Association Football 2020/21

[Alcibiades]

Liverpool's in a bit of a cold spell. They've dropped to fourth in the Premier League, and Manchester United just knocked them out of the FA Cup.

Liverpool. Is. Not. A. Very. Good. Team.

Man City is the only truly great team in the Premier League, in that they have complete balance and depth. Liverpool over-performed the last couple seasons because the game had yet to fully catch up with Klopp's tactics, (credit to him for that, of course) but since the restart, they've been far from unbeatable. You would have to say, as flawed as Man Utd's squad is, and as much as they've grossly overpaid for many of their players, they have the better team, although they are being managed by a clown who is way out of his depth.

All of their senior center backs are out, so their best options in that position are two midfielders and a 19-year-old who was playing sixth-tier football last season. I don't know of any team that would perform well under those circumstances.

They were defensively suspect post-restart even with Gomez and Van Dijk, who is extremely overrated. Maguire, on the other hand, is perhaps underrated, in that he's not a garbage player at all, rather just not worth his price tag, something he does not control. But how many teams in Europe, let alone England, really have two great central defenders right now? For me, it's basically just Man City and Juventus. (both have 3) It's no surprise both have such standout defensive records.

Maguire is not underrated, if anything he is overrated. He is very immobile, which he makes up for by blatantly grabbing hold of and wrestling attackers. Refs sadly often overlook this, and he’s lucky not to give away more penalties.

[Santander]

Liverpool's in a bit of a cold spell. They've dropped to fourth in the Premier League, and Manchester United just knocked them out of the FA Cup.

Liverpool. Is. Not. A. Very. Good. Team.

Man City is the only truly great team in the Premier League, in that they have complete balance and depth. Liverpool over-performed the last couple seasons because the game had yet to fully catch up with Klopp's tactics, (credit to him for that, of course) but since the restart, they've been far from unbeatable. You would have to say, as flawed as Man Utd's squad is, and as much as they've grossly overpaid for many of their players, they have the better team, although they are being managed by a clown who is way out of his depth.

All of their senior center backs are out, so their best options in that position are two midfielders and a 19-year-old who was playing sixth-tier football last season. I don't know of any team that would perform well under those circumstances.

They were defensively suspect post-restart even with Gomez and Van Dijk, who is extremely overrated. Maguire, on the other hand, is perhaps underrated, in that he's not a garbage player at all, rather just not worth his price tag, something he does not control. But how many teams in Europe, let alone England, really have two great central defenders right now? For me, it's basically just Man City and Juventus. (both have 3) It's no surprise both have such standout defensive records.

Maguire is not underrated, if anything he is overrated. He is very immobile, which he makes up for by blatantly grabbing hold of and wrestling attackers. Refs sadly often overlook this, and he’s lucky not to give away more penalties.

I think a lot of that is because he's misused by (or doesn't fit into the system of) Solksjaer and Southgate, and he plays with partners who are just not good enough. He's big, strong, good on the ball, and is solid defensively when he doesn't push up too high or lose his head and go out of position. John Terry was a great defender despite being slow. Obviously, Maguire's not John Terry, nor worth 80m, which is the standard to which many people seem to measure him, which is why I said he's perhaps underrated. How many English central defenders are better than Maguire, anyway? To my mind, only John Stones.

[Santander]

Wasting players like Odegaard is why Real Madrid are impossible to like.

[Battista Minola 1616]

The other night Inter beat Milan in the quarter-finals of the Coppa Italia and I feel so good about it. Derby won!

Eriksen's free kick goal was MASTERFUL.

Tonight Spezia plays at Naples in the last quarter-final and I don't feel good about our chances at all. Speaking of which, I've just found out that the stadium of Naples has been renamed foe Diego Armando Maradona after his death lmao.
In the unlikely event Spezia wins I'm going to heavily taunt Sprouts, sorry not sorry.

[Santander]

The other night Inter beat Milan in the quarter-finals of the Coppa Italia and I feel so good about it. Derby won!

Eriksen's free kick goal was MASTERFUL.

The Zlatan-Lukaku fight was fun to watch, too.

[Battista Minola 1616]

In the unlikely event Spezia wins I'm going to heavily taunt Sprouts, sorry not sorry.

Lmao
Spezia lost 4-2 and at one point was down 4-0.
Anyway, it's been fun. I mean, in the last eight years Spezia has reached the final phase (i.e. round of 16) of Coppa Italia four times and the quarter-finals twice, which is still much more than one would expect from a team of our caliber.

The other night Inter beat Milan in the quarter-finals of the Coppa Italia and I feel so good about it. Derby won!

Eriksen's free kick goal was MASTERFUL.

The Zlatan-Lukaku fight was fun to watch, too.

Eh, I only watched the end so I missed that episode.

[Zinneke]

Brussels derby this weekend.

Great article here https://doorfansvoorfans.org/2021/01/29/de-zwanze-derby-komedie-op-toneel-tragedie-voor-de-fans/

thirty-five years. That is how long the fans of RWDM and Union Saint-Gilloise had to wait to experience another Zwanze Derby in competition. And then it would also be served fourfold this season. The supporters were eagerly awaiting this Brussels mini-championship in four acts, but Corona has been throwing a spanner in the works all season.

Nothing beats a genuine city derby. And certainly not when it goes between two historic strongholds such as Union and RWDM. A derby means battle on the field, but maybe even more: battle in the stands. And it is precisely this that has been lacking all season.

The Zwanze Derby is a battle between North and South. The “poor” Molenbeek against the “richer” Sint Gillis and Vorst. RWDM, with the second smallest budget of 1B against Union, Tony Bloom's “million-dollar crew”. The Zwanze Derby is the derby of Brussels. Because where Anderlecht mainly has to rely on supporters from outside the city, the fans of Union and RWDM are real Brusseleirs.

THE ORIGIN OF THE SWAN DERBY
The name Zwanze Derby originated in 1938. The Brussels play Bossemans en Coppenolle juicy translates the rivalry between the two supporter groups. The story is about the Brussels bosom friends François and Auguste. Their son and daughter are about to get married. When François Bossemans and his son Joseph become members of the Union Saint-Gilloise supporters club and Joseph even starts playing there, the misery begins. The Coppenolle family, ardent supporters of Daring Molenbeek, are furiously demanding that the marriage be called off. In fact, emotions run so high that Mrs. Coppenolle locks goalkeeper Joseph just before the match between Union and Daring, so that he cannot participate. The playful way of experiencing football as described in the drama has since been inextricably linked to the Brussels derby. Although they are rivals on the field, the two supporter groups live in harmony with each other. Before, during and after the competition, the focus is on “zieveren en zwanzen”, the typical Brussels humor.

The two teams have a lot in common. In this way they can both look back on a striking history. With highlights, but also a lot of misery. The fans understand each other like no other. Maybe that's why the Zwanze Derby has always been dominated by solidarity in the stands. At least that's how it used to be. Nowadays the clubs seem to have grown apart. Union Saint-Gilloise - from 1897 - is now completely hip "& happening". This is not only due to the recent successes, but also mainly due to the charm and ambiance of the renovated Joseph Marienstadion. The authentic football atmosphere that prevails at Le Mariën has a sucking effect on expats and students.

RWDM is not hip. Molenbeek is old school. The fans of RWDM are always there. Noisy, sometimes a bit on the raw side, but faithful to the dog. In Molenbeek it is called “A legend never dies” and it shows. Fans don't care how many times the club has been buried and revived in the past, they still have a massive presence. A loyalty that was rewarded with the almost inadvertent promotion to 1B.


A promotion that must also have been received with cheers at Union. After all, it meant the return of the Zwanze Derby. Before, there was still a number of friendly games against each other, but a derby is only a derby when it comes to points. Before the start of this season, the old guard certainly had the memories of thirty-five years ago. In 1985, Union and RWDM played each other for the last time in competition. Then, just like now, the Second Division was the scene. In the Duden Park, RWDM won 0-1 by a penalty kick. Fifteen thousand people populated the stands. According to people who were there, it was a real football party, full of Brussels folklore. They were competitions that the whole city lived up to.

It was eagerly anticipated, but the Zwanze Derby unfortunately seems to be turning into an anti-climax this season. There is no room for comedy, as in the theater play Bossemans & Coppenolle (see box), because the derby looks everything like a tragedy to the fans. And it could have been so beautiful. Two tradition clubs with a large following. A playful battle in the stands. The Union Bhoyz against Brussels Power 05. Fireworks guaranteed.

Would there still be “swooning and seeing”, or does that no longer fit in with the present time? We won't know - at least for now. During the first meeting, sometime in September, a handful of supporters were still admitted, not anymore at the second match. This will also be the case next Saturday, so there will be no real derby atmosphere in this third edition either. The last panel of the derby quad will be on the program in just under two months.

FCK USG!

[Santander]

Fat Sam parking the bus against freaking Sheff Utd, lol. Arsenal also very unlucky with that outrageous penalty and red card. Pepe's goal was a contender for goal of the season so far, imo.

[Alcibiades]

Fat Sam parking the bus against freaking Sheff Utd, lol. Arsenal also very unlucky with that outrageous penalty and red card. Pepe's goal was a contender for goal of the season so far, imo.

Yeah, I’m not usually one to blame my team’s loss on refereeing decisions, but Craig Pawson’s performance was a travesty. It wasn’t a penalty (in fact the Wolves player accidentally kicked Luiz), and even if it was, it was a never red card under the double jeopardy rules, as Luiz clearly did not intentionally foul his opponent. As for Leno’s red card, I don’t think it was a denial of a clear goal scoring opportunity, and this is the only grounds for sending a player off for handball. A real shame, because we played very well in the first half. This is one of the rare occasions when the defeat is in no way on the players or manager, but solely due to an officiating nightmare.

[JGibson]

Fat Sam parking the bus against freaking Sheff Utd, lol. Arsenal also very unlucky with that outrageous penalty and red card. Pepe's goal was a contender for goal of the season so far, imo.

Yeah, I’m not usually one to blame my team’s loss on refereeing decisions, but Craig Pawson’s performance was a travesty. It wasn’t a penalty (in fact the Wolves player accidentally kicked Luiz), and even if it was, it was a never red card under the double jeopardy rules, as Luiz clearly did not intentionally foul his opponent. As for Leno’s red card, I don’t think it was a denial of a clear goal scoring opportunity, and this is the only grounds for sending a player off for handball. A real shame, because we played very well in the first half. This is one of the rare occasions when the defeat is in no way on the players or manager, but solely due to an officiating nightmare.

Agreed. Luiz's red card was a farce, while Leno's red was merited. Pawson is a wanker.

[Santander]

Yeah, I’m not usually one to blame my team’s loss on refereeing decisions, but Craig Pawson’s performance was a travesty. It wasn’t a penalty (in fact the Wolves player accidentally kicked Luiz), and even if it was, it was a never red card under the double jeopardy rules, as Luiz clearly did not intentionally foul his opponent.

The double jeopardy rule only applies when the defender makes an attempt to play the ball, so ironically, David Luiz might've been better off taking down Willian Jose, which makes the whole thing a farce. I don't blame the ref for the decision made in real-time, but if that is how VAR is going to interpret the double jeopardy rule, it needs to be rewritten.

[Alcibiades]

Yeah, I’m not usually one to blame my team’s loss on refereeing decisions, but Craig Pawson’s performance was a travesty. It wasn’t a penalty (in fact the Wolves player accidentally kicked Luiz), and even if it was, it was a never red card under the double jeopardy rules, as Luiz clearly did not intentionally foul his opponent.

The double jeopardy rule only applies when the defender makes an attempt to play the ball, so ironically, David Luiz might've been better off taking down Willian Jose, which makes the whole thing a farce. I don't blame the ref for the decision made in real-time, but if that is how VAR is going to interpret the double jeopardy rule, it needs to be rewritten.

I know that “attempt to play the ball” is the broader rule, but apparently the Premier League’s directive to refs includes “intent”. Either way, what happened was ridiculous.

[Santander]

Very similar incident in the Man Utd-Southampton game, except Martial did a lot more than Willian Jose to draw contact and a penalty. This is out of control.

[Santander]

Moyes is doing an amazing job at West Ham. It seems a great fit for him - great youth system, a bit of money to spend, and passionate, but patient fans. Soucek has to be one of the signings of the past 2 seasons. Obviously, Lingard is off to a dream start, too. On paper, I didn't think this team belonged in the top half, but they fully deserve to be in the mix for Europe.

[Santander]

Liverpool is not great and Leicester is awesome. More proof. Okay, playing Henderson in central defense is not ideal, but if their attackers were as good as people thought they were, they'd still be smashing them in for fun at the other end.

[Santander]

All of the Portuguese teams have a chance at an upset, so their ties could be interesting, too.

 

[NewYorkExpress]

Barcelona's loss at Paris-Saint-German yesterday was just embarrassing,

[Mike88]

All of the Portuguese teams have a chance at an upset, so their ties could be interesting, too.

 

However, it's astonishing how a team that loses with Sporting and ties with Braga and Boavista, wins against Juventus...

Nonetheless, amazing result from Porto. Let's hope the same happens in Turin.

[Lechasseur]

Barcelona's loss at Paris-Saint-German yesterday was just embarrassing,

PSG! PSG! PSG!

[Lechasseur]

Barcelona's loss at Paris-Saint-German yesterday was just embarrassing,

But seriously, I think the Spanish dominance of European football we've known for the last 10-20 years is well and truly over. Real and Barca don't seem to be very good anymore and I think it will be quite a while before either of them are Europe's top club again.

The question is who takes over now? I suspect if anything success between different countries' clubs will be more spread out now, but with English clubs+Bayern and PSG being the main forces.

[NewYorkExpress]

Barcelona's loss at Paris-Saint-German yesterday was just embarrassing,

But seriously, I think the Spanish dominance of European football we've known for the last 10-20 years is well and truly over. Real and Barca don't seem to be very good anymore and I think it will be quite a while before either of them are Europe's top club again.

The question is who takes over now? I suspect if anything success between different countries' clubs will be more spread out now, but with English clubs+Bayern and PSG being the main forces.

The way Manchester City's been playing, they might have a two to three year window, and Bayern Munich/Borussia Dortmund/Red Bull Leipzig's business model has proven to be sustainable.

I don't think it'll be PSG, unless they decide to sell one of Neymar/Mbappe. That's a lot of salary tied up into two (admittedly world-class players) that they could instead spread around to get a full team of Champions League quality players.

[Santander]

The biggest thing holding PSG back is the Ligue 1 TV rights deal collapse. PSG itself will survive better than other French clubs, but if they keep running rampant through a division without at least 3-4 other quality teams, they'll never be sharp enough to win the Champions League.

Madrid are the biggest club in the world and will always attract players. Remember, not that long ago, they were consistently getting dumped out of the Champions League in the Round of 16. Bayern will always be there because they basically have first dibs on German talent. When Juventus moves past Ronaldo, they'll be competitive again in a few years, too. Serie A, while a bit of a basketcase, is still miles ahead of Ligue 1, and Juve is way more prestigious than PSG. The Italian government's tax concessions and Brexit will help Serie A.

[NewYorkExpress]

Upset alert! Swiss side Young Boys leads Beyer Leverkusen 3-1 in the Swiss leg of their Europa League match.

EDIT: Make that 3-2.

[Santander]

The early Europa League matches were mediocre, but the late ones were amazing! Ajax and Rangers deserved their wins, and I think Benfica were slightly more deserving of a win than Arsenal, but a draw is fair. (I bet on Benfica to win, so it would've been nice) I have to go back and watch Molde-Hoffenheim later.

[Alcibiades]

The early Europa League matches were mediocre, but the late ones were amazing! Ajax and Rangers deserved their wins, and I think Benfica were slightly more deserving of a win than Arsenal, but a draw is fair. (I bet on Benfica to win, so it would've been nice) I have to go back and watch Molde-Hoffenheim later.

Yeah, Rangers-Antwerp was fantastic! I have to disagree with you on Arsenal-Benfica, I think Arsenal were clearly the better side, with a number of golden chances which went begging.