Israel-Gaza war

[America Needs R'hllor]

I'm shocked. Idk what to say.

[America Needs R'hllor]

Hamas claims they captured IDF Brigadier General Nimrod Aloni
https://twitter.com/jankibaat1/status/1710607018263032233

This is fake news as confirmed by the Israeli media. Don’t post hamas psychological warfare claims.

[America Needs R'hllor]

When was the last time Arab forces took control of Israeli territory inside the Green Line, even ephemerally? It can't be 48, can it?

As far as I’ve managed to gather- it’s 48.

[America Needs R'hllor]

Iran, Hamas, Hezbollah, the Houthis, the PMF, Russia, Belarus, Chechnya, and China I think will use human wave attack to humiliate the IDF and will be in control of Tel Aviv and Jerusalem in a few days after utilizing those tactics.

I captured your original post. You will not hide behind “think”.

[America Needs R'hllor]

Well, all Netanyahu's recent dicking around probably hasn't helped here has it?

In the obvious sense, no (this has clearly been planned for a very long time), but in an 'eye off the ball' sense, quite possible: what has happened/is still happening has been a known nightmare scenario for some time but, even leaving aside intelligence failings, it's striking how everything seems to have been out of place for a fast response.

Well, all Netanyahu's recent dicking around probably hasn't helped here has it?

Yeah, I was thinking that same thing. Obviously, indiscriminate attacks against civilian targets, (what Hamas is doing here) are unacceptable and Israel has the complete right to defend itself against that.

But I can’t help but feel that Bibi’s far-right buddies and treatment of the Palestinians hasn’t played a role or factor in Hamas’ decision making here. Especially when you consider the rhetoric coming from people like Ben Givr and others high up in the government. Hamas may have done this under some “protect the Palestinians” thing.

Quick thoughts, without a ton of weight: This is an unprecedented failure, for sure. First, obviously, Israel's intelligence, especially in the IDF, carries heavy blame and will have to pay a price. The army's reaction was also embarrasingly lackluster and slow. However, important to note that a lot of the blame is also on the government's priorities and actions. Most of the regular army was apparently in the West Bank, defending the settlers and their provocations and attacks on Palestinian villages. Including the Gaza Division, explicitly designed to protect the Gaza border. The settlers and the government supporting them, especially the Otzma-RZ pyromancers, have blood on their hands here, and I hope the Israeli people will acknowledge this (doubt it though). The realization should be that Israel simply doesn't have the regular forces to play nanny for the settlers, who are also directly working to provoke the Palestinians. We urgently need to create a border and guard it.

[America Needs R'hllor]

https://twitter.com/sentdefender/status/1710633622338781436?s=20
We're just getting started. Let's see all those people dancing with our civilians' corpses in the street by Wednesday.

I don't think boasting about dead civilians, even if said civilians are misguided individuals, is constructive either way is it?

Israel has a "right " to reoccupy the Gaza Strip and remove elements that attacked it from there but not to indiscriminately kill non-armed people.

Considering the amount of popular support we can see Hamas and PIJ having in the streets of Gaza perhaps the people of Gaza need a sharp reminder of the realities of life. I think they should take complaints about civilian losses to the Hamas Ombudsman.

Ok, why don't we just casually assisnate some of the Russian Israelis who support Russia's invasion of Ukraine (some even financially I imagine). I'm sure that will go down well with you

Being a keyboard warrior doesn't merit having a bomb dropped on you.

How is that a like-for-like? The Ukraine has indeed targeting numerous Russian civilian targets for months now. I don't recall the west having much qualms about the people of Donetsk  

Ah now you are towing the famous "Donbass genocide" line of the Russian propaganda machine. Good to see you've gone off the deep end.

If you can't see how an indiscriminate bombing campaign against cilivians in Gaza is not an appropriate and proportionate response, do us all a favour and vote for Ben Gvir next election to turn your strip of sand into a theocracy.

I don't see where I adopted Russian propaganda.

The reality is that civilians die in conflicts, especially when their leadership actively seeks to hide between them. Moreover, the people of Gaza are themselves taking part in this war as evident in many videos showing many of them spontaneously joining the fighting since the early strike. So my general stance atm is 'em. The gloves are off.

Your general stance is what leads to such a cycle of violence in the first place.

It is understandable given the rage you must be feeling but levelling Gaza will have dramatic consequences for the strategic direction of Israel.

There will have to be an unprecedented response, which will sadly lead to the death of many civilians. Israel simply cannot allow this brutal attack to go. At the very least, Hamas has to be toppled, and it'll require strong force. Simply can't expect Israel to immediately seek a ceasefire after this.

[America Needs R'hllor]

Palestinians have the right to fight and resist apartheid state Israël, in fact they should, and everyone who does is a freedom fighter. They have my support. The oppression needs to end, and no one is interested in peace & diplomacy from the international community.

It's a series of deliberate massacres of civilians. No one has a right to do that.

Than why does Hamas do that?

Because they’re evil and want to kill Jews.

They're defending from a genocide being perpetrated on their people. Whoever attacks them is even irrelevant. Also its not jews, its Israeli people that occupy them. That's different, many Jewish people for instance condemn Israël as well. Many of my political idols are Jewish. Many of the greatest communists ever were Jewish.

Respectfully, get the hell out of this thread. You're ignorant, misinformed and spamming while some people here are trying to have a civilized discussion, analysis and updates. Do us this one favor in this morning of slaughter. We don't need this rambling, we need clear-headed updates and analysis.

[America Needs R'hllor]

Situation is still ongoing in Israeli border towns, but the army is in the area.

[America Needs R'hllor]

Everyone please refrain from fighting and making useless posts here. Keep it for updates and analysis.

[America Needs R'hllor]

Civilians who survived the attack on a big outdoor party tell of terrorists shooting at people who were raising their hands and begging for mercy. If some tankies here want to know what not to shed any tears for

[America Needs R'hllor]

Civilians who survived the attack on a big outdoor party tell of terrorists shooting at people who were raising their hands and begging for mercy. If some tankies here want to know what not to shed any tears for

The same ones who held a picnic and cheered on airstrikes on Gaza last time this happened, or different ones?

I’m just asking you people to have some basic empathy for people experiencing horror amd cruelty. It’s not that hard.

[America Needs R'hllor]

It would be useful if this thread did not turn into a classic internet thread about ~The Conflict~ and be rendered as completely unreadable to non-psychopaths as something important and awful has happened and there are people who might wish to follow updates and to discuss things. Plenty of other places online where you can all defecate for attention.

This PLEASE!!! C’mon people, you don’t have to respond to every comment that says “this is horrible” with “actually, this is the consequences of decades of occupation, I’m very smart”. We know. Now can you please, please, let this thread be about the situation at hand? Myself, and I presume other serious posters, will simply stop updating and providing analysis here at this rate because everything is drowned out by pages of the same old arguments.

[America Needs R'hllor]

An Israeli colonel, commander of the Nahal Brigade, died fighting terrorists in the area. From what I’m hearing, it’s likely multiple high commanders directly engaged and died in these confrontations defending civilians

[America Needs R'hllor]

Death toll in Israel passed 700. For context, during the second intifada of 2000-2004, 1057 Israelis died (70% of them civilians). During the Yom Kippur war, 2689 Israelis died, presumably mostly military.

[America Needs R'hllor]

I am obviously overall deeply sympathetic to Palestinian liberation, but I will say that there has been a worrying trend in academia as of late to whitewash Hamas or pretend like they have become less problematic since 2006. I hope that today will end that trend once and for all. You can say that war, especially anticolonial war, is hell and all, and that's true, but it's also clear that the goal of this operation was explicitly to attack civilians, and that is completely unjustifiable. One can only hope that this is at least a step towards their being completely annihilated, and although I weep for the civilian casualties which are likely to ensue in Gaza, I will certainly not shed a tear for the elimination of as much of Hamas as possible.

With that being said, this war must also underscore the need for a permanent solution to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. Blathering on about the complexity of the conflict is nothing more than cowardice that will lead to more deaths. The two-state solution is dead – it's been dead for over a decade now, in fact – but that does not make the status quo any less unjustifiable. The only way this ends is by ending Palestinians' status as a stateless, voiceless, powerless people. Continuing the occupation will inevitably lead to more innocent deaths.

Strongly agree.

[America Needs R'hllor]

The United States is moving the USS Gerald Ford aircraft carrier and its accompanying warships (currently in the Mediterranean) towards Israel. It has a carrier strike group of 5000 soldiers and several aircrafts on deck. This has got to be extremely rare.

[America Needs R'hllor]

If true, he should resign in disgrace
https://twitter.com/ragipsoylu/status/1711394276687388687

Should resign in disgrace anyway but yes. The independent investigation after this will be really important.

Even without the pre-invasion issues, this government has been embarrassing throughout the past few days- transportation, welfare, information, everything. The government ministers being incompetent sycophants shows. The focus right now is squarely on taking down hamas, but once it’s over they will have to pay a heavy political price or there’s really no hope.

[America Needs R'hllor]

The first batch of hostages is out for the collective relief of everybody. It was nice to see Emilia Aloni, aged 5 return from a dank tunnel.


I'm not sure the ceasefire won't be permanent. Henceforth begins the pressure of the Arab world on Hamas to accept reality has changed, and Biden to draw a line in the sand with Bibi.

https://twitter.com/gaza_report/status/1728086759626481947?s=20

The thing is that there is only so far the Hamas leaders in Gaza can run. Right now, the only thing stopping the IDF from taking over Khan Yunis and cornering them is that all of the hostages are presumably there and it would put them at risk. Otherwise, Hamas is simply outmatched and I don't think their tunnel network is enough to protect them. So it makes sense that they would start looking for a way out.

[America Needs R'hllor]

Negotiations for a deal once again blew up as Qatari and American delegation arrive in Cairo- Hamas refuses to send a list of live hostages, Qatar says this prevents progress. Israel said they would only send a team to Cairo if Hamas provided a list of hostages.

This sure is an important development! I’m sure the activists who are so interested in a ceasefire will now pressure Hamas to stop withholding information about the hostages and preventing a ceasefire!

[America Needs R'hllor]

the public goodwill from 10/7 is gone at this point. People that were mildly pro-israel before this are turning against them, and that's not only in the US.


Said it before, I'll say it again, fu ck Hamas, fu ck Bibi, stand with civilians, stand with aid workers.

I've become increasingly convinced that the happiest day of Bibi's life was 10/7, b/c he saw an incredible opportunity to accomplish two goals he desperately wants: staying in power and the eradication of every human being in Gaza.

I don't have the energy to go into it, but this is a very big miscalculation of how Bibi works and what he wants. October 7th was not even close to a plus for him staying in power (which is indeed his primary goal and only directive), and he never had any wish to "eradicate everyone in Gaza". He wanted stability and the status quo, and for that reason propping up Hamas worked for him (less pressure for a 2SS). Bibi was pale and panicked on October 7th. It's not that he cares an awful lot for his country, but that day was horrible for him.

[America Needs R'hllor]

Israeli war cabinet agreed on increasing humanitarian aid to Gaza, hours after the phone call between Netanyahu and Biden. New aid corridor will open on land, and another on the sea. The IDF is conducting an investigation on the WCK attack and several officers already fired. Pressure works.

[America Needs R'hllor]

the public goodwill from 10/7 is gone at this point. People that were mildly pro-israel before this are turning against them, and that's not only in the US.


Said it before, I'll say it again, fu ck Hamas, fu ck Bibi, stand with civilians, stand with aid workers.

I've become increasingly convinced that the happiest day of Bibi's life was 10/7, b/c he saw an incredible opportunity to accomplish two goals he desperately wants: staying in power and the eradication of every human being in Gaza.

I don't have the energy to go into it, but this is a very big miscalculation of how Bibi works and what he wants. October 7th was not even close to a plus for him staying in power (which is indeed his primary goal and only directive), and he never had any wish to "eradicate everyone in Gaza". He wanted stability and the status quo, and for that reason propping up Hamas worked for him (less pressure for a 2SS). Bibi was pale and panicked on October 7th. It's not that he cares an awful lot for his country, but that day was horrible for him.

You may be right that lately 10/7 has turned out to not be so great for him, but that was very much not the case at the time. Bibi - and I truly believe this is almost beyond argument among reasonable people - was never interested in peace (he has openly bragged and said statements to this effect multiple times), and very thinly veiled his desire for endless war and to eventually settle the whole of Palestine and eradicate their people inch by inch, ever so slowly so that it would never be taken seriously until it was over. He's an agent of chaos and endless violence and he saw 10/7 the same way Republicans saw the Benghazi attack: as a shiny political gift to be exploited for maximum political gain.

You're right that Bibi was never interested in peace. You're wrong that he was interested in October 7th. He was, very notoriously, opposed to any big decisions or shakeups, and championed the status quo. To that end he kept propping up Hamas as a means to divide the Palestinian national movement between Gaza and the West Bank and keep them both on low fire. On October 7th, that backfired massively when we all learned that it's impossible to live with a fanatical, genocidal neighbor. On that day, most people assigned all the blame to him and his entire legacy collapsed.

Now, I'm no Bibi defender. I believe that he is the worst PM of Israel by far and the worst Jewish leader since Bar Kochva. He was a slow, corrosive poison that corrupted Israeli society and politics until we were left as a house bitterly divided, with a weak media that follows every cheap trick of his and a political class full of incompetent sycophants I wouldn't let manage an aviary, let alone one of the most complex countries in the world. But it is important to analyze his many failures and harms through the correct lens.

[America Needs R'hllor]

Sorry, but anybody genuinely suggesting that anyone who has criticised Israel's conduct of this war is urging them to "surrender" simply betrays their total lack of both seriousness and perspective.

If it is indeed true the remaining hostages are dead, that is both tragic and outrageous. But given the fact one of even Netanyahu's stated war aims is to enable their release, from a purely utilitarian point of view it removes one barrier to a ceasefire rather than the other way around.

This isn't accurate - the hostages are the only way for a ceasefire with Hamas intact. Without the hostages, there's no stopping the IDF from eventually invading Rafah and fighting until Hamas is no longer able to function as the governing force of Gaza (for now).