Is Kerry Ineligible for the Presidency?

[zorkpolitics]

A Petition is being circulated to request that John Kerry be removed form the Nov. ballots because he is ineligible for the Presidency, as defined by the 14th amendment.
see:
http://patriotpetitions.us/Kerry/

The 14th amendment:
No person shall be a Senator or Representative in Congress, or elector of President and vice-president ... having previously taken an oath ... to support the Constitution of the United States, [who has] engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the same, or given aid or comfort to the enemies thereof,

Kerry publically gave aid and comfort to North Vietnam while he was still in the Naval reserve, thus violating the Uniform code of military Justice..

Of course since he has never been convicted of treason, this is obviously way out of the mainstream, though given the recent released KGB documents calling the US antiwar movement The Soviet Union’s greatest success of the Cold War, one could certainly make a case against Kerry for given aid or comfort to the enemy.  Does the 14th amendment pertain to anything but the Civil War?  Does the 14th amendment require a criminal conviction?  It seems likely that should Kerry win he would face law suits to challenge his eligibility, which would have to be decided by the Supreme court.

Another reason to expect continued partisanship if Kerry is elected.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

this will get about as far as Ramsey Clark's movemen to impeach Bush.

[Lunar]

this will get about as far as Ramsey Clark's movement to impeach Bush.

I think you're too optimistic.

[Bandit3 the Worker]

this will get about as far as Ramsey Clark's movemen to impeach Bush.

Who knows how far this will get? There are some real nuts out there who listen to right-wing talk radio and believe the type of crap that's in the petition.

[Fmr. Gov. NickG]

So any dissent during time of war is treason?
Why not just put Kerry in jail for voting against the $87 billion?

Anyway, the North Vietnamese were not engaged in an insurrection against the US Constitution...so even defecting to their army would not apply to this amendment.

[Giant Saguaro]

That's interesting - I doubt seriously that it would be successful on even the lower levels, but it's the effort that counts. It might help get truth out there about this guy, but when you have 200+ plus guys saying he isn't fit to serve and the media gives greater weight to the 10 or 11 partisans that follow his campaign around, I don't know, I'm pessimistic about it even getting any attention. Add to it that he neglected and ignored his duty and obligation as an officer to report the atrocities he claimed were going on in Vietnam and later recounted them in front of Congress basically as rumor, which he had positively no business doing and which only hurt our soldiers. Talk about opportunity and exploitation.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

he neglected and ignored his duty

not something i think Bush wants to bring up...

[Giant Saguaro]

he neglected and ignored his duty

not something i think Bush wants to bring up...

Bush was not an officer in the Navy and did not make unproven allegations in Congress about his fellow soldiers.

You Dems value military service only when you think it will fit to your advantage, another exploitation.

And Bush did serve. Even if you want to find something wrong with the branch of service in which he was, fine, at least he wasn't making the enemy feel better about himself.

[AuH2O]

Why not?

Kerry misrepresented his service and got a lot of medals he didn't deserve. He was also a sh**tty officer.

Thing is, the way politics works.. what does Kerry do? Bush isn't saying this stuff. Even if he was, it wouldn't matter. Attacking Bush does not help clear up Kerry's record, because Democrats have already pushed Bush's National Guard issues as far as they will go.

[Lunar]

That's interesting - I doubt seriously that it would be successful on even the lower levels, but it's the effort that counts. It might help get truth out there about this guy, but when you have 200+ plus guys saying he isn't fit to serve and the media gives greater weight to the 10 or 11 partisans that follow his campaign around

Those 10 or 11 guys were actually in his boat.    Kerry's campaign actively supports them, which is why they get attention.  I think one of them is a Republican too, for what it's worth.

Bush's campaign doesn't actively prop up those Swift Boat Captains Against Kerry or whatever they're called, so they aren't covered as much in the campaign coverage.  Bush tried doing similar things with another fringe group against McCain in the South Carolina primaries and got it shot back in his face when McCain called him on it.  I think Bush is mostly keeping his hands off this hot potato.

I don't know, I'm pessimistic about it even getting any attention. Add to it that he neglected and ignored his duty and obligation as an officer to report the atrocities he claimed were going on in Vietnam

Kerry actually admitted to committing a war crime (burning down a village).

[Fmr. Gov. NickG]

The Republicans are wasting their time dwelling on Kerry's Vietnam service.  

The public isn't going to buy it.  Especially not coming from a Nixon shill like John O'Neill, who AFAIK didn't even know Kerry in the military,

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

It's a wash on both sides.

The public doesn't care that Bush was AWOL or what Kerry did after Vietnam. it's a bunch of fighting over something that will have no effect. I don't care about either one bit.

[Giant Saguaro]

That's interesting - I doubt seriously that it would be successful on even the lower levels, but it's the effort that counts. It might help get truth out there about this guy, but when you have 200+ plus guys saying he isn't fit to serve and the media gives greater weight to the 10 or 11 partisans that follow his campaign around

Those 10 or 11 guys were actually in his boat.    Kerry's campaign actively supports them, which is why they get attention.  I think one of them is a Republican too, for what it's worth.

Bush's campaign doesn't actively prop up those Swift Boat Captains Against Kerry or whatever they're called, so they aren't covered as much in the campaign coverage.  Bush tried doing similar things with another fringe group against McCain in the South Carolina primaries and got it shot back in his face when McCain called him on it.  I think Bush is mostly keeping his hands off this hot potato.

I don't know, I'm pessimistic about it even getting any attention. Add to it that he neglected and ignored his duty and obligation as an officer to report the atrocities he claimed were going on in Vietnam

Kerry actually admitted to committing a war crime (burning down a village).

The Swift Boat Vets for Truth need to be propped up by somebody. McCain's case is a little different - you can't compare him to Kerry, he didn't turn his back on his men when he got home or at any point. You can't compare Bush to McCain either - McCain is in a class by himself. Hey, I regret as a Republican that Bush's attacks on McCain and his characterizations of him were successful in 2000 - I really do - but McCain isn't the subject here. When you look at what Kerry did when he got home and that there are well over 200 people arguing that he's not fit to command, it has to be given some weight.

[Giant Saguaro]

It's a wash on both sides.

The public doesn't care that Bush was AWOL or what Kerry did after Vietnam. it's a bunch of fighting over something that will have no effect. I don't care about either one bit.

Well, Red, hard to argue with the cartoon! That's a good one.

[Lunar]

How many of those 200 people have met him?

They're simply veterans who were offended by his anti-war protests.  I don't see what's special about them that allows them to better judge Kerry's actions than the general public.

I brought up McCain as an example about how these fringe military groups are everywhere and don't necessarily deserve any special notice.   I also brought him up as an explanation why Bush will ignore these guys, but maybe he'll surprise me.

[Giant Saguaro]

How many of those 200 people have met him?

They're simply veterans who were offended by his anti-war protests.  I don't see what's special about them that allows them to better judge Kerry's actions than the general public.

I brought up McCain as an example about how these fringe military groups are everywhere and don't necessarily deserve any special notice.   I also brought him up as an explanation why Bush will ignore these guys, but maybe he'll surprise me.

Well, we can accomodate them a venue in which to speak nonetheless, I should think. See, and this is what gets me: whatever these 10 or 11 guys say must be the absolute Gospel truth. There's no politics here. But watch Bush get within 50 miles of NYC and it's all politics! He's just exploiting 9/11. Watch the people vouch for the fact that Bush served - that's just politics. So are the 200+ Swift Boat Vets; they're just questioning Kerry's patriotism or whatever. But these guys following Kerry around somehow aren't about politics. Somehow, even the Georgia Dem politician (his name escapes me now) isn't about politics either - well the hell he isn't! In any other context but this he'd be seen as the most partisan anti-Bush wing nut out there.

I say this because Kerry engaged in activities after Vietnam and voted in the Senate in such a way that makes me question what kind of a leader he'd be. Now if someone else has a perspective that doesn't paint Kerry in greatest light, let's hear it! That's all we hear about Bush is the negative from conspiracies about  him knowing about 9/11 FROM THE LIKES  OF MICHAEL MOORE WHO GETS TO MAKE MOVIES ABOUT BUSH AND WHO DOESN'T KNOW HIM EITHER to being AWOL to freaking creating the terror alert system to scare people into backing him!

[Fmr. Gov. NickG]

I guess we can "accomodate" anyone who has an opinion about anything.  But basically these anti-Kerry vets are just saying they didn't like people protesting the Vietnam War.  Nothing wrong with holding that opinion, but it is NOT a debate we need to regurgitate during this election.  9/11 on the other hand is actually a current issue that should be discussed during the campaign.

[Shira]

A Petition is being circulated to request that John Kerry be removed form the Nov. ballots because he is ineligible for the Presidency, as defined by the 14th amendment.
see:
http://patriotpetitions.us/Kerry/

The 14th amendment:
No person shall be a Senator or Representative in Congress, or elector of President and vice-president ... having previously taken an oath ... to support the Constitution of the United States, [who has] engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the same, or given aid or comfort to the enemies thereof,

Kerry publically gave aid and comfort to North Vietnam while he was still in the Naval reserve, thus violating the Uniform code of military Justice..

Of course since he has never been convicted of treason, this is obviously way out of the mainstream, though given the recent released KGB documents calling the US antiwar movement The Soviet Union’s greatest success of the Cold War, one could certainly make a case against Kerry for given aid or comfort to the enemy.  Does the 14th amendment pertain to anything but the Civil War?  Does the 14th amendment require a criminal conviction?  It seems likely that should Kerry win he would face law suits to challenge his eligibility, which would have to be decided by the Supreme court.

Another reason to expect continued partisanship if Kerry is elected.

As to intelligence the following holds:
Como > Dean > Teresa > Cheney > Kerry > Edwards > Rumsfeld > Bush > Hannity  

[The Duke]

Actually, Lunar, almost all have met Kerry.

Crewmates are in the group.
Kerry's field commander is in the group.
One of the medics who treated Kerry's "wounds" is in the group.
Kerry's debate partner from the Dick Cavett Show is in the group.

[Lunar]

Ah, my mistake then.  I thought only one person was actually abord Kerry's ship (a staunch Republican) and I thought that the superior officers never actually met him.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

The White House has commited grand treason (Valarie Plame, giving information we know about Iran to Iran through Chalaib). Kerry has not. Typical Republican hypocriticy.

[The Duke]

The White House has commited grand treason (Valarie Plame, giving information we know about Iran to Iran through Chalaib). Kerry has not. Typical Republican hypocriticy.

Flame on.

[The Duke]

Ah, my mistake then.  I thought only one person was actually abord Kerry's ship (a staunch Republican) and I thought that the superior officers never actually met him.

I think the commander emt him.  If I were commanding a military unit, I'd want to meet all my officers, anyway.  I think he said he had when he was on some cable show I watched.

In any case, none of this means Kerry is constitutionally ineligible to be President.

[MODU]

It's a wash on both sides.

The public doesn't care that Bush was AWOL or what Kerry did after Vietnam. it's a bunch of fighting over something that will have no effect. I don't care about either one bit.

I don't know how old you are, BRTD, but for us who remember hearing Kerry on tv or the radio back then while we were either in the military or had friends/family in the military, we DO care.  You can't shake that from our minds.  It is quite relavent to this years election.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

It's a wash on both sides.

The public doesn't care that Bush was AWOL or what Kerry did after Vietnam. it's a bunch of fighting over something that will have no effect. I don't care about either one bit.

I don't know how old you are, BRTD, but for us who remember hearing Kerry on tv or the radio back then while we were either in the military or had friends/family in the military, we DO care.  You can't shake that from our minds.  It is quite relavent to this years election.

So you do care that Bush was AWOL?