School uniforms

[John Dibble]

I don't really care - I don't think it's a big deal one way or another. My only caveat is that if public schools are going to have them then students in poor families need to have them provided at the district's expense.

[CJK]

They're a complete waste. Just a cheap attempt on the part of school/government officials to say they fixed disciplinary problems without imposing discipline.

On the first day of kindergarten these tools took away my cap because it promoted "gang behavior". Yeah, that's what promotes gang behavior... wearing hats!

[2952-0-0]

School uniform can help to make class divide in schools less apparent.

[John Dibble]

School uniform can help to make class divide in schools less apparent.

Well, there goes the thread. You murdered the thread. Are you proud of yourself?

[Obnoxiously Slutty Girly Girl]

I never understood that whole class divide crap, it wasn't obvious in my high school based on what people were wearing. One's clique perhaps, but that wasn't based on income, I knew some kids from richer families who hated preppy clothes and would never wear them.

Also if that's the reason why not just make the uniform a plain white T-shirt (or maybe a school shirt or something) and jeans instead of some horrid crap no kid would ever wear voluntarily?

I think the goal is to give all classes an equal level of class, not to make them all equally classless while sitting in their classes.

[Torie]

I tend to favor them, because what you wear, particularly as a young, affects behavior.

[patrick1]

Let's get real here. Most kids aren't individuals. Most kids are enormous conformists, look at all the cliques with their own unofficial dress codes there are (or gangs..). In any case if your ability to be an individual is seriously effected by not being able to wear certain clothes you're pretty boring anyway.

Agreed.  This was one of my arguments when we discussed this about 4 years ago.


Most jobs require a "uniform" of some sort-  so you'll better get used to sublimating that individuality.

[Bunwahaha [still dunno why, but well, so be it]]

I must say that spontaneously I tend to like it. And yes, those who can't have decent clothes at least it makes them having some in the public sphere that school is, which is the main one in the life of kids, this no matter the kind of clothes chosen for the uniform, cost of the uniform would be include in the social helps of those who receive some.

It also gives a more institutional image to school, which isn't bad.

Though, all in all I think I wouldn't really mind one way or the other, that's not a big issue for me.

[Free Palestine]

School uniform can help to make class divide in schools less apparent.

Well, there goes the thread. You murdered the thread. Are you proud of yourself?

Ah, Godwin's law.

I tend to favor them, because what you wear, particularly as a young, affects behavior.

The issue up for debate is whether or not the effects on behavior are positive.  I don't think smothering individualism by making children dress alike (while also setting the arbitrary standard for what is "proper" dress) is a good thing.

[JSojourner]

Has advantages and disadvantages. I don't really care either way.

Same.  This is how we felt.  We send our daughter to a private school, where uniforms are required.  We've come to appreciate the pros and accept the cons. 

But at least one of the arguments FOR uniforms is pretty bogus.  We were told that when the kids have the same outfits, there is no picking on other kids for not "dressing cool".  So our daughter was in first grade and a couple of the girls told her she was a dork because she didn't have the right boots.  Kids always find SOMETHING to capitalize on, no matter how "uniform" everything appears on the surface.

Now, in third grade, it's all about having one's ears pierced.  We're holding the line on that one for our own reasons...but she's definitely NOT cool.  Oh well.

Bottom line -- the uniforms help a little in some ways.  But I can't imagine making them a "cause" like some people do -- crusading for or against.  Talk about not having too much time on your hands...

[Bo]

No.

[Ban my account ffs!]

I can see the point of them... but where I live they were never necessary so we never had them.  In fact most schools in the U.S. don't have uniforms.

It's a hard issue for liberals because on the one hand.. it takes away individual rights to wear what you want.. but it also takes away the stigma if your family can't afford nice clothes.. and it removes things like gang symbols etc....

But students' families often end up having to pay for the uniforms which can be expensive.

Overall, it should depend on the school.

[Deldem]

Helllllllllllllll No.

[#CriminalizeSobriety]

No.

[Magic 8-Ball]

I'm not fond of their use in public schools, but they're waaay down on the list of things to care about.

[Queen Mum Inks.LWC]

It was a controversial move that my district implimeted (although I was in a private school, with a dress code, not uniform) - it can have it's advantages, and I think it helped the district, which was suffering with disciplinary problems at the time.

[Platypus]

Individuality has nothing to do with clothes, especially for teenagers, who mostly wear what they do to express unity with a particular group. Uniforms encourage school solidarity. Sure it's social engineering, but by creating a distinct sense of tribalism for all the students, you reduce motivators for bullying and foster a communal vobe. I know I always felt a little bit of pride when a group of 500 boys in black blazers would swarm south yarra station every afternoon. Those wimpy Wesley boys in purple had no chance.

There were still dividers of class and coolness, but most of these were based upon one's actions, not what you were wearing. I hated some things about school uniform - getting a detention for having your socks down if you were wearing shorts was one of the most frustrating. Seriously, who wears knee-high socks nowadays? Still, I appreciate that I was part of the MHS boys, and that I when people wanted to classify me I was sorted into that group, rather than a group based on wealth, or one of the stupid teenage subcultures.

[Vepres]

Class divide? I've never seen that (yes, there are some poors in Boulder County). Everybody wears t-shirts and jeans, at least the guys do.

[Gren]

I must admit that having an uniform implies quite a lot of benefits for the school as a colective, but as an individual, I prefer wearing my own clothes. It's just selfishness. Anyway, I don't think we need it were I study. We're quite homogeneous, lots of middle and upper-middle class students. Moreover, the trendy clothes are quite affordable, specially for girls. So here the differences you could find are just a matter of what kind of clothes people want to wear, not what kind of clothes they can wear.

[Cubby]

I'm strongly against school uniforms. I never had to wear them and I feel sorry for anyone who has to.

Girls are forced to always wear skirts, so it continues outdated social norms such as only men being allowed to wear pants. Personally I like seeing women in dresses and skirts but thats irrelevant. And the uniforms for boys always look so (for lack of a better word) gay. I can see why they are popular in the Commonwealth Countries, but uniforms seem un-American to me, unless you go to a private school. 

And whats with all this hand-wringing about "oh the poor children whose parents can't afford cool clothes"?  There are millions of things in life that not everyone can have. If we start using this logic then next everyone will have to drive the same car, live in the same style house, etc.  I hate to sound like a tea bagger but its true. School uniforms really are fascist.

[Bunwahaha [still dunno why, but well, so be it]]

Girls are forced to always wear skirts, so it continues outdated social norms such as only men being allowed to wear pants.

True. Boys and girls should be given a pair of pants and a skirt.

[rdouty]

The government can not force school to comply, but I believe school uniforms are great. School uniforms present a more professional/serious attitude to the schools, and I believe todays youth needs to understand that they are in the business of learning. The purpose of school is not to socialize or express individuality; it is about preparing oneself for the future. School uniforms can help this process, but as I have said, it is up to the school - not the government.

[Bunwahaha [still dunno why, but well, so be it]]

The purpose of school is not to socialize

Too bad that kids spend most of their time there then and have to wait the end of school to socialize themselves...

[Platypus]

Girls are forced to always wear skirts, so it continues outdated social norms such as only men being allowed to wear pants.

True. Boys and girls should be given a pair of pants and a skirt.

We were actually allowed to wear kilts to formal events. Almost nobody ever did except the bagpiper club.



My school was slightly weird.

[Bunwahaha [still dunno why, but well, so be it]]

Girls are forced to always wear skirts, so it continues outdated social norms such as only men being allowed to wear pants.

True. Boys and girls should be given a pair of pants and a skirt.

We were actually allowed to wear kilts to formal events. Almost nobody ever did except the bagpiper club.



My school was slightly weird.

As I said in an other topic, I've recently seen stuffs saying it was back to fashion (since...Romans?) in some urban places. I like the idea, well, for long skirts, but I wouldn't wear one by now personally.

Imagining it for boys as a school uniforms is funny.