Italy 2013 official results thread

[RogueBeaver]

Renzi flatly denied any interest, saying that he lost, supports Bersani and is 100% focused on the mayoralty. He's got plenty of time for the national stage anyways. Grillo isn't a fan of his either.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-03-01/florence-mayor-renzi-resists-calls-to-fill-italy-leadership-void.html

[Famous Mortimer]

Isn't Renzi to the right to Bersani? I know he's younger and hipper but I thought he was a Tony Blair type and Bersani was more Old Labourish (or at least more Old Labourish than Renzi). How the hell would taking on a more centrist, technocratic leader help the Democrats?

[Filuwaúrdjan]

Renzi is from a DC background, Bersani was a Commie.

[Famous Mortimer]

Yeah, so why go for a centrist? That's going against what the voters want.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

It does seem like a fundamental misreading of why Grillo did so extraordinarily well, yes.

[Lasitten]

This is going to be interesting:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/mar/01/five-star-movement-italy-elections

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[RogueBeaver]

I guess we can only wait for the talks to start.

[Keystone Phil]

Yes, Renzi is reasonable, you see.

I'm a fan of his on Facebook and it looks like he took a swing at Grillo a few minutes ago. Should be fun to watch this.

[Hash]

Does a government need to win an absolute majority in both chambers in the initial confidence vote? e.g. can the government win the confidence of the Senate assuming only the left votes in favour and M5S abstains (rather than votes against) -- are abstentions counted as votes against or not taken into account?

[SPQR]

Renzi is already designed as PD's candidate in the next elections, he has no interest whatsoever in being PM in this mess.

Anyway,most people don't care whether he is centrist or not...they would just vote for him because he is "new".

[SPQR]

Does a government need to win an absolute majority in both chambers in the initial confidence vote? e.g. can the government win the confidence of the Senate assuming only the left votes in favour and M5S abstains (rather than votes against) -- are abstentions counted as votes against or not taken into account?

In the Senate,abstentions are counted as votes against.
And even if M5S does not participate at all in the confidence vote,then also PDL could not participate and thus not allow a vote at all,since there wouldn't be enough senators.

[RogueBeaver]

Find enough senators or call another election. No other options. Question is whether he finds them.

[Keystone Phil]

Renzi is already designed as PD's candidate in the next elections, he has no interest whatsoever in being PM in this mess.

Anyway,most people don't care whether he is centrist or not...they would just vote for him because he is "new".

There won't be primaries or are you using "designated" very loosely (maybe he's just the clear frontrunner now)?

[SPQR]

Renzi is already designed as PD's candidate in the next elections, he has no interest whatsoever in being PM in this mess.

Anyway,most people don't care whether he is centrist or not...they would just vote for him because he is "new".

There won't be primaries or are you using "designated" very loosely (maybe he's just the clear frontrunner now)?

If elections are in fall 2013,there might as well be no primaries.

[RogueBeaver]

Berlusconi wants a new electoral law, then another election. Good luck with that.

[Keystone Phil]

Berlusconi wants a new electoral law, then another election. Good luck with that.

It might not happen one immediately after the other but isn't that the most likely scenario before the end of the year?

[RogueBeaver]

Early election? Probably, at this stage. But getting the Senate to agree on an electoral law when they might not even agree on who governs seems like herding rabid cats. Especially given how fluid the situation is.

[rob in cal]

Is there any type of consensus emerging as to what a new electoral law would look like?

[RogueBeaver]

No, just a brainwave of SB's.

[Hash]

A lot of people would probably support a system with a large single-member component like between 1994 and 2005; though nobody seems to agree on how those seats should be elected or how many there should be and if there should be a PR component still.

[SPQR]

PD's proposal is the French system more or less.

[RogueBeaver]

French system is one of my favourites, so best of luck to PD on that (and everything else).

[Antonio the Sixth]

Back to results. Turnout was down five points... on a previous record low.

Yeah, that's quite depressing, but still impressive when you think about it. Without Grillo, it would probably have been much worse.

[minionofmidas]

Back to results. Turnout was down five points... on a previous record low.

Yeah, that's quite depressing, but still impressive when you think about it. Without Grillo, it would probably have been much worse.

Yeah, I'm more wondering how high it would have had to be for Grillo to win.

[Antonio the Sixth]

Anyway, I'm actually really liking Bersani's attitude in this round of negotiations. Fortunately, he insists on ruling out the grand coalition and is seeking to pressure M5S senators to support him, in exchange for a short government with a broad agenda of political reforms. He's being ballsy and courageous for once, instead of the usual wimp he acted as throughout the campaign. It will be hard for the M5S to reject that offer when March 15 draws near, especially since comments on their blog are very strongly supportive of this.

I don't want to get my hopes too high, but... this might actually work.