Stop the Ignorance!

[Gustaf]

I've decided to start a thread related to the World Leader Survivor voting. The idea is to use this to get information on leaders that I know little about and thus stop the ignorance.

If others want to look at it and learn what I learn that's fine, obviously.

As long as people are cool and civilized about it this thread can also be used to discuss leaders, I guess. But since some won't be cool and civilized about it I don't really want that.

After glancing at Wikipedia I'll just throw out a couple of lesser known names there that after my shallow research seem to be pretty good leaders:

(NOTE: I've done this based on countries and don't have the names in front of me right now!)

Mauritius: is doing pretty well for an African country.

Mali: Overthrew non-democratic government, then volontarily stepped down allowing the democratically elected leader to gain power. Stood for election a decade later and was elected. Seems decent.

Sierra Leone: one of the few to criticize Mugabe, seems to be doing his best with rebuilding the country. I've heard from other sources that Sierra Leone is doing okay.

Indonesia: seems unusually peaceful for an Indonesian military commander.

Antigua and Barbuda: this guy seems to have done a lot of work to get the country democratic

Maldives: this guy was an Amnesty prisoner of conscience or whatever it is called and went through a lot of prison sentences due to being critical of the government. Finally brought free elections and won the first one.

Bhutan: I know I voted for having this loon out before, but he's in a weak group and he IS the first democratically elected leader of the country.

Tuvalu: the guy seems to be a democratic non-entity and thus deserves to stay on longer than some of the worse people on the list.

Botswana: Botswana is doing VERY well for an African country. THey're ranked as the least corrupt African country, similar to Portugal, and they're in the top 60-70 in the world when it comes to GDP per capita. Pro-Western government.

Liberia: democratically elected female economist. Seems to be putting the country on right track after long history of civil war.

BAD LEADERS!

Saint Vincent and the Grenadines: nepotist, rapist, radical leftist who doesn't seem to be doing the economy much good.

Bangladesh: that woman seems to be a trouble-maker who can't accept losing elections. She brought Bangladesh to the position of most corrupt country in the world.

Disclaimer! This is all wikipedia corroborrated by what little I knew beforehand. If you have better sources to bring in, please do. However, in cases where the article is obviously slanted I've mostly ignored it of course.

[Antonio the Sixth]

Great idea, Gustaf.

[dead0man]

Great idea, I thank you.  I've been using The State of the World Liberty Index along with Google/wiki for my votes.  link

[Gustaf]

Great idea, I thank you.  I've been using The State of the World Liberty Index along with Google/wiki for my votes.  link

Ah, that's good too. I've been using GDP per capita numbers too.

[Gustaf]

I think the bottom 44 in that index have all been voted off, so it's a good showing so far, imo.

[dead0man]

Guinea's Moussa Dadis Camara in Group 4.  Guinea is 143.  Group 4 REALLY sucks though.

[Gustaf]

Guinea's Moussa Dadis Camara in Group 4.  Guinea is 143.  Group 4 REALLY sucks though.

Ah, yes. Camara is my next target in that group.

The group isn't that bad. Several lesser-known but decent leaders in it, if you ask me. I think thee was another group I liked less, actually.

[minionofmidas]

Botswana: Botswana is doing VERY well for an African country. THey're ranked as the least corrupt African country, similar to Portugal, and they're in the top 60-70 in the world when it comes to GDP per capita. Pro-Western government.

Botswana got the kind of deal on its natural wealth that all similar countries would have been due. And has a very low population.

And that's its wealth. In other words, its much like Argentina before it was destroyed.

[Gustaf]

Botswana: Botswana is doing VERY well for an African country. THey're ranked as the least corrupt African country, similar to Portugal, and they're in the top 60-70 in the world when it comes to GDP per capita. Pro-Western government.

Botswana got the kind of deal on its natural wealth that all similar countries would have been due. And has a very low population.

And that's its wealth. In other words, its much like Argentina before it was destroyed.

Having natural resources is not a free pass at all, if you handle it wrongly. Look at Congo!

[minionofmidas]

Having natural resources is not a free pass at all, if you handle it wrongly. Look at Congo!

*cough* population *cough* Congo never got anything for its ores.

First link to come up.... Botswana had the bargaining power to get that contract back in 1967 due to the timing and its location. (decolonization; South Africa)

Mind you, I'm not voting to get Botswana's President off. It's just that other African countries never had the opportunity Botswana didn't blow.

[Hash]

People who vote for Nasheed hate democracy and freedom.

[Nhoj]

Guinea's Moussa Dadis Camara in Group 4.  Guinea is 143.  Group 4 REALLY sucks though.

camara isnt all that bad considering he couped an already undemocratic country and has said he nor any of his fellow coupers will stand in the elections of course i think he needs to go of course as hes definitely not all that good either..

[Gustaf]

Guinea's Moussa Dadis Camara in Group 4.  Guinea is 143.  Group 4 REALLY sucks though.

camara isnt all that bad considering he couped an already undemocratic country and has said he nor any of his fellow coupers will stand in the elections of course i think he needs to go of course as hes definitely not all that good either..

He isn't THAT bad, but there are better people in the group, imo.

[Nhoj]

Guinea's Moussa Dadis Camara in Group 4.  Guinea is 143.  Group 4 REALLY sucks though.

camara isnt all that bad considering he couped an already undemocratic country and has said he nor any of his fellow coupers will stand in the elections of course i think he needs to go of course as hes definitely not all that good either..

He isn't THAT bad, but there are better people in the group, imo.

indeed thats why im voting him off.

[Bunwahaha [still dunno why, but well, so be it]]

Good idea.

But well, personally, as long as I was on the forum, I stopped to vote after that people/regimes of which I was sure of their bad track record have left. When I don't know that much, just a small summary about the situation, I wouldn't vote given I always tell me that so much things can enter in counts to explain such or such a way to govern, and as I don't control all that things, I wouldn't accuse such or such.

Not that I say everyone should do the same, that's just a personal feeling, and I guess that with my method, the World survivors redux would pretty quickly turn into the Negev desert (why Negev? I don't know, put you can pick Sahara, or Gobi, or even Taklamakan, it's you to see, the most important is to get the idea of desert......).

That said, I must welcome that thread aimed to stop the ignorance. And I also welcome the fact that you don't only pick infos on Wiki, which could be the victim of every propagandist, especially when it's about controversial leaders...

Thank you.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

And Fuoud Sinoira is also the democratically elected leader of a pro-Western government. I suppose some people want him gone because he doesn't believe Israel has the right to do whatever it wants ever and carpet bomb and devestate his country.

[Gustaf]

And Fuoud Sinoira is also the democratically elected leader of a pro-Western government. I suppose some people want him gone because he doesn't believe Israel has the right to do whatever it wants ever and carpet bomb and devestate his country.

This thread is about stopping ignorance, so I'd prefer not to have you in it. I know you're not interested in thinking through your choices anyway.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

And Fuoud Sinoira is also the democratically elected leader of a pro-Western government. I suppose some people want him gone because he doesn't believe Israel has the right to do whatever it wants ever and carpet bomb and devestate his country.

This thread is about stopping ignorance, so I'd prefer not to have you in it. I know you're not interested in thinking through your choices anyway.

And there appears to be some ignorance about Sinoira with everyone trying to vote him off.

If you note too, I haven't been targeting the people you mentioned in the OP.

[Stranger in a strange land]

Ellen Johnson Sirleaf of Liberia is pretty good as well (certainly by African standards)

[Silent Hunter]

Botswana: Botswana is doing VERY well for an African country. THey're ranked as the least corrupt African country, similar to Portugal, and they're in the top 60-70 in the world when it comes to GDP per capita. Pro-Western government.

Botswana got the kind of deal on its natural wealth that all similar countries would have been due. And has a very low population.

And that's its wealth. In other words, its much like Argentina before it was destroyed.

Very high HIV/AIDS rate though. A very good country.

[Gustaf]

Ellen Johnson Sirleaf of Liberia is pretty good as well (certainly by African standards)

Yep. She's on my mental list as well. But I knew about her before this thing started so I didn't think of her as one of those people I had to look up.

[Gustaf]

And Fuoud Sinoira is also the democratically elected leader of a pro-Western government. I suppose some people want him gone because he doesn't believe Israel has the right to do whatever it wants ever and carpet bomb and devestate his country.

This thread is about stopping ignorance, so I'd prefer not to have you in it. I know you're not interested in thinking through your choices anyway.

And there appears to be some ignorance about Sinoira with everyone trying to vote him off.

If you note too, I haven't been targeting the people you mentioned in the OP.

No, you've been targeting Harper. I guess you prefer a radical islamist who support sucide attacks against civilians to Canada.

The point here is not that it's idiocy to vote off people like Harper or Sarkozy this early, but to spread information about lesser known leaders.

If you want to start a thread on why Canada is one of the world's worse countries and explain why Harper is one of the world's worse leaders, you go do that.

[GMantis]

I would say that Robert Fico is more of a populist and socialist, and most of all unprincipled than a fascist. In any case, his foreign policy and attitude to the IMF is vastly superior to most East European leaders.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

I didn't say that he himself was a fascist, just a fascist-enabler. Like the Catholic Centre Party.

[big bad fab]

And Fuoud Sinoira is also the democratically elected leader of a pro-Western government. I suppose some people want him gone because he doesn't believe Israel has the right to do whatever it wants ever and carpet bomb and devestate his country.

This thread is about stopping ignorance, so I'd prefer not to have you in it. I know you're not interested in thinking through your choices anyway.

And there appears to be some ignorance about Sinoira with everyone trying to vote him off.

If you note too, I haven't been targeting the people you mentioned in the OP.

You're right BRTD !
Huge ignorance about his name, for example....

Poor Fouad Siniora....
Hadn't you try to put Sarkozy, Harper or others out, we wouldn't vote for Siniora yet.