Israel-Gaza war

[jaichind]

https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/qatar-leading-talks-swap-hamas-held-hostages-palestinians-israeli-jails-2023-10-09/

"Qatar leading talks to swap Hamas-held hostages for Palestinians in Israeli jails"

My understanding is Hamas is offering two separate deals

a) Israeli civilian prisoners held by Hamas for Palestinian women held by Israel
b) Israel military prisoners held by Hamas for  Palestinian men held by Israel

They seem to be two separate deals that Israel can pick and choose which one or both they want to do

[KaiserDave]

Big Stalin trusted Hitler moment, honestly.

Sorry, couldn't find an English-subtitled version of Gorodnitsky's Molotov-Ribbentrop waltz. Might need to create one myself for reference.

The first song you posted about Operation Barbarossa in Ukraine is interesting because it is in Russian but it uses the Ukrainian word for fatherland, Batkivshchyna, instead of the Russian word otechestvo.

[President of the great nation of 🏳️‍⚧️]

Cry harder libs, you can be straight and into twinks. Donald Trump and Joe Biden agree that there are at least three genders: While Biden doesn't play those games, Trump went as far as to name them when he said he'd kiss anyone regardless of gender:

I'll kiss every guy, man and woman!

"Guy", of course, refers to twinks, and "man" refers to non-twinks.

[Meclazine for Israel]

Palesistinian's not happy that the Sydney Opera House sails lit up in the colours of the Israeli flag.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2023-10-10/pro-palestine-sydney-rally-flares-protest-opera-house-light-up/102954158


The Opera House will be lit in the colours of Israel's flag this evening.

That is what it looked like for Ukraine. ABC are refusing to post photos of the Israeli flag in case it offends Palestinians. ABC has been over-run by woke lefties.

I don't think Sydney siders will be on board with the Lebanese and Palestinian protestors given their track record.

A crime wave over two decades of murder, rapes and drug dealing stems mainly from Lebanese and Muslim gangs in Sydney.

Police are urging the Jewish community to avoid going to the Sydney CBD this evening.

The protestors were heard chanting "F#$ Israel, F$# The Jews".

Prime Minister Anthony Albanese called for their march to be abandoned.

[All Along The Watchtower]

https://twitter.com/sentdefender/status/1711397208648491033
Palestinian Islamic Jihad claims responsibility for today's attacks from along the Lebanon border.

Aren’t they a close ally/proxy of Iran?

[GALeftist]

Both Intifadas were explicitly declared by the Palestinians. You can consider them justified attacks -- I think this is totally ridiculous and that even stuff like WW2 had more shades of grey, but whatever -- but it certainly wasn't Israel who launched them.

Genuinely lol'd at this

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

https://twitter.com/EdKrassen/status/1711402908384743617?t=I2CSVlkQQn1_zbizXJeMT...

[All Along The Watchtower]

AP reports that the Egyptian government repeatedly tried to warn Israel that Hamas was planning this invasion - that Netanyahu knew what was coming but still failed to stop it

Allies who share intelligence with Israel said security agencies were misreading reality.

An Egyptian intelligence official said Egypt, which often serves as a mediator between Israel and Hamas, had spoken repeatedly with the Israelis about “something big,” without elaborating.

He said Israeli officials were focused on the West Bank and played down the threat from Gaza. Netanyahu’s government is made up of supporters of Jewish West Bank settlers who have demanded a security crackdown in the face of a rising tide of violence there over the last 18 months.

“We have warned them an explosion of the situation is coming, and very soon, and it would be big. But they underestimated such warnings,” said the official, who spoke on condition of anonymity because he wasn’t authorized to discuss the content of sensitive intelligence discussions with the media.

I suspected as much. Israel has close intelligence relationships with several Arab governments, Egypt being one of their closest. And the Egyptians would have very obvious reasons for keeping a close eye on Gaza.

This suggests that Israeli political leadership has made it clear that they don’t want to hear bad news from their own intelligence and security services, perhaps especially about Gaza. And said services have been too busy focused on protecting settlers in the West Bank even as Bibi has been high on his own supply about the Abraham Accords and the prospects of diplomatic recognition with Saudi Arabia.

Only time will tell whether he and anyone else in the Government will be held responsible for this lethally catastrophic failure to protect Israel from these attacks—in the meantime, there already are accusations flying around about an anti-patriotic “Deep State” within Shin Bet and other agencies.

[Darthpi – Anti-Florida Activist]

I've been a bit too horrified by all that's been going on thus far to comment until now, but I think I've finally gathered my thoughts sufficiently. All of these points are important, so I'm ordering them based on immediate relevancy to the current crisis, with the most immediate first.

1. The massacres of civilians committed by Hamas are absolutely reprehensible and unjustifiable. The Israeli people do not deserve to be facing such violence, and those responsible deserve to be jailed or executed. This is a simple point that requires no nuance, in my view.

2. I am very, very alarmed by the statements coming out of the Netanyahu government about cutting off all food and electricity in Gaza, and by the calls by some on the Israeli far right for a second Nakba. With fringe lunatics like Smotrich and Ben-Gvir in the government, I am terrified by the prospect of large-scale war crimes being committed by the Israeli military against the civilian population of Gaza, who are not responsible for the atrocities committed by Hamas.

3. Hamas is not engaged in anything resembling a just struggle for national liberation and does not give a damn about the well-being of the Palestinian people, and it's important that everyone recognize that. While sometimes armed resistance is justifiable in the face of human rights abuses, any such resistance must - absolutely *must* - be targeted at the government committing such abuses. The model I always keep in mind when discussing this is the MK in Apartheid-era South Africa, which focused on sabotage operations primarily against South Africa's military and policing forces. The statements coming out of PSL and some of the state level DSA groups - though importantly not the national DSA organization - trying to conflate Hamas' civilian massacres with legitimate armed resistance like the MK is at best delusional and at worst outright collaborationist.

4. The violent attacks by Hamas on civilian targets do not change *in any way* the fundamental truth that the Israeli government has routinely abused the Palestinian population for decades, denying basic human rights and setting up a military occupation in the West Bank and Gaza that is at minimum alarmingly and increasingly similar to Apartheid, even if it is not identical to the historical Apartheid regime in South Africa. This abusive regime is wrong and it must be brought to an end. Additionally, by delegitimizing and undermining the mainstream voices in the Palestinian National Authority and Fatah, the Israeli government created a power vacuum in Gaza that allowed Hamas to establish dominance by force. And while I must repeat with maximum emphasis that the actions of Hamas are entirely unjustified, it remains true that the Israeli governments policies of refusing any discussions of a just settlement with the Palestinian Authority, and of continued and growing abuses against Palestinian civilians, makes violence like this all the more likely.

[Red Velvet]

AP reports that the Egyptian government repeatedly tried to warn Israel that Hamas was planning this invasion - that Netanyahu knew what was coming but still failed to stop it

Allies who share intelligence with Israel said security agencies were misreading reality.

An Egyptian intelligence official said Egypt, which often serves as a mediator between Israel and Hamas, had spoken repeatedly with the Israelis about “something big,” without elaborating.

He said Israeli officials were focused on the West Bank and played down the threat from Gaza. Netanyahu’s government is made up of supporters of Jewish West Bank settlers who have demanded a security crackdown in the face of a rising tide of violence there over the last 18 months.

“We have warned them an explosion of the situation is coming, and very soon, and it would be big. But they underestimated such warnings,” said the official, who spoke on condition of anonymity because he wasn’t authorized to discuss the content of sensitive intelligence discussions with the media.

for what it's worth, Netanyahu's office has issued a statement denying it

What else is he gonna do?

"Yup, I f***ed that one up."  ?

He didn’t though, it’s all according to his plan.

[Comrade Funk]

If true, he should resign in disgrace
https://twitter.com/ragipsoylu/status/1711394276687388687

[Zinneke]

Are the reports that Netenyahu was hospitalised true? I can see someone that off the deep end of things powering on with the Kahanists when anybody concerned ilwith Israel's security would jettison them.

[jaichind]

If true, he should resign in disgrace
https://twitter.com/ragipsoylu/status/1711394276687388687

Is this not a function of "how many such warnings the Israeli government gets on a weekly basis?"  If they get 5 or 6 of such warnings every week how is Netanyahu supposed to know this particular warning has legs. 

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

If true, he should resign in disgrace
https://twitter.com/ragipsoylu/status/1711394276687388687

Is this not a function of "how many such warnings the Israeli government gets on a weekly basis?"  If they get 5 or 6 of such warnings every week how is Netanyahu supposed to know this particular warning has legs. 

One would think Israel's own (very good when it's not being made to prioritize mollycoddling settlers) security apparatus would have been able to corroborate the Egyptians on this.

[LAKISYLVANIA]

https://twitter.com/POLITICOEurope/status/1711384192435556383

Belgium has announced they aren't ending it.

[Ferguson97]

https://twitter.com/DrDavidInDC/status/1711126327250534484

https://twitter.com/Hitler9/status/11293812509

[Bacon King]

Is this not a function of "how many such warnings the Israeli government gets on a weekly basis?"  If they get 5 or 6 of such warnings every week how is Netanyahu supposed to know this particular warning has legs. 

how often does the Intelligence Minister of a neighboring country personally call Netanyahu himself to share urgent news of a severe and immenent threat?

I would assume not very often

like this wasn't a vague generic warning getting shared between low-level functionaries of their intelligence agencies. the intel obtained by Egypt was credible, serious, and urgent enough that they found it necessary to immediately go straight to the top and share it with Bibi directly rather than passing it through any of the usual channels

[🦀🎂🦀🎂]

Hamas have just released a statement: they will execute the hostages (on video) if the unannounced (i.e. no roof knocking) airstrikes continue.

[Birdish]

Hamas have just released a statement: they will execute the hostages (on video) if the unannounced (i.e. no roof knocking) airstrikes continue.

Seeing as how a sizable chunk of the hostages don't even appear to be Israeli, that seems unwise.

[Farmlands]

Egyptian officials are also claiming that the political leaders of Hamas were unaware of the planned attack. I strongly doubt the veracity of that. We'll probably need to wait a while longer to get the full picture of the events of this past week.

[It’s so Joever]

Hamas have just released a statement: they will execute the hostages (on video) if the unannounced (i.e. no roof knocking) airstrikes continue.

Are they actually stupid?

[LAKISYLVANIA]

Hamas have just released a statement: they will execute the hostages (on video) if the unannounced (i.e. no roof knocking) airstrikes continue.

Are they actually stupid?

What should they do according to you?

[Ferguson97]

https://twitter.com/DeItaone/status/1711432535098462336

[🦀🎂🦀🎂]

Hamas have just released a statement: they will execute the hostages (on video) if the unannounced (i.e. no roof knocking) airstrikes continue.

Are they actually stupid?

It strikes me as latter day Da'esh style nihilism: you accept you are dead so you take out Israel's credibility as a safe space along with the entire arab reconciliation project with you.

[It’s so Joever]

Hamas have just released a statement: they will execute the hostages (on video) if the unannounced (i.e. no roof knocking) airstrikes continue.

Are they actually stupid?

What should they do according to you?

As of now? Surrender completely and call upon both the Palestininian and Israeli people to work towards a deal in which 1967 border are completly respected. Of course it likely wouldn’t work but it’s better than further provoking their much stronger neighbor into committing a genocide against their own people.
Escalation on both sides for decades brought us here, the solution is not the same thing that has caused so much pain in the first place.