This Once Great Movement Of Ours

[beesley]

I think he was one of the few mps at risk of being deselect in 2019

Yes, and relative to pretty much everyone on that wing, not entirely unsurprisingly. The person I was most surprised about being triggered was Diana Johnson, though I assume that was a local thing.

Iirc it was local and generational; she is from right and always came across as a parliamentarian rather than a constituency MP.

Funnily enough every triggered MP was triggered because of local factors and it was just as likely to be done by the right.

There are also some like Virenda Sharma who I don’t think actually have a faction or ideology.

How(and also why) do you become an MP without one ?

Not having a particular faction or ideology within Labour doesn't prevent you from being a good advocate for Labour's values and policies - being a party member usually proves that commitment, and being an impressive candidate can easily be enough to be selected instead of factional allegiance (even if voting is split on factional lines). Keir Starmer is an example of this - other than educated guesses who knows what faction he was actually aligned with if any when he was selected. And just like in the US being aligned with a faction is not deterministic enough to get an accurate reading of a particular candidate - take the mix of people in the Blue Dogs over time, or the differences in the SCG membership now.

In Sharma's case he had no presence in his local Labour Party at all and his advanced age probably reinforces that distance. But he does have a clear set of issues that he focuses on within Parliament. I have no idea how he got selected though.

[MaxQue]

I think he was one of the few mps at risk of being deselect in 2019

Yes, and relative to pretty much everyone on that wing, not entirely unsurprisingly. The person I was most surprised about being triggered was Diana Johnson, though I assume that was a local thing.

Iirc it was local and generational; she is from right and always came across as a parliamentarian rather than a constituency MP.

Funnily enough every triggered MP was triggered because of local factors and it was just as likely to be done by the right.

There are also some like Virenda Sharma who I don’t think actually have a faction or ideology.

How(and also why) do you become an MP without one ?

I don’t know Ealing Labour politics but I’m sure that Al or others will be able to tell the story better than I can about how Virenda get selected…

Wasn't it a case of the NEC excluding the frontrunner endorsed by the late MP and only shortlisting Sharma and the candidate the NEC really wanted?

[Filuwaúrdjan]

I have no idea how he got selected though.

Because he is a prominent local supporter of the Indian National Congress. You asked!

[Blair]

I have no idea how he got selected though.

Because he is a prominent local supporter of the Indian National Congress. You asked!

He did then blame the attempt to trigger him on people playing along religious lines or words to that effect.

[Хahar 🤔]

I have no idea how he got selected though.

Because he is a prominent local supporter of the Indian National Congress. You asked!

In fairness, if people are being selected for their political affiliations in the old country, the Indian National Congress is about as inoffensive as it gets.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

In fairness, if people are being selected for their political affiliations in the old country, the Indian National Congress is about as inoffensive as it gets.

Absolutely, and that was basically the point as well: in a CLP which also contains significant CPI (via whatever is left of the IWA) and Sikh Nationalist elements (some of the latter o/c stormed out and defected to the Tories when their man was not selected; this did not work out well for them in the end) a Congress Man works reasonably well as some sort of compromise of sorts. His predecessor was from a CPI background, though actually spent a few years in the early 1980s in the SDP. Not that that's necessarily entirely contradictory, as you know.

[Secretary of State Liberal Hack]

In fairness, if people are being selected for their political affiliations in the old country, the Indian National Congress is about as inoffensive as it gets.

Absolutely, and that was basically the point as well: in a CLP which also contains significant CPI (via whatever is left of the IWA) and Sikh Nationalist elements (some of the latter o/c stormed out and defected to the Tories when their man was not selected; this did not work out well for them in the end) a Congress Man works reasonably well as some sort of compromise of sorts. His predecessor was from a CPI background, though actually spent a few years in the early 1980s in the SDP. Not that that's necessarily entirely contradictory, as you know.

Both CPI and CPI(M) some of the worst democratic political parties in history, Labour should be wary of their influence

I have no idea how he got selected though.

Because he is a prominent local supporter of the Indian National Congress. You asked!

In fairness, if people are being selected for their political affiliations in the old country, the Indian National Congress is about as inoffensive as it gets.

If you find corruption inoffensive, sure

[CumbrianLefty]

Well we are talking about outside India here, where such opportunities are somewhat reduced.

[Blair]

I think he was one of the few mps at risk of being deselect in 2019

Yes, and relative to pretty much everyone on that wing, not entirely unsurprisingly. The person I was most surprised about being triggered was Diana Johnson, though I assume that was a local thing.

Iirc it was local and generational; she is from right and always came across as a parliamentarian rather than a constituency MP.

Funnily enough every triggered MP was triggered because of local factors and it was just as likely to be done by the right.

There are also some like Virenda Sharma who I don’t think actually have a faction or ideology.

How(and also why) do you become an MP without one ?

Not having a particular faction or ideology within Labour doesn't prevent you from being a good advocate for Labour's values and policies - being a party member usually proves that commitment, and being an impressive candidate can easily be enough to be selected instead of factional allegiance (even if voting is split on factional lines). Keir Starmer is an example of this - other than educated guesses who knows what faction he was actually aligned with if any when he was selected. And just like in the US being aligned with a faction is not deterministic enough to get an accurate reading of a particular candidate - take the mix of people in the Blue Dogs over time, or the differences in the SCG membership now.

In Sharma's case he had no presence in his local Labour Party at all and his advanced age probably reinforces that distance. But he does have a clear set of issues that he focuses on within Parliament. I have no idea how he got selected though.

It was very much the Milibandite tendency- if this counts as a faction. He was privately backed by Ed for his selection & was endorsed by Neil Kinnock. It was reported that he would have been made Attorney General if Ed had won in 2015.

There are remarkable parallels between his selection in 2014 & his election in 2020- prepared very early on, faced a weak field, had a good campaign etc.

In fairness, if people are being selected for their political affiliations in the old country, the Indian National Congress is about as inoffensive as it gets.

Absolutely, and that was basically the point as well: in a CLP which also contains significant CPI (via whatever is left of the IWA) and Sikh Nationalist elements (some of the latter o/c stormed out and defected to the Tories when their man was not selected; this did not work out well for them in the end) a Congress Man works reasonably well as some sort of compromise of sorts. His predecessor was from a CPI background, though actually spent a few years in the early 1980s in the SDP. Not that that's necessarily entirely contradictory, as you know.

There is also the equally funny situation in selections where various cross-community groups in the local area end up backing someone to stop an 'outsider' (e.g someone from another Borough) getting the seat- see Feltham & Heston in 2011.

[beesley]

I think he was one of the few mps at risk of being deselect in 2019

Yes, and relative to pretty much everyone on that wing, not entirely unsurprisingly. The person I was most surprised about being triggered was Diana Johnson, though I assume that was a local thing.

Iirc it was local and generational; she is from right and always came across as a parliamentarian rather than a constituency MP.

Funnily enough every triggered MP was triggered because of local factors and it was just as likely to be done by the right.

There are also some like Virenda Sharma who I don’t think actually have a faction or ideology.

How(and also why) do you become an MP without one ?

Not having a particular faction or ideology within Labour doesn't prevent you from being a good advocate for Labour's values and policies - being a party member usually proves that commitment, and being an impressive candidate can easily be enough to be selected instead of factional allegiance (even if voting is split on factional lines). Keir Starmer is an example of this - other than educated guesses who knows what faction he was actually aligned with if any when he was selected. And just like in the US being aligned with a faction is not deterministic enough to get an accurate reading of a particular candidate - take the mix of people in the Blue Dogs over time, or the differences in the SCG membership now.

In Sharma's case he had no presence in his local Labour Party at all and his advanced age probably reinforces that distance. But he does have a clear set of issues that he focuses on within Parliament. I have no idea how he got selected though.

It was very much the Milibandite tendency- if this counts as a faction. He was privately backed by Ed for his selection & was endorsed by Neil Kinnock. It was reported that he would have been made Attorney General if Ed had won in 2015.

There are remarkable parallels between his selection in 2014 & his election in 2020- prepared very early on, faced a weak field, had a good campaign etc.

In fairness, if people are being selected for their political affiliations in the old country, the Indian National Congress is about as inoffensive as it gets.

Absolutely, and that was basically the point as well: in a CLP which also contains significant CPI (via whatever is left of the IWA) and Sikh Nationalist elements (some of the latter o/c stormed out and defected to the Tories when their man was not selected; this did not work out well for them in the end) a Congress Man works reasonably well as some sort of compromise of sorts. His predecessor was from a CPI background, though actually spent a few years in the early 1980s in the SDP. Not that that's necessarily entirely contradictory, as you know.

There is also the equally funny situation in selections where various cross-community groups in the local area end up backing someone to stop an 'outsider' (e.g someone from another Borough) getting the seat- see Feltham & Heston in 2011.

Also some recent cases where the opposite happened because it  was assumed that would happen and the leadership picked out a candidate - only for the local party to do the opposite. Coventry North West was an example in 2020. Normally this involves leaving out frontrunners - Southwark has a lot of moderate/non-Corbynite councillors yet the only moderate candidate for the London Assembly seat was from Bromley, and was still selected.

[Blair]

Has taken 12 years but finally someone explained local government in an engaging way to a national audience.

https://twitter.com/Zero_4/status/1494448412644761600

[CumbrianLefty]

In fairness, if people are being selected for their political affiliations in the old country, the Indian National Congress is about as inoffensive as it gets.

Absolutely, and that was basically the point as well: in a CLP which also contains significant CPI (via whatever is left of the IWA) and Sikh Nationalist elements (some of the latter o/c stormed out and defected to the Tories when their man was not selected; this did not work out well for them in the end) a Congress Man works reasonably well as some sort of compromise of sorts. His predecessor was from a CPI background, though actually spent a few years in the early 1980s in the SDP. Not that that's necessarily entirely contradictory, as you know.

Sharma himself started off in the Liberals before joining Labour.

[Blair]

Rumours Bercow was involved in another CLP meeting tonight in Battersea- which was an AGM.

He does seem like he was born for the petty rules, grandstanding and long speeches we all love in CLP meetings.

[Torrain]

Rumours Bercow was involved in another CLP meeting tonight in Battersea- which was an AGM.

He does seem like he was born for the petty rules, grandstanding and long speeches we all love in CLP meetings.

Oh no - he’s not trying to get selected for a seat in 2024 is he? Surely not.

Edit: Apparently the Chair of the Battersea CLP (pro-Corbyn, Momentum etc) was ousted at the AGM by a faction of moderates, shepherded by Bercow. According to at least one journalist for the Independent

If I was more versed in Labour politics I’d hazard a joke about entryists.

[Secretary of State Liberal Hack]

Rumours Bercow was involved in another CLP meeting tonight in Battersea- which was an AGM.

He does seem like he was born for the petty rules, grandstanding and long speeches we all love in CLP meetings.

Doesn't Bercow have better things to do ? like seriously does he want to be a backbench MP again ?

[CumbrianLefty]

I would doubt that, actually. But he clearly finds politics too addictive to give up completely.

[Torrain]

Small PLP scuffle yesterday - Labour chief whip called on the 11 MPs who signed the Stop the War letter on Ukraine (widely seen as suggesting Ukraine shared equal responsibility for the invasion) to retract their signatures (subtext clearly suggesting whip would be withdrawn if they refused).

They did so that afternoon

Unclear whether the two suspended MPs (Corbyn and Webbe) recanted.

Either way, Owen Jones went on a tirade about Starmer creating divisions, and most people ignored him.

Just thought it was worth putting here because it had shades of Kinnock scrapping with Militant. Also, have to wonder what the optics would have been like if Starmer had actually done it, and dismissed a full 1/3 of the Socialist Campaign Group from the party in a single afternoon.

[beesley]

Small PLP scuffle yesterday - Labour chief whip called on the 11 MPs who signed the Stop the War letter on Ukraine (widely seen as suggesting Ukraine shared equal responsibility for the invasion) to retract their signatures (subtext clearly suggesting whip would be withdrawn if they refused).

Diane Abbott broke rank first and recanted her signature, and the remaining 10 (including McDonnell, Sultana and Burgon) followed shortly after.

Unclear whether the two suspended MPs (Corbyn and Webbe) recanted.

Either way, Owen Jones went on a tirade about Starmer creating divisions, and most people ignored him.

Just thought it was worth putting here because it had shades of Kinnock scrapping with Militant. Also, have to wonder what the optics would have been like if Starmer had actually done it, and dismissed a full 1/3 of the Socialist Campaign Group from the party in a single afternoon.

Also, this was very much that wing of the SCG. None of the MPs who formed the breakway grouping (Russell-Moyle, Whittome etc.) appear to have signed.

[Torrain]

Just to follow-up on an ambiguity in my last post, Claudia Webbe and Jeremy Corbyn currently remain signatories, according the Stop the War:

https://www.stopwar.org.uk/article/list-of-signatories-stop-the-war-statement-on-the-crisis-over-ukraine/

[EastAnglianLefty]

Young Labour have now had access to their Twitter account taken away. The usual suspects are calling it a vicious purge, but honestly it's just less embarrassing for all concerned this way.

[CumbrianLefty]

Small PLP scuffle yesterday - Labour chief whip called on the 11 MPs who signed the Stop the War letter on Ukraine (widely seen as suggesting Ukraine shared equal responsibility for the invasion) to retract their signatures (subtext clearly suggesting whip would be withdrawn if they refused).

Diane Abbott broke rank first and recanted her signature, and the remaining 10 (including McDonnell, Sultana and Burgon) followed shortly after.

Unclear whether the two suspended MPs (Corbyn and Webbe) recanted.

Either way, Owen Jones went on a tirade about Starmer creating divisions, and most people ignored him.

Just thought it was worth putting here because it had shades of Kinnock scrapping with Militant. Also, have to wonder what the optics would have been like if Starmer had actually done it, and dismissed a full 1/3 of the Socialist Campaign Group from the party in a single afternoon.

Its the opposite of what you say above - Abbott was apparently the last of the 11 to withdraw (though it isn't clear if this had much actual significance)

[Secretary of State Liberal Hack]

Young Labour have now had access to their Twitter account taken away. The usual suspects are calling it a vicious purge, but honestly it's just less embarrassing for all concerned this way.

This would be considered going too far if it was part of a satriarcal media piece.

[Torrain]

Small PLP scuffle yesterday - Labour chief whip called on the 11 MPs who signed the Stop the War letter on Ukraine (widely seen as suggesting Ukraine shared equal responsibility for the invasion) to retract their signatures (subtext clearly suggesting whip would be withdrawn if they refused).

Diane Abbott broke rank first and recanted her signature, and the remaining 10 (including McDonnell, Sultana and Burgon) followed shortly after.

Unclear whether the two suspended MPs (Corbyn and Webbe) recanted.

Either way, Owen Jones went on a tirade about Starmer creating divisions, and most people ignored him.

Just thought it was worth putting here because it had shades of Kinnock scrapping with Militant. Also, have to wonder what the optics would have been like if Starmer had actually done it, and dismissed a full 1/3 of the Socialist Campaign Group from the party in a single afternoon.

Its the opposite of what you say above - Abbott was apparently the last of the 11 to withdraw (though it isn't clear if this had much actual significance)

Apologies - was going off a journalist’s tweet, and should have double checked. Can’t find confirmation about the exact order, so I’ll just delete that section from my original post. Out of interest, do you have a link for that? I’m interested in the dynamics (ie, was the retraction started by a ‘grandee’ like McDonnell, one of the 2019 intake, or did they act in unison).

[Blair]

I think it was Patrick maguire.

The remarkable thing was how quick it was which makes you wonder how many had actually read it…

[beesley]

The Grassroots Voice slate won 5CLP seats on the NEC last time but are only running 4 candidates this election - incumbents Mish Rahman, Gemma Bolton and Yasmine Dar and Young Labour Chair Jess Barnard. Not confident? It wouldn't be a surprise.