Israel-Gaza war

[Associate Justice PiT]

No side is disputing this theory that "actually the hospital was a secret disguise for rocket launchers" because no one is alleging it other than a manaic republican Talk Elections poster from Ohio.

Come on! "Hamas uses hospitals to launch attacks" is, like, the first thing that anybody learns about this conflict. I guess to some it's presented as "false Israeli narrative", but everybody's heard it. It's literally common knowledge and goes without saying.

The general statement that Hamas stores weapons in or under hospitals is correct. But no one besides you is alleging that it is true of this hospital (a Christian hospital mostly funded by US/UK church groups) or that it is the cause of this explosion.

     It's possible they were pressed into service by Hamas militants, but given the background of the hospital it's definitely something that should be substantiated more thoroughly than just "well this is what Hamas does". I am leaning towards this being an Israeli missile, but the truth behind the situation is far from clear.

[Associate Justice PiT]

     Not sure if it has been mentioned in this thread, but there was some news on the bombing of the St. Porphyrios Church posted in the Facebook group of an Orthodox charity working with them:

[Associate Justice PiT]

    Not sure if it has been mentioned in this thread, but there was some news on the bombing of the St. Porphyrios Church posted in the Facebook group of an Orthodox charity working with them:

https://greekreporter.com/2023/10/20/greek-orthodox-church-st-porphyrios-gaza-bombed/

https://www.aljazeera.com/amp/news/liveblog/2023/10/19/israel-hamas-war-live-condemnation-after-israeli-strike-on-gaza-church

Al Jeezera has uped the reported deaths to 8 in their live feed.

Not 150-200. Like I said, it's still a tragedy. We dont need to spread rumors as fact.

     It might not be 150, but I don't buy that only 8 people died from a bomb dropping on a crowded building.

[Associate Justice PiT]

    Not sure if it has been mentioned in this thread, but there was some news on the bombing of the St. Porphyrios Church posted in the Facebook group of an Orthodox charity working with them:

https://greekreporter.com/2023/10/20/greek-orthodox-church-st-porphyrios-gaza-bombed/

https://www.aljazeera.com/amp/news/liveblog/2023/10/19/israel-hamas-war-live-condemnation-after-israeli-strike-on-gaza-church

Al Jeezera has uped the reported deaths to 8 in their live feed.

Not 150-200. Like I said, it's still a tragedy. We dont need to spread rumors as fact.

     It might not be 150, but I don't buy that only 8 people died from a bomb dropping on a crowded building.

It will probably rise sadly. But its Al Jeezera reporting this, not The Times of Israel. There is 0 reason to think they're covering for Israel.

     I don't think they are covering, but the fog of war is thick and it's hard to get exact numbers quickly. Either way, I hope that Al Jazeera is indeed accurate and the death toll is far lower than the contacts in the parish estimated.

[Associate Justice PiT]

Everyone really needs to stop believing the hysterical claims coming out of Hamas-controlled Gaza until there’s been at least a day or two to verify them.
https://twitter.com/osinttechnical/status/1715367749206024513?s=46&t=o2RmfeV...

     Interestingly, I notice now that the claims from sources that actually had inside knowledge never said the church itself fell, but rather social halls that the community was using. It's not a nothing-burger, but the media fumbled the ball once again in reporting on the story.

[Associate Justice PiT]

There is literally no way for Israel to win isn't there?
Launch a ground invasion -> fight on multiple fronts -> suffer heavy casualties -> get bogged down -> lose western support
Back down -> admit defeat -> restart an even more vicious internal unrest

That is the thing. There is literally no way to defeat Hamas without a massive ground invasion or a massive bombing campaign, both of which would be deemed as war crimes and get condemnation from the international community . The fact is sometimes there is no good options and you cant expect nations to put "international law" over their own self interest especially when those laws would make it so you cant respond effectively at all.

     International law as it exists today is largely predicated on an assumption of easily-identifiable, uniformed armies. Asymmetric warfare is so effective in the modern age in large part due to exploiting this blind spot. Winning a war against a terrorist organization is extremely hard because of the ease with which they blend in among innocent civilians.