traditional marriages are good.  But starting off with a bad, sinful marriage won't be good for the child.

On DADT

I just have to say absolutely not on this one--I am a hard core conservative, "anti-gay" person…

And on which forumite was the most…

anti gay rights? - Myself

It was once a badge of honour back in the day

Yeah, that was back before I developed my libertarian side in 2007-2008 (although it really didn't develop to the level it is now until probably 2009-2010)

[All Along The Watchtower]

I "evolved" from not really knowing/caring about gay marriage (or gay rights, for that matter...) to now considering it a very, very important issue (though  I hesitate to call it the most important-there are so many pressing concerns in the world, it's not really fair to say that one is more important at the expense of others).

[minionofmidas]

I know I have. But that's what we do when we are young and stupid.

Evolve?

[Fmr. Pres. Duke]

I know I have. But that's what we do when we are young and stupid.

Evolve?

Yep. It's all part of growing up.

[MasterJedi]

If it was natural and meant to be men could have children with men. That can't happen, it's not natural.

Well it really isn't not natural, and it's probably partly nature's way of trying to do population control but that's really besides the point.

I still don't believe in gay marriage in that marriage is a religious instition between a man and a women. However, if the government wants to consider them married and give them all the rights and tax benefits and everything else that everyone else has that's perfectly fine. I've for the most part never really been against any of it. I might have been for a time a long time ago back when that quote was made but even since then back as far as 2006 I helped support repealing don't ask don't tell, gay adoption and whatnot in Atlasia as well as real life.

So basically, marriage is a religious institution which government has no rights to give or take away, civil unions and having people who are gay be equal in everything else? Yes, they have that power and it should have been like that all along.