PA-SN 2022 megathread: Shrek vs. The Wizard of Oz

[Morning in Atlas]

Enthusiastically endorsed. Fetterman would 100% have won in 2016.

[Morning in Atlas]

Anyone else think Shapiro would be better for senate and Fetterman for governor or is that just me?

Perfectly understandable and arguable, tbh.

[Morning in Atlas]

I mean as I see it they're both great.

[Morning in Atlas]

We would be so much better off if he won the nomination in 2016.

[Morning in Atlas]

You all realise this man chassed down a black man in 2013 with a shotgun because he was jogging right?  Like why are you cheering him on?

I wasn't aware of this, even as someone who was going to college in PA in 2016. The incident was a few weeks after Sandy Hook, a few months before Black Lives Matter became an organized movement and a Florida jury pushed police brutality to the forefront of white America's minds.

I 100% understand why you'd be suspicious of Fetterman if you're black. At the same time, I believe he should be given the chance to demonstrate that he's changed, and I have faith that he'll show that he has.

[Morning in Atlas]

Absolutely no moderate heroes in my Senate.

[Morning in Atlas]

If the DSCC backs Lamb it would signify my point of no return with the Democratic Party. There's a difference between principled centrism and blatant moderate heroism like the crap you see with Sinema and Lamb.

Cartwright is fine. He's a man of courage and convictions and I can get behind him. I can even get behind Houlahan - a moderate through and through, but one with principles. Georgia has proven that we don't need Conor Lambs or Kyrsten Sinemas to compete in hostile territory.

[Morning in Atlas]

We're lucky to have two great qualified progressives in the race. I would enthusiastically support Kenyatta if he made it to the general - he seems to be above Kennedy's petty dogwhistling and is at least unquestionably strong on the issues.

[Morning in Atlas]

No matter how you feel about Kenyatta, you have to appreciate the gift of someone who's willing to con Blue MAGA into supporting a progressive.

[Morning in Atlas]

No matter how you feel about Kenyatta, you have to appreciate the gift of someone who's willing to con Blue MAGA into supporting a progressive.

lol it's amazing that somebody who was a literal Biden delegate to the DNC and enrosde biden on day 1 is getting so much rose twitter support.

Most people on Atlas can see beyond fealty to Bernie. Even then most of the Donut crap he posted was from 2016-2017 and he didn't really attack Bernie in 2020.

I'm more concerned about where he stands on the issues and he's very good.

[Morning in Atlas]

If you thought Markey vs. Kennedy was ugly, Kenyatta vs. Fetterman is just getting started (have fun with that, PA Dems):

https://twitter.com/malcolmkenyatta/status/1364290274852294656

Apparently the context is that it's been a year since Ahmaud Arbery's murder, but Kenyetta isn't stupid.

[Morning in Atlas]

I see Kenyatta is going with the "Fetterman is racist" strategy

He was talking about Ahmaud Arbery. Y'all are so pressed to find a reason to disqualify Kenyatta. LOL. All the excuses in the world for Fetterman but won't give Kenyatta the benefit of the doubt.

We aren't stupid, and neither is Rep. Kenyatta. It's pretty clear what he was also trying to imply, especially when he left the context of Arbery's murder into a second tweet.

Which, as the record shows, I have no problem with. That's politics and campaigning.

[Morning in Atlas]

Good. Dean is no Fetterman or Kenyatta, but she seems fine.

Lamb is the real enemy in the primary.

[Morning in Atlas]

If the apparatus backs Lamb, it will mark my point of no return with the Democratic Party. Manchinism must be stopped if the party is truly interested in making policy.

[Morning in Atlas]

If the apparatus backs Lamb, it will mark my point of no return with the Democratic Party. Manchinism must be stopped if the party is truly interested in making policy.

Let’s see if the primary moves him to the left first.  I mean, he supports $15 minimum wage so that already puts him ahead of some Democratic Senators.

The problem is that in practice, he's already tried the usual moderate hero-esque doublespeak crap on one popular key Democratic issue. His statement on his no vote in the MORE act was uniquely vague and almost devoid of policy. All he said was that how he Totally Supports federal decriminalization, but We're In A Pandemic and In A Recession, and how he voted against it because he doesn't think it's important.

Compare this to statements from Cheri Bustos and Chris Pappas, who named specific concerns and policies that they were against. Lipinski and Cuellar said (what I believe to be) the quiet part about Conor Lamb's marijuana beliefs out loud - that they don't think marijuana should be legal at all because of long-obsolete reefer madness logic.

Obviously, I don't like how my Congressman voted, but at least he had the guts to stand by his vote. Lamb's statement on marijuana reform was even more policy-free than the initial statements from my senators.

After a few weeks, it came out from a teleconference that the main sticking point from Hassan and Shaheen was the fact that the Sanders proposal eliminated the tipped minimum wage exemption. Or, more simply, they voted no on a $15 minimum wage because their donors in the restaurant lobby told them to.

My position is fairly simple. I don't trust Lamb to be a reliable vote because he hasn't even been reliable for one of the Democratic Party's most popular proposals! The MORE Act isn't "defund the police" or a Green New Deal or even "eliminate private insurance companies". This is marijuana decriminalization. If he's trying the moderate hero approach on the party's most popular bipartisan issue, what's to stop him from blocking a minimum wage hike or a public option?

[Morning in Atlas]

I guess part of it is that we disagree on whether the MORE Act was a key issue or a virtue-signaling bill dealing with a low priority issue that never had a chance of passing.  I’d argue it was the latter, so I am obviously less troubled than you by Lamb’s opposition to it.

At the same time, the virtue signaling doesn't necessarily hurt Lamb. It's less about how important the MORE Act was and more about how marijuana is not the issue to go "Jeez oh man look at how broken Washington is" over.

Let's take Lamb's position at face value. His vote against the MORE Act is, at best, the type of moderate hero pundit brain that hurts candidates. These types of people in the Democratic establishment think that the MORE Act is a liberal issue that's never going to actually become a law, and therefore safe to vote against to establish their moderate, centrist bona fides and highlight how dysfunctional DC is.

Of course, the issue here is that marijuana decriminalization is popular policy with bipartisan support.

[Morning in Atlas]

Lamb’s alleged moderate heroism seems to be entirely built around a single vote on what is, let’s be honest, a niche issue.

Yeah, I’m not super worried about it.

On an issue that happens to be one of the few that doesn't hurt him electorally. Not to mention the decision to justify that "single vote" using moderate hero logic - the only one to do so in the caucus.

Your point is the same point I just shot down.

[Morning in Atlas]

If Houlahan jumps in, though, I'd move to her camp in an instant.

Fair. Not ideologically my cup of tea, but someone I could enthusiastically get behind in the general and 100% trust to win.

[Morning in Atlas]

I guess right now I'm Kenyatta > Arkoosh > Fetterman

Lamb is the wildcard. I'd probably put him first then, but I'm not sure. I would really love for PA to break some real progressive ground with Kenyatta.

You want PA to break "real progressive ground" (with a candidate who's narrowly less progressive than Fetterman) but would throw that out the window when Lamb runs?

Supporting Manchin Jr. to own the Bros

[Morning in Atlas]

I guess right now I'm Kenyatta > Arkoosh > Fetterman

Lamb is the wildcard. I'd probably put him first then, but I'm not sure. I would really love for PA to break some real progressive ground with Kenyatta.

You want PA to break "real progressive ground" (with a candidate who's narrowly less progressive than Fetterman) but would throw that out the window when Lamb runs?

Supporting Manchin Jr. to own the Bros

Err…Lamb supports nuking the filibuster and generally votes the party line

Sinema generally voted the party line too when she was in the House.

[Morning in Atlas]

Absolutely f***ing not.

[Morning in Atlas]

Lamb's campaign is already looking like a Major Yikes.

Ideally Fetterman and The Progressives hold his feet to the fire for this lack of support for Pelosi, since that's what seems to work best.

[Morning in Atlas]

Seeing Blue MAGA rush from Kenyatta to Lamb says all their priorities.

They'd rather stop the left than fight for the Democratic agenda - let alone a progressive one.

[Morning in Atlas]

Seeing Blue MAGA rush from Kenyatta to Lamb says all their priorities.

They'd rather stop the left than fight for the Democratic agenda - let alone a progressive one.

Do you believe that Lamb would "stab Democrats in the back" like Sinema has? Or at least, how many have perceived her to have done?

I do. My position is that he says things, but with the way he campaigns, the reasons he's used to justify his votes, and the state's trend, I don't trust him.

[Morning in Atlas]

Seeing Blue MAGA rush from Kenyatta to Lamb says all their priorities.

They'd rather stop the left than fight for the Democratic agenda - let alone a progressive one.

Do you believe that Lamb would "stab Democrats in the back" like Sinema has? Or at least, how many have perceived her to have done?

I do. My position is that he says things, but with the way he campaigns, the reasons he's used to justify his votes, and the state's trend, I don't trust him.

Lamb seems to be trying to reposition himself as an "anti-Trump" liberal, judging from his announcement video. He seems to have shifted to the left compared to his earlier days as a Representative, but I suspect that's because he's trying to appeal to the Democratic primary base rather than Trump voters, as he did when he ran against Saccone.

This is essentially my position. Once he has to appeal to Trump voters again everything goes out the window.