North Korea declares War on South Korea

[Beet]

Lets just remember, we are talking about a country that found a magical Unicorn lair.

Of course, the Western media proved their usual incompetence and desire to ridicule North Korea and didn't even try to understand what was going on, then peddled their ignorance to a blithely unaware public.

Exactly. The US media treats North Korea as some sort of minstrel show instead of the tragic fascist regime headed by a crazed lunatic with access to nuclear weapons and ballistic missiles, which is what it is. We need to understand this regime, what drives it, and develop a clear strategy to respond to it.

[The Mikado]

Worth pointing out that it was the North Koreans themselves that picked Unicorn as a translation for Qilin.

[The Mikado]

North Korea has great music.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o0wRspGrxjA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ztGGNo5ZmjI

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

...QILIN is what got translated as 'unicorn'?!

[Benj]

...QILIN is what got translated as 'unicorn'?!

It's "kirin" in Korean, but yeah. It's not an uncommon translation, apparently. (Wikipedia says qilin are sometimes called the "Chinese unicorn", similar to how Western dragons and Chinese dragons are connected.)

[Yank2133]

Lets just remember, we are talking about a country that found a magical Unicorn lair.

Of course, the Western media proved their usual incompetence and desire to ridicule North Korea and didn't even try to understand what was going on, then peddled their ignorance to a blithely unaware public.

Exactly. The US media treats North Korea as some sort of minstrel show instead of the tragic fascist regime headed by a crazed lunatic with access to nuclear weapons and ballistic missiles, which is what it is. We need to understand this regime, what drives it, and develop a clear strategy to respond to it.

They aren't as crazy as you think, they know where the line in the sand is drawn and how far they can go with this. NK cares about maintaining their regime and order at all cost and they know attacking Seoul or Japan would be basically be the end of their regime as they know it.

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

...QILIN is what got translated as 'unicorn'?!

It's "kirin" in Korean, but yeah. It's not an uncommon translation, apparently. (Wikipedia says qilin are sometimes called the "Chinese unicorn", similar to how Western dragons and Chinese dragons are connected.)

It's 'kirin' in Japanese, too; I wasn't sure what it was in Korean.

That's terrible. It's really not the sort of thing that can be translated, in my opinion. Even if it was, 'chimera' would be better. The confusion between the different types of dragons--Chinese dragons are normally associated with water, for one thing--is bad enough.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

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http://www.kcna.co.jp/item/2013/201304/news10/20130410-29ee.html

Of course Japan never conspired to shut down a certain .jp website.

[DINGO Joe]

^^

You drunk?

I believe he's preparing for a one-man invasion of NK.

There are a good many of us looking for a chance to return to Asia in fatigues... if only they'd let us...

No.

[MaxQue]

^^

You drunk?

I believe he's preparing for a one-man invasion of NK.

There are a good many of us looking for a chance to return to Asia in fatigues... if only they'd let us...

Time is talking its toll on bodies and I'm pretty sure your body would make you know you're not 20 anymore, sadly.

[Beezer]

Of course, the Western media proved their usual incompetence and desire to ridicule North Korea and didn't even try to understand what was going on, then peddled their ignorance to a blithely unaware public.

Well, it's not like some of the other stories about KJI being born on Mt. Paektu and his birth being heralded by a rainbow are more credible.

[Silent Hunter]

Seems like that missile test is getting closer - worse case scenario there is a failure of the launch resulting in the missile heading for Japan...

[Benj]

Of course, the Western media proved their usual incompetence and desire to ridicule North Korea and didn't even try to understand what was going on, then peddled their ignorance to a blithely unaware public.

Well, it's not like some of the other stories about KJI being born on Mt. Paektu and his birth being heralded by a rainbow are more credible.

Eh, but that has clear propaganda benefits and fits with the ideology of the state. You have to dissect the myths meant for the people of North Korea (most of which are just outlandish claims as to the accomplishments of the Kim family and which have clear internal stability goals) from the statements of the regime to the outside world.

[Beet]

North Korea likely has nuclear weapons that can be delivered by ballistic weapons, according to a classified report by the Defense Intelligence Agency.

According to the report, “DIA assesses with moderate confidence the North currently has nuclear weapons capable of delivery by ballistic missiles however the reliability will be low.” That line was read aloud by Rep. Doug Lamborn, a Republican from Colorado, on Thursday during a House Armed Services Committee hearing. Lamborn was questioning Gen. Martin Dempsey, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, who seemed taken aback and declined to answer the question, saying, “I haven’t seen it and you said it’s not publicly released, so I choose not to comment on it.”

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2013/04/11/pentagon-report-says-north-korea-likely-has-nukes.html

The US can exploit Pyongyang and Kim Jong-un's pride by shelving the nuclear issue for now, engaging in talks, and offering substantial aid and investments that boost North Korea's economy and helps its people 'help themselves.' This can break the cycle of threats and blackmail.

http://www.csmonitor.com/Commentary/Opinion/2013/0410/Obama-must-throw-North-Korea-a-curve-ball-a-helping-US-hand

[CLARENCE 2015!]

We cannot REWARD a dictator threatening to nuke our homeland!

What message does that send to another nutjob... it tells them to acquire weapons of mass destruction and come to the brink of using them on us or our allies to get what they want... to suggest so is madness!!!

[Beet]

We cannot REWARD a dictator threatening to nuke our homeland!

What message does that send to another nutjob... it tells them to acquire weapons of mass destruction and come to the brink of using them on us or our allies to get what they want... to suggest so is madness!!!

What about president Kennedy's decision to remove missiles from Turkey and Italy, and to publicly renounce any future in invasion of Cuba, to resolve the Cuban missile crisis?

[Benj]

The US can exploit Pyongyang and Kim Jong-un's pride by shelving the nuclear issue for now, engaging in talks, and offering substantial aid and investments that boost North Korea's economy and helps its people 'help themselves.' This can break the cycle of threats and blackmail.

http://www.csmonitor.com/Commentary/Opinion/2013/0410/Obama-must-throw-North-Korea-a-curve-ball-a-helping-US-hand

No, that would be phenomenally stupid. It's what Clinton did and then, surprise! In 2002 the North Korean nuclear program they'd begun during "sunshine" was revealed. The regime is happy to take aid from other countries, but it will never take any promises to disarm seriously. Heavy militarization and anti-US propaganda is the entire raison d'etre of the Kim family. You can't make them give that up with some food; the Kims don't care whether the people have extra food.

Nothing the US or anyone else could give them would solve the inherent problem that North Korea is ridiculously far behind South Korea in economic development. As long as the North Koreans know this (and they do), the Kim family needs to keep militarizing and portraying the US as the great enemy in order to ensure that the people are too scared of the US and the US's supposed influence on South Korea to push for reunification and an end to Kim rule. Because, without that fear, the Kims have no argument to the North Korean public that reunification with South Korea is a bad idea.

[CLARENCE 2015!]

We cannot REWARD a dictator threatening to nuke our homeland!

What message does that send to another nutjob... it tells them to acquire weapons of mass destruction and come to the brink of using them on us or our allies to get what they want... to suggest so is madness!!!

What about president Kennedy's decision to remove missiles from Turkey and Italy, and to publicly renounce any future in invasion of Cuba, to resolve the Cuban missile crisis?

We blockaded Cuba and demanded they remove their missiles... it was equitable- we didn't send a gift to Moscow with a pretty bow on top

[Beet]

The US can exploit Pyongyang and Kim Jong-un's pride by shelving the nuclear issue for now, engaging in talks, and offering substantial aid and investments that boost North Korea's economy and helps its people 'help themselves.' This can break the cycle of threats and blackmail.

http://www.csmonitor.com/Commentary/Opinion/2013/0410/Obama-must-throw-North-Korea-a-curve-ball-a-helping-US-hand

No, that would be phenomenally stupid. It's what Clinton did and then, surprise! In 2002 the North Korean nuclear program they'd begun during "sunshine" was revealed. The regime is happy to take aid from other countries, but it will never take any promises to disarm seriously.

Oh come on, that's a Republican talking point. The North had started a uranium enrichment program under the sunshine policy. While undoubtedly a violation of the Agreed Framework, the US was also in violation of the AF by that point. Also, it takes much longer to enrich uranium to the point of a nuclear bomb than it did the Yongbyon plutonium plant that North Korea shut down in the 1990s in response to the AF. As wikipedia said, "The Agreed Framework was successful in freezing North Korean plutonium production in Yongbyon plutonium complex for eight years From 1994 to December 2002." Also,  the AF was successful in keeping North Korea in the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty until January 2003, by which time the U.S. had renounced the AF.

Any way you look at it, North Korea was more cooperative under the AF than it has ever been since.

[Beet]

We cannot REWARD a dictator threatening to nuke our homeland!

What message does that send to another nutjob... it tells them to acquire weapons of mass destruction and come to the brink of using them on us or our allies to get what they want... to suggest so is madness!!!

What about president Kennedy's decision to remove missiles from Turkey and Italy, and to publicly renounce any future in invasion of Cuba, to resolve the Cuban missile crisis?

We blockaded Cuba and demanded they remove their missiles... it was equitable- we didn't send a gift to Moscow with a pretty bow on top

And we'll demand they restore the peace treaty with South Korea, reduce their threat posture, shut down Yongbyon, and restart the Kaesong facilities.

[CLARENCE 2015!]

We cannot REWARD a dictator threatening to nuke our homeland!

What message does that send to another nutjob... it tells them to acquire weapons of mass destruction and come to the brink of using them on us or our allies to get what they want... to suggest so is madness!!!

What about president Kennedy's decision to remove missiles from Turkey and Italy, and to publicly renounce any future in invasion of Cuba, to resolve the Cuban missile crisis?

We blockaded Cuba and demanded they remove their missiles... it was equitable- we didn't send a gift to Moscow with a pretty bow on top

And we'll demand they restore the peace treaty with South Korea, reduce their threat posture, shut down Yongbyon, and restart the Kaesong facilities.

The only deal we should find acceptable is a dismantling of their nuclear program

[Stranger in a strange land]

Unfortunately, Clarence is right here. If Obama does what the author of the CS Monitor Article is advocating, it would be seen as caving to North Korea's threats, and the regime would be able to sell it to their population, and much more importantly, to China, as a victory.

[Bleach Blonde Bad Built Butch Bodies for Biden]

CNN: An administration official says, “We do not believe” North Korea has developed a nuclear warhead.

[Beet]

Why does it matter if North Kores "has a victory"? What matters should be the millions of lives at stake if North Korea actually does something violent. That should be a higher priority than saving face.

[Beet]

Benj, you're just parroting the guy in the video Mikado posted; as I said above, I saw the video already and agree with it. That's why I don't think demanding that North Korea end it's nuclear program right now should be a prerequisite to talks. This is not about Kim portraying the US as an enemy, the content of North Koreas propaganda is not why this crisis is worrying. In fact, the precise need to give Kim a legitimating cause besides belligerence is why we should negotiate. The Norths justification for being will never be solely economics, but that doesn't mean that making North Korea richer wouldn't help them. The regime would like to be able to make the argument 'we can develop economically and remain the " pure race" at the same time.'