Obama has torture memos released

[Scam of God]

All I'm hearing is Blubber spouting off various right-wing inanities, without bothering to back them up with facts.

... you do have factual evidence for your assertions, right, Blubby?

What is inane about saying that terrorists do not have any rights?  What is inane about saying that it is better to torture a captured terrorist if he has information that could potentially prevent a terrorist attack?

Your assertion is that 'terrorists' retrieved off a battlefield have no rights. The Geneva Convention suggests otherwise.

Your status as an Internet Tough Guy and reality seem to be at fundamental loggerheads.

[Scam of God]

# Convention I, Article 13: Non-traditional combatants, such as militias or resistance movements, must, among other things, have “a fixed sign recognizable at a distance,” they must “carry their army openly”, and they must themselves follow the laws of war.

Al-Qaeda in Iraq wears a uniform, and those who have not committed war crimes are fully entitled to the protections offered by Geneva.

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Sure, some enemy combatants do this. Most don't.

Again I ask: upon what factual premises do you base your claims?

[Rowan]

px75, you really don't think Americans are tortured when captured by Al-Qaeda? Do you really think they give a sh**t about the Geneva convention?

[Rowan]

# Convention I, Article 13: Non-traditional combatants, such as militias or resistance movements, must, among other things, have “a fixed sign recognizable at a distance,” they must “carry their army openly”, and they must themselves follow the laws of war.

Al-Qaeda in Iraq wears a uniform, and those who have not committed war crimes are fully entitled to the protections offered by Geneva.

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Sure, some enemy combatants do this. Most don't.

Again I ask: upon what factual premises do you base your claims?

A turbin doesn't count as a uniform.

[Scam of God]

px75, you really don't think Americans are tortured when captured by Al-Qaeda? Do you really think they give a sh**t about the Geneva convention?

It doesn't matter if they don't care. We are legally required to.

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Nobody thinks your cock is longer for pretending to be macho on the Internet.

Also: it's turban, you non-spelling redneck subhuman sh**tstain.

[Rowan]

px75, you really don't think Americans are tortured when captured by Al-Qaeda? Do you really think they give a sh**t about the Geneva convention?

It doesn't matter if they don't care. We are legally required to.

Nobody thinks your cock is longer for pretending to be macho on the Internet.

I just don't understand the mentality of coddling terrorists that are trying to kill Americans. No wonder Democrats always lose on national security issues.

[Scam of God]

px75, you really don't think Americans are tortured when captured by Al-Qaeda? Do you really think they give a sh**t about the Geneva convention?

It doesn't matter if they don't care. We are legally required to.

Nobody thinks your cock is longer for pretending to be macho on the Internet.

I just don't understand the mentality of coddling terrorists that are trying to kill Americans. No wonder Democrats always lose on national security issues.

I don't understand the psychology of beating one's chest in compensation for one's tiny intellect and micropenis. No wonder conservatives are all permavirgins.

[k-onmmunist]

px75, you really don't think Americans are tortured when captured by Al-Qaeda? Do you really think they give a sh**t about the Geneva convention?

You'd be foolish to actually believe that Americans wouldnt be tortured... Al Qaeda are a terrorist group, not a nation, who aren't bound by such terms.

[Scam of God]

px75, you really don't think Americans are tortured when captured by Al-Qaeda? Do you really think they give a sh**t about the Geneva convention?

It doesn't matter if they don't care. We are legally required to.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

Nobody thinks your cock is longer for pretending to be macho on the Internet.

Also: it's turban, you non-spelling redneck subhuman sh**tstain.

If we've been violating the Geneva Convention (we haven't been) for all these years, then why don't we just do it some more?  The other nations don't seem to care.  Do you really want to follow the law to the letter when American lives are at stake?

Sure. I don't give a good God damn motherf**k about "'Murrican lives". Lives are lives, being equivalent in value, and that is to say possessing in none.

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I have no 'values'; my 'values' extend only to my own life, and I am not so presumptuous as to pretend that they are fit for any other man. Know this, however: when I am in Hell, I will pull your Christ off his throne and rape his ass until he shoots. I will make the God of all Creation squirm in ecstasy and agony while his cheeks throttle my rod.

... I hope you sleep well at night.

[tik 🪀✨]

px75, you really don't think Americans are tortured when captured by Al-Qaeda? Do you really think they give a sh**t about the Geneva convention?

It doesn't matter if they don't care. We are legally required to.

Nobody thinks your cock is longer for pretending to be macho on the Internet.

I just don't understand the mentality of coddling terrorists that are trying to kill Americans. No wonder Democrats always lose on national security issues.

Part of defeating terrorism is being an example that we are better than them morally. Lowering ourselves to their levels is not winning us points in preventing future terrorists. Is it that hard for you to comprehend that not bending, breaking, or avoiding international law is good for both our future and the future of the countries we've invaded? Islamic terrorists adore a tortured martyr, it's perfect recruiting material. I don't know how many ways to state this - but what's terrifying is that there are millions of people out there just like you who don't understand. I really am beginning to think it goes beyond the "anything to get the needed information" schtick (a valid concern, of course, just not a real solution to the problem) and really does venture into some sadistic pleasure.

[k-onmmunist]

They can't win: If they give the terrorists what they deserve (execution), it makes them martyrs, if we're soft on them, the government are seen as weaklings. It's not like it's an easy choice to make.

[Landslide Lyndon]

px75, you really don't think Americans are tortured when captured by Al-Qaeda? Do you really think they give a sh**t about the Geneva convention?

So what you propose is for the civilized Western Democracies to stoop to Bin Laden's level in order to defeat him. How thoughtful! How brilliant!

But I'll just let Andrew Sullivan speak. I couldn't have said it better myself.

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[k-onmmunist]

The terrorists have no rules. We do. That's the difference.

[tik 🪀✨]

They can't win: If they give the terrorists what they deserve (execution), it makes them martyrs, if we're soft on them, the government are seen as weaklings. It's not like it's an easy choice to make.

I would have thought that invading other nations and toppling their governments within mere weeks, capturing their former leaders, resisting insurgencies, finding and capturing extremist leaders and soldiers, and helping establish new governments and infrastructure would be enough of a sign. But I suppose without testicle electrodes and water boarding that's pretty pansy.

[Landslide Lyndon]

If you really think that, you're an idiot.  While we go on being 'moral' the terrorists will still be attacking.  They're not going to quit because they see this as a war (not as a criminal matter as most liberals see it).  Also, we're not 'stooping down to their level'.  If someone attacks you with a knife and you retaliate, it is not being evil but being defensive.  Right now we're doing what we failed to do in the 90's by not reacting but taking preventive measures to make sure our citizens don't get killed.  The two are not comparable.

My god, you are absolutely right. I wonder how that wussy FDR won WWII without creating extermination camps where he would torture and kill the captured German and Japanes soldiers, like they did.

Being the smarmy liberal he was he just did some lame-ass concentration camps for the Japanese-Americans, which as we know were crucial to the Allied victory.
 

[k-onmmunist]

They can't win: If they give the terrorists what they deserve (execution), it makes them martyrs, if we're soft on them, the government are seen as weaklings. It's not like it's an easy choice to make.

I would have thought that invading other nations and toppling their governments within mere weeks, capturing their former leaders, resisting insurgencies, finding and capturing extremist leaders and soldiers, and helping establish new governments and infrastructure would be enough of a sign. But I suppose without testicle electrodes and water boarding that's pretty pansy.

And how well did that work in Iraq? Not very.

[tik 🪀✨]

px75, you really don't think Americans are tortured when captured by Al-Qaeda? Do you really think they give a sh**t about the Geneva convention?

It doesn't matter if they don't care. We are legally required to.

Nobody thinks your cock is longer for pretending to be macho on the Internet.

I just don't understand the mentality of coddling terrorists that are trying to kill Americans. No wonder Democrats always lose on national security issues.

Part of defeating terrorism is being an example that we are better than them morally. Lowering ourselves to their levels is not winning us points in preventing future terrorists. Is it that hard for you to comprehend that not bending, breaking, or avoiding international law is good for both our future and the future of the countries we've invaded? Islamic terrorists adore a tortured martyr, it's perfect recruiting material. I don't know how many ways to state this - but what's terrifying is that there are millions of people out there just like you who don't understand. I really am beginning to think it goes beyond the "anything to get the needed information" schtick (a valid concern, of course, just not a real solution to the problem) and really does venture into some sadistic pleasure.

If you really think that, you're an idiot.  While we go on being 'moral' the terrorists will still be attacking.  They're not going to quit because they see this as a war (not as a criminal matter as most liberals see it).  Also, we're not 'stooping down to their level'.  If someone attacks you with a knife and you retaliate, it is not being evil but being defensive.  Right now we're doing what we failed to do in the 90's by not reacting but taking preventive measures to make sure our citizens don't get killed.  The two are not comparable.

I'm not really up for arguing with you at length as I was convinced months ago that you're a joke poster, but for now I must reply that comparing what happens actively on a battle field and what happens when you're a prisoner of war are hardly in the same league. Let's say someone with a knife did attack you on the street and you retaliated, winning the fight. Would it then be alright for you to take them back to your house, lock them in the basement, and torture them for days? I know this isn't comparable to war, but then again, it was your scenario.

The point here is that treating someone like scum (and many are - I do not feel much empathy for them, believe me) is both unlikely to give us good information to prevent imminent attacks AND is likely to give sentiment to the other side, increasing the likelihood of future attacks. This strategy works against us in both present and future. If you cannot understand that then I'm afraid you need to re-evaluate who needs to be addressed as an idiot.

[tik 🪀✨]

They can't win: If they give the terrorists what they deserve (execution), it makes them martyrs, if we're soft on them, the government are seen as weaklings. It's not like it's an easy choice to make.

I would have thought that invading other nations and toppling their governments within mere weeks, capturing their former leaders, resisting insurgencies, finding and capturing extremist leaders and soldiers, and helping establish new governments and infrastructure would be enough of a sign. But I suppose without testicle electrodes and water boarding that's pretty pansy.

And how well did that work in Iraq? Not very.

I mentioned not whether I thought that course of events was a good idea - I was simply mentioning why, with all of that, not torturing individual combatants was necessary to look "tough" on the "war on terror."

[Landslide Lyndon]

If you really think that, you're an idiot.  While we go on being 'moral' the terrorists will still be attacking.  They're not going to quit because they see this as a war (not as a criminal matter as most liberals see it).  Also, we're not 'stooping down to their level'.  If someone attacks you with a knife and you retaliate, it is not being evil but being defensive.  Right now we're doing what we failed to do in the 90's by not reacting but taking preventive measures to make sure our citizens don't get killed.  The two are not comparable.

My god, you are absolutely right. I wonder how that wussy FDR won WWII without creating extermination camps where he would torture and kill the captured German and Japanes soldiers, like they did.

Being the smarmy liberal he was he just did some lame-ass concentration camps for the Japanese-Americans, which as we know were crucial to the Allied victory.
 

This is different from FDR's internment camps (the horrors of which have been exaggerated greatly) because we are talking about terrorists here, not American citizens.

The captured German and Japanese soldiers weren't American citizens you moron.

And don't tell me they were wearing uniforms. The resistance fighters weren't, but the Nazi officers who executed them were convicted of war crimes.

[opebo]

They can't win: If they give the terrorists what they deserve (execution), it makes them martyrs, if we're soft on them, the government are seen as weaklings. It's not like it's an easy choice to make.

Who cares if the government is 'seen as weaklings'? 

Anyway, it is funny to see that the right-wingers still support torture, even at this late date!  No doubt so do most americans.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

Ag and tik speak the truth.

[justfollowingtheelections]

Hopefully all those who are responsible for these crimes (torture) will end up in jail.

[Rowan]

Hopefully all those who are responsible for these crimes (torture) will end up in jail.

LOL. That's a winner there.

[justfollowingtheelections]

Hopefully all those who are responsible for these crimes (torture) will end up in jail.

LOL. That's a winner there.

I love how you seem to think it's ok for the U.S. government to be involved in illegal activities.

[Rob]

"Ignorant"? Aren't you the one who believes the world was created six thousand years ago?

I don't think Vander Blubb is a real poster.