Survey Atlasia - August At-large Senate Elections Poll

[Purple State]

Wow, look at the numbers for the DA candidates. That is just amazing.

While this doesn't reflect first preferences and that will obviously have an impact, it just goes to show how cross-cutting the DA message is. I'm proud to be a member.

[Purple State]

Don't get me wrong, I did preface my remarks by saying first preferences would clearly not reflect those numbers. I'm just saying that the will of active members shows that the DA candidates are clearly most wanted in the Senate. How it will turn out? I can't see the JCP not getting one seat, or even two. This poll is more indicative of the party itself than future election results.

[Purple State]

Don't get me wrong, I did preface my remarks by saying first preferences would clearly not reflect those numbers. I'm just saying that the will of active members shows that the DA candidates are clearly most wanted in the Senate. How it will turn out? I can't see the JCP not getting one seat, or even two. This poll is more indicative of the party itself than future election results.

I'd happily vote for five JCP'ers if that was an option in this poll... but it's not, so I voted for the JCP and then the DA because I don't want the RPP to have seats.

Don't mistake the JCP not wanting the RPP and the RPP not wanting the JCP for the DA being widely loved. There's a reason you guys are the smallest major party.

We haven't been around very long and don't actively recruit? We represent a pragmatic center that was never meant to be very large?

I didn't say we are loved, but there is clearly a preference that the three DA candidates remain in the Senate, no matter the reason for it. You didn't have to choose five in the poll, so that most people did and stuck the three DA candidates in there should say something.

[Purple State]

I'm just saying that the will of active members shows that the DA candidates are clearly most wanted in the Senate..

No. DA is advantaged on this sort of poll because it's a moderate party, and so it will get JCP's preferences after the JCP candidates and RPP preferences after RPP candidate. That doesn't mean DA is especially beloved or that its senators are especially good. They just benefit to the voting system.

I feel like I'm talking to myself here. No where did I say we were "beloved" or "especially good". I said that this poll indicates that the three DA candidates are, for whatever reason, wanted back in the Senate. It is actually the voting system that obstructs this, because first preferences are so important. But clearly each party prefers the DA candidates over those of the other party.

The DA candidates are wanted back in the Senate, that's what I'm saying. Feel free to spin the reason however you want, but the fact remains.

[Purple State]

I feel like I'm talking to myself here. No where did I say we were "beloved" or "especially good". I said that this poll indicates that the three DA candidates are, for whatever reason, wanted back in the Senate. It is actually the voting system that obstructs this, because first preferences are so important. But clearly each party prefers the DA candidates over those of the other party.

The DA candidates are wanted back in the Senate, that's what I'm saying. Feel free to spin the reason however you want, but the fact remains.

The poll shows that the 3 DA Senators are generally the least objectionable candidates. The poll though was never going to reveal any useful information for the upcoming election. Nor is it the fault of the voting system that the DA won't retain their seats this time - the party just doesn't have the support.

Judging by the last election, we're looking at a quota of around 13 voters. Assuming the standard GOTV efforts and given the undying party loyalties involved, the RPP and JCP should easily get 2 quotas each, leaving only 1 other seat up for grabs.

Really, you guys need to start reading what I'm writing. I already prefaced my remarks by saying that this does not in any way reflect the voting outcome, as the system is based on first preferences and not on overall preferences. I accept that and I'm not looking to overhaul the system.

Whether you want to spin it as least objectionable, most liked, whatever, that doesn't change the fact that the three DA candidates are wanted in the Senate.

[Purple State]

Oh for goodness sakes, will everyone take a chill pill. Antonio is just saying that just because the DA has the most votes in this poll is doesn't mean they're preferred.

The DA has it's base of comparatively small support, and it gets secondary support from both the other major parties. The JCP votes for itself, and the DA over the RPP. The RPP votes for itself, and the DA over the JCP. This leads DA numbers to be inflated in a poll that doesn't take into account our voting system, and make it seem like tons of people love the DA and want them all in the Senate.

The realities of our voting system are unfortunate, but there you are.

Either way that translates into a clear preference that the DA senators remain senators. The reason is far less important than the fact.

Perhaps it would be nice to break up some of the partisanship in the game, not by statute but through outreach. It is clear that the parties are becoming echo chambers, where pawns begin to spout off the same talking points as the leadership. I don't know, maybe in an effort to "look cool." I say it is time for a new era for Atlasia, where it isn't a sin to reach across party lines and where compromise is not a word to be maligned.

[Purple State]

Oh for goodness sakes, will everyone take a chill pill. Antonio is just saying that just because the DA has the most votes in this poll is doesn't mean they're preferred.

The DA has it's base of comparatively small support, and it gets secondary support from both the other major parties. The JCP votes for itself, and the DA over the RPP. The RPP votes for itself, and the DA over the JCP. This leads DA numbers to be inflated in a poll that doesn't take into account our voting system, and make it seem like tons of people love the DA and want them all in the Senate.

The realities of our voting system are unfortunate, but there you are.

Either way that translates into a clear preference that the DA senators remain senators. The reason is far less important than the fact.

Perhaps it would be nice to break up some of the partisanship in the game, not by statute but through outreach. It is clear that the parties are becoming echo chambers, where pawns begin to spout off the same talking points as the leadership. I don't know, maybe in an effort to "look cool." I say it is time for a new era for Atlasia, where it isn't a sin to reach across party lines and where compromise is not a word to be maligned.

How speechy. I don't believe I've ever been hyper-partisan or combative towards "compromise." But we tried the whole "compromise" thing and all it did was lead to an active but hollow Senate. Before I and the rest of the JCP Senators took office the Senate was an echo chamber, just that of compromise and getting something passed as quickly and easily as possible, with as little debate as possible.

Without partisanship and combativeness, this game would be a terribly boring place.

I'm sorry for speaking in clear, thought out sentences. I'll try to break ti up more this time.

Partisanship for partisanship's sake is a terrible thing. Combativeness hurts the game. Those are the facts. What is good, and what I believe you mean to say, is real debate, like the ones I have had recently with Hamilton and PiT. Those were real disagreements between us and no one changed their minds in the end, but the tone was kept respectful, the debate remained substantive and it resulted in some honest thoughts laid out on the table. I don't think that's boring at all. In fact, I became quite passionate during those debates; however, never did it fall into personal attacks or bitter partisanship of the sort that hurt the game.

[Purple State]

Which is?

My willingness to do whatever it takes to make sure Purple State or Franzl is the DA member that is carried across the finish line

This is the kind of partisanship that's harmful, not the partisanship in the Senate.

Ironic, given Purple State's obsession with gaining your support.

What is ironic, Marokai, is your blatant hypocrisy. Don't go citing harmful partisanship in the same post as you throw a needless personal attack.

[Purple State]

I feel like I'm talking to myself here. No where did I say we were "beloved" or "especially good". I said that this poll indicates that the three DA candidates are, for whatever reason, wanted back in the Senate. It is actually the voting system that obstructs this, because first preferences are so important. But clearly each party prefers the DA candidates over those of the other party.

The DA candidates are wanted back in the Senate, that's what I'm saying. Feel free to spin the reason however you want, but the fact remains.

The poll shows that the 3 DA Senators are generally the least objectionable candidates. The poll though was never going to reveal any useful information for the upcoming election. Nor is it the fault of the voting system that the DA won't retain their seats this time - the party just doesn't have the support.

Judging by the last election, we're looking at a quota of around 13 voters. Assuming the standard GOTV efforts and given the undying party loyalties involved, the RPP and JCP should easily get 2 quotas each, leaving only 1 other seat up for grabs.

Really, you guys need to start reading what I'm writing. I already prefaced my remarks by saying that this does not in any way reflect the voting outcome, as the system is based on first preferences and not on overall preferences. I accept that and I'm not looking to overhaul the system.

Whether you want to spin it as least objectionable, most liked, whatever, that doesn't change the fact that the three DA candidates are wanted in the Senate.

No you guys aren't. Neither the JCP nor the RPP want you guys in the Senate. However, since we want the other guys even less, we go with you.

You can say that "the three DA candidates are not wanted less in the Senate" or something, but to say that you're "wanted" is misleading and false.

I'm not really sure why you have turned this into a battle of semantics. You act as though everyone had to choose five candidates and so the DA undoubtedly wins that. You didn't have to choose five; you could have just chosen your JCP candidates. That a large number chose not to and, instead, put the DA candidates in their picks does say something.

Whether you think it says that we are "the least not wanted" or "the best of the worst" or whatever else, it's clear that of the available choices, people want the DA members to return to the Senate.

[Purple State]

Which is?

My willingness to do whatever it takes to make sure Purple State or Franzl is the DA member that is carried across the finish line

This is the kind of partisanship that's harmful, not the partisanship in the Senate.

Ironic, given Purple State's obsession with gaining your support.

If it were partisanship, don't you think he'd either support or oppose the DA. Not just, you know, certain members that he feels don't deserve his support for whichever reason.

His crazed obsession with attacking Afleitch is senseless. The point is that DWTL and some in the RPP have engaged in a policy over the months of organized disruption, and yet Purple State says the problem is that some Senators use naughty words on the Senate floor. That's silly.

I find it amusing that you can't see beyond the Senate. Has Marokai lost touch with the regular people? I'm not referring at all to naughty words on the Senate floor. I'm talking about your inability to move beyond personal attacks here.

What is with your obsession in attacking me? You rail against DWTL's partisanship and, while I don't support his absolute hatred of afleitch, yet you are just as bad. Are you so blinded by your own self-righteousness that you can so epitomize hypocrisy and not notice?

Your presence in Atlasia began as, what I believed to be, a genuine interest in generating excitement. It is now obvious that you just want to be an arrogant ass, no matter what it means to the game. The internet is not a venue for you to vent your personal anger. I am sorry to have once supported your candidacy to the Senate.

[Purple State]

Which is?

My willingness to do whatever it takes to make sure Purple State or Franzl is the DA member that is carried across the finish line

This is the kind of partisanship that's harmful, not the partisanship in the Senate.

Ironic, given Purple State's obsession with gaining your support.

If it were partisanship, don't you think he'd either support or oppose the DA. Not just, you know, certain members that he feels don't deserve his support for whichever reason.

His crazed obsession with attacking Afleitch is senseless. The point is that DWTL and some in the RPP have engaged in a policy over the months of organized disruption, and yet Purple State says the problem is that some Senators use naughty words on the Senate floor. That's silly.

I find it amusing that you can't see beyond the Senate. Has Marokai lost touch with the regular people? I'm not referring at all to naughty words on the Senate floor. I'm talking about your inability to move beyond personal attacks here.

What is with your obsession in attacking me? You rail against DWTL's partisanship and, while I don't support his absolute hatred of afleitch, yet you are just as bad. Are you so blinded by your own self-righteousness that you can so epitomize hypocrisy and not notice?

Your presence in Atlasia began as, what I believed to be, a genuine interest in generating excitement. It is now obvious that you just want to be an arrogant ass, no matter what it means to the game. The internet is not a venue for you to vent your personal anger. I am sorry to have once supported your candidacy to the Senate.

My problem with you is that you're always about Purple State. Grandstanding against Bgwah and Ebowed over the Game Moderator issue (court cases, constitutional amendments, Senate resolutions), constantly getting headlines in Vepres' newspaper, routinely shoving yourself into court cases, trying to fashion yourself as the savior of constitutional reform in the ConCon. You always have to be the center of attention, always trying to take the reigns and steal the glory.

And now you're trying to step back and claim yourself to be the level headed one, trying oh-so-nobly to be "post-partisan" and "reach across the aisle" to "forge consensus" or whatever hand-holding buzzwords you're using this hour. It's all about Purple State.

Someone who is so quick to criticize me for my attitude yet says not a cross word about DWTL shouldn't call me the hypocrite. Especially when DWTL is childishly trying to screw over one of your own.

Now that I've been called an egoist by the most egotistical member of Atlasia (see here for a little breakdown of the most self-centered post I've ever seen), I'll end this discussion right here. Clearly nothing will come of this. I'm glad we could reveal the true Marokai though. It means a lot to me that you can so publicly show your arrogance and hypocrisy. Bravo for guts.

[Purple State]

This is why we love you Hash.

[Purple State]

Bump, just because it's so fun to have a look at the good old days when PS and MB hated each other.

Sorry, couldn't resist !

The good ol' days. There is also a taste of DWTL here, for those who have renewed interest in the life and times of an Atlasian favorite.