Hot take: much of rural white America swings/shifts left.

[Spectator]

The brain drain is a very real phenomenon in rural America. I’m not saying the Republican voters in these areas are dumb. What I’m saying is that the types of people that would be offended by Trump’s/GOP’s behavior that grew up in these areas are the ones that tend to leave for college and never come back. It’s quite sad honestly.

This, 100%. I made a comment about this in another thread, but basically if you ever go visit one of these dying towns, it's going to be one of the most depressing things you'll ever witness firsthand. Anybody with anything to live for has left. The people who remain aren't even voting for Trump because they think he'll save their sh-tty little town, they're just hoping he'll bring the rest of the country down too.

Condescending attitudes like this are a large part of why Democrats struggle in rural areas. I don't need to visit one of these "dying towns" I live there. As hard as it is for you to believe the vast majority of people who live here would not live anywhere else, myself included. I'm not saying rural areas don't have their problems, they do, but so do suburbs and cities. I may not agree politically with a majority of my neighbors but for the most part they are good people living life the way they want,who the F*** are you to say they have nothing to live for.

I agree that the “nothing to live for” remark was uncalled for. The rest of the point is arguably true, though. I do think a non-insignificant part of why these areas are so attracted to Trump is because of pettiness/vindictiveness/bitterness. I wish there was a way to attract talent back to rural America, because these places really are dying and getting more of a shell of their former selves. That’s not good for anyone in this country, no matter where you live.

[ProgressiveModerate]

The brain drain is a very real phenomenon in rural America. I’m not saying the Republican voters in these areas are dumb. What I’m saying is that the types of people that would be offended by Trump’s/GOP’s behavior that grew up in these areas are the ones that tend to leave for college and never come back. It’s quite sad honestly.

This, 100%. I made a comment about this in another thread, but basically if you ever go visit one of these dying towns, it's going to be one of the most depressing things you'll ever witness firsthand. Anybody with anything to live for has left. The people who remain aren't even voting for Trump because they think he'll save their sh-tty little town, they're just hoping he'll bring the rest of the country down too.

Condescending attitudes like this are a large part of why Democrats struggle in rural areas. I don't need to visit one of these "dying towns" I live there. As hard as it is for you to believe the vast majority of people who live here would not live anywhere else, myself included. I'm not saying rural areas don't have their problems, they do, but so do suburbs and cities. I may not agree politically with a majority of my neighbors but for the most part they are good people living life the way they want,who the F*** are you to say they have nothing to live for.

This is basically the reverse of when Republicans attack heavily nonwhite cities for being crime infested hell-holes. Yes, these areas often do have issues including crime and poverty but by and large the people living in them are good people who have community.

[DaleCooper]

The brain drain is a very real phenomenon in rural America. I’m not saying the Republican voters in these areas are dumb. What I’m saying is that the types of people that would be offended by Trump’s/GOP’s behavior that grew up in these areas are the ones that tend to leave for college and never come back. It’s quite sad honestly.

This, 100%. I made a comment about this in another thread, but basically if you ever go visit one of these dying towns, it's going to be one of the most depressing things you'll ever witness firsthand. Anybody with anything to live for has left. The people who remain aren't even voting for Trump because they think he'll save their sh-tty little town, they're just hoping he'll bring the rest of the country down too.

Condescending attitudes like this are a large part of why Democrats struggle in rural areas. I don't need to visit one of these "dying towns" I live there. As hard as it is for you to believe the vast majority of people who live here would not live anywhere else, myself included. I'm not saying rural areas don't have their problems, they do, but so do suburbs and cities. I may not agree politically with a majority of my neighbors but for the most part they are good people living life the way they want,who the F*** are you to say they have nothing to live for.

If you're putting "dying town" in scare quotes then I don't think we're talking about the same thing. Get your ass down to some of these Nebraska towns and it will not take you more than a minute or two to realize why I described them exactly the way I did.

For people who are old enough to remember when there was still a little life left in these towns, it borders on apocalyptic just how much some of these places have declined.

[Minnesota Mike]

If you're putting "dying town" in scare quotes then I don't think we're talking about the same thing. Get your ass down to some of these Nebraska towns and it will not take you more than a minute or two to realize why I described them exactly the way I did.

For people who are old enough to remember when there was still a little life left in these towns, it borders on apocalyptic just how much some of these places have declined.

While I may not have ever been to small Nebraska towns I have been in and know enough people in small towns in rural Minnesota and Iowa to have a pretty good idea what they are probably like. I'm also old enough (59) to remember what they were like 40-50 years ago. There is no doubt rural areas have their problems, lack of opportunities for young people with certain college degrees leading the way, but they are not the $hitholes you make them out to be.

[Open Source Intelligence]

The brain drain is a very real phenomenon in rural America. I’m not saying the Republican voters in these areas are dumb. What I’m saying is that the types of people that would be offended by Trump’s/GOP’s behavior that grew up in these areas are the ones that tend to leave for college and never come back. It’s quite sad honestly.

This, 100%. I made a comment about this in another thread, but basically if you ever go visit one of these dying towns, it's going to be one of the most depressing things you'll ever witness firsthand. Anybody with anything to live for has left. The people who remain aren't even voting for Trump because they think he'll save their sh-tty little town, they're just hoping he'll bring the rest of the country down too.

I’m from one of these areas. We just had our 10-year reunion. Our high school class of roughly 100 people punched significantly above its weight. Two doctors, 4 nurses, a Harvard-educated lawyer, 3-4 engineers, and a handful of people with solid careers in the military. Only one of the engineers remains in the local area. Quite sad, but also super proud of us for getting out and making waves in the world.

To add onto this point, since it is relative to this thread: I’d imagine Biden/Dems would do decently among the slice of my high school class that “succeeded”. They don’t live there anymore though, and Trump will probably get an even more insane margin out of the people remaining.

Why act like this is just rural America? Hell, that is the story of Eastern Europe inside the EU post-Schengen. Latvia does a great job educating all their youth, that then move to Germany. It's why I think the region is probably doomed for Russia domination: the demographics aren't there, what demographics they do have move out, and while Russia hardly has great demographics itself, they are considerably larger to be able to weather it than their neighbors to the west are, and their youth aren't automatically allowed to leave and emigrate.

There's a very real problem in the world that most of the first worldness and benefits that globalization have brought are overwhelmingly tied into these geographically small communities that are effectively islands and people have greater sense of connection with those islands even if they're in different time zones or even different countries than they do the people that live a hundred miles away. That Biden and Trump have both abandoned free trade and are gung-ho "fair trade", tariffs, and mercantilism is a reaction all that has not been working in the opinion of both major political parties. Although I will note that remote work post-Covid has been per census estimates resulted in a flip of some rural areas are actually gaining population for the first time in forever as some cities are losing.

[gerritcole]

The brain drain is a very real phenomenon in rural America. I’m not saying the Republican voters in these areas are dumb. What I’m saying is that the types of people that would be offended by Trump’s/GOP’s behavior that grew up in these areas are the ones that tend to leave for college and never come back. It’s quite sad honestly.

This, 100%. I made a comment about this in another thread, but basically if you ever go visit one of these dying towns, it's going to be one of the most depressing things you'll ever witness firsthand. Anybody with anything to live for has left. The people who remain aren't even voting for Trump because they think he'll save their sh-tty little town, they're just hoping he'll bring the rest of the country down too.

Condescending attitudes like this are a large part of why Democrats struggle in rural areas. I don't need to visit one of these "dying towns" I live there. As hard as it is for you to believe the vast majority of people who live here would not live anywhere else, myself included. I'm not saying rural areas don't have their problems, they do, but so do suburbs and cities. I may not agree politically with a majority of my neighbors but for the most part they are good people living life the way they want,who the F*** are you to say they have nothing to live for.

I agree that the “nothing to live for” remark was uncalled for. The rest of the point is arguably true, though. I do think a non-insignificant part of why these areas are so attracted to Trump is because of pettiness/vindictiveness/bitterness. I wish there was a way to attract talent back to rural America, because these places really are dying and getting more of a shell of their former selves. That’s not good for anyone in this country, no matter where you live.

Unsure how feasible it is but I saw an idea for geographical based immigration in which immigrants would be allowed to live in a certain number of states and need permission to go to others, could repopulate small farming towns this way, the logistics and culture war make this impossible but a good thought experiment

[Spectator]

The brain drain is a very real phenomenon in rural America. I’m not saying the Republican voters in these areas are dumb. What I’m saying is that the types of people that would be offended by Trump’s/GOP’s behavior that grew up in these areas are the ones that tend to leave for college and never come back. It’s quite sad honestly.

This, 100%. I made a comment about this in another thread, but basically if you ever go visit one of these dying towns, it's going to be one of the most depressing things you'll ever witness firsthand. Anybody with anything to live for has left. The people who remain aren't even voting for Trump because they think he'll save their sh-tty little town, they're just hoping he'll bring the rest of the country down too.

Condescending attitudes like this are a large part of why Democrats struggle in rural areas. I don't need to visit one of these "dying towns" I live there. As hard as it is for you to believe the vast majority of people who live here would not live anywhere else, myself included. I'm not saying rural areas don't have their problems, they do, but so do suburbs and cities. I may not agree politically with a majority of my neighbors but for the most part they are good people living life the way they want,who the F*** are you to say they have nothing to live for.

I agree that the “nothing to live for” remark was uncalled for. The rest of the point is arguably true, though. I do think a non-insignificant part of why these areas are so attracted to Trump is because of pettiness/vindictiveness/bitterness. I wish there was a way to attract talent back to rural America, because these places really are dying and getting more of a shell of their former selves. That’s not good for anyone in this country, no matter where you live.

Unsure how feasible it is but I saw an idea for geographical based immigration in which immigrants would be allowed to live in a certain number of states and need permission to go to others, could repopulate small farming towns this way, the logistics and culture war make this impossible but a good thought experiment

I could see something like COVID where work-from-home became prevalent helping to enable it. If I’m a big law attorney that doesn’t need to be in the courtroom, what difference does that make if I’m living in my small town hometown? But you’re right. I do think the job opportunities make it untenable for basically anyone with that level of education/background to come back, and if they do, their earnings potential takes a huge hit. And to a smaller extent, you’re probably onto something about the culture war driving some of those high-achieving (and oftentimes more liberal thinking) people away and leave them not wanting to come back.

[DaleCooper]

If you're putting "dying town" in scare quotes then I don't think we're talking about the same thing. Get your ass down to some of these Nebraska towns and it will not take you more than a minute or two to realize why I described them exactly the way I did.

For people who are old enough to remember when there was still a little life left in these towns, it borders on apocalyptic just how much some of these places have declined.

While I may not have ever been to small Nebraska towns I have been in and know enough people in small towns in rural Minnesota and Iowa to have a pretty good idea what they are probably like. I'm also old enough (59) to remember what they were like 40-50 years ago. There is no doubt rural areas have their problems, lack of opportunities for young people with certain college degrees leading the way, but they are not the $hitholes you make them out to be.

First of all, I am not talking about small towns, I am talking about small towns that are basically in free fall as far as population goes, which is a majority of my state's counties by the way, last I checked. These towns are literally dying year after year. Some of them just consist of a handful of old people who remember good times and some middle aged parents watching their now adult kids drink themselves to death or worse. Meth is a huge problem too. I've seen this all firsthand. Pretending that "lack of opportunities for young people with certain college degrees" is one of the leading problem for these towns is absurd and a bit insulting. Some sack of sh-t getting an English degree and then wondering why it isn't helping him in a town of 500 people is the least of these communities' problems.

[DaleCooper]

I left something out of my other posts on this subject lately, and it's that honestly, in my opinion, they kind of have a right to be angry. Obviously I hate that they're forcing Trump onto the rest of us, but can you blame them for giving up on this country? Look what it's done to their homes.

[Spectator]

I left something out of my other posts on this subject lately, and it's that honestly, in my opinion, they kind of have a right to be angry. Obviously I hate that they're forcing Trump onto the rest of us, but can you blame them for giving up on this country? Look what it's done to their homes.

Honestly, yeah. I don’t blame the bitterness/resentment. I think in many ways it’s justified. But oddly enough they tend to have a lot of patriotism, but that’s very much a part of the culture. Guns, trucks, cowboy boots, and ‘Merica

[DaleCooper]

I left something out of my other posts on this subject lately, and it's that honestly, in my opinion, they kind of have a right to be angry. Obviously I hate that they're forcing Trump onto the rest of us, but can you blame them for giving up on this country? Look what it's done to their homes.

Honestly, yeah. I don’t blame the bitterness/resentment. I think in many ways it’s justified. But oddly enough they tend to have a lot of patriotism, but that’s very much a part of the culture. Guns, trucks, cowboy boots, and ‘Merica

They have patriotism, but if you listen closely it's more like, "This was a great country once, now it's gone." That kind of thing. They don't have good things to say about the US right now.

[pbrower2a]

In some of those counties the new young voters are often Hispanic workers who have citizenship and can vote. They are a classic proletariat right out of Marxist stereotype who work on farms and ranches, in feedlots, dairies, and slaughterhouses. These people are much like factory workers of the 1930s in their economic interests. The GOP has little appeal to them. Who wants to be overworked and underpaid?

[Open Source Intelligence]

The brain drain is a very real phenomenon in rural America. I’m not saying the Republican voters in these areas are dumb. What I’m saying is that the types of people that would be offended by Trump’s/GOP’s behavior that grew up in these areas are the ones that tend to leave for college and never come back. It’s quite sad honestly.

This, 100%. I made a comment about this in another thread, but basically if you ever go visit one of these dying towns, it's going to be one of the most depressing things you'll ever witness firsthand. Anybody with anything to live for has left. The people who remain aren't even voting for Trump because they think he'll save their sh-tty little town, they're just hoping he'll bring the rest of the country down too.

Condescending attitudes like this are a large part of why Democrats struggle in rural areas. I don't need to visit one of these "dying towns" I live there. As hard as it is for you to believe the vast majority of people who live here would not live anywhere else, myself included. I'm not saying rural areas don't have their problems, they do, but so do suburbs and cities. I may not agree politically with a majority of my neighbors but for the most part they are good people living life the way they want,who the F*** are you to say they have nothing to live for.

I agree that the “nothing to live for” remark was uncalled for. The rest of the point is arguably true, though. I do think a non-insignificant part of why these areas are so attracted to Trump is because of pettiness/vindictiveness/bitterness. I wish there was a way to attract talent back to rural America, because these places really are dying and getting more of a shell of their former selves. That’s not good for anyone in this country, no matter where you live.

Unsure how feasible it is but I saw an idea for geographical based immigration in which immigrants would be allowed to live in a certain number of states and need permission to go to others, could repopulate small farming towns this way, the logistics and culture war make this impossible but a good thought experiment

That's Hispanics now wherever there's a need for manual farm labor. My wife's middle school is 25% Hispanic, mostly Mexicans and Guatemalans.

[Open Source Intelligence]

I left something out of my other posts on this subject lately, and it's that honestly, in my opinion, they kind of have a right to be angry. Obviously I hate that they're forcing Trump onto the rest of us, but can you blame them for giving up on this country? Look what it's done to their homes.

Honestly, yeah. I don’t blame the bitterness/resentment. I think in many ways it’s justified. But oddly enough they tend to have a lot of patriotism, but that’s very much a part of the culture. Guns, trucks, cowboy boots, and ‘Merica

They have patriotism, but if you listen closely it's more like, "This was a great country once, now it's gone." That kind of thing. They don't have good things to say about the US right now.

You really want to see this sentiment go to in Indiana old car manufacturing middle-sized cities where the carmakers have left: New Castle, Kokomo, Anderson, Muncie, South Bend. These are old UAW towns. They're proud of where they live due to friends and family connections and they want the place to succeed. It's one thing I learned moving here from Notth Carolina, the sense of community of "we're all in this together" is much stronger here.