Opinion of the #BernieorBust movement

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I went rambling on about this the other day. I'll requote:

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Simply put, it's stupid.

Hillary is terrible on basically every issue I care about. She's OK on abortion, I guess.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

I went rambling on about this the other day. I'll requote:

You must be logged in to read this quote.

...

You must be logged in to read this quote.

Simply put, it's stupid.

Hillary is terrible on basically every issue I care about. She's OK on abortion, I guess.

You must not care about any actual issues then

She's a hawk who wants endless wars. She supports a no fly zone where Russian planes are flying. She wants regime change against Assad while he's fighting Al Qaeda and ISIS. She voted for Kyl-Lieberman. She repeated all of the Bush administration talking points and voted against a diplomatic solution to Iraq.

She supports deporting child refugees. She supports expanding H-1Bs. She pressured other countries to frack. She's against $15 an hour minimum wage, except when she claims she was always for it. She lies. She was totally against gun control 8 years ago and is totally for it now.

She pushed for NAFTA, Panama trade, and called TPP the gold standard, but also at other times claimed to be against them.

She had top secret classified information on her server. The Clinton foundation took $10 million from Saudi Arabia and she approved selling them billion in  arms. She took lots of money from Wall Street, and opposes reinstating Glass Steagall. She supports the death penalty. She's open to entitlement reform. She supported DADT, DOMA, and didn't support SSM until 2013.  

I really could go on.

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I mean, the one issue where Obama clearly ran to the right of Hillary Clinton in 2008 was gun control, and that mailer people always bring up is actually attacking Obama for not being consistently in favor of gun control. To say that Hillary Clinton hasn't been a consistent supporter of gun control measures is a fabrication.

LOL, Obama was to the left of the person he called Annie Oakley on gun control.

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I really could go on.

Or you could just give us a link to the RNC website.

LOL, I didn't even notice the last paragraph. jfern has gone full Reince Priebus.

On TPP - Wasn't she "for this" when it was basically a bare bones framework? I mean, even I as a Hillary supporter can admit she probably is pandering to the left on this, but it's hard to frame it as a flip flop to be for something in theory but against it if it didn't go the way you expected/hoped.

As jfern very well knows, DADT was actually an improvement at the time, since before that there were active witch hunts to find and kick out gays. DOMA was supported by many Democrats, including progressive hero Paul Wellstone, to stop a constitutional amendment (spoiler: nobody liked gays in the 90s!) And didn't Saint Bernard say gay marriage was "too divisive" and that he preferred civil unions as late as 2006? Yes, it turns out he's a politician as well! What a revelation I'm sure that will be for you.

She called TPP the gold standard in 2014, and waited until Bernie was gaining a lot of support to come out against it. The US Chamber of Commerce President said not to worry though, she'll revert back to supporting it.

DADT was a stupid idea from the first time I heard of it. Almost half of Democrats (including Bernie) voted against it. They should have just let gays openly serve. No one was talking about a constitutional amendment in 1996. That was just some revisionism made up a year or 2 ago. Bill Clinton bragged about signing DOMA. Quite a number of Democrats voted against it, including a Senator from Nebraska. Bernie's 2006 comment was just that he didn't think the time was right for Vermont to legalize SSM. Remember Vermont got a lot of sh**t when they were the first state to legalize civil unions. Governor O'Malley waited 6 years to legalize SSM, but I never heard of anyone attacking him for that.

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Some others I just remembered. She wants to backdoor your encryption so that hackers get your credit card information. She's for warrantless wiretaps. In the last debate she went totally Likud, and she did the same with her AIPAC speech. Her campaign chair is a Saudi lobbyist. She voted for the 2001 bankruptcy bill (Elizabeth Warren was really pissed about this). She claims that you can't have supported the auto bailout and opposed TARP. She supported the Honduras coup. The Clinton Foundation takes a lot of money from dictators, and some of it is through a Canadian non-profit so that they don't have to release donor information.  

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Some others I just remembered. She wants to backdoor your encryption so that hackers get your credit card information. She's for warrantless wiretaps. In the last debate she went totally Likud, and she did the same with her AIPAC speech. Her campaign chair is a Saudi lobbyist. She voted for the 2001 bankruptcy bill (Elizabeth Warren was really pissed about this). She claims that you can't have supported the auto bailout and opposed TARP. She supported the Honduras coup. The Clinton Foundation takes a lot of money from dictators, and some of it is through a Canadian non-profit so that they don't have to release donor information.  

Are you capable of saying a single thing that is true or accurate?

What specifically do you think isn't true or accurate?

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I really could go on.

Or you could just give us a link to the RNC website.

LOL, I didn't even notice the last paragraph. jfern has gone full Reince Priebus.

On TPP - Wasn't she "for this" when it was basically a bare bones framework? I mean, even I as a Hillary supporter can admit she probably is pandering to the left on this, but it's hard to frame it as a flip flop to be for something in theory but against it if it didn't go the way you expected/hoped.

As jfern very well knows, DADT was actually an improvement at the time, since before that there were active witch hunts to find and kick out gays. DOMA was supported by many Democrats, including progressive hero Paul Wellstone, to stop a constitutional amendment (spoiler: nobody liked gays in the 90s!) And didn't Saint Bernard say gay marriage was "too divisive" and that he preferred civil unions as late as 2006? Yes, it turns out he's a politician as well! What a revelation I'm sure that will be for you.

She called TPP the gold standard in 2014, and waited until Bernie was gaining a lot of support to come out against it. The US Chamber of Commerce President said not to worry though, she'll revert back to supporting it.

DADT was a stupid idea from the first time I heard of it. Almost half of Democrats (including Bernie) voted against it. They should have just let gays openly serve. No one was talking about a constitutional amendment in 1996. That was just some revisionism made up a year or 2 ago. Bill Clinton bragged about signing DOMA. Quite a number of Democrats voted against it, including a Senator from Nebraska. Bernie's 2006 comment was just that he didn't think the time was right for Vermont to legalize SSM. Remember Vermont got a lot of sh**t when they were the first state to legalize civil unions. Governor O'Malley waited 6 years to legalize SSM, but I never heard of anyone attacking him for that.

Again, she never saw the final TPP agreement. Things change during the course of negotiations, you know. But like I said, I do agree she's probably pandering on it, so I'm not going to press the issue. That said, the left should be happy they managed to force her into pandering to them and try to continue that strategy rather than whine, cry, stamp your feet, and vote for Trump.

Obviously they should've let gays openly serve. In fact, that's exactly what the Clintons pushed for initially and what Bill ran on. But the Republicans and the Dixiecrats viciously opposed him. I know the left has trouble grasping the concept of Congress, but it does matter. At that point the choice was either to continue the status quo of gay witch hunts or go with DADT, which was obviously the lesser of two evils. And again we get to Congress. Bill opposed DOMA, but it passed with a veto proof majority. So he did what politicians do and got some credit for something that was inevitable no matter what he did. If there was no threat of an amendment, I guess Paul Wellstone must be a bigot then. I rarely see the internet leftists raking him over the coals though, he's as lionized as ever. "The time wasn't right"? That sounds very pragmatic and politiciany to me! I'm sure Vermont did get a lot of sh*t when they tried to legalize civil unions, but I doubt it compared to how much sh*t Bill got when he pushed for gays to serve openly in the military. As for why nobody ever attacked O'Malley, it's because he's always been irrelevant. Are you going to ask why nobody attacked De La Fuente too?

Did TPP change drastically since she spoke positively of it in her 2014 book?

An executive order could have allowed gays to serve. Truman used one to desegregate the military. Speaking of Truman, he voted Taft-Hartley even though it had a veto proof majority because it was the right thing to do. And Clinton did push for DOMA. I'm sure the President could have scored some more nay votes from his own party if he had opposed it. No one said that Bernie wasn't a politician, he just was saying it might be better to wait a bit. It passed 3 years later, which was 4 years before Hillary support SSM.

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Some others I just remembered. She wants to backdoor your encryption so that hackers get your credit card information. She's for warrantless wiretaps. In the last debate she went totally Likud, and she did the same with her AIPAC speech. Her campaign chair is a Saudi lobbyist. She voted for the 2001 bankruptcy bill (Elizabeth Warren was really pissed about this). She claims that you can't have supported the auto bailout and opposed TARP. She supported the Honduras coup. The Clinton Foundation takes a lot of money from dictators, and some of it is through a Canadian non-profit so that they don't have to release donor information.  

Are you capable of saying a single thing that is true or accurate?

Hey, you have to admit she voted for the USA Patriot Act which allowed the NSA to rip the constitution to shreds. Bye, Bye 4th Amendment, And your right from unreasonable search and seizure. Bye, Bye 8th Amendment, and denying the right of government detainees from invoking the writ of Habeus Corpus and protection from arbitrary detainment and protection from cruel and unusual punishment.

Funnily enough, Clinton was a major critic of the Bush administration using warrantless wiretaps and voted not to authorize that section of the PATRIOT ACT in 2006.

Bernie voted against both Patriot Acts while she voted for both of them. OK, I got Obama and her votes on warrantless wiretaps confused. I stand by all the other statements.