Israel general discussion

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Good. Sharon Gal is a twerp and obnoxious (much like Yisrael Beiteinu as a whole, I guess, but I digress).

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since the issue of Syrian refugees has come up, a poll has been done about with very definitive results:

Do you support or oppose accepting refugees in Israel?

Oppose: 80%
Support: 11%
Don't know: 9%

Bibi is definitely with most Israelis on this issue.

Good. very glad to see most Israelis are sensible on this.

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Glad to see Amir Ohana get a chance to be in the Knesset. Likud continues to outclass the American Right with it's tolerance of LGBT.

Very depressed to see Shalom go. I hope he is innocent because of his long service in politics, but his wife interfering with an investigation is not a good sign.

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http://www.jpost.com/Israel-News/Politics-And-Diplomacy/Jerusalem-mayor-Nir-Barkat-joins-the-Likud-calls-on-supporters-to-do-the-same-438030

Nir Barkat is officially a Likud member. Not a surprise to anyone, but great news nonetheless for people like me. Whenever the next election is, and if Bibi retires, I'll be starting a #DraftBarkat4PMMovement

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Glad to see Amir Ohana get a chance to be in the Knesset. Likud continues to outclass the American Right with it's tolerance of LGBT.

Very depressed to see Shalom go. I hope he is innocent because of his long service in politics, but his wife interfering with an investigation is not a good sign.

Long service? He's seriously one of the dullest politicians we had, also one who always seemed firmly committed to advancing his reputation with no "agenda\ideology" to advance. I was trying to think of a single memorable decent thing he did and I cannot think of anything. Heck I couldn't even determine his stance on anything!

I'm happy he's gone, he was from the post Yom Kippor generation who brought us nothing but corruption and self preservation (Olmmert, Ramon, and others as well).

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A fringe charecter recently shot by a Palestinian for his third temple activities. would fit better in right of JH, can't see Bibi letting him (he's also a political ally of Feiglin)

Agreed. This is why I think Likud is hoping Oren Hazan isn't corrupt and that he will eventually be unsuspended. I personally have no issue w/ Glick and would like to see him in the Knesset, especially to rid Likud of Hazan.

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http://www.jpost.com/Israel-News/Politics-And-Diplomacy/Jerusalem-mayor-Nir-Barkat-joins-the-Likud-calls-on-supporters-to-do-the-same-438030

Nir Barkat is officially a Likud member. Not a surprise to anyone, but great news nonetheless for people like me. Whenever the next election is, and if Bibi retires, I'll be starting a #DraftBarkat4PMMovement

Word is Likud primaries will be in 2 months so Barkat won't compete.
Hazan isn't going to resign unless he's really under criminal investigation...his parent have too much at stake to let their stock fall...

Very true. It's not surprising, but depressing nonetheless. Hopefully this controversy is either something real or nothing at all...anything to get Hazan's name out of the news for a few weeks.

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I'll put in my two cents on Feiglin. I'm glad he's gone from the Knesset. As Famous Mortimer mentioned, his views aren't crazy but more of a ridiculous nature. Which is part of why I don't take him seriously. I also just think he comes off as an ass.

Yehuda Glick is much better and I would prefer him in.

Also, i agree w/ DavidB on Bibi. I love him, think he's been a good leader, but he needs to retire. He is no longer being productive and he's been in office too long. Whenever the next elections are, if he is still party leader, I will likely support The Jewish Home.

I'll likely support Barkat, if he runs, which won't be while Bibi is still leader, but my preferred and unrealistic choices would be Regev or Hotovely.


 

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http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/205496#.Vn8Be_krLIV

Tel Aviv man arrested for threatening Bibi, other figures.

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a) Still no one has put up any evidence that torture actually took place.
b) By principled I assume you mean "we should only torture Palestinians".

a) One of the detainees lawyer's has released photos of his scarred wrist. Bennett, Shaked etc. also said that there had been no suicide attempt. I don't believe them anymore. I do think these kids were tortured.
b) I am my brother's keeper (even if I disapprove of the bad stuff he did), not the keeper of my evil cousin who wants to kill my brother and me.

I don't disagree with the concept, but when it comes to detaining people, I disagree. Being Jewish does not give anyone a free pass. If you want to have a conversation on whether or not these Jewish suspects were properly detained or not then thats a different conversation, but I frankly don't care either way.

let's not pretend like these people randomly got brought in. There is a reason they were brought in. Their personal histories are shoddy at best and they can provide answers ISA and Shabak needs.

I'm sure you'll disagree, DavidB, many of my friends and family have bitterly disagreed me.

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Fair point. It's a difficult situation, regardless of position. I agree w/ your last point, for sure. It's become a distraction.

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First post of 2016

Going off Hnv1's post, there were rumors of Sa'ar making his own party too? http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/205227#.Vob3JPkrLIU (or am I missing an update on this?)


Also, prayers to Tel Aviv and BDE to the confirmed deceased victims, Alon and Shimon.

And Shabbat Shalom to everyone.

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This is a fairly interesting article about the only remotely realistic way in which centrist/center-leftist parties might be able to oust Netanyahu.

Interesting article, but the word "curious" appeared waaaay too many time in this piece haha

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Well, I've blocked AlwaysBernie after reading his idiotic ramblings.

Moving onto the solider controversy. I feel  for the solider's family, it seems like he let his emotions get the best of him, however, the IDF does have protocol and he violated it. His own soldiers aren't even defending him.

He didn't attack an innocent person, however, and that should be stated over and over. He attack a terrorist, but at the same time Israel prides itself on building a moral military. This type of incident cannot be allowed to go unquestioned.

Also, MKs Avigdor Lieberman, Bezalel Smotrich and Oren Hazan are not people I'd want to cite as people on this solidier's side. Smotrich is crazy, Lieberman is an attention whore, and Hazan is an a-hole.

So, all and all, I think the government and IDF responded appropriately

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So the target was a soldier, who is part of a belligerent occupation of a subjugated populace (which, on top of that, is slowly being ethnically cleansed) and the attacker is a terrorist? I thought there was supposed to be a distinction between civilian and military targets?

Why don't you block me as well then? I'm sure it will be just as effective as when DavidB. blocked me.

I don't block people for dissenting opinions. I block people, like AlwaysBernie and IndyTexas, who are blind hacks and completely belligerent in their opinions.

I won't bother arguing with you because, as we both know, it won't end in any mutual agreement. However, I have no reason to block you.

Now, why don't you be a useful puppet and ignore the war-crimes of ISIS, Assad, Hezbollah and Hamas while you protest Israel.

[SATW]

So the target was a soldier, who is part of a belligerent occupation of a subjugated populace (which, on top of that, is slowly being ethnically cleansed) and the attacker is a terrorist? I thought there was supposed to be a distinction between civilian and military targets?

Why don't you block me as well then? I'm sure it will be just as effective as when DavidB. blocked me.

I don't block people for dissenting opinions. I block people, like AlwaysBernie and IndyTexas, who are blind hacks and completely belligerent in their opinions.

I won't bother arguing with you because, as we both know, it won't end in any mutual agreement. However, I have no reason to block you.

Now, why don't you be a useful puppet and ignore the war-crimes of ISIS, Assad, Hezbollah and Hamas while you protest Israel.

I never understand this argument. Just cause Hamas and Assad are bad, doesn't mean Israel isn't doing really bad stuff too. Isn't it a bit weird Israel has the "let's stay majority Jewish" fetish while gobbling non-Jewish land?

Israel isn't doing "really bad stuff" under any real definition of that term. If you think Israel's actions during the 2008, 2012, and 2014 Gaza/Hamas conflicts are "bad" then I want to see U.S. and U.K. military actions in Iraq thrown into international court, because they killed significantly more civilians in percentage and sheer numbers then Israel ever has.

In regards to settlement construction, I do not believe it is weird at all. The west bank is not anybody's land by international law and most of that land is not inhabited by anybody, so it's not "non-Jewish land." If Israel really wanted to take non-Jewish lands (whatever this is supposed to even mean) then it would've taken Bethlehem and Hebron already. Which, btw, will never happen. So this fantasy dream that Israel is taking over Palestinian-controlled cities is false.

The real double standard is this notion that Israel should be harped on for settlement construction when the Palestinian Authority has no real goal of making peace. Israel could be completely out of the settlements and the PA still won't sign any deal. But, of course, why focus on that?

The Leadership of the Palestinians are the sole people to blame for the lack of a Palestinian state. They have blown every legitimate chance for peace and statehood since 1967.

This whole issue would have been over in 2000, despite the whining of Anti-Israel, Leftist clowns like Robert Malley and Sid Blumenthal. But Arafat was making too much $$$ off being a corrupt terrorist.

Also, how is it a "fetish" to want to keep Israel a Jewish state? It is clearly a democracy that protects it's minority populations. So the negative connotation you placed with your statement is unnecessary.

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Maybe I am miswording my statements by alluding to other countries sins, but that doesn't automatically mean Israel is hiding something or trying to take attention off itself.

The status quo, generally, remains quiet in Israel and the disputed territories until Hamas or the PA start spewing off terror attacks or terror statements. This is literally not the case anywhere else in the region.

Israelis work with Palestinians, Palestinians work with Israelis. Until their leadership starts spewing hatred.

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http://www.jpost.com/Israel-News/Report-Police-scrutinize-opposition-chief-in-suspected-corruption-probe-449738

Herzog named in corruption probe.


http://www.timesofisrael.com/2-top-politicians-suspected-of-major-corruption-report/

Deri too, which is as surprising as learning expired milk can make you sick.

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Chag Sameach to those who celebrate.

Just wanted to know what you all thought of the latest political mishap of Labor's vilage idiot, Isaac Herzog:

"We are not Arab Lovers." - Herzog.

http://www.jpost.com/Israel-News/Politics-And-Diplomacy/Herzog-Zionist-Union-should-stop-giving-the-impression-they-are-always-Arab-lovers-451743
http://972mag.com/no-herzog-arab-lovers-is-the-last-thing-you-can-say-about-labor/118738/
http://www.timesofisrael.com/yachimovich-herzogs-pandering-to-far-right-on-arabs-miserable/


I linked the last article, with Yachimovich's criticisms, because it brings up a point I brought up when I met with Jeremy Bird, the American progressive activist who led V15 for the Zionist Union, in late 2015.

We were discussing whether or not Labor will remain a political force in Israel or if it will fade into obscurity. I predicted that Herzog, but not Labor, will fade into obscurity due to his attempt to swing the party to the middle. Yachimovich seems to be trying to make this a reality, but I think this back and forth between these two will cause a fracture in the party, while Bird claims that he thinks Herzog's strategy will work.

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The name and the mass membership nature of the party means it will always have the potential to bounce back.

True. The question is, i guess, when that will be. As a Likudnik, I won't mind if Labor takes another decade or so to save itself

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So is this good news for Meretz?

eh. I dont' see any major bump for them from this whole ZU fiasco, maybe a seat or two?

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Bibi is a political genius, Liberman joining the coalition and Herzog demolished in a single stroke.

Yup. It's honestly insane how he's mastered the game. Good news for supporters of the coalition. Herzog is quickly becoming a candidate for a political darwin award.

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Orli Levi Abuksis announced in a shock move she's leaving YB right before their entry to the coalition which makes YB one of the smallest factions in the house with only 5 MKs. She said the social requirements were neglected in the coalition talks (which is good because she wanted to have a sub prime bubble here). She was always considered a good MK and a moderate within the party, I guess Lapid will try to attract her to join now.

Bibi promised to fulfil Liberman's demand for "death penalty for terrorists" which is pretty weird as it is already the law but the military courts decide not to activate it. So I guess they'll try making this a mandatory penalty for murder offence in specific Mens Rea which will result in a constitutional cluster F and a certain void. 

Orly Levy, like her father, has a messiah complex, imo.

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Just last election, she was mulling over an offer to join Likud outright.

Yup. Whatever gives her more leverage is what she will do. Just like David Levy.

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Bye, Bogie. Maybe you'll learn how to be a non-crappy politician in the future. All respect to you on your IDF service and service as Def. Min, but clearly, you needed to go.

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Liberman, Bennett, and Kachlon all showing some muscles so the new coalition is delayed. Nothing big will be sorted soon.

MK Micky Zohar (Likud) plans on resigning. Advocate Osnat Hilla Mark wil be sworn in instead. Frankly never even heard her name

Related to Ya'alon's resignation? Or something else?